Wembley FA Cup Final Villa Surfer Flag

[Chris Jameson]

Oh and "go wild in the stadium" sounds like something David Mellor would say.

This is red hot soccer chat.

[amfy]

I find the idea that fans weren't consulted a little odd in this situation.

He put it out on social media, and said 'if you want it, we've got 24 hours to raise £2000 for it'
The fact that they did, with both money and time to spare, can I think be construed as a fair level of support for the flag. Also - having been involved in consultations, I can tell you that the level of apathy is usually overwhelming until you do something people disagree with, and then suddenly everyone has an opinion.

(Look at that Wembley song consultation - 'Aston Villa That's Who' was actually an overwhelming winner, and then everyone who didn't vote was outraged that we would be accompanied by something so shit.)

I get that no-one here likes it, and I can identify with the reasons why, but it isn't actually fair to say that he didn't consult. If there wasn't a significant number of Villa fans who wanted it, it wouldn't have got off the ground.

The T-shirts were for sale for quite a long time ahead of the flag. I have to say that the banning of the flag, does provide an excellent sales pitch for the T-shirts!To be honest, the level of misery in this forum about the flag tempted me to buy one just to annoy everyone!
 
MOMs bloke can be a bit of a pain in ass at times, but he gets stuff done, and for that reason, I try to be supportive of him.

[Chris Jameson]

Getting off your arse and doing something is great but I've never ever heard our club referred to as 'The Aston Villa'. 'The Villa' yes, but never that.

[pauliewalnuts]

I find the idea that fans weren't consulted a little odd in this situation.

He put it out on social media, and said 'if you want it, we've got 24 hours to raise £2000 for it'
The fact that they did, with both money and time to spare, can I think be construed as a fair level of support for the flag.

This is what he said on the funding page:

DESIGN
There's no time to mull over designs. The 'Villa Pistols' design though has the perfect underdog attitude going up against one of the football establishment's 'Sky Four'.  The design is iconic and will be known by football supporters around the world watching the game, as it draws from a classic design (and a bloody good album too).

Like you said, it was "do you want this", which is a totally different thing to, say, giving people designs to choose from.

The fact that lots of people contributed to it is fine, clearly they did want it. The point I was getting at is that implying people are "toxic" for not liking it is pretty poor.

[amfy]

Getting off your arse and doing something is great but I've never ever heard our club referred to as 'The Aston Villa'. 'The Villa' yes, but never that.

Not me - but the original wording is 'The Sex Pistols'. I can see why people think its odd, but surely people can also see why it's The Aston Villa in this context.

[IAmTheOneIanOlney]

We're not toxic, we just don't like it.

[amfy]

The song survey gave people designs to choose from. The badge gave people designs to choose from. See how well those turned out.

I actually think - Do you want this or not? Is a better, more honest, question. Other than the choices thing taking too long, people would be asked to donate without knowing what design they were donating for. In short - people will always moan!

[amfy]

....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.

[Richard E]

"The Clueless Toxic W*****s" sounds like the name of a Manics tribute act.

[pauliewalnuts]

True enough, people will always moan. But by the same chalk, sometimes they'll have a point. People aren't moaning for the sake of it. They're moaning because they've seen a few things they don't like.

One of the things people pointed out was the mentioning of another club, which as it happens, although for bureaucratic reasons, has turned out to be a problem. I can't help thinking that, given the amount of time, it might have make sense to ask people - not just because of the mentioning Arsenal, but also the "The" thing - and maybe it would have been avoided?

The intentions were noble, though, like the intentions behind the  Liverpool match protest. The problem is, it has turned out - again - to not be very well thought out.

[dave.woodhall]

....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.

Nobody asked him to do it. If you do something like this off your own bat you should expect that not everyone will agree with you. To then call everyone who does disagree "clueless toxic wankers" isn't the brightest.   

[amfy]

I can totally see why people don't like it, but by the same token, a lot of people clearly do.

In retrospect, talking to the club about how we might get out Holte End flag down there may have worked out better, or may have come to nothing at all. I think we need to accept that the wasn't time for a survey, or consultation period, it was do it or not do it. Many will wish he hadn't, and others will be glad he has and be right behind it.

This forum has a general consensus about the flag, which makes us think 'This is what Villa fans think about it' - but we are a small section of Villa fans, and H&V has a culture which means that whilst we might be largely of one mind on it, that doesn't mean all Villa fans are of the same mind.

In the end, it will happen or not. Like the song, it will pass largely unnoticed after everyone being so concerned about it. The fuss created by the ban will give it far more attention than it should have had, but could also mean that the BBC don't show it! One thing I am picking up, is that other sets if fans are getting behind it, because of the ban, the original meaning of the flag is gaining greater significance - its gaining some anti-establishment credentials. I really don't believe it is the embarrassment that people fear it is.

[IAmTheOneIanOlney]

....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.

I didn't mean to appear sensitive, I was just making a reference to the O'Leary "fickle" incident.


Although I don't actually like the flag.

[Chris Jameson]

                                                              NEVER MIND
                                       THE VILLA
                                                                 HERE'S THE
                                                    CLueLeSs toXiC WanKErS

[pauliewalnuts]

This forum has a general consensus about the flag, which makes us think 'This is what Villa fans think about it' - but we are a small section of Villa fans, and H&V has a culture which means that whilst we might be largely of one mind on it, that doesn't mean all Villa fans are of the same mind.

That's true.

Mind you, so are the people who saw the crowdfunding campaign and thought it was a good idea in the first place.

re the club, that's a good point regarding the Holte flag. Wonder why that wasn't an option?

Although aren't they doing some sort of scarf thing, involving some having home scarves and some away?