Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: KRS on May 20, 2015, 01:34:29 AM
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Not sure if this is allowed so apologies to H&V mods in advance if it breaks any cross Villa fan site politics...but would be nice if all Villa fans could unite on the sentiment on this one.
Wembley FA Cup Final Villa Surfer Flag (http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/villafanwembleysurfer)
Project aim
To create an iconic Villa supporter-owned 20x20 metre giant surfer flag especially for the FA Cup Final.
About the project
Lets face it we were all a little dissapointed by the club's surfer flag at the semi-final, it was the only blot on the perfect Wembley day. The mosaic was great and it certainly helped blow the Liverpool's fans away, which in turn spurred on the players and gave them belief on the pitch.
To win the FA Cup final, we'll need to be perfect to help our team beat a talented Arsenal team.
The club have a scarf display planned and Wembley will hand out free mini flags, but of course this is a bit of a manufactured atmosphere.
We have got wind that Arsenal will have a surfer flag. Since Villa will not bring a surfer this time, as supporters we want to create a surfer flag that will go head-to-head with Arsenal's, before the club's planned scarf display happens.
The eyes of the world will be on us and such an iconic surfer will win a lot of admirers.
IS IT POSSIBLE?
Maybe, if we all act fast. We have less than 24 hours - IGNORE THE TIME LEFT ON THE PAGE (minium setting was two weeks). I've had a Chinese company get back to me saying they can deliver on time a 20x20m surfer - 3 days production time and 4 days delivery- before the 29th May. The cost is £1900 (around £400 will be the express courier cost) - with paypal fees/crowdfunder's fees, lets round it up to £2000.
I got a quote from one of the only UK companies who could do such a job and they said, it would cost £12,000!
So you can see the scope of what we're trying to pull off here.
So, here's the plan...
DESIGN
There's no time to mull over designs. The 'Villa Pistols' design though has the perfect underdog attitude going up against one of the football establishment's 'Sky Four'. The design is iconic and will be known by football supporters around the world watching the game, as it draws from a classic design (and a bloody good album too).
The lead singer of the Sex Pistols is also a massive Arsenal fan (who's views on the direction of the game we actually share), so there's a cheeky wink there and also 'Birmingham' is actually namechecked in the lyrics to 'Bodies' on the album.
It's also original and will be respected as a 'supporter flag' and not a generic/pc type of flag that the club itself would do.
It will be MUCH MORE impressive than the one surfed at the semi-final and twice as big!
Read more: Linky (http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/villafanwembleysurfer)
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Edited now I've read the post in full.
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Any flag should just reference the Villa, that's my view anyway.
It's something the blues do about us.
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Why not just take the one from the Holte lower and use that? Does it belong to an individual or is it the club's?
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I like the idea but I think the flag is terrible. It shouldn't make reference to them.
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Nah! - Why the punk theme to it? or any reference to them for that matter.....
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I think you should check that the material is flame proof if you order it or it will not be allowed in the ground.
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I like the punk theme.
It fits in with our 'back to the dark ages' rioting fans image!
I think Villa only took the little flag last time because we were doing the mosaic. Clearly it is logistically possible to take a much larger flag because Liverpool did.
I've supported this because it is something, and it is different, and it if it works it'll have been something that has come direct from the fans, and I like its anarchic edge.
It's a shame it mentions Arsenal but I kind of read them as representing the Sky 4 on this, and it's not like singing about teams you aren't playing. I don't mind us singing about Blues when we are actually playing them, it's going on about them the rest of the time I object to, so the Arsenal mention is OK by me.
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I like the idea but I think the flag is terrible. It shouldn't make reference to them.
same here.
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I like the idea but I think the flag is terrible. It shouldn't make reference to them.
This.
I agree with the other comments regarding not mentioning the opposition. It should be just Villa
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I like the idea but I think the flag is terrible. It shouldn't make reference to them.
This.
I agree with the other comments regarding not mentioning the opposition. It should be just Villa
Once again, another one for great idea but no mention of Arsenal. It's going to be re-used for future occasions when we won't be playing them.
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I wonder what Arsenal fan John Lydon would make of it?
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Not Villa enough and for that reason I'm oot.
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I still have the gigantic silk flag. Not flame-proof, though, so it cannot be brought into the ground.
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I like the punk theme.
It fits in with our 'back to the dark ages' rioting fans image!
I think Villa only took the little flag last time because we were doing the mosaic. Clearly it is logistically possible to take a much larger flag because Liverpool did.
I've supported this because it is something, and it is different, and it if it works it'll have been something that has come direct from the fans, and I like its anarchic edge.
It's a shame it mentions Arsenal but I kind of read them as representing the Sky 4 on this, and it's not like singing about teams you aren't playing. I don't mind us singing about Blues when we are actually playing them, it's going on about them the rest of the time I object to, so the Arsenal mention is OK by me.
"Never Mind The Sky Four It's The Villa" - That would be much better and it means the flag could be re-used. Like others, I don't like the flag name-checking another team.
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I like the idea but I think the flag is terrible. It shouldn't make reference to them.
same here.
Indeed great idea, poor choice & unncessary choice to define ourselves in relationship to others. I sing myself hoarse, my voice still hasn't recovered from the semi (and yes I'm a bit hardcore about this) but I never sing against or mention any other team, my choice to support my team. I don't wish others ill. Not a fan of the whole "I don't care about..." Stuff either. Yep I know it's all banter/light hearted but just my choice.
Was disappointed how quiet we went against Southampton...
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'Here's the Aston Villa'? Shouldn't that be 'here's Aston Villa'?
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Not a fan of the flag design but great to see the energy in putting it together.
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It isn't original either, St Pauli have had flags and t-shirts with this design for years.
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I still have the gigantic silk flag. Not flame-proof, though, so it cannot be brought into the ground.
I assume that such a flag as this would have to go through some sort of approval process from Wembley before being allowed in, and I imagine it's not straight forward?
As other have mentioned great idea, not too sure about the design though.
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only need Villa on the flag
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Why not just take the one from the Holte lower and use that? Does it belong to an individual or is it the club's?
It belongs to the club but it's too big for the lower tier of Wembley.
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Looks like the targets been smashed anyway.
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Mixed feelings on this- great to see fan initiative pay off and succeed- it will never be possible to please all of the people all of the time, we would never agree on exact design details.
My own personal opinion though is that using the flag to troll Arsenal is a tad embarrassing and small time- makes me think of Paul Tait (too far perhaps!).
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Mixed feelings on this- great to see fan initiative pay off and succeed- it will never be possible to please all of the people all of the time, we would never agree on exact design details.
My own personal opinion though is that using the flag to troll Arsenal is a tad embarrassing and small time- makes me think of Paul Tait (too far perhaps!).
Agreed. Bring a flag by all mean, but it should be all about the Villa. Name checking other clubs is small time and chip on the shoulder stuff. Leave that sort of thing to Small Heath and co.
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I'm sorry for those involved, but I think it's rubbish. Why oh why make reference to another team!?
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Over a grand raised since I left home and got to work. Impressive.
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I'm sorry for those involved, but I think it's rubbish. Why oh why make reference to another team!?
agree
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Why not just take the one from the Holte lower and use that? Does it belong to an individual or is it the club's?
It belongs to the club but it's too big for the lower tier of Wembley.
All that money, but still "My garden shed....."
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I love punk rock.
I love Villa.
I don't get this at all, especially the reference to another team.
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Wow! The target has been hit in just a few hours which is really very impressive considering it only went up late last night.
Obviously this isn't anything to do with me personally, and I actually agree with most of the comments on here about mentioning Arsenal, however I also understand that its a last minute thing, the message they are trying to deliver (whether that is right or wrong is a debate for another time) and that due to timescales the design isn't something they have time to dwell over at such short notice (this is explained on the page).
edit:
For those that have concerns over fireproofing:
UPDATE: We have made the funding!
Even better news is the Chinese company have managed to source the required fireproof material, which is more expensive and takes up the price to £2200. But we have this covered anyway.
I will speak to them one more time to make sure everything is in order and message all investors. GREAT EFFORT EVERYONE! UTV
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It's embarrassing name checking Arsenal. Hope it doesn't happen.
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Its our day , lets not reference any other club.
Tho I think its to late on this flag
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I wondered where Jay Forsyth had got to.
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I wondered where Jay Forsyth had got to.
Blimey... there's a blast from the past.
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So it will get here from China before the 29 May?
I think it would be cutting it fine to get it here a month later given my experience of getting stuff out of China.
Dont like the design either.
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Seems a bit shit loike.
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Great band, great album... obviously a great football club - but not a good flag design. Does anyone like it?
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Great initiative, but when something's this short notice it's better to keep it simple. Aside from mentioning Arsenal, they haven't even got the grammar right.
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Steven Gerrard. Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?
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At the very least it should have just read 'the VILLA' rather than 'the Aston Villa'. Terrible really.
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This has gone down like a shit salad.
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Am I missing the point?
Why not have the one that gets used for every home game - design seems ok to me and I assume the club would allow it to be used - maybe with some of deposit.
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That's terrible. About as shit a design as you could come up with. Bravo. Can only ever be used against Arsenal as well.
Good investment.
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Underwhelmed.
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The word 'hipster' comes to mind for some reason.
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Is there a picture of the design of the flag anywhere ?
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Is there a picture of the design of the flag anywhere ?
There's a link in the original post.
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Am I missing the point?
Why not have the one that gets used for every home game - design seems ok to me and I assume the club would allow it to be used - maybe with some of deposit.
Why not just take the one from the Holte lower and use that? Does it belong to an individual or is it the club's?
It belongs to the club but it's too big for the lower tier of Wembley.
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Not surprisingly, it's a bit crap. But that's MOMS for you.
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Is there a picture of the design of the flag anywhere ?
(http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/uploads/project_images/17/87/22088/22088-83c73d4d6275580b796e316accdccfe5.jpg)
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Awful.
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Am I missing the point?
Why not have the one that gets used for every home game - design seems ok to me and I assume the club would allow it to be used - maybe with some of deposit.
Why not just take the one from the Holte lower and use that? Does it belong to an individual or is it the club's?
It belongs to the club but it's too big for the lower tier of Wembley.
Which one was used for the semi final then? I was in the lower tier and I was underneath a giant flag which stopped at the end of our block because it would have carried on to the seats who were holding up the mosaic. Was that not the Holte End lower one?
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The word 'hipster' comes to mind for some reason.
Not quite the word I was thinking Dave.
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The word 'hipster' comes to mind for some reason.
Not quite the word I was thinking Dave.
You're clearly not down with the young people.
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It doesn't even make sense, "Here's the Aston Villa"?
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It doesn't even make sense, "Here's the Aston Villa"?
It must be intended to be in keeping with the wording of the original album cover.
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It doesn't even make sense, "Here's the Aston Villa"?
It must be intended to be in keeping with the wording of the original album cover.
And how many will know that?
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I know that, but it still makes no sense.
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In fairness, its better than the flag we would've used if Lambert was still in charge.
(http://fromztoa.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/pretty_vacant.jpg)
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Surely it would have been more like this under Lambert...
(http://www.defendclevelandshow.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/White-Flag.jpg)
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The design is shit. But fair play to them for trying to sort something.
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Isn't there something in the Wembley T's and C's about max size of flag being 2.5m sq? I do hope someone has asked Wembley if it's ok to bring this monstrosity??
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Surely the moment the day is over the flag is redundant? What a waste - why not have something simply villa related so it could be used at home / away games for a good while
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Just to make it clear that I am not in anyway associated to this project, but a lot of comments in this thread about the design, longevity, permissions and fireproofing are addressed on the link in the first post.
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Surely the moment the day is over the flag is redundant? What a waste - why not have something simply villa related so it could be used at home / away games for a good while
As someone else said another MOMS idea that's alright when you've had 5 pints down the pub but smacks of not having thought it through properly.
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In fairness, its better than the flag we would've used if Lambert was still in charge.
(http://fromztoa.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/pretty_vacant.jpg)
*Like*
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This answers the questions regarding longevity:
LIFE AFTER WEMBLEY - ADDED VALUE
Of course this will make an incredible iconic surfer for the final, but what can we do with it after?
Depending on the amount of your investment, you will have a proportionate amount of shares/votes.
We'll discuss the options later, but they could include:
1) Future outings - there's a potential August Wembley date in the Community Shield (when the message on the flag would be quite poignant!) or when Arsenal next come to Villa Park.
2) Recycle the material into souvenirs to be sold - like pendants, bags, framed sections etc - so that all contributors can see a return on their contributions. The total amount from sales can then be shared between investors.
3) I've spoken to the club about the dimensions for a possible surfer for the lower North Stand. The allowance is 8m x 20m long, so we could alter/cut up the flag to just have the punk rock 'ASTON VILLA' bit, which would be the perfect size to surf on the North.
The rest of the flag could be recycled as in 2) so that flag contributors can have a return on their investment.
4) Sell it to some rich Villan who wants the ultimate souvenir! Then all contributors can have a dividend back in relation to their contribution.
5) Auction it off for charity? Those who want a return can have it, those who want to donate it can.
Of course, we could probably go for a combination: surf it again, cut it down for the North Stand and use the rest for recycled goods.
Or, as mentioned, you could donate any return from your investment to a charity like Acorns or the Petrov foundation.
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He calls his own idea "incredibly iconic", Jesus wept.
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Can't we just have a 'Norman Bites Yer Leg' bedsheet? It would be less embarrassing than that pile of crap.
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The word 'hipster' comes to mind for some reason.
Shut up, grandad!
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Maybe 'Never Mind The FA' would have been better.
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He calls his own idea "incredibly iconic", Jesus wept.
I hate the design as much as the next man. But in fairness I think he means the original album artwork is iconic. Which of course is.
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I'm all up for big flaggy things but won't this mess up the 25.000 scarf display.
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I'm all up for big flaggy things but won't this mess up the 25.000 scarf display.
Yep! #facepalm
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Yeah but the scarf idea is manufactured atmosphere, this isn't, apparently. Although considering he wanted us all in Gerrard face masks as it would be a great photo opportunity this is a step up.
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I'm all up for big flaggy things but won't this mess up the 25.000 scarf display.
Yep! #facepalm
Nope...again I'm only trying to provide correct information:
We have got wind that Arsenal will have a surfer flag. Since Villa will not bring a surfer this time, as supporters we want to create a surfer flag that will go head-to-head with Arsenal's, before the club's planned scarf display happens.
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He calls his own idea "incredibly iconic", Jesus wept.
I hate the design as much as the next man. But in fairness I think he means the original album artwork is iconic. Which of course is.
He calls it an incredibly iconic surfer, I don't think he meant the original artwork.
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I'm all up for big flaggy things but won't this mess up the 25.000 scarf display.
Yep! #facepalm
Nope...again I'm only trying to provide correct information:
We have got wind that Arsenal will have a surfer flag. Since Villa will not bring a surfer this time, as supporters we want to create a surfer flag that will go head-to-head with Arsenal's, before the club's planned scarf display happens.
No chance I'll be in my seat that early
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Can we not have a big banner in the style of NWA with players substituted for the NWA crew and' Fuck the FA!!!' on it.
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Although considering he wanted us all in Gerrard face masks as it would be a great photo opportunity this is a step up.
Which idiot came up with that bonkers idea?
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The scarves are enough.
Arse have got a flag, we've got scarves.
Don't need to do a flag just because they are.
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I think the scarves are a great idea and gesture from the club...and will hopefully prove to be a great souvenir from a fantastic day.
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Although considering he wanted us all in Gerrard face masks as it would be a great photo opportunity this is a step up.
Which idiot came up with that bonkers idea?
MOMS, who are doing the flag.
Another idea was we take a load of inflatable European Cups as "Wembley Banter" to the Arsenal fans. Don't have an inflatable European Cup? Well MOMS sell them, which is convenient. Or maybe i'm just getting cynical in my old age!
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I'm surprised we didn't do another mosaic, the one at the semi was very impressive and effective. A number of non Villa I know commented on how good it looked.
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I just wish it didn't have a reference to the opposition - now there will be two giant flags going around the stadium with "Arsenal" on it. Surely it would only take a couple of minutes to reword that bit of the design. Indeed, I just can't stomach how the flag refers to the opposition as "The" Arsenal. There's only one "The" in football and that's "The Villa"!
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I think I just ruptured my cringing pipes.
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Although considering he wanted us all in Gerrard face masks as it would be a great photo opportunity this is a step up.
Which idiot came up with that bonkers idea?
MOMS, who are doing the flag.
Another idea was we take a load of inflatable European Cups as "Wembley Banter" to the Arsenal fans. Don't have an inflatable European Cup? Well MOMS sell them, which is convenient. Or maybe i'm just getting cynical in my old age!
I see the Chelsea fans laminated their banter when seeing Gerrard off.
LAMINATED BANTS
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Although considering he wanted us all in Gerrard face masks as it would be a great photo opportunity this is a step up.
Which idiot came up with that bonkers idea?
MOMS, who are doing the flag.
Another idea was we take a load of inflatable European Cups as "Wembley Banter" to the Arsenal fans. Don't have an inflatable European Cup? Well MOMS sell them, which is convenient. Or maybe i'm just getting cynical in my old age!
I see the Chelsea fans laminated their banter when seeing Gerrard off.
LAMINATED BANTS
I hope the Hampshire supporters club will be giving the Arsenal fans some stick singing in a cockney dialect.
You can't beat Hants Cants Bants Chants.
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I just wish it didn't have a reference to the opposition - now there will be two giant flags going around the stadium with "Arsenal" on it. Surely it would only take a couple of minutes to reword that bit of the design. Indeed, I just can't stomach how the flag refers to the opposition as "The" Arsenal. There's only one "The" in football and that's "The Villa"!
In my family all the Midlands teams are prefaced by the definite article - The Villa, The Albion, the Wolves, even the Blues.
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Flag looks great and will go down very well with most Villa fans imo.
Well done. I hope it arrives on time.
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Flag looks great and will go down very well with most Villa fans imo.
Well done. I hope it arrives on time.
From now on you shall be known as The Lucky Eddie.
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I'm surprised we didn't do another mosaic, the one at the semi was very impressive and effective. A number of non Villa I know commented on how good it looked.
I agree, I always think Villa are looked at as a classy outfit, steeped in history (IMO), the mosaic was classy, this isn't really.
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Flag looks great and will go down very well with most Villa fans imo.
Well done. I hope it arrives on time.
From now on you shall be known as The Lucky Eddie.
Well said The Jimbo.
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Flag looks great and will go down very well with most Villa fans imo.
Well done. I hope it arrives on time.
From now on you shall be known as The Lucky Eddie.
Well said The Jimbo.
The thanks.
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The don't mention it.
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I think it looks shit.
Have I been helpful?
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The The The were a decent band.
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Load of crap, hope it don't happen. Even " London Calling Aston Villa" wouldn't be right. Should just be Villa related.
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I think it looks shit.
Have I been helpful?
Not The Shit which I understand means excellent in young person parlance?
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Can't we just have a 'Norman Bites Yer Leg' bedsheet? It would be less embarrassing than that pile of crap.
Sometimes simple is the best. This is still my all time favourite Villa banner; Wembley 75:
(http://www.midlandsmemorabilia.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/aston-villa-coventry-city-football-programme-30-08-1975-news-and-record.jpg)
It's the the nuts.
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"Withe Evans help we're Shaw to win" was always one of my faves.
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" 77, Saunders' Trip"
"Villa's Cup - Fill It Up!"
"What a Difference A Gray Makes"
All you need is a sheet and a tin of paint. No need to outsource it to China
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I think it looks shit.
Have I been helpful?
Not The Shit which I understand means excellent in young person parlance?
Do they? Shit. I call The Shit The Shit.
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a half and half flag - novel!!!
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What The?
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" 77, Saunders' Trip"
"Villa's Cup - Fill It Up!"
"What a Difference A Gray Makes"
All you need is a sheet and a tin of paint. No need to outsource it to China
Your flag for wind up value also deserves a mention. You should bring it out more.
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This reminds me of The Young Ones book with a picture inside with the heading "Never mind the Sex Pistols, here's our bollocks"
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Fuck the Fuckers
I'd donate
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Iconic album and album cover that it is, what has a 40 year old album got to do with us?
Of course if we win the cup it will be the best banner ever.
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On the 4th May, 1957, the number one selling album was 'The King & I' soundtrack.
Maybe they should have reworked this cover sleeve:
(http://991.com/newgallery/Original-Soundtrack-The-King-And-I-521965.jpg)
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On the 4th May, 1957, the number one selling album was 'The King & I' soundtrack.
Maybe they should have reworked this cover sleeve:
(http://991.com/newgallery/Original-Soundtrack-The-King-And-I-521965.jpg)
Get rid of the "The" and I'm in.
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Arsenal can have the best surfer flag ever made but as soon as the " 12th man"gets into full voice it will be soon forgotten about
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Fuck the Fuckers
I'd donate
If I get a ticket, I'll scrawl this legend on a bed sheet (well, a hankie).
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After the flag has surfed would it be possible to fold it into a plane shape and throw it on the pitch?
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How about 'Fuck the Arse' or Fuck the Arse Fuckers!'
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great enthusiasm, energy and organisation to get this project off the ground - baffling design and message
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I like the idea, less keen on the content. It's ok but not 20m by 20m ok.
Speaking of which, I hope he's been very clear.
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTPW7hOa03h7oMaxIamDmbvDAaP736d30WWsH-WevdqK6QcvgrkwA)
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Load of crap, hope it don't happen. Even " London Calling Aston Villa" wouldn't be right. Should just be Villa related.
Yep, and then it can be donated to our London Lions Club
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On the 4th May, 1957, the number one selling album was 'The King & I' soundtrack.
Maybe they should have reworked this cover sleeve:
(http://991.com/newgallery/Original-Soundtrack-The-King-And-I-521965.jpg)
Superimpose Arsenes's mug onto the dame and Tim's onto the fella and it's done - caption : "Villa manager gives Arse the finger".
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Fuck the Fuckers
I'd donate
If I get a ticket, I'll scrawl this legend on a bed sheet (well, a hankie).
Can you get a plane to fly past with the message too please?
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Fuck the Fuckers
I'd donate
If I get a ticket, I'll scrawl this legend on a bed sheet (well, a hankie).
Can you get a plane to fly past with the message too please?
What something like a Jimbo Jet.
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Is there a picture of the design of the flag anywhere ?
(http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/uploads/project_images/17/87/22088/22088-83c73d4d6275580b796e316accdccfe5.jpg)
Christ on a bike that is absolutely dreadful. And an embarrassing back-handed compliment to Arsenal as well.
"The Aston Villa". Jesus wept!
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Never mind the bollocks, my banner would read:
Bringing passion to the cup - £200k
Bringing kids to the final - £110
Taking the cup home - PRICELESS!
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I think the problem is they've tried too hard to be different and 'original'. So many will dislike it for different reasons, and a lot won't even get the reference.
More often than the most effective things are the simple and basic. The mosaic at the semi, £ protest, We're Not Fickle, Proud History scarves, even the 19th minute, all were ultimately very simple things that worked really well at the time.
As an example, a flag with the lion's head we see on the screen now and "Fight Like Lions" on it would, for me at least, be a lot more effective, it's all about us and it's not going to have very many hating it. Or even another mosaic with the same thing on. I just don't see how that "Never Mind" flag is inspiring to fans or players.
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Never mind the bollocks, my banner would read:
Bringing passion to the cup - £200k
Bringing kids to the final - £110
Taking the cup home - PRICELESS!
Perfect.
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I think the problem is they've tried too hard to be different and 'original'. So many will dislike it for different reasons, and a lot won't even get the reference.
More often than the most effective things are the simple and basic. The mosaic at the semi, £ protest, We're Not Fickle, Proud History scarves, even the 19th minute, all were ultimately very simple things that worked really well at the time.
As an example, a flag with the lion's head we see on the screen now and "Fight Like Lions" on it would, for me at least, be a lot more effective, it's all about us and it's not going to have very many hating it. Or even another mosaic with the same thing on. I just don't see how that "Never Mind" flag is inspiring to fans or players.
It's not even original. Here's St Pauli's version, which they've had for years:
http://fanshop.kicker.de/fc-st-pauli-t-shirt-never-mind.html
They managed to get the grammar right, though, and they're German.
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The mosaic was brilliant. Really set the tone for the rest of the match. It has to be repeated.
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How about
£30 to park
You robbing wankers
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We'd like to thank everybody who made the effort and donated, China has promised to get it sent out on time.
Due to a strong reaction we modified the flag.
Good luck at Wembley everybody!
(http://s18.postimg.org/458okgax1/fuck.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/458okgax1/)
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We'd like to thank everybody who made the effort and donated, China has promised to get it sent out on time.
Due to a strong reaction we modified the flag.
Good luck at Wembley everybody!
(http://s18.postimg.org/458okgax1/fuck.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/458okgax1/)
Excellent, where do I donate?
-
Never mind the bollocks, my banner would read:
Bringing passion to the cup - £200k
Bringing kids to the final - £110
Taking the cup home - PRICELESS!
Perfect.
Never mind the bollocks, my banner would read:
Bringing passion to the cup - £200k
Bringing kids to the final - £110
Taking the cup home - PRICELESS!
Brilliant. I'd donate a bedsheet for that.
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I always liked this one.
(http://thekopstand.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/this_is_a_sheet.jpg)
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I always liked this one.
(http://thekopstand.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/this_is_a_sheet.jpg)
Looks like its a used sheet with that shit stain on the left.
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"Sterling’s relationship with the Liverpool has deteriorated since giving an unauthorised interview to the BBC in which he insisted he was not a “money-grabber”.
From the Standard online today. They've seen the banner.
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"Sterling’s relationship with the Liverpool has deteriorated since giving an unauthorised interview to the BBC in which he insisted he was not a “money-grabber”.
From the Standard online today. They've seen the banner.
That tickled me no end.
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It's not even original. Here's St Pauli's version, which they've had for years:
http://fanshop.kicker.de/fc-st-pauli-t-shirt-never-mind.html
They managed to get the grammar right, though, and they're German.
Oh dear. That just makes the the Aston Villa banner completely and utterly embarrassing.
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We'd like to thank everybody who made the effort and donated, China has promised to get it sent out on time.
Due to a strong reaction we modified the flag.
Good luck at Wembley everybody!
(http://s18.postimg.org/458okgax1/fuck.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/458okgax1/)
Excellent, where do I donate?
what do you want to donate?
-
We'd like to thank everybody who made the effort and donated, China has promised to get it sent out on time.
Due to a strong reaction we modified the flag.
Good luck at Wembley everybody!
(http://s18.postimg.org/458okgax1/fuck.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/458okgax1/)
Excellent, where do I donate?
what do you want to donate?
Around £3,000 to send to China, and a kidney for good measure.
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Can't we just have a 'Norman Bites Yer Leg' bedsheet? It would be less embarrassing than that pile of crap.
Sometimes simple is the best. This is still my all time favourite Villa banner; Wembley 75:
(http://www.midlandsmemorabilia.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/aston-villa-coventry-city-football-programme-30-08-1975-news-and-record.jpg)
It's the the nuts.
Love the Villa In Space one.
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I will be throwing cans at my TV screen if I see that fucking flag containing "Arsenal" and "the Aston Villa".
I applaud the idea but it should have been a small bed sheet draped over the railings.
Woeful.
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Never mind the bollocks, my banner would read:
Bringing passion to the cup - £200k
Bringing kids to the final - £110
Taking the cup home - PRICELESS!
That is fantastic.
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What about some claret and blue ballons instead.
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Can't we just have a 'Norman Bites Yer Leg' bedsheet? It would be less embarrassing than that pile of crap.
Sometimes simple is the best. This is still my all time favourite Villa banner; Wembley 75:
(http://www.midlandsmemorabilia.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/aston-villa-coventry-city-football-programme-30-08-1975-news-and-record.jpg)
It's the the nuts.
I wonder if the silk scarf will ever make a comeback
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I still have my dad's silk scarf from the 1975 LC final. May need more than me wearing one round my wrist to create a full comeback though.
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I still have my dad's silk scarf from the 1975 LC final. May need more than me wearing one round my wrist to create a full comeback though.
you could be the starter, like you did with the the 19th minute thing
a leader of men
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If you don't all wear one on Sunday in support of Tim, then you all like willys. Or something like that.
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A couple of strange things in that wonderful photo- firstly, 3 rows above the Villa in Space photo is a man with a very large head, much larger than those around him. Secondly, about three fans to the left of him as you look, just under the sky blue flag, is a very sinister looking man who looks like he is in the wrong place.
-
Also, the gent nearest the top left-hand corner of the Villa In Space box is wearing some kind of Tyrolean hunting hat. I wonder when the Tyrolean hunting hat will make its return in the modern game.
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Also, the gent nearest the top left-hand corner of the Villa In Space box is wearing some kind of Tyrolean hunting hat. I wonder when the Tyrolean hunting hat will make its return in the modern game.
We could ask everyone to share on Twitter and Facebook and stuff and organise a mass Tyrolean hunting hat celebration day to show our support for Tim?
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"Never mind the Arsenal, here's our the Tyrolean hunting hats."
-
I've just googled Tyrolean Hunting hats,
there's a lot of them about, very popular in Austria
-
I hear they're very popular among Tyrolean hunters, especially when it's raining.
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I thought they were something worn in Game of Thrones.
-
So, basically:
- not funny
- not original
- not just about Villa
- not grammatically correct
It's not looking great. The best I am hoping for is
- not allowed in.
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If we must have a flag that mentions another team, I'd rather it was taking the piss out of Newcastle, for old times' sake.
-
They go down and we have a fecking massive "Who's Your Next Messiah? P.s. We're still laughing." banner surfing.
Or "Can you see this one Carver?"
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At the bottom, just left of Villa in Space is Frankie Abbot, the leather clad moron from Please Sir and the Fenn Street Gang. I guess Dennis Dunstable was in the other end.
-
I'd rather it said "I hate Wigan. Your pies are shit".
-
Is this rag actually happening then? If it is I'm not taking my seat till it's been and gone.
-
I'm upper tier. I may take a wazz on it.*
*Not really.*
*Probably.
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I'd rather it said "I hate the Wigan. Your pies are shit".
Fixed.
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Does anyone here go on MOMS? What do they all make of it? It's clearly the shittest flag ever.
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As it was their idea and they are paying for it, I'm assuming they love it.
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Ahhh wonderful delusion. I'll never understand the design but fair play to them. I will cringe a little if i see it on tv though.
-
They go down and we have a fecking massive "Who's Your Next Messiah? P.s. We're still laughing." banner surfing.
Or "Can you see this one Carver?"
Please someone do those banners if they go down this weekend! :D
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Can't we just have a 'Norman Bites Yer Leg' bedsheet? It would be less embarrassing than that pile of crap.
Sometimes simple is the best. This is still my all time favourite Villa banner; Wembley 75:
(http://www.midlandsmemorabilia.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/aston-villa-coventry-city-football-programme-30-08-1975-news-and-record.jpg)
It's the the nuts.
Love the Villa In Space one.
"VILLA IN SPACE" would make a great surfer flag, complete with picture of rocket. The rest of the watching football world would wonder what it was all about, and guess at it's meaning... Ambition, tactics, drugs, marking at corners, Tony Moon?
-
ASTON VILLA
or,
VILLA BLOODY VILLA
in that classic Black Sabbath 'Sabbath Bloody Sabbath' typeface.
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I'd like to think a massive banner with, 'Villa In Space' will feature at Wembley. Perhaps Randy could spring for a sky writer.
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Does anybody know what the story on pp 14 and 15 actually was?
I'm going for a crater on the Moon called Doug.
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How about a nod to our FA Cup history?
WIN IT
SHOW IT
NICK IT
MELT IT
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Does anybody know what the story on pp 14 and 15 actually was?
I'm going for a crater on the Moon called Doug.
I think it was a Villa supporter who visited Cape Canaveral on his holiday.
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Does anybody know what the story on pp 14 and 15 actually was?
I'm going for a crater on the Moon called Doug.
I think it was a Villa supporter who visited Cape Canaveral on his holiday.
Thanks. Just thinking, though; It's about time there was a star called Aston Villa, really, to complement the badge!
-
ASTON VILLA
or,
VILLA BLOODY VILLA
in that classic Black Sabbath 'Sabbath Bloody Sabbath' typeface.
ASTON
VILLA
MASTERS
OF
WEMBLEY
in slightly wobbly font.
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Well apparently it's paid for and ordered from a Chinese manufacturer, here's hoping it doesn't make it on time. Sorry if you like it but I think it's more than a bit shit.
-
With you, Jon. Like the idea, hate the realization of it. A poorly interpreted 40 year old album cover. Better to do nothing in this instance, imo.
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Yep, would rather no flag at all than that flag.
We have a really good club badge. What's wrong with just using that?
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It's so shit. I really admire his get up and go for sorting something out. But how come one persons crap idea be allowed to make us all look like twats on national TV?
I can hear people laughing and piss-taking now about how shit it is and that it just doesn't scan right.
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"We're the famous The Aston Villa and we're going to Wemberlee...."
"We are the famous, the famous, The Holte End"
"Holte Enders in the the sky"
"And it's The Aston Villa, The Aston Villa FC"
etc
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They could have gone with the classic Back in Black cover but we would probably have got something like
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7686/17960916152_53b04844af_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/tn9oC9)
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Well apparently it's paid for and ordered from a Chinese manufacturer, here's hoping it doesn't make it on time. Sorry if you like it but I think it's more than a bit shit.
I have had a word with the manufacturers and in order to save a few quid and rip off westerners they promise it is not compliant with UK fire regulations
-
Does anybody know what the story on pp 14 and 15 actually was?
I'm going for a crater on the Moon called Doug.
I think it was a Villa supporter who visited Cape Canaveral on his holiday.
And to think then that got you a spot on the front of the match day programme!
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They have some shit ideas on MOMS. Even their name is wank.
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They have some shit ideas on MOMS. Even their name is wank.
Isnt MOMS connected to the Brigada lot ?
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Call the Flag Police
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They have some shit ideas on MOMS. Even their name is wank.
Isnt MOMS connected to the Brigada lot ?
Not sure, but I'd be surprised if they put their name to it, their stuff is generally much better.
-
I like this game.
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5345/17969235752_59d2b3436c_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/tnT2Kw)
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I like this game.
(https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8890/17783121430_61d5903402_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/t6r9rU)
The Aston Villa. Get it right.
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Shit! You're right
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David Michael who runs MOMS spends a lorra lorry time with Brigada.
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Let's shove it up the the arse.
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I've always thought a nice big flag or banner thing would be one with just the silhouettes of all the things we've won. So, 7 (or, by the time it would happen, 8) FA cups, the European cup, the league cups, the trophies etc etc *
All that shit.
It basically says far more than any old trying to be clever shit referencing popular culture.
* i know someone else does this, but can't remember. It's a good idea, though
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Like the one we surf every home game you mean? ;)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5X7m-SIQAA0LqZ.jpg)
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Like the one we surf every home game you mean? ;)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5X7m-SIQAA0LqZ.jpg)
Is there any reason that flag can't go to Wembley?
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I assume because we're doing the scarves. It, or the old flag, was used at the semi but only surfed one section because of the mosaic. Not sure which flag as it didn't reach us so only saw the edge.
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Why are fucking around with tradition? Take the flag that got us to the final. We don't need something new. And I hope everyone will be wearing the same socks and underwear that they had on for the Liverpool game.
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Why are fucking around with tradition? Take the flag that got us to the final. We don't need something new. And I hope everyone will be wearing the same socks and underwear that they had on for the Liverpool game.
I've not took mine off.
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And I hope everyone will be wearing the same socks and underwear that they had on for the Liverpool game.
I still am. Doesn't everyone?
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It feels like corporate banter to me. I'd rather see this sort of thing.
(http://www.midlandsmemorabilia.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/webassets/aston-villa-fan-outside-wembley-1957-fa-cup-final.jpg)
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May be a little cynical, but MOMS have been selling the same design as a t-shirt so I'm assuming the design for the flag design was not only for convenience but also for free advertising and publicity under the veil of representing Villa fans and delivering a message.
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Like the one we surf every home game you mean? ;)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5X7m-SIQAA0LqZ.jpg)
No, on account of that not being what I described.
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I assume because we're doing the scarves. It, or the old flag, was used at the semi but only surfed one section because of the mosaic. Not sure which flag as it didn't reach us so only saw the edge.
It was the chequered one. And your logic re the mosaic makes complete sense.
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Like the one we surf every home game you mean? ;)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B5X7m-SIQAA0LqZ.jpg)
Is there any reason that flag can't go to Wembley?
i asked that earlier Paulie- evidently its too big for Wembley! Will only fit in the Holte lower! My garden shed...
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I have news, people. It seems it's not getting universal slating....
Unexpected support (http://redaction-gooners.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/joint-statement-from-arsenal-fans.html?m=1)
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The old flag was retired because it was worn in patches. At the semi final, they just surfed one edge of it (I think about a 1/3 or a 1/4 of the original size). The Club had already said that they may use sections of the old flag to surf in other parts of the ground such as The Lower North Stand.
Although we did the mosaic, the mini flag did look a bit rubbish, especially as Liverpool did have their massive flag. From the Villa end, we couldn't see the mosaic, we saw when it happened, and I think some people had the sense to look at the big screen, but I think most of us came out of Wembley with no idea what it had said or how good it looked.
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I have news, people. It seems it's not getting universal slating....
Unexpected support (http://redaction-gooners.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/joint-statement-from-arsenal-fans.html?m=1)
I said this right from the off, name checking Arsenal is a small time back handed compliment to them. It's like something I'd expect Small Heath to resort to. Just embarrassing.
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I have news, people. It seems it's not getting universal slating....
Unexpected support (http://redaction-gooners.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/joint-statement-from-arsenal-fans.html?m=1)
Cockney c**ts would like it.
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May be a little cynical, but MOMS have been selling the same design as a t-shirt so I'm assuming the design for the flag design was not only for convenience but also for free advertising and publicity under the veil of representing Villa fans and delivering a message.
Surely this is effectively advertising and not allowed in the crowd?
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I have news, people. It seems it's not getting universal slating....
Unexpected support (http://redaction-gooners.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/joint-statement-from-arsenal-fans.html?m=1)
Click bait plus I'd be delighted if Arsenal did something like this mentioning the Villa - in fact I'd go out of my way to support it.
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May be a little cynical, but MOMS have been selling the same design as a t-shirt so I'm assuming the design for the flag design was not only for convenience but also for free advertising and publicity under the veil of representing Villa fans and delivering a message.
Not cynical in the slightest. They do seem to like making money over there.
-
I've no problem with them making money, I just don't want them to do so in a way that makes us look shit. Why did they not consult before submitting the design? Surely anyone with an IQ higher than single figures could've told them that a flag mentioning Arsenal was petty and stupid.
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The flag might get a few seconds of exposure during a camera spanning the villa end,
I don't think it's anything to get our knickers in a twist over
It's going to be a massive day, the flag will be a total irelavance in my opinion
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The old flag was retired because it was worn in patches. At the semi final, they just surfed one edge of it (I think about a 1/3 or a 1/4 of the original size). The Club had already said that they may use sections of the old flag to surf in other parts of the ground such as The Lower North Stand.
Although we did the mosaic, the mini flag did look a bit rubbish, especially as Liverpool did have their massive flag. From the Villa end, we couldn't see the mosaic, we saw when it happened, and I think some people had the sense to look at the big screen, but I think most of us came out of Wembley with no idea what it had said or how good it looked.
You could see the mosaic from 2/3 of the ground, and it looked unbelievably good. It was a real shiver-down-the-spine moment, and the Scousers sat near us all commented on it. It really should be repeated if it isn't too late.
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The flag might get a few seconds of exposure during a camera spanning the villa end,
I don't think it's anything to get our knickers in a twist over
It's going to be a massive day, the flag will be a total irelavance in my opinion
Agreed. Like many others I think the design isn't great but at least they've had the gumption to do something so I'm not going to be too harsh on them. I think everyone is taking the flag thing a bit too seriously. The main thing is we create as much noise as possible, support the team throughout and come home with the big eared cup!
-
I think the blocks of scarves is the 'upgrade' on the mosaic, and would have an ongoing lesser colour impact throughout, presuming we all have a bit on display round our necks etc.
I share the view that it's great people just get on and do stuff, just regret we define ourself in opposition to another team.
Imagine if it was never mind the 'homophobia' or something worthwhile saying, there's so much positive stuff we could say, to actually shine a good light on the club, something about safe standing, loads of stuff that could profile Villa still as we have been, leaders in the game, holders of the right values. This isn't as classy as one expects from Villa fans.
-
Although we did the mosaic, the mini flag did look a bit rubbish, especially as Liverpool did have their massive flag. From the Villa end, we couldn't see the mosaic, we saw when it happened, and I think some people had the sense to look at the big screen, but I think most of us came out of Wembley with no idea what it had said or how good it looked.
I was underneath the mosaic so couldn't see it and was looking at the screen throughout but for some reason the editor chose not to show it.
-
We were to the side of the mosaic and had no idea what it said. I only knew in the car home when I saw a picture of it on Facebook, I think by Risso. It looked fantastic though, i've said before, a lot of non Villa fans I know, sometimes grudgingly, commented on how good it looked.
-
The mosaic looked great on TV. What would be ace is if they did another mosaic, the one Randy restored on the Holte. That would look ace.
-
speaking of flags the Xavi flag at the Camp Nou tonight is fucking immense
(http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/live-experience/cps/512/mcs/media/images/83191000/jpg/_83191162_xavibanner_epa.jpg)
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speaking of flags the Xavi flag at the Camp Nou tonight is fucking immense
(http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/live-experience/cps/512/mcs/media/images/83191000/jpg/_83191162_xavibanner_epa.jpg)
That is impressive. The mosaic looks awesome as well.
To put my two penneth in, I think the flag design is terrible. It shouldn't mention Arsenal. What's wrong with a flag like the one we have in The Holte?
-
It's awful.
-
It's awful.
Agree 100%, that looks bloody terrible!
-
I'm confused, what's awful? Apart from the The Aston Villa abomination.
-
I'm confused, what's awful? Apart from the The Aston Villa abomination.
I don't think he was suggesting the Xavi flag. At least I'm assuming he was referring to the proposed Villa flag.
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I'm confused, what's awful? Apart from the The Aston Villa abomination.
I don't think he was suggesting the Xavi flag. At least I'm assuming he was referring to the proposed Villa flag.
This.
-
I'm hoping the notoriously efficient Chinese will be uncharacteristically incredibly inefficient this week.
The Aston Villa bugs me even more than the mention of Arsenal.
-
The flag might as well say:
"Hello. We're a smalltime outfit with no grasp of our own language. Bye.”
-
Apart from the fact that it is basically a nu-football half and half flag abomination, how did they not see that it doesn't fucking scan.
Here's the Sex Pistols = 5 syllables. Here's Aston Villa = 5 syllables.
And here's another 3 syllables: fucking twats!
-
THE Aston Villa. THE fucking Aston Villa. And enough people contributed money, actual money, money they had to earn and could have spent on beer or the kids, to fund it. I haven't had this sense of disbelief and disappointment in my fellow man since the election.
-
Can't we have a vote to ban the abomination?
Maybe a Kickstarter to have it intercepted before it reaches Europe?
-
Can't we have a vote to ban the abomination?
Maybe a Kickstarter to have it intercepted before it reaches Europe?
I was thinking more a giant safety pin & alternative message to cover the arsenal bit, in keeping with the rather faux punk effort. Proper punk is Fugazi. Ethic not image. Straight edge innit.
-
Is there a nuclear option?
-
Again, if the initiators ever read this, massive credit for making the effort, just sorry all the content is so unfavourable...to the point of being unwanted/embarrassing. It's not a nice feeling to wish a villa fan project didn't happen :/
-
He calls his own idea "incredibly iconic", Jesus wept.
This puts me in mind of Desmond Olivier Dingle and The National Theatre of Brent's Iconic Icons.
Here is the episode Tracey Emin and How She Done the Bed (http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00tbhbf#auto)
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My feeling is that the flag will be come, go and quickly be forgotten. If the premise that it doesn't interfere with the "scarf mosaic" holds true then the sight of 25,000 Villa fans decorating Wembley in claret and blue will be quite impressive from the other end of the ground.
I can also see the scarves being useful and inspiring during the match...again 25,000 claret and blue Villa helicopter scarves in motion will provide a pretty awesome visual, and potentially for the whole game rather than a few minutes before.
-
If it was just The Villa, but here comes The Aston Villa!! Idiots
-
Maybe we should borrow the Xavi flag, it would be less embarassing.
-
It would appear Wembley have banned the flag. Because it mentions Arsenal.
-
That was always on the cards. Right decision on the grounds it was shite.
-
The the correct decision.
-
We all said we'd rather have a flag concentrating on Villa than referring to the other team. I do have sympathy and always support initiatives funded and supported by fans, but I'm quite glad that flag won't be aired around the world as a representation of me as a Villa fan.
-
I didn't like the the flag but I like censorship even less.
Having said that I hope Wembley also ban half and half scarves that mention Arsenal too.
-
I didn't like the the flag but I like censorship even less.
Having said that I hope Wembley also ban half and half scarves that mention Arsenal too.
My take onit. Fuck the FA!
-
To be fair I have a degree of sympathy, the flag didn't make sense on several levels but as you say DeKuip the censorship/sterility issue is ridiculous.
Advertise beer & gambling that's just fine, sing songs about shitting on the city & the cockneys, but heaven forbid anyone who mentions the other team on an oversized bed sheet.
-
To be fair I have a degree of sympathy, the flag didn't make sense on several levels but as you say DeKuip the censorship/sterility issue is ridiculous.
Advertise beer & gambling that's just fine, sing songs about shitting on the city & the cockneys, but heaven forbid anyone who mentions the other team on an oversized bed sheet.
It wasn't in the least bit offensive, just crap
-
It would appear Wembley have banned the flag. Because it mentions Arsenal.
Excellent.
Finally, the football business gets something right.
-
How much was it £2,000? Ha!
Fools and their money are easily departed.
-
http://(http://thumbsnap.com/s/O93HzkNG.jpg)|http://thumbsnap.com/O93HzkNG (http://[img width=400 height=300)
-
They have some shit ideas on MOMS. Even their name is wank.
Isnt MOMS connected to the Brigada lot ?
I assumed so - this flag reminded me of some of their efforts.
-
Feel sorry for those that donated, but ultimately the right decision.
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aston-villa-v-arsenal-villa-9332222?
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There is still time to create a 'Fuck the Fuckers' mosaic.
I think we could do it if we had enough post it notes.
-
The the correct decision.
The this.
-
Why didn't they just have an iconic Villa one that could be used more than just this game?
-
I'm sure I read somewhere that they said Wembley had agreed to it before they had raised the money.
-
Apparently the idea is to use the bottom part in the lower North. £3k on a flag and they plan to cut it up. And didn't bother checking if Wembley would allow it. Genius.
-
The the correct decision.
The this.
The flag might be shit but it doesn't make it the correct decision. Funny Liverpool got away with one twice the regulatory size.
-
Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
-
Can't wait for the MOMS end of season Piss up, they're trying to arrange it at Marston's in Burton so I believe.
-
The The The were a decent band.
Apparently this is the only band whose records people from Leeds can never ask for when entering a shop.
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There is still time to create a 'Fuck the Fuckers' mosaic.
I think we could do it if we had enough post it notes.
Silhouettes of the FA, BBC and Arsenal logos and Steven Gerrard's rat-face at the top; at the bottom the legend: FUCK THE FUCKERS in a speech bubble emanating from the cheeky grin of the 'Villa Villain' Clarry Blue.
Can someone please knock this up on photoshop? I'll send it to China with a cheque for three grand - I think we still have time.
-
Best news I've heard all day.
-
Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
Absolutely. I fucking hate the FA, Wembley and everyone else who seem to take pleasure in turning the Cup Final into an expensive, sanitised, TV-friendly, fan-unfriendly, corporate snouts in trough session. I honestly can't think of an organisation that I dislike as much as the FA. I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
-
Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
It would have been more palatable if they'd come out with
"We don't like to say it, but it's not coming in because it's a bit shit."
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
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Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
Absolutely. I fucking hate the FA, Wembley and everyone else who seem to take pleasure in turning the Cup Final into an expensive, sanitised, TV-friendly, fan-unfriendly, corporate snouts in trough session. I honestly can't think of an organisation that I dislike as much as the FA. I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
I'm not a great fan of the flag but I totally agree with Chico.
Even if they just cut out the word 'Arse' and wave that about.
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What an almighty cock-up.
Maybe it was Randy's idea.
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Apparently the idea is to use the bottom part in the lower North. £3k on a flag and they plan to cut it up. And didn't bother checking if Wembley would allow it. Genius.
I know it is all done with good intentions and what not, but this is just like that "don't watch the first eight minutes of the game in protest" brainwave they had.
So many problems glaringly obvious, but not one of them managed to spot them.
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Apparently the idea is to use the bottom part in the lower North. £3k on a flag and they plan to cut it up. And didn't bother checking if Wembley would allow it. Genius.
Wasn't there a link on here on Friday to a press release from Arsenal fan groups saying they had been contacted ~(by the FA??) about the banner and saw no reason for it not to be allowed into the ground. I certainly got the impression it was a done deal.
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Even though it's not to everyones tastes, a lot of effort has been put in, seems unfair to just shrug it off and cheer that it can't be used
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the flag is a bit shit, granted. but it's shame they didn't get all this clarified before getting it into production
i just read the first choice of design was a 'have you ever won the European Cup?' one ... dear fucking God. possibly the most cringe worthy and embarassing song we've ever had
we've probably got off lightly with this eyesore
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I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
They were told to stick their flag up their arse, which would be one way of making this happen.
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I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
They were told to stick their flag up their arse, which would be one way of making this happen.
You'd need a really big arse though. What's Gareth Barry up to this Saturday?
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It's all good publicity.
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
What's wrong with that? Would you rather we won the cup when nobody was looking?
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
What's wrong with that? Would you rather we won the cup when nobody was looking?
He's right. It should be 3pm. We'll be there to see it, i don't care how many people round the world do.
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So old men are dangerous, but Dyke doesn't even know what time kick-off is.
Greg Dyke also defended the 5.15pm kick-off time for the final, insisting only “purists” or “old men” wanted it returned to its traditional 3pm slot.
“The purists would still want the FA Cup final at 3pm on the last Saturday of the season,” he said.
“But, actually, you get a much bigger audience at 5.30pm than you do at 3pm.
“You look at some of the big clubs – Manchester United or Chelsea – they hardly play on a Saturday at 3pm anymore.
“But as this generation go through, people who are 20 or 30 today, they have never known anything else. It has always been like that.
“Old men are always dangerous. You should never let them make the decisions because actually want they want is yesterday. And yesterday doesn’t exist.”
Lineker, meanwhile, called for fifth-round and quarter-final FA Cup replays to be abolished.
“Personally, I would definitely scrap them. I think it would also help our sides in the Champions League, which we need to improve on.”
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So old men are dangerous, but Dyke doesn't even know what time kick-off is.
Greg Dyke also defended the 5.15pm kick-off time for the final, insisting only “purists” or “old men” wanted it returned to its traditional 3pm slot.
“The purists would still want the FA Cup final at 3pm on the last Saturday of the season,” he said.
“But, actually, you get a much bigger audience at 5.30pm than you do at 3pm.
“You look at some of the big clubs – Manchester United or Chelsea – they hardly play on a Saturday at 3pm anymore.
“But as this generation go through, people who are 20 or 30 today, they have never known anything else. It has always been like that.
“Old men are always dangerous. You should never let them make the decisions because actually want they want is yesterday. And yesterday doesn’t exist.”
Lineker, meanwhile, called for fifth-round and quarter-final FA Cup replays to be abolished.
“Personally, I would definitely scrap them. I think it would also help our sides in the Champions League, which we need to improve on.”
Sorry Mr. Dyke for being an old man and wanting the FA Cup to be something special again, like it was in the 70's and 80's when I was growing up.
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So old men are dangerous, but Dyke doesn't even know what time kick-off is.
Greg Dyke also defended the 5.15pm kick-off time for the final, insisting only “purists” or “old men” wanted it returned to its traditional 3pm slot.
“The purists would still want the FA Cup final at 3pm on the last Saturday of the season,” he said.
“But, actually, you get a much bigger audience at 5.30pm than you do at 3pm.
“You look at some of the big clubs – Manchester United or Chelsea – they hardly play on a Saturday at 3pm anymore.
“But as this generation go through, people who are 20 or 30 today, they have never known anything else. It has always been like that.
“Old men are always dangerous. You should never let them make the decisions because actually want they want is yesterday. And yesterday doesn’t exist.”
Lineker, meanwhile, called for fifth-round and quarter-final FA Cup replays to be abolished.
“Personally, I would definitely scrap them. I think it would also help our sides in the Champions League, which we need to improve on.”
What does he mean 'yesterday dosen't exist'?
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
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Not a huge fan of the design but it was good to see the Arsenal fans siding with us over it, apparently, according to the article in the Standard, they were actually quite flattered to get a mention on it! Way to go Gooners! - sorry in advance for ruining your weekend x.
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Bar a couple of TV inspired occasions it's never played on the last day of the league season either. An ill informed sound bite.
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There is still time to create a 'Fuck the Fuckers' mosaic.
I think we could do it if we had enough post it notes.
We should definitely do this!
:D
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Let's get a new trophy whilst we're at it Gregg, the current one is yesterday's design. Maybe replace it with a plane shaped one, Emirates would love that.
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
What point are you trying to prove with that?
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
Singing Abide with me is going to be one of the highlights of the day for me, have no idea why you'd want to ruin that.
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So old men are dangerous, but Dyke doesn't even know what time kick-off is.
Greg Dyke also defended the 5.15pm kick-off time for the final, insisting only “purists” or “old men” wanted it returned to its traditional 3pm slot.
“The purists would still want the FA Cup final at 3pm on the last Saturday of the season,” he said.
“But, actually, you get a much bigger audience at 5.30pm than you do at 3pm.
“You look at some of the big clubs – Manchester United or Chelsea – they hardly play on a Saturday at 3pm anymore.
“But as this generation go through, people who are 20 or 30 today, they have never known anything else. It has always been like that.
“Old men are always dangerous. You should never let them make the decisions because actually want they want is yesterday. And yesterday doesn’t exist.”
Lineker, meanwhile, called for fifth-round and quarter-final FA Cup replays to be abolished.
“Personally, I would definitely scrap them. I think it would also help our sides in the Champions League, which we need to improve on.”
What does he mean 'yesterday dosen't exist'?
Brum musician Christine Perfect reckons yesterday's gone as well, maaan.
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It's all good publicity.
Well, it is clearly getting more publicity by being banned than if it had been unfurled; the media is awash with the story. Given the Sex Pistols theme of the flag, maybe they have a Machiavellian Malcy Mclaren figure over at MOMS and this is a cunning ruse.
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What came first, the flag or the t-shirts? Not that I'm cynical or anything.
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There is still time to create a 'Fuck the Fuckers' mosaic.
I think we could do it if we had enough post it notes.
Silhouettes of the FA, BBC and Arsenal logos and Steven Gerrard's rat-face at the top; at the bottom the legend: FUCK THE FUCKERS in a speech bubble emanating from the cheeky grin of the 'Villa Villain' Clarry Blue.
Can someone please knock this up on photoshop? I'll send it to China with a cheque for three grand - I think we still have time.
It was all made up but the fa wouldn't allow any reference to Gerrard
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
Yeah, if we try really hard we could try and ruin all of the things that make the FA Cup Final great.
Any other bright ideas?
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
What's wrong with that? Would you rather we won the cup when nobody was looking?
He's right. It should be 3pm.
Why?
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I couldn't care less if it kicked off at 2.00 on a Thursday morning as long as we win the sodding thing.
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
Yeah, if we try really hard we could try and ruin all of the things that make the FA Cup Final great.
Any other bright ideas?
One of the highlights for me too. I know I'll be choked up to fuck when it's playing, same as I was in 2000. Leave it alone!
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Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
Absolutely. I fucking hate the FA, Wembley and everyone else who seem to take pleasure in turning the Cup Final into an expensive, sanitised, TV-friendly, fan-unfriendly, corporate snouts in trough session. I honestly can't think of an organisation that I dislike as much as the FA. I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
FIFA
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Those pesky, busybodies at the Football Supporters Federation should keep there bloody noses out of our business and the Arsenal fans should be extremely offended.
As much as I think the flag is bollocks, fair play to all for coming together and telling the FA to do one with their sanitisied opinion. I think we may see a u-turn from the FA in the coming days.
Absolutely. I fucking hate the FA, Wembley and everyone else who seem to take pleasure in turning the Cup Final into an expensive, sanitised, TV-friendly, fan-unfriendly, corporate snouts in trough session. I honestly can't think of an organisation that I dislike as much as the FA. I'd love it if they somehow sneaked this flag in and unfurled it just to spite the FA.
FIFA
ISIS, the SS...
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Everyone of us should belt out "Holte Enders in the sky " when that abide with me shite is being played
Yeah, let's make us all look like a bunch of bloody wankers.
Honestly, all this because the FA refused us permission to display a shitty flag that would have made us look like a bunch of small time losers.
I'm with the FA on this one.
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We seem to have an increasing number of selfish wanker fans. The twat with the drum, who, to my knowledge has never asked anyone if they mind being deafened for half the game by his inane dross is one. The arse who wants us to pay for a flag but didn't bother to consult on the design before handing out the begging bowl is another one.
I hope the FA tell the flagtwat to bugger off and Villa ban the selfish drumtwat next season.
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We seem to have an increasing number of selfish wanker fans. The twat with the drum, who, to my knowledge has never asked anyone if they mind being deafened for half the game by his inane dross is one. The arse who wants us to pay for a flag but didn't bother to consult on the design before handing out the begging bowl is another one.
I hope the FA tell the flagtwat to bugger off and Villa ban the selfish drumtwat next season.
Hear hear.
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
What's wrong with that? Would you rather we won the cup when nobody was looking?
He's right. It should be 3pm.
Why?
Because it's tradition. They've already messed around with it enough.
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Another example of which is the ludicrous 5.30 kick off time to appeal to a 'global' audience. What a load of crap.
What's wrong with that? Would you rather we won the cup when nobody was looking?
He's right. It should be 3pm.
Why?
Because it's tradition. They've already messed around with it enough.
"It's tradition" is no argument unless you can argue it's a valid tradition. See fox-hunting, for instance. In any case, it's not exactly a long-lasting tradition and most pre-floodlit era finals kicked off earlier (ie the finals when Villa used to sometimes win it!)
People who complain that "nobody cares about the FA Cup anymore" will often be the ones that complain when they attempt to make more people care by bringing it to a wider audience.
I think there needs to be a balance between the best interests of the watching TV audience and those of us who are able to attend games. Too often for my liking that balance is shifted too far in favour of broadcasters with scant regard for the paying public.
For instance, there have been occasions when Villa have played at Newcastle before the first train from
Birmingham arrives while Man Utd play Man City in a later game. A tiny bit of common sense would say those could be swapped around.
Regarding the Final, they could be really inconsiderate and stick it on a week night. They'd almost certainly get a much bigger audience if they did so, but it would be an absolute pain to get there, involving booking a day off work and making attendance all but impossible for school age fans.
They haven't done that though. They've moved it by a couple of hours as they believe it will attract a bigger audience and boost its flagging profile.
My main gripes were that the FA Cup Final was being played on the same day as Premier League matches, it no longer is. I also always think it should be the finale of the domestic season. It is again.
I'd probably just about prefer a 3pm start. However, with those two amendments made I'm not going to worry too much about moving it by a couple of hours.
In fifty years time, a 5.30pm kick off will be "the tradition".
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They haven't moved the kick off time to boost it's flagging profile, they've moved it to boost their own profits.
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"It's tradition" is no argument unless you can argue it's a valid tradition. See fox-hunting, for instance. In any case, it's not exactly a long-lasting tradition and most pre-floodlit era finals kicked off earlier (ie the finals when Villa used to sometimes win it!)
Take a wild guess what time the 1923 FA Cup final kicked off.
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"It's tradition" is no argument unless you can argue it's a valid tradition. See fox-hunting, for instance. In any case, it's not exactly a long-lasting tradition and most pre-floodlit era finals kicked off earlier (ie the finals when Villa used to sometimes win it!)
Take a wild guess what time the 1923 FA Cup final kicked off.
I don't know, but all those people on the pitch, what a depressing flash forward to the bad years of the 1980s
*Jonathan Pearce face*
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I'll say 11am. Or you're going to prove me wrong and say it was 3pm after all...
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They haven't moved the kick off time to boost it's flagging profile, they've moved it to boost their own profits.
Well, maybe. However it's happened though, the competition has regained some of the esteem it lost when the Final played second fiddle to Premier League games. 3pm or 5.30pm is neither here nor there.
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A coupe of hours might not be significant to us, but if one of the north eastern teams was in the final, they'd probably find extra time & penalties would complicate their journey home somewhat. There is no chance that the decision would be any different if the fans had further to travel.
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Agree. I would hope train companies would lay on extra trains in such circumstances.
The real traditionalists would never have got rid of cup final replays which would've been much, much more awkward than a 5.30pm kick off.
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Virgin Trains are the official shirt sponsor of Preston North End, and last week they had to issue an apology for not being able to get PNE fans back from their play off final due to a 5.30 kick off.
So no, they wouldn't.
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They haven't moved the kick off time to boost it's flagging profile, they've moved it to boost their own profits.
Well, maybe. However it's happened though, the competition has regained some of the esteem it lost when the Final played second fiddle to Premier League games. 3pm or 5.30pm is neither here nor there.
Which happened maybe twice, and also used to be a regular thing.
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Probably because they'd anticipated a strike which never happened, and it was the day before a Bank Holiday so they may have had lots of staff on leave.
If there's a choice between taking money off 25,000 Geordies/Mackems and not taking it, I reckon most train companies would probably rather have a few extra trains and maximise their profits.
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.........Or just sting them for the overnight sleeper at twice the price of a regular train - it all works for someone, but not the fan.
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If there's a choice between taking money off 25,000 Geordies/Mackems and not taking it, I reckon most train companies would probably rather have a few extra trains and maximise their profits.
They weren't exactly begging for the business when Man City played Wigan.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2309785/FA-Cup-final-5-15pm-kick--Manchester-City-v-Wigan--train-firm-rescue-fans.html
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They haven't moved the kick off time to boost it's flagging profile, they've moved it to boost their own profits.
Well, maybe. However it's happened though, the competition has regained some of the esteem it lost when the Final played second fiddle to Premier League games. 3pm or 5.30pm is neither here nor there.
Which happened maybe twice, and also used to be a regular thing.
Sadly, it'll probably continue to happen in every Euro/World Cup year, and in ones where Wembley has been selected to host the Champions League Final.
I'm not particularly bothered about traditions, as I've said. I think what is best for the FA Cup is for the Final to be last game of the season and not played on the same day as any league games. I think that if this isn't the case, regardless of how often it happened in the past, the FA Cup's reputation will suffer.
I think that moving the game from 3pm to 5.30pm will cause no damage whatsoever to the competition's esteem.
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Probably because they'd anticipated a strike which never happened, and it was the day before a Bank Holiday so they may have had lots of staff on leave.
If there's a choice between taking money off 25,000 Geordies/Mackems and not taking it, I reckon most train companies would probably rather have a few extra trains and maximise their profits.
They can't do that anymore, with different train companies, Railtrack and all that bollocks. If only there was some way of having all the rail network under one ownership, possibly with the profits being utilised for the public good.
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Probably because they'd anticipated a strike which never happened, and it was the day before a Bank Holiday so they may have had lots of staff on leave.
If there's a choice between taking money off 25,000 Geordies/Mackems and not taking it, I reckon most train companies would probably rather have a few extra trains and maximise their profits.
They can't do that anymore, with different train companies, Railtrack and all that bollocks. If only there was some way of having all the rail network under one ownership, possibly with the profits being utilised for the public good.
Nah, it's surely much better to have far more expensive tickets through privatised train companies, companies which still need enormous government subsidies, thus giving us the most expensive train tickets in Europe AND one of the highest government subsidies for the industry.
Brilliant.
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It's hardly impossible for train companies not to be shit.
Extra trains for Villa...
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/aston-villa-fa-cup-trains-9329401
Extra trains for Hull...
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/fa-league-cups/fa-cup-final-hull-city-fans-will-be-able-to-travel-home-as-extra-trains-put-on-for-wembley-final-with-arsenal-9267454.html
Extra trains for Aberdeen...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-26352002
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Oh, I still agree that trains should be renationalised by the way, I just put a few random links that came up by Googling "extra trains cup final".
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Anyway, sorry for derailing (geddit???) the thread.
Back on topic.
The flag. Shit, innit?
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Well if the decision to ban the flag isn't overturned, it will at least be a case of the FA reaching a decent decision. Just a pity it's for the wrong reasons.
It doesn't scan, it's small time and it's a bit shit. All fair enough.
It might be considered inflammatory because it uses the world Arsenal? Get real.
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
Oh my God these guys have no idea what they're talking about and need to shut up.
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"Take Arsenal on in the stands".
Somebody call me a doctor, I can't get my toes uncurled.
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
I think he should look a bit closer to home when it comes to his clueless comment.
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Well if the decision to ban the flag isn't overturned, it will at least be a case of the FA reaching a decent decision. Just a pity it's for the wrong reasons.
It doesn't scan, it's small time and it's a bit shit. All fair enough.
It might be considered inflammatory because it uses the world Arsenal? Get real.
That's it really isn't it.
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Now they're blaming the club for their self inflicted bed sheet disaster. You couldn't make this stuff up.
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Has mom missed the point that we're also having scarves, paid for by the club? And we're really going for a claret and blue theme!
Maybe if he/she/they had engaged a brain when designing the the flag the reaction to it would have been positive from both Villa fans and the FA.
One thing's for sure, a flag isn't going to affect either the noise levels or who wins the cup.
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I think we all know that we will out-sing the Arsenal fans easily
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
Is this a football match or a carnival?
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
That's pretty mental stuff.
Announce you're going to make a massive flag, then get the massive hump when people don't like it and feel entitled to say so.
Here's an idea, why didn't you ask supporters about the design on the flag before presenting it as a fait accompli?
Oh and "go wild in the stadium" sounds like something David Mellor would say.
As for the Arsenal statement supporting it, they've reproduced their reply on the MOMS site in full, which includes this paragraph:
We are flattered that the Villa fans consider us worthy of being included on their banner and see absolutely no reason why Arsenal fans should consider it anything other than what it is, a well designed idea with no intention to cause any offence or incite bad feeling between the fans.
"flattered" - can't they see that that's a perfect example of the things people were criticising in the first place?
Why name check the name of the club we're playing? It makes us look like plucky Burton Albion on a rare day out against some premier league giant.
I can put up with the nonsensical grammar, and the "inciting trouble" line is utter shite, but to me that banner looks incredibly small-time.
To then get the hump because some people point this out is beyond parody. Maybe they should have thought about it before now, rather than leaving it to the last minute? The semi final was on April 19th. That's a 5-6 week gap between then and the final.
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
That's pretty mental stuff.
Announce you're going to make a massive flag, then get the massive hump when people don't like it and feel entitled to say so.
Here's an idea, why didn't you ask supporters about the design on the flag before presenting it as a fait accompli.
Oh and "go wild in the stands" sounds like something David Mellor would say.
As for the Arsenal statement supporting it, they've reproduced their reply on the MOMS site in full, which includes this paragraph:
We are flattered that the Villa fans consider us worthy of being included on their banner and see absolutely no reason why Arsenal fans should consider it anything other than what it is, a well designed idea with no intention to cause any offence or incite bad feeling between the fans.
"flattered" - can't they see that that's a perfect example of the things people were criticising in the first place?
Why name check the name of the club we're playing? It makes us look like plucky Burton Albion on a rare day out against some premier league giant.
I can put up with the nonsensical grammar, and the "inciting trouble" line is utter shite, but to me that banner looks incredibly small-time.
To then get the hump because some people point this out is beyond parody. Maybe they should have thought about it before now, rather than leaving it to the last minute? The semi final was on April 19th. That's a 5-6 week gap between then and the final.
Speaking as a clueless toxic w****r, I don't feel qualified to comment.
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Oh and "go wild in the stadium" sounds like something David Mellor would say.
This is red hot soccer chat.
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I find the idea that fans weren't consulted a little odd in this situation.
He put it out on social media, and said 'if you want it, we've got 24 hours to raise £2000 for it'
The fact that they did, with both money and time to spare, can I think be construed as a fair level of support for the flag. Also - having been involved in consultations, I can tell you that the level of apathy is usually overwhelming until you do something people disagree with, and then suddenly everyone has an opinion.
(Look at that Wembley song consultation - 'Aston Villa That's Who' was actually an overwhelming winner, and then everyone who didn't vote was outraged that we would be accompanied by something so shit.)
I get that no-one here likes it, and I can identify with the reasons why, but it isn't actually fair to say that he didn't consult. If there wasn't a significant number of Villa fans who wanted it, it wouldn't have got off the ground.
The T-shirts were for sale for quite a long time ahead of the flag. I have to say that the banning of the flag, does provide an excellent sales pitch for the T-shirts!To be honest, the level of misery in this forum about the flag tempted me to buy one just to annoy everyone!
MOMs bloke can be a bit of a pain in ass at times, but he gets stuff done, and for that reason, I try to be supportive of him.
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Getting off your arse and doing something is great but I've never ever heard our club referred to as 'The Aston Villa'. 'The Villa' yes, but never that.
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I find the idea that fans weren't consulted a little odd in this situation.
He put it out on social media, and said 'if you want it, we've got 24 hours to raise £2000 for it'
The fact that they did, with both money and time to spare, can I think be construed as a fair level of support for the flag.
This is what he said on the funding page:
DESIGN
There's no time to mull over designs. The 'Villa Pistols' design though has the perfect underdog attitude going up against one of the football establishment's 'Sky Four'. The design is iconic and will be known by football supporters around the world watching the game, as it draws from a classic design (and a bloody good album too).
Like you said, it was "do you want this", which is a totally different thing to, say, giving people designs to choose from.
The fact that lots of people contributed to it is fine, clearly they did want it. The point I was getting at is that implying people are "toxic" for not liking it is pretty poor.
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Getting off your arse and doing something is great but I've never ever heard our club referred to as 'The Aston Villa'. 'The Villa' yes, but never that.
Not me - but the original wording is 'The Sex Pistols'. I can see why people think its odd, but surely people can also see why it's The Aston Villa in this context.
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We're not toxic, we just don't like it.
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The song survey gave people designs to choose from. The badge gave people designs to choose from. See how well those turned out.
I actually think - Do you want this or not? Is a better, more honest, question. Other than the choices thing taking too long, people would be asked to donate without knowing what design they were donating for. In short - people will always moan!
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....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.
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"The Clueless Toxic W*****s" sounds like the name of a Manics tribute act.
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True enough, people will always moan. But by the same chalk, sometimes they'll have a point. People aren't moaning for the sake of it. They're moaning because they've seen a few things they don't like.
One of the things people pointed out was the mentioning of another club, which as it happens, although for bureaucratic reasons, has turned out to be a problem. I can't help thinking that, given the amount of time, it might have make sense to ask people - not just because of the mentioning Arsenal, but also the "The" thing - and maybe it would have been avoided?
The intentions were noble, though, like the intentions behind the Liverpool match protest. The problem is, it has turned out - again - to not be very well thought out.
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....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.
Nobody asked him to do it. If you do something like this off your own bat you should expect that not everyone will agree with you. To then call everyone who does disagree "clueless toxic wankers" isn't the brightest.
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I can totally see why people don't like it, but by the same token, a lot of people clearly do.
In retrospect, talking to the club about how we might get out Holte End flag down there may have worked out better, or may have come to nothing at all. I think we need to accept that the wasn't time for a survey, or consultation period, it was do it or not do it. Many will wish he hadn't, and others will be glad he has and be right behind it.
This forum has a general consensus about the flag, which makes us think 'This is what Villa fans think about it' - but we are a small section of Villa fans, and H&V has a culture which means that whilst we might be largely of one mind on it, that doesn't mean all Villa fans are of the same mind.
In the end, it will happen or not. Like the song, it will pass largely unnoticed after everyone being so concerned about it. The fuss created by the ban will give it far more attention than it should have had, but could also mean that the BBC don't show it! One thing I am picking up, is that other sets if fans are getting behind it, because of the ban, the original meaning of the flag is gaining greater significance - its gaining some anti-establishment credentials. I really don't believe it is the embarrassment that people fear it is.
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....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.
I didn't mean to appear sensitive, I was just making a reference to the O'Leary "fickle" incident.
Although I don't actually like the flag.
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NEVER MIND
THE VILLA
HERE'S THE
CLueLeSs toXiC WanKErS
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This forum has a general consensus about the flag, which makes us think 'This is what Villa fans think about it' - but we are a small section of Villa fans, and H&V has a culture which means that whilst we might be largely of one mind on it, that doesn't mean all Villa fans are of the same mind.
That's true.
Mind you, so are the people who saw the crowdfunding campaign and thought it was a good idea in the first place.
re the club, that's a good point regarding the Holte flag. Wonder why that wasn't an option?
Although aren't they doing some sort of scarf thing, involving some having home scarves and some away?
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NEVER MIND
THE VILLA
HERE'S THE
CLueLeSs toXiC WanKErS
Very good.
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I'm not happy about the FA 'banning' this flag if that's what they've done, but the very fact that that it name checks the opponents (small time), adds the prefix (The) and scans badly is enough for me to think that it would've been a lot better if they'd have taken the time to research it.
There are some Villa fans who have a soft spot for Doug Ellis.
If they had got the money together, they could've had a huge flag featuring the old boy on it and I reckon it would've garnered an equal amount of debate.
Come to think of it, 'The Doug Ellis' scans much better.
*Hello China? About that flag we've ordered...*
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I don't think I meant you, I don't even particularly mean the other person that mentioned it. I think anyone can get sensitive about being called 'clueless toxic wankers' to be fair, but I just thought we need to take into account why he might have got to that point!
I remember being at the great Les Milner's funeral. He was the man who grew the amazing St Basil's organisation for young homeless people from letting 2 homeless kids sleep on the floor of his youth club, to a multi hostel organisation, providing not only shelter, but advice and support for thousands of young people who struggled to find any stability anywhere else in their young lives. It was the first funeral I had ever been to where the deceased didn't turn into a Saint. People got up to talk about him and called him stubborn, belligerent, unreasonable & a whole host of other unflattering adjectives.......and then said that that was how he got stuff done.
I really don't wish to put MOMs bloke in anything like the same league as Les Milner - as running a twitter & Facebook account for Villa fans isn't in the same league as helping young homeless people, but I think the same applies. He is always going to piss people off, because people who get stuff done invariably do.
Anyway - I only today thought of my favourite ever Wembley banner - back in 1975.
'Aston Villa - Canary Killer'
Referencing the other team goes back a long way.
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Getting off your arse and doing something is great but I've never ever heard our club referred to as 'The Aston Villa'. 'The Villa' yes, but never that.
Not me - but the original wording is 'The Sex Pistols'. I can see why people think its odd, but surely people can also see why it's The Aston Villa in this context.
The original wording is "Here's the Sex Pistols" because the band is commonly known as The Sex Pistols. When St Pauli did this design - about 10 years ago - they managed to work out that "Here's the St Pauli" would not only be grammatically incorrect, but it would also look ridiculous. So they went with 'Here's St Pauli'. They're German.
I'm assuming that: a) the designers of the Villa flag have English as their first language; and b) they are Aston Villa supporters, who must surely know that the club is never referred to as "the Aston Villa". Why couldn't one of the clued-up non-toxic unwankers at MOM flag this up before it went off to Guangzhou? Sorry, the Guangzhou.
On the subject of name-checking Arsenal, the Arsenal fans approve, which is precisely why name-checking Arsenal is a bad idea.
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Anyway - I only today thought of my favourite ever Wembley banner - back in 1975.
'Aston Villa - Canary Killer'
Referencing the other team goes back a long way.
Very true - I was looking for an image of this the other day. I seem to remember it being on some official merchandise cover.
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....and if we are going to be sensitive about being called toxic, maybe we need to scan back and give some thought to what the thread he is talking about feels like to him.
Nobody asked him to do it. If you do something like this off your own bat you should expect that not everyone will agree with you. To then call everyone who does disagree "clueless toxic wankers" isn't the brightest.
He wasn't referring to messageboard posters as "clueless toxic wankers" when he wanted their money for it.
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I'm going to stop now because we're back to the same thing. How you decide to transfer the wording is just a matter of opinion. I can see what you mean because we're not The Aston Villa, but I also think there would be others who would complain that the number of words was wrong if we'd done it the other way.
I don't really want to go on defending it. I'm just putting it out there that quite a lot of people like it. It isn't just about us.
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What I find a little weird is the connection - made by MOMS on Twitter - between the flag-style and some socio-political view that things are still as oppressive in 2015 as they were in 1976-77 (thus - according to them - spawning the punk movement).
Regardless of your view of the social situation and the politcal implications, making this link is both tenuous and irrelevant to the FAC Final of 2015.
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What I find a little weird is the connection - made by MOMS on Twitter - between the flag-style and some socio-political view that things are still as oppressive in 2015 as they were in 1976-77 (thus - according to them - spawning the punk movement).
Regardless of your view of the social situation and the politcal implications, making this link is both tenuous and irrelevant to the FAC Final of 2015.
Ha ha, really?
God knows I hate living under this oppressive neo-Thatcherite junta* as much as the next man, but I am struggling to think of many social and cultural phenomena similar today to back then.
* don't bite, Tory voter(s)
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I think Amfy makes a lot of valid points and I honestly think MOMS deserved a lot of credit for getting off his backside and doing something.
I also think the FA's stance is an absolute joke. Does anybody really think if Arsenal or Liverpool had come up with something similar it would have been banned?
But, with all of this said, I just can't get over the fact that I think the design is really shit.
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I think Amfy makes a lot of valid points and I honestly think MOMS deserved a lot of credit for getting off his backside and doing something.
I also think the FA's stance is an absolute joke. Does anybody really think if Arsenal or Liverpool had come up with something similar it would have been banned?
But, with all of this said, I just can't get over the fact that I think the design is really shit.
This is exactly what I wanted to say.
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Unexpected but, none-the-less welcome, support from an Arsenal organ. Respect from me............Godzvilla!.
It cost the group of fans £3,000 to produce and will, perhaps, now be seen by more than it would have been at the final because of the FA’s ridiculous decision.
The FA said: ‘The FA and competing clubs agreed the criteria by which supporters could be allowed to bring display flags into the stadium.
‘It was communicated through the usual channels that supporters are required to submit requests to Wembley and must supply a visual for approval prior to consent.’
The fan group responsible, My Old Man, have started an online petition regarding the ban and issued a statement saying “While there’s a slight edge of humour there, it’s not disrespectful in the slightest to Arsenal fans.”
And we have to agree.
Here at Cannon Towers we can’t see what all the fuss is about at all and would like to offer the Villa fans our support in getting the banner into Wembley.
At a time when the fans matter less and less to the FA, things like this are just another step towards sterilising the atmosphere at what is supposed to be the biggest domestic game of the season.
Already the fans of each side are outnumbered by people with no association to either, what’s next? The banning of colours and songs?
If you’d like to support the Villa fans, you can add your name to their online petition here.
#ArsenalDaily....Read more at:
http://dailycannon.com/2015/05/aston-villa-bonkers-banner-ban/#VYvMiWhUJjXRk9lD.99
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Those of us old enough to remember when the Sex Pistols album came out, there was a court case about the use of bollocks and it being displayed in shops. At the time some shops had the word blanked out which was ridiculous really as we all knew what it was. Why don't MOMS just blank out Arsenal to comply with the FA and get it in the ground? It would have the added bonus that it could be used for any game in the future.
And while they've got the sewing machine out they can cover the offensive 'The' as well.
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I think Richard Branson (that punk icon...) was able to successfully argue in court that bollocks is an old English word meaning "nonsense".
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I think Richard Branson (that punk icon...) was able to successfully argue in court that bollocks is an old English word meaning "nonsense".
"Priest", I thought
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Those of us old enough to remember when the Sex Pistols album came out, there was a court case about the use of bollocks and it being displayed in shops. At the time some shops had the word blanked out which was ridiculous really as we all knew what it was. Why don't MOMS just blank out Arsenal to comply with the FA and get it in the ground? It would have the added bonus that it could be used for any game in the future.
And while they've got the sewing machine out they can cover the offensive 'The' as well.
It is coming from China.
I just hope Beijing Red 4 Lyf (@beijingcasuals) has left his job at the iphone factory and started working at the big flag factory. Then he'll doubtless sabotage it to say "MINNOWS FROM VILLAGE NOBODY HAS HEARD OF" rather than "The Aston Villa".
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I think Richard Branson (that punk icon...) was able to successfully argue in court that bollocks is an old English word meaning "nonsense".
Never trust a hippy.
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Taking them on in the stands? Megalulz at that Lovejoy.
We will need help with some foam hands and curly wigs if we are going to do it. Come on The Aston Villa.
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I think Richard Branson (that punk icon...) was able to successfully argue in court that bollocks is an old English word meaning "nonsense".
"Priest", I thought
Both, according to Wiki.
"Mortimer [John, that is, of Rumpole of the Bailey fame] produced expert witnesses who were able to successfully demonstrate that the word "bollocks" was not obscene, and was actually a legitimate Old English term originally used to refer to a priest, and which, in the context of the title, meant "nonsense". "
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I love watching Rumpole. They have it on Drama on Saturday mornings at the same time as Soccer AM.
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I love watching Rumpole. They have it on Drama on Saturday mornings at the same time as Soccer AM.
The origin of SWMBO (She who must be obeyed) I think...
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I love watching Rumpole. They have it on Drama on Saturday mornings at the same time as Soccer AM.
I thought you'd be glued to Soccer Am every saturday just to watch that hilarioulsy funny 'Tubes'?
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One of the Kingston Lions has connections at Sky and a few of us were invited to be the "Fans of the Week" on Soccer AM on Cup Final day. On the Sex Pistols theme, I had visions of us getting pissed and turning Soccer AM into a Bill Grundy-type interview, so we declined. I'd have done it if Lovejoy was still hosting it though. "You dirty fackin' barstard, Lovejoy....."
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I've just designed some very special hoodies you can buy. Get them now before they sell out.
http://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/-C59/product/129699577/view/1/sb/l (http://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/-C59/product/129699577/view/1/sb/l)
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Personally I am not keen on the flag design. In "honour" of the Frenchies at the Arsenal, and seeing it is 200 years on from Waterloo and 600 years on from Agincourt would have preferred a simple and giant 'V' sign! :)
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So he's blaming everyone but himself. The club, the FA, toxic wankers, when in fact it's his fault for not making sure the design would be allowed in before getting it made. Regardless of whether you agree with it, not allowing a flag with another team's name on it is the rule, surely you'd check that first.
And even if I thought the flag was great, why should they change the rule for us? They open themselves up to "but you let that Villa flag in" from other fans in the future.
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All this might never have happened had the bloke from MOMS counted the number of syllables in "Here's the Sex Pistols" (5) and realised that "Here's Aston Villa" (5) was the line he was looking for.
Nevertheless, being toxic ****** we would still have moaned about a) having Arsenal on the flag and b) St Pauli having done it .
I admire your defence of him amfy, but many of us did repeatedly say "great initiative, well done but not that"*
* OK we ripped the piss out of him.
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So he's blaming everyone but himself. The club, the FA, toxic wankers, when in fact it's his fault for not making sure the design would be allowed in before getting it made. Regardless of whether you agree with it, not allowing a flag with another team's name on it is the rule, surely you'd check that first.
And even if I thought the flag was great, why should they change the rule for us? They open themselves up to "but you let that Villa flag in" from other fans in the future.
They let Liverpool take one that wasn't regulation apparently. It was twice the size.
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Arsenal fans are supportive because they have a huge banner ready in response which says WHO THE FUCK ARE THE ASTON VILLA? Probably.
I've never disliked a 'The' so much.
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So he's blaming everyone but himself. The club, the FA, toxic wankers, when in fact it's his fault for not making sure the design would be allowed in before getting it made. Regardless of whether you agree with it, not allowing a flag with another team's name on it is the rule, surely you'd check that first.
And even if I thought the flag was great, why should they change the rule for us? They open themselves up to "but you let that Villa flag in" from other fans in the future.
They let Liverpool take one that wasn't regulation apparently. It was twice the size.
Yeah but we know they wouldn't turn down a request from her majesty Slippy G!
It doesn't change though that the design isn't allowed. Surely that and the size are the two things you'd check before spending 3K?
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Arsenal fans are supportive because they have a huge banner ready in response which says WHO THE FUCK ARE THE ASTON VILLA? Probably.
I've never disliked a 'The' so much.
THE
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I think Amfy makes a lot of valid points and I honestly think MOMS deserved a lot of credit for getting off his backside and doing something.
But he didn't need to do anything. They'll be 25k Villa fans at Wembley on Saturday with the sole purpose of cheering the club onto an FA Cup win, and that's what we'll do. A pathetic banner which is an embarrassment to the club isn't needed, and it a purely selfish on his behalf.
Well done to the FA. They're not entirely useless it seems.
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Personally I am not keen on the flag design. In "honour" of the Frenchies at the Arsenal, and seeing it is 200 years on from Waterloo and 600 years on from Agincourt would have preferred a simple and giant 'V' sign! :)
How about not referencing Arsenal at all.
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The only possible acceptable use of the word THE in a Wembley FA Cup Final banner is in the term 'Fuck The Fuckers'
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The only possible acceptable use of the word THE in a Wembley FA Cup Final banner is in the term 'Fuck The Fuckers'
Or "THE winners Aston Villa"
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The in depth debate on the wording and context, cultural implications etc are unbelievable
It's just a banner ffs,
I don't know the guy off MOMS and have no desire too, and am reliably informed he is a bit of a knob,
but so what, it's just another flag to wave no one will give two shits on the day about what it says
Live and let live chaps
I'm Going to Wembley with both my sons on Saturday, it could end up being the greatest day of my life and I'm not even joking
I won't give a flying fuck about the banner or what it says on it if Delph ends up holding that cup aloft
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It's just aN EMBARRASSINGLY-BAD banner ffs,
Fixed.
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The in depth debate on the wording and context, cultural implications etc are unbelievable
If the cameras focus on it I'll be so sickened by what I see on my TV I'm putting my foot through the screen on Saturday.*
*another Pistols reference there.
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Call it filthy lucre.
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I'm going to sell the below hoodies on my own blog: DADS (Denizens of Aston are Dead Sexy)
http://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/-C59/product/129702558/view/1/sb/l
Please can any of you clueless toxic wankers give me three grand to 'send to China' for a really big hoodie that all 25, 000 Villa fans can squeeze into on Saturday, thus sidestepping Wembley's sissy rules and sticking it to the man, yeah!
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Ha, Comic Sans indeed!
Banttastic
Bantdabbydozy
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I'm going to sell the below hoodies on my own blog: DADS (Denizens of Aston are Dead Sexy)
http://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/-C59/product/129702558/view/1/sb/l
Please can any of you clueless toxic wankers give me three grand to 'send to China' for a really big hoodie that all 25, 000 Villa fans can squeeze into on Saturday, thus sidestepping Wembley's sissy rules and sticking it to the man, yeah!
Is it supposed to read 'fuck fuckers' or is 'the' done on purpose?
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Please can any of you clueless toxic wankers give me three grand to 'send to China' for a really big hoodie that all 25, 000 Villa fans can squeeze into on Saturday, thus sidestepping Wembley's sissy rules and sticking it to the man, yeah!
I'll ask me mom if she'll knit one for you.
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When we win back to back FA cups, League titles and Champion Leagues all the pundits (particularly Lawro') will be referring to us in the same way as the Chelseas, the Manchester Uniteds and the Manchester Cities. This could see a return of the flag with a few letter S' stitched on in the appropriate place. It still won't look great but will look better.
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I find the idea that fans weren't consulted a little odd in this situation.
He put it out on social media, and said 'if you want it, we've got 24 hours to raise £2000 for it'
The fact that they did, with both money and time to spare, can I think be construed as a fair level of support for the flag. Also - having been involved in consultations, I can tell you that the level of apathy is usually overwhelming until you do something people disagree with, and then suddenly everyone has an opinion.
Ah, but the thing with social media is that in general you tend to follow things you like (unless you are like me and follow people I hate just to slag them off of course), so the vast majority of MOMS followers on Twitter and Facebook and on their forum are people who agree with them. Putting the design out on those was inevitably going to produce an overwhelming "Yes that's fantastic, do it" vote, by the time the dissenters from elsewhere got to hear about it, it was too late.
For what it's worth, I think the flag is rubbish but to ban it is pathetic.
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Flag in "we didnt bother going through the proper channels" ban shocker.
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From MOMS on Facebook:-
"Arsenal plans for final - they will have scarves, giant flag (reportedly the club paid 8k for flag) and they're really going for the yellow & blue theme.
Our club prefer to listen to a handful of clueless toxic wankers on forums and hinder own fans' attempts to take Arsenal on in the stands - without good reason and despite even Arsenal fans support of flag.
We will all need to go wild in the stadium to make up for this."
I think he's just continuing the Malcolm McLaren theme with that quote (as in Bow Wow Wow).
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Have I missed it, has it been made and delivered now?
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I'm going to sell the below hoodies on my own blog: DADS (Denizens of Aston are Dead Sexy)
http://www.spreadshirt.co.uk/-C59/product/129702558/view/1/sb/l
Please can any of you clueless toxic wankers give me three grand to 'send to China' for a really big hoodie that all 25, 000 Villa fans can squeeze into on Saturday, thus sidestepping Wembley's sissy rules and sticking it to the man, yeah!
Letters need to be bigger...and...could the back say something like "Fuckers well and truly Fucked" and a smiley face?
UTV!
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Can we have Fuck the Fucking Fuckers?
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Can we have Fuck the Fucking Fuckers?
We are The Aston Villa and we fuck the fucking fuckers
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Can we have Fuck the Fucking Fuckers?
Fuck The BBC, Fuck the FA, Fuck FIFA, Fuck Arsenal, Fuck the Fuckers, and Fuck the Albion.
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Barcelona did a great THE XAVI flag at the weekend.
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Can we have Fuck the Fucking Fuckers?
Fuck The BBC, Fuck the FA, Fuck FIFA, Fuck Arsenal, Fuck the Fuckers, and Fuck the Albion.
Can we fit a SOTC line in there somewhere?
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All this is distracting from the main question: which is the block for standing?
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All this is distracting from the main question: which is the block for standing?
We're all going to meet at The Green Man and sort it out there.
No problem.
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Remember: there's only one letter different between Banner and Banter.
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Remember: there's only one letter different between Banner and Banter.
Oh, your grace, you really are the Archbishop of Banterbury.
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Remember: there's only one letter different between Banner and Banter.
Oh, your grace, you really are the Archbishop of Banterbury.
Big can of Orange Banta to you sir.
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This whole shenanigans could have been avoided if the design was simply pro-Villa without unnecessary hidden messages or agenda...a nicely designed 20m flag of the old Villa badge would have been epic, legendary and no doubt would have had the support of the majority of Villa fans without being inflammatory to anyone. Again, without meaning to be cynical...but MOMS don't have a t-shirt design with just the old Villa badge for sale so I doubt such a sensible truly iconic design would have even been considered.
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It just puts me in mind of a contestant on The Apprentice who picks their own terrible idea against the advice of their team and focus groups and gets fired before spending the cab ride of fail bleating about the lack of support they received, how Siralan has made a big mistake and that you haven't heard the last of them. And you never hear of them again.
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I should take my own flag.
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I should take my own flag.
You got a flag then? What does it say?
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I should take my own flag.
You got a flag then? What does it say?
WE'RE NOT FICKLE, WE'RE JUST ANT AND DEC.
Oh, no hang on...
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I should take my own flag.
You got a flag then? What does it say?
It will say "Free Sepp and the Zurich 6"
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"We've got a werewolf, we've got a werewolf, you ain't, you ain't."
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I should take my own flag.
You got a flag then? What does it say?
It will say "Free Sepp and the Zurich 6"
That would actually be funny.
Well, not the Sepp bit, as he's annoyingly un-not-free, but Free The Zurich 7 (or whatever it is) would be ace.
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Can we have Fuck the Fucking Fuckers?
Fuck The BBC, Fuck the FA, Fuck FIFA, Fuck Arsenal, Fuck the Fuckers, and Fuck the Albion.
Fuck All.
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Has he said whether it actually turned up or not?
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We generally can find an argument on here in anything so having a general consensus is as rare as sightings of Haleys Comet.
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How many people actually donated in the end? I remember thinking it wasn't as many as i expected as quite a few people donated a fair bit.
They should give it to a charity shop to rag. It will only give you enough to buy a twix but chocolate bars are bloody expensive nowadays.
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We generally can find an argument on here in anything so having a general consensus is as rare as sightings of Haleys Comet.
Halley's Comet.
Sorry, it's just the H&V way.
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How many people actually donated in the end? I remember thinking it wasn't as many as i expected as quite a few people donated a fair bit.
They should give it to a charity shop to rag. It will only give you enough to buy a twix but chocolate bars are bloody expensive nowadays.
Aren't they just, I'm sure I paid 90p for a Mars Bar the other week at New Street station.
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We may have won the cup if that flag hadn't been made - butterflies flapping their wings and all that.