Please humour me as I know little about rugby and enjoy watching international tests. I have always been led to believe that when the referee makes a decision it is accepted with respect and almost without question. What I'm seeing now is almost every decision is being debated and not just by Owen Farrell. Am I correct in my observations.
Quote from: taylorsworkrate on October 23, 2023, 06:51:10 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 06:44:15 AMI agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.What I don't like about scrum penalties is that referees will generally call a penalty when a scrum is being dominated by one of the teams. Sometimes it just looks like dominance and the other team aren't actually infringingYep, then you have scrums that are stable and the ball could come out easily but the team keeps it in to try force a penalty because they think the ref is favouring them.And of course props boring in or binding short (watch how often a scrum collapses and the prop on one side is bound on the shoulder or armpit).There's plenty more as well and all combined they give teams too many options to "earn" cheap shots for 3 points. Even worse is that so many refs compound the problem with yellow cards.
Quote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 06:44:15 AMI agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.What I don't like about scrum penalties is that referees will generally call a penalty when a scrum is being dominated by one of the teams. Sometimes it just looks like dominance and the other team aren't actually infringing
I agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.
Quote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 07:25:44 AMQuote from: taylorsworkrate on October 23, 2023, 06:51:10 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 06:44:15 AMI agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.What I don't like about scrum penalties is that referees will generally call a penalty when a scrum is being dominated by one of the teams. Sometimes it just looks like dominance and the other team aren't actually infringingYep, then you have scrums that are stable and the ball could come out easily but the team keeps it in to try force a penalty because they think the ref is favouring them.And of course props boring in or binding short (watch how often a scrum collapses and the prop on one side is bound on the shoulder or armpit).There's plenty more as well and all combined they give teams too many options to "earn" cheap shots for 3 points. Even worse is that so many refs compound the problem with yellow cards.I think it's this that's infuriates me watching rugby as an outsider really, it loses some of it's credibillity as a sport when games are won and lost by a man deciding someone's hips are pointing the wrong way.
Quote from: LeeB on October 23, 2023, 10:23:24 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 07:25:44 AMQuote from: taylorsworkrate on October 23, 2023, 06:51:10 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 06:44:15 AMI agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.What I don't like about scrum penalties is that referees will generally call a penalty when a scrum is being dominated by one of the teams. Sometimes it just looks like dominance and the other team aren't actually infringingYep, then you have scrums that are stable and the ball could come out easily but the team keeps it in to try force a penalty because they think the ref is favouring them.And of course props boring in or binding short (watch how often a scrum collapses and the prop on one side is bound on the shoulder or armpit).There's plenty more as well and all combined they give teams too many options to "earn" cheap shots for 3 points. Even worse is that so many refs compound the problem with yellow cards.I think it's this that's infuriates me watching rugby as an outsider really, it loses some of it's credibillity as a sport when games are won and lost by a man deciding someone's hips are pointing the wrong way.And when the scrum half puts the ball in straight to the 2nd row….might as well rename hooker as middle prop
Quote from: Gareth on October 23, 2023, 10:51:11 AMQuote from: LeeB on October 23, 2023, 10:23:24 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 07:25:44 AMQuote from: taylorsworkrate on October 23, 2023, 06:51:10 AMQuote from: paul_e on October 23, 2023, 06:44:15 AMI agree, scrum penalties are terrible for the game at the highest level because they encourage a lot of negative play.What I don't like about scrum penalties is that referees will generally call a penalty when a scrum is being dominated by one of the teams. Sometimes it just looks like dominance and the other team aren't actually infringingYep, then you have scrums that are stable and the ball could come out easily but the team keeps it in to try force a penalty because they think the ref is favouring them.And of course props boring in or binding short (watch how often a scrum collapses and the prop on one side is bound on the shoulder or armpit).There's plenty more as well and all combined they give teams too many options to "earn" cheap shots for 3 points. Even worse is that so many refs compound the problem with yellow cards.I think it's this that's infuriates me watching rugby as an outsider really, it loses some of it's credibillity as a sport when games are won and lost by a man deciding someone's hips are pointing the wrong way.And when the scrum half puts the ball in straight to the 2nd row….might as well rename hooker as middle propI don't mind feeding (to an extent) as much, with the size and power professional scrums have it can be very difficult for the attacking team to hook against an opponent that are all pushing, it is a restart but there should be some advantage for the team putting in.I honestly think the scrum is the only part of the sport that needs serious review by officials because it's not even inconsistency, it's outright lack of understanding from the refs that means whichever front row convinces him they're being cheated gets the calls and once they're on top there's loads of little tricks to make sure the ref sees what you want him to.
The breakdown is the other area for me Paul, as against it seems that players are able to milk penalties without even really attempting to play the ball. If you watch a game closely, nearly every breakdown had multiple infringements going on and Ireland and New Zealand in particular are masters of illegal breakdown play.On the subject of the scrum, here's that last vital one from another angle [
World Rugby has announced a new competition starting in 2026 as part of a "significant overhaul" of the men's international calendar.The tournament will be made up of 24 teams, split into two divisions with 12 teams in each, with promotion and relegation starting from 2030.The top division will include the 10 sides from the Six Nations and Rugby Championship, plus two unnamed others.The World Cup will also be expanded to 24 teams from 2027.The new competition - yet to be given an official name - will be played in July and November, replacing the current summer and autumn international windows.It will take place in alternate years, excluding those which will include the World Cup and British and Irish Lions tours.
I think England need to be mega careful to ensure they don’t get into a mindset of essentially projecting forward too much to the next World Cup. Players who retire or who opt to play in France are out (although Arundell will be available), but other than that you need to evolve over time and don’t worry about 4 years time for now.
Quote from: PaulWinch again on October 24, 2023, 04:53:13 PMI think England need to be mega careful to ensure they don’t get into a mindset of essentially projecting forward too much to the next World Cup. Players who retire or who opt to play in France are out (although Arundell will be available), but other than that you need to evolve over time and don’t worry about 4 years time for now.I agree. Originally I was only looking at retiring players, but then Johnny May is 34, Tuilagi 33 and Anthony Watson seems to be forever injured as is Henry Slade.Ollie Lawrence is the obvious choice to step into inside centre and partner Marchent, but that’s it.There have been a few players who were selected, but seem to have disappeared Unless we’re allowed to select players from outside England then I fear we could be in the sh*t.