Rugby Union (was 2014-15, now an ongoing thread)

[paul_e]

brilliant half from Joseph, Eastmond and Devoto, there's some special talent in this Bath backline with them, Ford, Roko, Watson and Burgess.

[lovejoy]

...playing against 12. If Bath were that great why are they so low in the table?

[PaulWinch again]

"If we've underperformed so gravely yet have only lost by three points to the two top teams, then it'll be interesting to see what happens when we get it right."

It's snide comments like that from Tom Wood that annoy me. The points margin is irrelevant they were piss poor against those teams.

[paul_e]

...playing against 12. If Bath were that great why are they so low in the table?

Do you mean top of the table Bath?  Quins defended well but when they went to 12 men it was poor from the ref, the latter 2 could both have been given as penalty tries without the card (the Collier one in particular, it's not often you see 3 consecutive scrum penalties on the 5yard line and it doesn't lead to a penalty try).

[taylorsworkrate]

This has been a very poor start

[paul_e]

First half was better than anything we've seen all autumn (what a shock we drop the 10 who's form is as bad as it gets and we improve) but we still lack threat in midfield and struggle to get the ball to the wingers in space, so long as that's the case we'll struggle to beat the better sides.

Lawes is man of the match by miles, I hope taking him off at 54mins doesn't mean he's out of their minds when they make the call, he's been close to perfect.

[PaulWinch again]

Lawes and Morgan were excellent. I thought the game management was much much better, but our defence was absolutely shocking and there were far too many line breaks. The most important thing was winning and we can build from that. Fair play to Barritt he's extremely brave, but he's not international class. Twelvetrees was awful and Burrell and Tuilagi need to be the centre partnership for the 6 nations.

[lovejoy]

Yes Twelvetrees didn't have a great game, got involved in the tight too much, probably trying too hard. It was a tough but well-earned victory.

[Jon Crofts]

Finally I see a win at Twickenham.
An improvement for sure but quite honestly Australia were pretty poor, every time they stretched us wide they could and probably should have scored were it not for a handling error.  Laws was immense, he looked shattered when he left the field, hurt physically.  Billy 36 was all huff and puff but without making any real impression in the game.
The pack was well on top and really should have dominated Austraila far more in the second half, the Aussies managed to get a couple of stable scrums and get quick ball from them which stemmed the flow because England were all over it in the last 10 of the first half.  A good day out, too many Guinness and a lovely sunny day sat in short sleeves on the steps of Twickenham drinking beer and eating a pie before the game watching the world go by.  A very pleasant distraction from the shambles in B6.

[peter w]

I think Ford's kicking is a potential problem. He missed with two kickable penalties that should have been taken at this level. Another day those misses may have been more crucial. It would be then too easy throw Farrell on and let him take over kicking duties. So, sacrficing a bit of flair for the formulaic.

[paul_e]

I think Ford's kicking is a potential problem. He missed with two kickable penalties that should have been taken at this level. Another day those misses may have been more crucial. It would be then too easy throw Farrell on and let him take over kicking duties. So, sacrficing a bit of flair for the formulaic.

The 2 he missed were too long for him, anything over about 40m seems to give him trouble and has eer since he broke through.  His kicking from hand and understanding of space makes up for it but Farrelll on the bench to tighten the game late is perfectly viable for me.  Farrell has his qualities, the problem is hasn't got that little bit of spark to turn a game and get us back on top, Ford did that 2-3 times yesterday with loving weighted kicks that May chased superbly.

[peter w]

I agree. But if we have to make a change because of missed kicks and then Farrell kicks the chances to win a close game then the calls will go up again in favour of starting Farrell. But yes, as a replacement he'd be brilliant.

[andyaston]

I think Ford's kicking is a potential problem. He missed with two kickable penalties that should have been taken at this level. Another day those misses may have been more crucial. It would be then too easy throw Farrell on and let him take over kicking duties. So, sacrficing a bit of flair for the formulaic.

That's the one thing that concerns me about his game. I will see him in the flesh in two weeks time at Bath, but there were a few times last season Bath failed to put points on the board when on top due to him have a bad day with the boot.

[aev]

You could also argue it is his superior game management that gets the team into a position to win the penalties.

I said before, Ford could win a world cup, but could also see us out early on.

Farrell could get us to the final, but does he have that extra to get the back line going?

[paul_e]

For me you can carry Farrell if you have a genius in the centres.  I'll reuse the wilkinson comparison aside from the fact that JW was streets ahead in terms of game management the reason he could get away with not having a fantastic running game is we had Greenwood in the centres who was a special talent.  Picking Farrell and then selecting brawn outside him makes us utterly flat.

I can't see us not making the semi-final regardless, our pack is exceptional (they've been competitive in all 4 games despite 3 of the 'best' front 5 missing, and 3 understudies also out) and will beat anyone other than NZ and SA on their own.