Aston Villa v Manchester United Post-Match Thread

[Nev]

One thing I noticed about that red card was how quick he got his card out. As soon as I looked at the ref, he was running over desperately trying to get it out of his pocket. Not to mention the three Man Utd players who surrounded him almost instantly. He couldn't wait to make a big decision.

It was a 50/50 tackle. Maybe a foul, although I don't know who fouled who.

Unfortunatley I believe that most top officials run games with pre-concieved ideas regarding certain teams. It may be sub-concious but the constant barrage from the media about the top clubs must have an effect at some point. Add to that the fear factor cultivated by certain managers who are praised for their footballing nous while their bitter, spiteful, unsportsman like approach to officials is ignored.

Who can blame them at times though? As an official what will make bigger headlines and ultimatley affect your career? Mourihno launching an attack on your skills with outlandish claims about costing teams victories and players their careers or a little bleat from the likes of Lambert or Mark Hughes when on the wrong end of a poor decision?

Had the decision been reversed, all the talk would've been about Newton Heath's title challenge being adversely affected but as it's us, who gives a fuck?

[Witton Warrior]

On a separate issue it has to be said that a lot of their support consists of complete twats.  There appeared to be a few scattered around the lower Holte showing no respect and then left wondering why people would take exception to their disrespect.

What was being disrespected Bren'd?

[dave.woodhall]

One thing I noticed about that red card was how quick he got his card out. As soon as I looked at the ref, he was running over desperately trying to get it out of his pocket. Not to mention the three Man Utd players who surrounded him almost instantly. He couldn't wait to make a big decision.

It was a 50/50 tackle. Maybe a foul, although I don't know who fouled who.

Unfortunatley I believe that most top officials run games with pre-concieved ideas regarding certain teams. It may be sub-concious but the constant barrage from the media about the top clubs must have an effect at some point. Add to that the fear factor cultivated by certain managers who are praised for their footballing nous while their bitter, spiteful, unsportsman like approach to officials is ignored.

Who can blame them at times though? As an official what will make bigger headlines and ultimatley affect your career? Mourihno launching an attack on your skills with outlandish claims about costing teams victories and players their careers or a little bleat from the likes of Lambert or Mark Hughes when on the wrong end of a poor decision?

Had the decision been reversed, all the talk would've been about Newton Heath's title challenge being adversely affected but as it's us, who gives a fuck?

When the CEO of the body that ultimately pays your wages talks about the need for a club to be successful in order to boost said body's revenue streams, how in God's name can you not be even subconsciously influenced to favour them?

[Smoke]

I'd love for the officials to actually utilise the players in order to make their decisions.

Had the ref asked Ashley Young, "Do you think Gabby should be sent off for that tackle?" in this case I genuinely believe that he'd have said no.

However had Ashley Young said yes, the refs response should be "Ok, Fine. However IF when I watch the replay back and I see that you've cheated me here, you will get double the ban Gabby does. Still happy with the sending off?"

The same should go for penalty claims, dives etc etc

This sort of approach I believe, would help the game improve.

The rules are clear, known and accepted by the players but the system at the moment rests all the responsibility on the officials to catch the players out at breaking the rules. If there was more retrospective punsihment used players would begin to think about their conduct a bit more during those 90 minutes.

[Somniloquism]

The thing is the ref went by the reaction of Young and if he's going to send people off without properly seeing the incident then he shouldn't be refereeing at all.

This.

Watching MOTD you can see the ref was only seeing it from behind Gabby and no way could he have made any judgement properly. He should have consulted with one of the other officials but obviously hadn't as the red card was being reached for even whilst running across.

Was it Mason who didn't send off Cahill the other week for the "John Terry" challenge? If not I do wonder if that publicity had any bearing as you normally see Refs react to criticism in the papers by being more over reactive to what they deem similar challenges.

[supertom]

The last couple of years the standard of refereeing has generally been utterly fucking horrendous. I mean refs have always been moaned about. It's an occupational hazard, but in recent times it's been difficult to defend the standard as generally it's poor. Too many shocking decision. Phil Dowd is still one of the top refs in the league and the guy is breathing out his arse after 5 minutes. There seems to be several contentious decisions every week, and something like Gabby's sending was a truly appalling decision.

[kippaxvilla2]

The main problem with them today is they are 'celebrities' themselves and like politicians crave attention and power.  Years ago you knew about 2-3 referees names and that was because they were considered to be the best - Jack Taylor, Neil Midgeley, Thomas (even though he was a twat).  These days they want to be in the limelight.  I remember seeing some Christmas show on Sky a few years ago where the referees had a team against Sky commentators in a quiz and also remember thinking wtf is going on?

[Villa in Denmark]

The main problem with them today is they are 'celebrities' themselves and like politicians crave attention and power.  Years ago you knew about 2-3 referees names and that was because they were considered to be the best - Jack Taylor, Neil Midgeley, Thomas (even though he was a twat).  These days they want to be in the limelight. I remember seeing some Christmas show on Sky a few years ago where the referees had a team against Sky commentators in a quiz and also remember thinking wtf is going on?

A contest between 2 teams of individuals who haven't got the foggiest idea that 90% of the population would quite gladly see Manchester x 2, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal and Spurs disappear to the conference and below?

[LeeS]

I'd love for the officials to actually utilise the players in order to make their decisions.

Had the ref asked Ashley Young, "Do you think Gabby should be sent off for that tackle?" in this case I genuinely believe that he'd have said no.

However had Ashley Young said yes, the refs response should be "Ok, Fine. However IF when I watch the replay back and I see that you've cheated me here, you will get double the ban Gabby does. Still happy with the sending off?"

The same should go for penalty claims, dives etc etc

This sort of approach I believe, would help the game improve.

The rules are clear, known and accepted by the players but the system at the moment rests all the responsibility on the officials to catch the players out at breaking the rules. If there was more retrospective punsihment used players would begin to think about their conduct a bit more during those 90 minutes.

Or we could just let the ref do the reffing and leave players to play. He made a mistake. That's all. It wasnt the first time and it wont be the last.

[ClaretAndBlueBlood]

The last couple of years the standard of refereeing has generally been utterly fucking horrendous. I mean refs have always been moaned about. It's an occupational hazard, but in recent times it's been difficult to defend the standard as generally it's poor. Too many shocking decision. Phil Dowd is still one of the top refs in the league and the guy is breathing out his arse after 5 minutes. There seems to be several contentious decisions every week, and something like Gabby's sending was a truly appalling decision.

yes referees make mistakes, don't we all. The game is played at break neck speed and they get only one look at it. Sometimes, even after watching incidents scrutinised countless times on tv, its not always possible to decide what the correct decision is and different people make different judgements even then.

what is clear is that they have near on impossible jobs which are made all the much harder by players cheating. If players didn't cheat and were more honest then a referees job would be much easier. We should be condemning the cheating players more than the refs.

There was next to no contact on Saturday. If Young hadn't stayed down writhing in agony, would the decision been different - probably.

Time to start punishing the cheaters rather than castigating the refs.

[Toronto Villa]

Refs have resources available to them if they are not 100% sure of a decision or even if they need to make a critical call. Too often they don't use them as was the case during the weekend. Lee Mason could easily have consulted his assistant or the 4th official but failed to do either. It was poor refereeing at PL level.

[silhillvilla]

You take the rough with the smooth, the big teams do get all the decisions though and have done for years. I was sat just in front of young when he swung the cross In for the goal, him and lowton end up in a heap together. I saw falcao head it in then turned to look at lowton who was busy giving young a boot (totally un spotted), I think young had given him a dig first mind you.

[olaftab]

I'd love for the officials to actually utilise the players in order to make their decisions.

Had the ref asked Ashley Young, "Do you think Gabby should be sent off for that tackle?" in this case I genuinely believe that he'd have said no.

However had Ashley Young said yes, the refs response should be "Ok, Fine. However IF when I watch the replay back and I see that you've cheated me here, you will get double the ban Gabby does. Still happy with the sending off?"

The same should go for penalty claims, dives etc etc

This sort of approach I believe, would help the game improve.

What do you actually smoke Smoke?

[olaftab]

What day this week will the red be rescinded ?

Usually on Getridreday!

[berneboy]

I'd love for the officials to actually utilise the players in order to make their decisions.

Had the ref asked Ashley Young, "Do you think Gabby should be sent off for that tackle?" in this case I genuinely believe that he'd have said no.

However had Ashley Young said yes, the refs response should be "Ok, Fine. However IF when I watch the replay back and I see that you've cheated me here, you will get double the ban Gabby does. Still happy with the sending off?"

The same should go for penalty claims, dives etc etc

This sort of approach I believe, would help the game improve.

The rules are clear, known and accepted by the players but the system at the moment rests all the responsibility on the officials to catch the players out at breaking the rules. If there was more retrospective punishment used players would begin to think about their conduct a bit more during those 90 minutes.

Peace on earth, goodwill to all men!

Let it be so.