The Cricket Thread 2016

[PaulWinch again]

Problem with Bell is that in modern ODIs it's not good enough getting scores of 50/60 at a strike rate of 77. You either have to go on and regularly get centuries at a strike rate of at least 100 or you get 50/60 at a strike rate of about 130. Bell doesn't go on anywhere near often enough to make up his strike rate.

[PaulWinch again]

I'm hoping Jordan can get back to bowling quick and aggressive rather than the line and length bowler he's been coached into. He's definitely got wicket taking ability,  he's an excellent fielder and a pretty good bat too. He's worth perservering with.

I think it's part of the problem Paul.  Young bowlers come into the international fold and it seems that the coaching set up want to change everything about them.  Look at what has happened to Finn. 

Yep the philsophy in England seems to be to coach every bowler into being essentially the same thing, which is a medium pace line and length bowler.

[PaulWinch again]

I really think it's time to draw a line under Broad, Anderson and Bell in ODI cricket. Basically if you're too old to be at the next World Cup then time's up. We need a bold, proactive and exciting team moving forward. We also need the current structure of cricket in England to be looked at.

[Villan For Life]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

I'm with you on Broad and Anderson.

Bias aside, Ian Bell would make a great one day captain. I recall he led the Bears in a one day Lords final a few seasons ago. The opponents were Somerset who had a strong side and were well led by Marcus Trescothick. Bell completely out thought Trescothick with imaginative field placings and well-timed bowling changes. Trescothick was made to look a poor captain as the Bears won well.

I do think his day has passed though.

[tomd2103]

I really think it's time to draw a line under Broad, Anderson and Bell in ODI cricket. Basically if you're too old to be at the next World Cup then time's up. We need a bold, proactive and exciting team moving forward. We also need the current structure of cricket in England to be looked at.

Agree.  I would like to see the limited overs game separated from the test game with a different coaching set up, so that players are stepping into a totally different environment.  Keep it uncomplicated and let the players go out and play.  I think the captaincy has been a burden on Morgan and would look at Joe Root as maybe the man to take it forward.

The structure of the domestic game definitely has to be looked at.  I think 18 counties is too many for domestic limited overs competitions as the quality isn't really there to make it a competitive and productive breeding ground.  I'd keep the county championship as it is (though it might be worth considering a loan system with centrally contracted players to ensure they play in the top division), but would completely change the limited over competitions.  Ten city teams (2 in London, Southampton, Bristol, Cardiff, Birmingham, Nottingham, Leeds, Manchester and Newcastle) playing out of the international grounds, in much shorter and compact tournaments with the international players playing in them. 

[paul_e]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

I'm with you on Broad and Anderson.

Bias aside, Ian Bell would make a great one day captain. I recall he led the Bears in a one day Lords final a few seasons ago. The opponents were Somerset who had a strong side and were well led by Marcus Trescothick. Bell completely out thought Trescothick with imaginative field placings and well-timed bowling changes. Trescothick was made to look a poor captain as the Bears won well.

I do think his day has passed though.

I absolutely agree, I just think you need a small handover period where there's someone there who's in form, has experience and has captain credentials.  I don't think there's anyone else who is all 3 for now, which puts pressure on Morgan and he's wilted under it.  For Bell he always seems to thrive under pressure, it's generally when he plays at his best.  The other thing is that I think Bell is well capable at scoring faster, for some reason he plays within himself in ODIs, a mentality change at the highest level would hopefully address that.

[tomd2103]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

I'm with you on Broad and Anderson.

Bias aside, Ian Bell would make a great one day captain. I recall he led the Bears in a one day Lords final a few seasons ago. The opponents were Somerset who had a strong side and were well led by Marcus Trescothick. Bell completely out thought Trescothick with imaginative field placings and well-timed bowling changes. Trescothick was made to look a poor captain as the Bears won well.

I do think his day has passed though.

I absolutely agree, I just think you need a small handover period where there's someone there who's in form, has experience and has captain credentials.  I don't think there's anyone else who is all 3 for now, which puts pressure on Morgan and he's wilted under it.  For Bell he always seems to thrive under pressure, it's generally when he plays at his best.  The other thing is that I think Bell is well capable at scoring faster, for some reason he plays within himself in ODIs, a mentality change at the highest level would hopefully address that.

Totally agree.  He is more than capable of going over the field, yet seems more and more reticent to do it recently.  I find it quite laughable really that some of those criticising him (Hussain, Strauss, Atherton) were criticised themselves for exactly the same thing when they played. 

[tomd2103]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

On reflection, I think that is probably a sound plan.  I hope to see the team for the next ODI looking something like:

Bell (c), Hales, Taylor, Root, Morgan, Buttler, Stokes, Woakes, Jordan, Tredwell, Finn

I think that would be enough of a change whilst also maintaining a little bit of stability.  Importantly, it would also give us a foundation to build on over the next few years.  Going forward, I'd like to see Root maybe take over Bell's role with a more explosive hitter coming in at four and I would like to see Adil Rashid given a chance as the spinning option. 

 

[Villan For Life]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

On reflection, I think that is probably a sound plan.  I hope to see the team for the next ODI looking something like:

Bell (c), Hales, Taylor, Root, Morgan, Buttler, Stokes, Woakes, Jordan, Tredwell, Finn

I think that would be enough of a change whilst also maintaining a little bit of stability.  Importantly, it would also give us a foundation to build on over the next few years.  Going forward, I'd like to see Root maybe take over Bell's role with a more explosive hitter coming in at four and I would like to see Adil Rashid given a chance as the spinning option. 

 

I wonder if they will give Root the one day captaincy as an apprenticeship to his eventual elevation to test captain?

Athers in The Times suggests that of the current squad only Tredwell and Bopara are likely to be left out. The old guard are safe because of a refocus towards test cricket.

As the past few months has been dominated by one day cricket - and what a waste of time that has been - the next few months are dominated by test cricket. We play 17 tests between April and January against the West Indies, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa.

[tomd2103]

Nice for Bell to get a fifty in what should be his last one-day innings for England.

Being a Warwickshire fan and a fan of Ian Bell, I can't help but think some of the criticism of him in the last few days has been a bit harsh.  Yes he hasn't gone on to make big scores, but he has scored 50's in the last three innings which others haven't done. 

The more I think on it the more I'm coming round to thinking that we can't drop him.  If Morgan were in form then it'd be ok but with Morgan struggling to deserve his place (even before being made captain) I'd be tempted to make Bell captain for the next year with the plan being to move that on to someone else once the new ethos is in place.  As harsh as it may sound the critical requirement is to get Broad and Anderson out of the way as I'm utterly convinced that they are the root of a lot of the problems.

On reflection, I think that is probably a sound plan.  I hope to see the team for the next ODI looking something like:

Bell (c), Hales, Taylor, Root, Morgan, Buttler, Stokes, Woakes, Jordan, Tredwell, Finn

I think that would be enough of a change whilst also maintaining a little bit of stability.  Importantly, it would also give us a foundation to build on over the next few years.  Going forward, I'd like to see Root maybe take over Bell's role with a more explosive hitter coming in at four and I would like to see Adil Rashid given a chance as the spinning option. 

 

I wonder if they will give Root the one day captaincy as an apprenticeship to his eventual elevation to test captain?

Athers in The Times suggests that of the current squad only Tredwell and Bopara are likely to be left out. The old guard are safe because of a refocus towards test cricket.

As the past few months has been dominated by one day cricket - and what a waste of time that has been - the next few months are dominated by test cricket. We play 17 tests between April and January against the West Indies, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa.

It would be a good idea, as it would also add a different dynamic.  The amount of test cricket we will be playing over the next year means there is an opportunity to split the two and look at some new players in ODIs.  We realistically could only be looking at 3 or 4 test players featuring in the one day team going forward anyway (Root, Buttler, Woakes).

[Villan For Life]

I've just been reading that Martin Crowe who was one of my favourite players is very ill with cancer.

Good luck fella I hope you beat it.

[PaulWinch again]

Don't think sadly he will it's terminal now.

[PaulWinch again]

After reading Collingwood's column on Sky I'm inclined to think Jordan is the way forward. He makes a good point that Jordan can contribute in all areas of the game. I think, if we can get him back to being confident, he'll be an excellent player for us.

[tomd2103]

After reading Collingwood's column on Sky I'm inclined to think Jordan is the way forward. He makes a good point that Jordan can contribute in all areas of the game. I think, if we can get him back to being confident, he'll be an excellent player for us.

I think Jordan is one who has suffered from the coaches meddling too much with his action.  He's got a strange run up and he can be a little wayward, but he bowls quick and has a habit of taking wickets.  I think the attitude of the set up has to change to one that accepts that players aren't perfect and instead of trying to change them, concentrate on what they do well. 

Collingwood would be a good shout for someone who could take over the limited overs team.  Paul Farbrace had success with Sri Lanka, so could also step in.

[paul_e]

Focusing on what players don't do is a very English attitude that's prevalent across most sports, it means we get lots of players who are decent at everything but very few who are exceptional at something.

Jordan has definitely been badly coached, the coaching should have been focused on increasing his pace, getting him from 88-90mph to a regular 92-94mph instead they've tried to reign him in and work on accuracy and he's dropped down to 84-86 just like our other 'quicks' and it's made him easier to pick.