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Author Topic: International Rugby  (Read 381874 times)

Offline taylorsworkrate

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1380 on: February 05, 2017, 01:57:17 AM »
Really poor performance. Shockingly bad in the 1st half. France played with far more intensity and seemed more motivated. Got out of jail. Can't see us playing that bad again

Online nigel

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1381 on: February 05, 2017, 12:10:22 PM »
Not great.
Cant blame the ref, but, he did make 3 or 4 big errors.
The one where he called the ball out, then gave a penalty when Wood dropped on it. Maybe I missed something there?
Yes, May's yellow was harsh,but, the legs came up.
The French yellow at the end was a red, for me.

Offline peter w

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1382 on: February 05, 2017, 03:05:08 PM »
The May certainly was harsh - he said it was out and then said Wood couldn't drop on a ball as it emerged from the ruck (or was it maul I can't remember). It was a fine line but as the referee had said it was out it couldn't also be said to be emerging from the maul. Very poor. I agree that the yellow was harsh - yes the leg came up but that was as the French player was trying to twist out of the tackle and he tried to take a forward step. This is one of those where slow motion should have helped the referee and show that it wasn't a yellow but a good tackle that the French players side and forward motion resulted in the leg going in the air as May had already committed to the tackle.


Offline Jon Crofts

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1383 on: February 06, 2017, 01:53:30 PM »
The one where he called the ball out, then gave a penalty when Wood dropped on it. Maybe I missed something there?

The only possible cause I can imagine for the penalty is that Wood was already in motion toward the ball as it emerged from the ruck and the referee called the ball out. Basically he jumped the gun.

Offline paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1384 on: February 06, 2017, 02:04:06 PM »
The one where he called the ball out, then gave a penalty when Wood dropped on it. Maybe I missed something there?

The only possible cause I can imagine for the penalty is that Wood was already in motion toward the ball as it emerged from the ruck and the referee called the ball out. Basically he jumped the gun.

There's no way to justify that decision, it was just straight up wrong.  There is no concept of 'emerging' it's in or out and you're onside or you're not.  If anyone was offside or the ball wasn't out then Hughes gets penalised but the ref waved him on and told him the ball was available.  There is no rule ever which leads to the ball then being back 'in' and unavailable for Wood to dive on it, especially given the fact that the ref was fairly clear that him going off his feet was the problem.  The ref just got confused and blew up and then didn't have the balls to admit he'd made a mistake, it's really that simple.

Offline Jon Crofts

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1385 on: February 06, 2017, 03:27:58 PM »
(e)A player must not fall on or over the ball as it is coming out of a ruck.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Like I said that's the only reason I can think of to justify the unjustifiable!

Offline paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1386 on: February 06, 2017, 03:39:47 PM »
(e)A player must not fall on or over the ball as it is coming out of a ruck.
Sanction: Penalty kick

Like I said that's the only reason I can think of to justify the unjustifiable!

That rule is all about the ball being in the ruck and a player falling over it to stop it coming out (it's the rule that Richie McCaw was allowed to ignore for his entire career) and is normally referred to as players going off their feet at the ruck.  The ball is never in an 'emerging' state it's in until it's out and that rule, and any others relating to it (such as not releasing or interfering with the scrumhalf) exist to punish teams for not allowing the ball to come out and cannot be applied once the ref has called the ball as out.

I do get what you're saying but it makes no sense, I honestly can't think of any reason why he'd blow up when he did and the correct thing should've been to give England a scrum and apologise for interrupting play but for whatever reason he panicked and made up a rule that doesn't exist to justify it.

Offline Jon Crofts

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1387 on: February 06, 2017, 04:20:23 PM »
He never explained it either, we had the Ref Link and never heard his interpretation or explanation.

Offline paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1388 on: February 06, 2017, 04:28:42 PM »
I think he probably realised that there was no way to explain it that wouldn't have just dug him deeper.

I've spoken to a fair few people in the game yesterday and today and I'm yet to find anyone who could offer any explanation (let alone justification) for the decision.  The only crumb of comfort I can find is that they missed the kick so it had no effect on the scoreboard, if we'd lost by 3 or less I think things could've been very ugly.

Offline cheltenhamlion

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1389 on: February 06, 2017, 06:11:34 PM »
He missed some very clearly forward passes as well notwithstanding the prop the size of a house leading with his elbow at Hughes head.

Shite performance from England who tried too hard to force things in the first half on their ball and didn't get down and dirty with the French first half when they had it.

What is clear is that, regardless of our injury situation, we have the strength in depth to empty the bench against anyone in this tournament and win the match.

I felt for Johnny May as well. If the frog hadn't flung himself forward to try to break the tackle then his leg wouldn't have gone in the air and nor would he have landed as he did.

Offline paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1390 on: February 06, 2017, 08:43:19 PM »
He missed some very clearly forward passes as well notwithstanding the prop the size of a house leading with his elbow at Hughes head.

Shite performance from England who tried too hard to force things in the first half on their ball and didn't get down and dirty with the French first half when they had it.

What is clear is that, regardless of our injury situation, we have the strength in depth to empty the bench against anyone in this tournament and win the match.

I felt for Johnny May as well. If the frog hadn't flung himself forward to try to break the tackle then his leg wouldn't have gone in the air and nor would he have landed as he did.

That's the one I was most angry with, given the new regs around head injuries I just can't work out why no one mentioned it.

Online nigel

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1391 on: February 06, 2017, 10:03:27 PM »
He missed some very clearly forward passes as well notwithstanding the prop the size of a house leading with his elbow at Hughes head.

Shite performance from England who tried too hard to force things in the first half on their ball and didn't get down and dirty with the French first half when they had it.

What is clear is that, regardless of our injury situation, we have the strength in depth to empty the bench against anyone in this tournament and win the match.

I felt for Johnny May as well. If the frog hadn't flung himself forward to try to break the tackle then his leg wouldn't have gone in the air and nor would he have landed as he did.

That's the one I was most angry with, given the new regs around head injuries I just can't work out why no one mentioned it.

Surprised he hasn't been sited yet

Offline cheltenhamlion

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1392 on: February 07, 2017, 05:18:46 PM »
He missed some very clearly forward passes as well notwithstanding the prop the size of a house leading with his elbow at Hughes head.

Shite performance from England who tried too hard to force things in the first half on their ball and didn't get down and dirty with the French first half when they had it.

What is clear is that, regardless of our injury situation, we have the strength in depth to empty the bench against anyone in this tournament and win the match.

I felt for Johnny May as well. If the frog hadn't flung himself forward to try to break the tackle then his leg wouldn't have gone in the air and nor would he have landed as he did.

That's the one I was most angry with, given the new regs around head injuries I just can't work out why no one mentioned it.

I don't if that is because the elbow missed and he got him with his shoulder.

Offline paul_e

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1393 on: February 08, 2017, 12:11:15 PM »
England U20s absolutely smashed France today 59-17

The conveyer belt just keeps running.

Just to come back to this because I've watched a fair bit more of this now and I think I've picked out the next superstar.  The right winger on Saturday was a kid from London Irish called Joe Cokanasiga who was making his U20 debut and he looks like he'll be an absolute monster in a few years.  6'4, 18stone, has pace, a decent step/change of direction, good hands, fairly solid defence.  I recommend anyone who's interested in what's coming through to keep an eye on him in this tournament.

Other than that Randall and Malins at 9 and 10 both look like they'll be top players as well and the back row are all a bit special.  We also gave a debut to Jacob Umaga who will, I think, be a 12 long term and looks like he'll do more than enough to keep the family reputation intact (Tana Umaga is his uncle, getting Jacob to go with England ahaed of New Zealand is a bit of a coup).

Final point there's a young lock at Wasps who's on the verge of breaking into their squad (this year or next) who is apparently a bit special.  I've not seen much of him but he's called Ehize Ehizode and he's getting some really good reviews, lots of people likening him to Itoje.

Offline Dave Summers

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Re: International Rugby
« Reply #1394 on: February 09, 2017, 06:38:41 PM »
England U20s absolutely smashed France today 59-17

The conveyer belt just keeps running.

Just to come back to this because I've watched a fair bit more of this now and I think I've picked out the next superstar.  The right winger on Saturday was a kid from London Irish called Joe Cokanasiga who was making his U20 debut and he looks like he'll be an absolute monster in a few years.  6'4, 18stone, has pace, a decent step/change of direction, good hands, fairly solid defence.  I recommend anyone who's interested in what's coming through to keep an eye on him in this tournament.

Other than that Randall and Malins at 9 and 10 both look like they'll be top players as well and the back row are all a bit special.  We also gave a debut to Jacob Umaga who will, I think, be a 12 long term and looks like he'll do more than enough to keep the family reputation intact (Tana Umaga is his uncle, getting Jacob to go with England ahaed of New Zealand is a bit of a coup).

Final point there's a young lock at Wasps who's on the verge of breaking into their squad (this year or next) who is apparently a bit special.  I've not seen much of him but he's called Ehize Ehizode and he's getting some really good reviews, lots of people likening him to Itoje.

Yup, I spotted him about 2/3 months back when I saw a glimpse of I believe his debut for Irish. Very impressed with Malins too, bit annoyed he's back with Sarries this week instead of playing against Wales.

The two flankers also looked pretty decent and with the impending availability of Sam Underhill, I believe our back row issues maybe close to being resolved. Speaking of which, delighted to see Clifford finally get a chance this weekend.

 


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