The Cricket Thread 2016

[paul_e]

Why a bizarre post paul_e ? You have your opinion i have mine. Go on to the BBC cricket website and you will see Boycott and Agnew discussing the inclusion of both Jorden and Ali. Both these guys agree with me over Ali , they know far more about cricket than you ever will with all due respect. I suspect your opinion has a lot to do with you probably being a Pears follower

No I'm not a pears fan.

It's bizarre for the very reason I said.  No one called him world class on the back of those 3 wickets

You say if he takes wickets in the summer you'll change your opinion but you clearly believe he shouldn't be given the opportunity.  Personally I think he improved so much between SL and India last summer that he deserves a chance to see how far he can go.  I'd certainly prefer that to relying on Tredwell who is the only credible alternative.  Rashid should come in but for a seamer not to replace Moeen.

Rashid would have to come in for Ali, as Root offers a spinning option as well so there would be no need for all three. 

Not really, Root is useful to bring on when nothing much is happening but he shouldn't be use any more than that.  The reason he's bowled the number of overs he has recently is because once the ball isn't doing anything for the quicks they don't have the variety to mix it up and create chances from nothing, so you bring on Root, speed through a few overs fairly cheaply and hope he gets one to stick (which he's done pretty well with to be fair to him).  If you're playing on pitches like the last 2 I'd like to see a seamer go out and a spinner come in as someone you can put on for a 10-12 over spell with the old ball and they'll make things happen.  That 4th seamer/2nd spinner should be a horses for courses selection between, for example, Stokes and Rashid.

[PaulWinch again]

Why a bizarre post paul_e ? You have your opinion i have mine. Go on to the BBC cricket website and you will see Boycott and Agnew discussing the inclusion of both Jorden and Ali. Both these guys agree with me over Ali , they know far more about cricket than you ever will with all due respect. I suspect your opinion has a lot to do with you probably being a Pears follower

No I'm not a pears fan.

It's bizarre for the very reason I said.  No one called him world class on the back of those 3 wickets

You say if he takes wickets in the summer you'll change your opinion but you clearly believe he shouldn't be given the opportunity.  Personally I think he improved so much between SL and India last summer that he deserves a chance to see how far he can go.  I'd certainly prefer that to relying on Tredwell who is the only credible alternative.  Rashid should come in but for a seamer not to replace Moeen.

Rashid would have to come in for Ali, as Root offers a spinning option as well so there would be no need for all three. 

Not really, Root is useful to bring on when nothing much is happening but he shouldn't be use any more than that.  The reason he's bowled the number of overs he has recently is because once the ball isn't doing anything for the quicks they don't have the variety to mix it up and create chances from nothing, so you bring on Root, speed through a few overs fairly cheaply and hope he gets one to stick (which he's done pretty well with to be fair to him).  If you're playing on pitches like the last 2 I'd like to see a seamer go out and a spinner come in as someone you can put on for a 10-12 over spell with the old ball and they'll make things happen.  That 4th seamer/2nd spinner should be a horses for courses selection between, for example, Stokes and Rashid.

I agree Root is good for a few overs, but he's not a front line spinner like Ali. Ali is our main off spinner and would be expected to bowl a lot of overs in normal circumstances. It would be Plunkett or Rashid in for Jordan, if they make that change.

[tomd2103]

Why a bizarre post paul_e ? You have your opinion i have mine. Go on to the BBC cricket website and you will see Boycott and Agnew discussing the inclusion of both Jorden and Ali. Both these guys agree with me over Ali , they know far more about cricket than you ever will with all due respect. I suspect your opinion has a lot to do with you probably being a Pears follower

No I'm not a pears fan.

It's bizarre for the very reason I said.  No one called him world class on the back of those 3 wickets

You say if he takes wickets in the summer you'll change your opinion but you clearly believe he shouldn't be given the opportunity.  Personally I think he improved so much between SL and India last summer that he deserves a chance to see how far he can go.  I'd certainly prefer that to relying on Tredwell who is the only credible alternative.  Rashid should come in but for a seamer not to replace Moeen.

Rashid would have to come in for Ali, as Root offers a spinning option as well so there would be no need for all three. 

Not really, Root is useful to bring on when nothing much is happening but he shouldn't be use any more than that.  The reason he's bowled the number of overs he has recently is because once the ball isn't doing anything for the quicks they don't have the variety to mix it up and create chances from nothing, so you bring on Root, speed through a few overs fairly cheaply and hope he gets one to stick (which he's done pretty well with to be fair to him).  If you're playing on pitches like the last 2 I'd like to see a seamer go out and a spinner come in as someone you can put on for a 10-12 over spell with the old ball and they'll make things happen.  That 4th seamer/2nd spinner should be a horses for courses selection between, for example, Stokes and Rashid.

I agree Root is good for a few overs, but he's not a front line spinner like Ali. Ali is our main off spinner and would be expected to bowl a lot of overs in normal circumstances. It would be Plunkett or Rashid in for Jordan, if they make that change.

Geoff Boycott made the point on TMS that Root and Ali are both off spinners so there is no real variety there at the moment.  I would personally drop Ali and Jordan for the next test, with Plunkett and Rashid coming in.  I don't expect conservative, safety-first England to make any changes though. 

[PaulWinch again]

Ali took 4-98 after being injured and not bowling before coming straight into a Test match, so he did pretty well from the bowling side. He was clearly rusty, but still took 4 wickets on a very flat pitch. It wouldn't make any sense to drop him. I do agree that Plunkett or Rashid should come in to add variety to the attack.

On Boycott's point, it's not really valid. Ali is an off spinner and Root is a batsman who bowls a few overs of off spin. It's not like Root would ever be considered as the only spinner going into a game. It's not a choice of Root or Ali they occupy completely different roles in the side.

[tomd2103]

Ali took 4-98 after being injured and not bowling before coming straight into a Test match, so he did pretty well from the bowling side. He was clearly rusty, but still took 4 wickets on a very flat pitch. It wouldn't make any sense to drop him. I do agree that Plunkett or Rashid should come in to add variety to the attack.

On Boycott's point, it's not really valid. Ali is an off spinner and Root is a batsman who bowls a few overs of off spin. It's not like Root would ever be considered as the only spinner going into a game. It's not a choice of Root or Ali they occupy completely different roles in the side.

Tredwell had similar figures in the first test, but he was dropped.  Ali also failed pretty spectacularly with the bat, getting run out in a way that would be embarassing for most junior cricketers.  As for Boycott's point, I think it is a pretty salient one.  If Rashid was in the side, you would have a leg spinner doing most of the work and then Root coming on doing something different for a few overs, rather than offering more of the same.  I don't think you need to worry though, as I can't see England making any changes for the next test and Ali and Jordan will stay in. 

Away from that, I see England Lions have named a pretty attacking one day squad for the game with Ireland:

James Taylor (capt) Zafar Ansari, Jonny Bairstow (wkt), Sam Billings (wkt), Tim Bresnan, Steven Finn, Lewis Gregory, Alex Hales, Jason Roy, James Vince, David Willey

   

[paul_e]

Ali took 4-98 after being injured and not bowling before coming straight into a Test match, so he did pretty well from the bowling side. He was clearly rusty, but still took 4 wickets on a very flat pitch. It wouldn't make any sense to drop him. I do agree that Plunkett or Rashid should come in to add variety to the attack.

On Boycott's point, it's not really valid. Ali is an off spinner and Root is a batsman who bowls a few overs of off spin. It's not like Root would ever be considered as the only spinner going into a game. It's not a choice of Root or Ali they occupy completely different roles in the side.

Tredwell had similar figures in the first test, but he was dropped.  Ali also failed pretty spectacularly with the bat, getting run out in a way that would be embarassing for most junior cricketers.  As for Boycott's point, I think it is a pretty salient one.  If Rashid was in the side, you would have a leg spinner doing most of the work and then Root coming on doing something different for a few overs, rather than offering more of the same.  I don't think you need to worry though, as I can't see England making any changes for the next test and Ali and Jordan will stay in. 

Away from that, I see England Lions have named a pretty attacking one day squad for the game with Ireland:

James Taylor (capt) Zafar Ansari, Jonny Bairstow (wkt), Sam Billings (wkt), Tim Bresnan, Steven Finn, Lewis Gregory, Alex Hales, Jason Roy, James Vince, David Willey

   

Tredwell wasn't dropped, he was replaced in the side by the person he was providing injury cover for.

This argument will just keep going round and round with some people seeing enough promise and others not seeing it, we might as well just call it a draw and move on.

[PaulWinch again]

Indeed I think it's fairly clear some don't rate Ali and some do. I quite the ODI team there are a few players I'd like to see on a more regular basis.

[PaulWinch again]

Cook is looking much more like the old Cook. It's not just the runs it's his leaving and foot movement.

[tomd2103]

Indeed I think it's fairly clear some don't rate Ali and some do. I quite the ODI team there are a few players I'd like to see on a more regular basis.

Agree Paul.  It seems like the penny may have finally dropped.

[pooligan]

So Tredwell was not dropped but replaced and i was told one of my earlier posts was bizarre

[paul_e]

So Tredwell was not dropped but replaced and i was told one of my earlier posts was bizarre

How difficult a concept is it to understand that tredwell only got into the side because Moeen wasn't available and he didn't do enough to stay in ahead of him once he was back, that's clearly what happened. Whereas deciding anyone who thinks Moeen has done enough to stay in the side is calling him world class because he bowled out the tail is bizarre because it's nothing like what anyone was saying.

[pooligan]

Spin it anyway you like ,but in when a player is left out of a team ,unless he is injured or suspended he is commonly referred to as being dropped

[paul_e]

By you maybe, if Benteke missed a game with a knock and Weimann started ahead of him for the next game I'd be talking about Benteke being back not Weimann being dropped, and that's the difference.

The truth is you don't rate Moeen and don't want him in the team so you're framing the discussion based on that.  I like him and I'm doing the opposite.  I already said we won't agree until something major happens, which won't be before the summer so we might as well move on.

[pooligan]

We agree to disagree!

[Whiney MacWhineface]

IPL: Hmmm

Sarfaraz Khan: 17, wow.