McLeish was very much a little effort / 'lazy' appointment.It also largely coincided with the point at which Randy decided to stop giving a fuck.That's what sticks in my craw about the Lerner era. All that time General Krulak telling us they'd be here through thick and thin, and the first instance of thin, they were off like a rat up a fucking drainpipe.Fucking chancers. I appreciate he spent a lot of money, but it was largely wasted through his own stupidity, and they cultivated fan approval right up till the very moment at which it started to become difficult for them.He was a dreadful owner for us, and surrounded himself with utterly average people who had not the first idea what they were doing.We are paying the price for it now, an extended spell not in the top flight, and meanwhile he's probably found some other sparkly rich kids toy he prefers to obsess about.The fact General Krulak got himself a new job at a University and lifted the 'Proud History, Bright Future' slogan tells you all you need to know about their sincerity.
Quote from: peter w on May 04, 2017, 07:49:04 PMQuote from: brian green on May 04, 2017, 08:47:02 AMWould not disagree with you directly Peter, we see eye to eye on most things but I try to examine why the club was rotten as you put it. It was, but why? How had it come about? I had heard from my son who has a friend who is a friend and colleague of Remi Garde that he is a very decent man and a very competent manager at Lyon. How did we come to treat him so badly?The closest I have come to ever understanding what went on in the death throes of Lerner's ownership was a post by Ads suggesting that the club was effectively in receivership. Steering the club off the rocks took priority over everything else, including dumping Remi Garde.I agree with that. garde was probably who we needed either after O'Neill or Houllier. Not when he came in. Lerner made such a mess of us it was going to take him to get it back onto an even keel again, never mind getting it right. I absolutely agree with that.For me the pivotal moment in the last 6 or 7 years was when, after the Houllier season, we'd had a painful time, but had started to show glimpses of knowing how to play actual, proper football.What we needed then was a manager with the ethos to take those hard earned little signs of growth and work with them, create a side that passed the ball around a bit.They tried with Martinez, then decided to go for McLeish, which was *exactly* the type of manager we did not need.They threw away every little bit of progress in the Houllier season and went for a mental year zero approach. Insanity.
Quote from: brian green on May 04, 2017, 08:47:02 AMWould not disagree with you directly Peter, we see eye to eye on most things but I try to examine why the club was rotten as you put it. It was, but why? How had it come about? I had heard from my son who has a friend who is a friend and colleague of Remi Garde that he is a very decent man and a very competent manager at Lyon. How did we come to treat him so badly?The closest I have come to ever understanding what went on in the death throes of Lerner's ownership was a post by Ads suggesting that the club was effectively in receivership. Steering the club off the rocks took priority over everything else, including dumping Remi Garde.I agree with that. garde was probably who we needed either after O'Neill or Houllier. Not when he came in. Lerner made such a mess of us it was going to take him to get it back onto an even keel again, never mind getting it right.
Would not disagree with you directly Peter, we see eye to eye on most things but I try to examine why the club was rotten as you put it. It was, but why? How had it come about? I had heard from my son who has a friend who is a friend and colleague of Remi Garde that he is a very decent man and a very competent manager at Lyon. How did we come to treat him so badly?The closest I have come to ever understanding what went on in the death throes of Lerner's ownership was a post by Ads suggesting that the club was effectively in receivership. Steering the club off the rocks took priority over everything else, including dumping Remi Garde.
Quote from: pauliewalnuts on May 04, 2017, 11:38:05 PMMcLeish was very much a little effort / 'lazy' appointment.It also largely coincided with the point at which Randy decided to stop giving a fuck.That's what sticks in my craw about the Lerner era. All that time General Krulak telling us they'd be here through thick and thin, and the first instance of thin, they were off like a rat up a fucking drainpipe.Fucking chancers. I appreciate he spent a lot of money, but it was largely wasted through his own stupidity, and they cultivated fan approval right up till the very moment at which it started to become difficult for them.He was a dreadful owner for us, and surrounded himself with utterly average people who had not the first idea what they were doing.We are paying the price for it now, an extended spell not in the top flight, and meanwhile he's probably found some other sparkly rich kids toy he prefers to obsess about.The fact General Krulak got himself a new job at a University and lifted the 'Proud History, Bright Future' slogan tells you all you need to know about their sincerity.Agree but .......Shit but not all not all shit.....Bodymoor Heath modernisation, Acorns and the renovation of the Holte pub
They completely missed the fact that subjectively he was obviously the wrong candidate but he met all the criteria they set out.
Garde on the other hand - no idea what the thinking was there.
Quote from: Ad@m on May 05, 2017, 11:59:32 AMGarde on the other hand - no idea what the thinking was there.European technical director + three French and three Francophone players = let's get a French manager. Fox's Arsenal background might also have played a part.
Quote from: pauliewalnuts on May 04, 2017, 10:49:51 PMQuote from: peter w on May 04, 2017, 07:49:04 PMQuote from: brian green on May 04, 2017, 08:47:02 AMWould not disagree with you directly Peter, we see eye to eye on most things but I try to examine why the club was rotten as you put it. It was, but why? How had it come about? I had heard from my son who has a friend who is a friend and colleague of Remi Garde that he is a very decent man and a very competent manager at Lyon. How did we come to treat him so badly?The closest I have come to ever understanding what went on in the death throes of Lerner's ownership was a post by Ads suggesting that the club was effectively in receivership. Steering the club off the rocks took priority over everything else, including dumping Remi Garde.I agree with that. garde was probably who we needed either after O'Neill or Houllier. Not when he came in. Lerner made such a mess of us it was going to take him to get it back onto an even keel again, never mind getting it right. I absolutely agree with that.For me the pivotal moment in the last 6 or 7 years was when, after the Houllier season, we'd had a painful time, but had started to show glimpses of knowing how to play actual, proper football.What we needed then was a manager with the ethos to take those hard earned little signs of growth and work with them, create a side that passed the ball around a bit.They tried with Martinez, then decided to go for McLeish, which was *exactly* the type of manager we did not need.They threw away every little bit of progress in the Houllier season and went for a mental year zero approach. Insanity.Totally agree, for the life of me I still dont understand the McLeish appointment
Quote from: pauliewalnuts on May 04, 2017, 11:38:05 PMMcLeish was very much a little effort / 'lazy' appointment.It also largely coincided with the point at which Randy decided to stop giving a fuck.That's what sticks in my craw about the Lerner era. All that time General Krulak telling us they'd be here through thick and thin, and the first instance of thin, they were off like a rat up a fucking drainpipe.Fucking chancers. I appreciate he spent a lot of money, but it was largely wasted through his own stupidity, and they cultivated fan approval right up till the very moment at which it started to become difficult for them.He was a dreadful owner for us, and surrounded himself with utterly average people who had not the first idea what they were doing.We are paying the price for it now, an extended spell not in the top flight, and meanwhile he's probably found some other sparkly rich kids toy he prefers to obsess about.The fact General Krulak got himself a new job at a University and lifted the 'Proud History, Bright Future' slogan tells you all you need to know about their sincerity.I actually think the McLeish appointment made more sense than the Remi Garde one when you consider that the people making the decision didn't have the faintest idea what they were doing.It was a classic checklist appointment - they decided they wanted someone with knowledge of the Prem, knowledge of the local area and therefore the status of the Villa, someone with international experience - tick, tick, tick. They completely missed the fact that subjectively he was obviously the wrong candidate but he met all the criteria they set out.Garde on the other hand - no idea what the thinking was there.