Nathan Baker - Sold

[Toronto Villa]

I think he could still be sent out on loan. I don't imagine the new contract just happened either and it is part of a long term approach, where we might still bring in an experienced defender but give Baker a bit of time to get proper playing time in the Championship. It's exactly the approach we should be taking for some of young players who aren't quite ready. He's a decent player who will get better the more he plays and coached through his mistakes.

[pauliewalnuts]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

[OCD]

I imagine he's part of the squad but if he were to be sent out on loan, you would think it would be to a PL side.

[ktvillan]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

Yes, at that age you should only sending out players on loan to put them in the shop window to get rid or get them off the wage bill, not to develop them.  Looks like Sherwood has a role for him.  For some reason I can't quite fathom I actually like Baker, but I just he wish he would learn to stay on his feet and avoid this tendency to dive in, even when it's not for a last ditch block.  It's probably why he gets injured so much.

[Clark W Griswold]

The way it would make sense to me would be if we are trying to get an older, more experienced guy in (like Lescott) for a year or two, and we extend Bakers contract and then loan him to someone else to get a bit more of an education. If he comes back the better for it, he can take the Lescott or whoever's place in the squad. If not we sell him on. I watched the Sherwood interview about it on AVTV and he said something about not wanting to get rid of him permanently, and put it in a way that made me think he may loan him out instead.

Personally though i agree with Paulie that at 24 he may not get a great deal better now. Tim obviously thinks there still may be a chance of him coming good, but of course may not have seen too much of him before he took over as manager. Whatever happens i just hope he's not required to play for us much next season as we will definately ship more goals if so.

[silhillvilla]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

He proved his worth last season despite having shite full backs and a paper mâché midfield in front of him

[Toronto Villa]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

He is, but he's never really had a sustained run of games. I think with his age a good solid season on loan might  do him some good.

[villadelph]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

He proved his worth last season despite having shite full backs and a paper mâché midfield in front of him

I agree. Thought he was okay, and obviously cares about the club. Maybe all this speculation and sweating that new contract up until yesterday will kick him into another gear.

[old man villa fan]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

He is, but he's never really had a sustained run of games. I think with his age a good solid season on loan might  do him some good.

I agree.  He needs a season of playing week in week out to (i) see if he can overcome his injury problems (ii) build his confidence (iii) improve his concentration levels and (iv) improve his positional play.

[Villa in Denmark]

He's 24 now. If he's not ready now, he probably never will be.

He is, but he's never really had a sustained run of games. I think with his age a good solid season on loan might  do him some good.

I agree.  He needs a season of playing week in week out to (i) see if he can overcome his injury problems (ii) build his confidence (iii) improve his concentration levels and (iv) improve his positional play.

I can genuinely see why some people like Baker, but you've just listed why it's always going to be an uphill battle for him at this level.

He does have a tendency to switch off / lose concentration, which is why he seems to gets caught out of position more often.

He knows that this is a problem (lacking confidence) so launches into tackles to make up for it, which is where he appears to pick up a fair proportion of his injuries.

Unless he can sort out the concentration thing he'll never get any better than he is now.

I can't see another PL club taking him on loan, and I don't know how keen he'd be to go on loan in the championship at his age.

I'd also question how much benefit he'd get playing in a division that would play more to his existing strengths. As we saw at Anfield last season, let him line up between the 6 yard box and penalty box while you swing crosses in all day, and he'll quite happily headed them away all day.

He needs to be playing at this level to get better. I hope I'm wrong but I don't think he will. He'll be great against a Pulis type of team mind you.

[Matt C]

Something we've been very poor at in recent time is managing our assets. Players shouldn't go into the last year of their contracts and walk away for free - if nothing else we've protected an investment with Baker.

[Toronto Villa]

Kendrick reporting that Ciaran Clark will be getting a new deal very soon.

[N'ZMAV]

Baker is shit and needs to leave. He makes too many mistakes. Bench warmer at best.

[silhillvilla]

Baker is shit and needs to leave. He makes too many mistakes. Bench warmer at best.

No shitter than vlaar, Clark, Okore . He's not had a fair run yet with a consistent partner week in week out and solid full backs and dcm ahead of him.
Worth keeping and investing in IMHO .

[paul_e]

Baker is shit and needs to leave. He makes too many mistakes. Bench warmer at best.

No shitter than vlaar, Clark, Okore . He's not had a fair run yet with a consistent partner week in week out and solid full backs and dcm ahead of him.
Worth keeping and investing in IMHO .

Disagree with both of you, which feels really strange.  Bench warmer at best is probably not far off the truth, which is ok as he's the 4th choice centre back at the club.

Clark is a far better player the main difference being that Clark had a clear weakness when he came in (he got pushed around far too easily) and he's worked on it and improved.  He still makes some naive mistakes but they're becoming rarer.  For Baker you can't say the same, his concentration and basic skills (passing) aren't good enough to be a starter in the PL and he's not really improved in either area since he came into the team.

As for Okore he has flaws to his game but we've only seen him for 1 season and for a decent part of that he was half of the best pairing we saw all season.  He needs to work on those areas where he was exposed and then when he comes in again we'll see if there's noticeable improvement.  If there are then he'll be firmly cemented as 3rd choice back there.

Finally Vlaar was always difficult to judge because you never knew just how fit he was, at his best he was a step above he rest of our defenders but those games were few and far between because they normally came in the few weeks before another injury.  His shoddy performances were often either the first one or two back from an injury or the last one before he had a few weeks out.