The Takeover Thread - Recon Group - NOW WITH NEW POLL

[Risso]

Hitchins has been terminated as a Director according to Companies House.

non-filing of accounts, per chance?

Nope, if he was disqualified as a director he'd be listed as such on companies house.  He's still a director on a few other companies.

[Steve R]

From the same article, I hadn't read this before..

American billionaire Randy Lerner, who bought Aston Villa in 2006 for 62.2 million pounds, put the club up for sale in 2014. Six companies showed interest, Xia said, but the final competing bidders were Recon and the American software company Oracle Corp.

Lerner eventually chose to sell to Recon in part because China provides a large fan base for English soccer teams, Xia said.

I hope Xia was bullshitting there. Its distinctly painful if not.

[Ads]

I don't think it's wrong to question and probe, but we are doing so with limited knowledge of the process and extrapolating disasters from elsewhere to fill the vacuum and then getting worried about it, is not the same as asking considered questions.

Here are 4 'considered questions' from Reading supporters regarding Samuelson, Jamie Banfill (the x2) and Alan Hitchins. The final paragraph could easily relate to us as it did to them.

http://twohundredpercent.net/the-elephant-in-the-madstad-boardroom/

I'm not massively interested in what's happening at Reading.

If Samuelson is a dodgy character, then that is of concern, but Xia is the key figure rather than any adviser or broker; how much money does he have being ultimately the main point. He says a lot, has shown some evidence that's he's got a bob or two and I've not seen any other evidence to suggest otherwise.

I'll wait and see, as I don't think the process is taking any more or less time than other take overs. I'd like it to be done now of course so we can start spending yesterday, but that's a football fan and their attitude for you.

[chrisf]

I don't think it's wrong to question and probe, but we are doing so with limited knowledge of the process and extrapolating disasters from elsewhere to fill the vacuum and then getting worried about it, is not the same as asking considered questions.

Here are 4 'considered questions' from Reading supporters regarding Samuelson, Jamie Banfill (the x2) and Alan Hitchins. The final paragraph could easily relate to us as it did to them.

http://twohundredpercent.net/the-elephant-in-the-madstad-boardroom/

It's very worrying that Reading fans were very worried about the same set of people that they didn't know any more about than we do. Worrying indeed.

[mr underhill]

Mr McWorry of McWorry

[not3bad]

Mr McWorry of McWorry

Mr McWorry of McWorrysville City USA?

[Stirchley Villain]

I'm worried that I'm not worried about the takeover...

[mr underhill]

I'm getting increasingly worried that you are not worried about the worrying aspects of this takeover worry

[Dave Javu]

One of the first things TSI (Samuelson) did when they took over at Reading was to take out a "payday loan" with a BVI registered (in other words you'll never find out who you owe the money to) company called Vibrac. Security was in the form on future parachute payments. The loan was for £10m and £1.5m was added on top for fees

Vibrac demanded that they put a company in place  called BTG to handle the sale. Guess what happened next?

According to Wiki:

"Vibrac pushed through the sale of Adam Le Fondre to Cardiff and seemingly made things difficult for the chairman, Sir John Madejski, by changing terms of sale on several occasions. This led to many potential investors disengaging with the club, whilst Vibrac sought to push through sale to the mystery Phoenix consortium, which involves former Director, and person for bringing Vibrac into Reading, Chris Samuelson. This called the Football League to look into the inappropriate role that Vibrac have given themselves, of running the club without having undertaken the Fit and Proper Persons Test.Reading were subsequently fined £30,000 by The Football League in March 2015.

Is £30000 enough to put anyone off doing the same thing again?

I note with interest that when then Samuelson/TSI buggered off from Reading and the Thais took over, Reading were £60m in debt.

Happy days.

[old man villa fan]

This deal really is starting to walk like a duck and quack like a duck.

From what I read, it ended at Reading with the frontman - the Russian chap - simply disappearing, leaving a number of debts, including a significant one to the Inland Revenue. Whatever is true of Tony Xia, there is nothing stopping him disappearing just as quickly as he appeared.

One of the many things I don't understand is what Samuelson gets out of all this, a director's salary alone doesn't seems that much for the circles he moves in. Moreover, I don't see why Xiai - if he has his own finance - needs Samuelson in the first place.

Has any more information come out since the start that has made it any more dubious than it was from day one.  All the 'players' seem to be the same.  Quoted funding seems to be the same.  Xia's background seems to be the same.  If anything, I would say that the more information that has come out and actual actions have made it seem less dubious.  I use the word dubious not to reflect my viewpoint but for the more sceptical.

You may well have been totally familiar is Samuelson and co - and their involvement with Xia- all along. I was not. Day one it was just Xia, the involvement of others didn't become apparent until the pictures with the shirts appeared on the OS. Since then, the more I read or see posted on here the worse it sounds.

You may be comfortable with it all, that is fine. I am not, and that is not scepticism as such, just a different perspective to the one you have.

Apologies, I meant day one as including the shirts photo as it was within days of the news breaking and was part of the initial news on what he owned/didn't own, did he go to Uni /didn't he go etc.

[Duncan Shaw]

I would find it astounding that he would choose this lot over Ellison.
But the fact it says "The Oracle Corporation" smells of bullshit to me.  Ellison would have been buying us and he wouldn't and probably indeed couldn't have used Oracle as a vehicle to do that.

[chrisf]

One of the first things TSI (Samuelson) did when they took over at Reading was to take out a "payday loan" with a BVI registered (in other words you'll never find out who you owe the money to) company called Vibrac. Security was in the form on future parachute payments. The loan was for £10m and £1.5m was added on top for fees

Vibrac demanded that they put a company in place  called BTG to handle the sale. Guess what happened next?

According to Wiki:

"Vibrac pushed through the sale of Adam Le Fondre to Cardiff and seemingly made things difficult for the chairman, Sir John Madejski, by changing terms of sale on several occasions. This led to many potential investors disengaging with the club, whilst Vibrac sought to push through sale to the mystery Phoenix consortium, which involves former Director, and person for bringing Vibrac into Reading, Chris Samuelson. This called the Football League to look into the inappropriate role that Vibrac have given themselves, of running the club without having undertaken the Fit and Proper Persons Test.Reading were subsequently fined £30,000 by The Football League in March 2015.

Is £30000 enough to put anyone off doing the same thing again?

I note with interest that when then Samuelson/TSI buggered off from Reading and the Thais took over, Reading were £60m in debt.

Happy days.

They didn't fail the fit and proper persons test.
They took too much control of the company (selling a player) before passing the fit and proper persons test.
For giving Vibrac too much control Reading were fined £30k.

[Percy McCarthy]

I would find it astounding that he would choose this lot over Ellison.
But the fact it says "The Oracle Corporation" smells of bullshit to me.  Ellison would have been buying us and he wouldn't and probably indeed couldn't have used Oracle as a vehicle to do that.

Or it could be that's just how Xia refers to him, or where he's aware of him from, rather than by his name.

[ChicagoLion]

So how is fining the club that is being abused by unfit owners any form of detterant?

[ChicagoLion]

From the same article, I hadn't read this before..

American billionaire Randy Lerner, who bought Aston Villa in 2006 for 62.2 million pounds, put the club up for sale in 2014. Six companies showed interest, Xia said, but the final competing bidders were Recon and the American software company Oracle Corp.

Lerner eventually chose to sell to Recon in part because China provides a large fan base for English soccer teams, Xia said.

I hope Xia was bullshitting there. Its distinctly painful if not.

well you know how good Randy is at decision making.