AGM - Protest

[tomd2103]

It's not about heritage Neil. I deliberately avoided brining up the past as it really does have little to do with this generation. Being the biggest club in such a huge catchment areas offers us a lot of benefits over other clubs that we should be exploiting. We haven't. In their own words the growth of the club has been one of the poorest in the Premier League since it's inception. First we had Mr Cornershop running us like his own small time little fiefdom and now we have Randy, who came in and tossed a bit of moolah around with absolutely nothing to hold it all up. We have a lot going for us, we need clever people, indeed clever business men to exploit it. We haven't as of yet.

Europe is littered with clubs who should be bigger than they are; Hertha Berlin, Eintracht Frankfurt, SV Hamburg and Napoli, to name but a few. Should we be in better shape than we are right now, damn right we should be? Do we have the right people to address the mistakes that have led us to where we are; in some cases no, but in Hollis we are going to have to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Pendant alert - Napoli are currently top of Serie A aren't they?

[Percy McCarthy]

However, I’ve heard this statement made before that we have some right to be better as we are the biggest club in the 2nd City, I find this a false narrative for a variety of reasons.

You can dispute about what we have a 'right' to quite easily, as I don't really see we have a right to anything.

But the second point isn't really something to have an opinion on or a dispute about. Somebody might think that the capital of Australia is Sydney, it doesn't mean that it is.

My point exactly. I didn't see the relevance of some people not knowing it's the second city.

[tomd2103]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

[NeilH]

It's not about heritage Neil. I deliberately avoided brining up the past as it really does have little to do with this generation. Being the biggest club in such a huge catchment areas offers us a lot of benefits over other clubs that we should be exploiting. We haven't. In their own words the growth of the club has been one of the poorest in the Premier League since it's inception. First we had Mr Cornershop running us like his own small time little fiefdom and now we have Randy, who came in and tossed a bit of moolah around with absolutely nothing to hold it all up. We have a lot going for us, we need clever people, indeed clever business men to exploit it. We haven't as of yet.

Europe is littered with clubs who should be bigger than they are; Hertha Berlin, Eintracht Frankfurt, SV Hamburg and Napoli, to name but a few. Should we be in better shape than we are right now, damn right we should be? Do we have the right people to address the mistakes that have led us to where we are; in some cases no, but in Hollis we are going to have to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Pendant alert - Napoli are currently top of Serie A aren't they?

They are, but historically they have under-performed and have even been relegated into the lower leagues - Can I swap my choice to Banik Ostrava instead?

[aj2k77]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

As an addition, to show where we are right now

2014/15  Revenue E148.8m Wages £65.1m
2013/14  Revenue E133.0m Wages £69.3m  Posted a loss of £3.9m

In 2009/10 our revenue was 13m euros higher than Evertons, fast forward to last season and our revenue was now 17m euros lower than Evertons. A 30m Euro swing, showing how poorly we've done behind the scenes.

[tomd2103]

It's not about heritage Neil. I deliberately avoided brining up the past as it really does have little to do with this generation. Being the biggest club in such a huge catchment areas offers us a lot of benefits over other clubs that we should be exploiting. We haven't. In their own words the growth of the club has been one of the poorest in the Premier League since it's inception. First we had Mr Cornershop running us like his own small time little fiefdom and now we have Randy, who came in and tossed a bit of moolah around with absolutely nothing to hold it all up. We have a lot going for us, we need clever people, indeed clever business men to exploit it. We haven't as of yet.

Europe is littered with clubs who should be bigger than they are; Hertha Berlin, Eintracht Frankfurt, SV Hamburg and Napoli, to name but a few. Should we be in better shape than we are right now, damn right we should be? Do we have the right people to address the mistakes that have led us to where we are; in some cases no, but in Hollis we are going to have to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Pendant alert - Napoli are currently top of Serie A aren't they?

They are, but historically they have under-performed and have even been relegated into the lower leagues - Can I swap my choice to Banik Ostrava instead?

I was joking about Napoli.  Went on holiday to that region last summer and it seemed like a club with a big catchment area, who apart from when a certain cheating little Argentinian was there, haven't achieved too much.  Banik Ostrava - there is a name from the past!

[aj2k77]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

Since our £3.9m loss we've lowered the wage bill by £4m and improved our turnover by £12m.

[old man villa fan]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

Which would probably equate to the net spend in the last transfer window, with a bit left for a rainy day (this window).

The question is, do you spend it now on a couple of better quality players (if available) or save it for more lesser quality players better suited to get us out of the Championship. Do you gamble now at high risk of not saving us from relegation or go for the lower risk at the end of the season.

I don't know as I do not how it all pans out regarding players wages, contracts, cash in hand. It would be easy for me to say spend £20m on players but I do not know what financial effect that would have on us. If I was to ignore the latter point it would be called 'taking a blinkered view '. Football fans are very good at that.

[Villa in Denmark]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

Only because the debts we have racked up have been converted to equity by Lerner.  Any actual write off is now dependent on a sales price.

It's basically the same deal as the Bolton owner has offered to a potential buyer, just that Lerner has done it up front, the Bolton guy was waiting to see if someone would take the club as was and repay the debts.  All swings and roundabouts unless there's some clever tax wheeze in having debt repaid v a higher sales price.

[tomd2103]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

As an addition, to show where we are right now

2014/15  Revenue E148.8m Wages £65.1m
2013/14  Revenue E133.0m Wages £69.3m  Posted a loss of £3.9m

In 2009/10 our revenue was 13m euros higher than Evertons, fast forward to last season and our revenue was now 17m euros lower than Evertons. A 30m Euro swing, showing how poorly we've done behind the scenes.

No doubt we have been poor behind the scenes (stand up a certain Paul Faulkner who seems to have been forgotten in all this), but competition money factor into that as well though wouldn't it?  They have finished higher in the league than us and have featured in European competition.

[tomd2103]

As regards being the biggest club in the second city, to most outside Brum it’s not the second city, it’s third or perhaps even fourth.

I think he's hinting at the size of the club by saying that. If people outside Brum are not aware of it doesn't make it untrue.

Let's just say biggest club between London and Manchester!

[AVH87]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

Only because the debts we have racked up have been converted to equity by Lerner.  Any actual write off is now dependent on a sales price.

It's basically the same deal as the Bolton owner has offered to a potential buyer, just that Lerner has done it up front, the Bolton guy was waiting to see if someone would take the club as was and repay the debts.  All swings and roundabouts unless there's some clever tax wheeze in having debt repaid v a higher sales price.

Only some of them. The last accounts showed we still owed Lerner over 80 million including loan interest.

[amfy]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

I have not said, and nor have they, that we can't bring players in, just that we are not going to do it by throwing stupid wages & contracts at players out of desperation.

The club are in talks with several players. There is more than wriggle room, but if the only way to get players in is to throw stupid money at it, they are not going to do that.

As a club we have gone through hell to try & get solvent. This would be the worst possible moment to reverse that.

[saunders_heroes]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

I have not said, and nor have they, that we can't bring players in, just that we are not going to do it by throwing stupid wages & contracts at players out of desperation.

The club are in talks with several players. There is more than wriggle room, but if the only way to get players in is to throw stupid money at it, they are not going to do that.

As a club we have gone through hell to try & get solvent. This would be the worst possible moment to reverse that.

Our immediate priority should be to stay in the PL.

[mattjpa]

Tom, I believe that for the 2013/14 season we lost £3.9m. The wage bill has continued to drop since then and the turnover has continued to rise so i'd expect that we currently run at a profit not a loss, albeit a small one.

So we're not talking massive losses on the scale of Bolton then?  Again, I'm no financial expert, but surely there is some wriggle room to bring some players in?

I have not said, and nor have they, that we can't bring players in, just that we are not going to do it by throwing stupid wages & contracts at players out of desperation.

The club are in talks with several players. There is more than wriggle room, but if the only way to get players in is to throw stupid money at it, they are not going to do that.

As a club we have gone through hell to try & get solvent. This would be the worst possible moment to reverse that.

Our immediate priority should be to stay in the PL.

SH you talk about a couple of wins bringing us back into it and you would be right.....if non of the teams above us picked up points. Im sorry but you need to accept (barring an escape of Shawshank proportions)we are down. I would look at it like this; We could maybe spend 10m on a striker now, someone like maybe Asamoah Gyan. He would come and want 100k per week which we could pay him. He would also probably want 5m release clause and be off in the summer having maybe won us 6-7points and cost us 10-15m in wages and fees. Ultimately we would still most probably be down.
Alternatively we could keep that 10m, scout young players not quite ready for the top table and pay a fair price for them in the summer ---players like  Zaha or that Demauri Gray. Build them into our long term plans, stick in some heavy release clauses etc.
I think what our board is trying to say is we need to break the cycle and change the entire ethos of the club. Clean the decks, get the fundamentals right and come back in a years time