The Accounts are out.

[supertom]

I don't care what budget we're working on, how much money we have for players...there is no excuse for Tonev...none...not one...3-4 of the other signings have been very shoddy too.

He was signed as a diuretic.  At least I assume so, judging by the amount of pant-wetting he's caused on this site (I hope the poor sod never visits it).  In all seriousness, he was recommended by Stan Petrov and he's a Bulgarian international.  That's two "excuses" off the top of my head.  He's played badly and not settled in as we hoped, that's all.  He isn't the first foreign player to struggle like that and he won't be the last.  No need to be so over-dramatic.

I'm just exaggerating to be honest. I don't think he'll ever make it at this level unfortunately. Very poor touch and very limited. That said, whether or not he gets recommended by Petrov or not, it's Lambert who has final say on a player. I wouldn't say he's been that well scouted, certainly as you'd have to recognise right off the bat that he's not quite skilfull or technically proficient for Prem football. He almost makes Brett Holman look like Zidane (okay I'm exaggerating again...well...a little).

[pauliewalnuts]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

[supertom]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

I'm not saying it's Tonev who's the problem at all, but the likes of him and Helenius still cost money. Not much granted, but it's still a chunk of budget that's been spent on player who look a million miles off being ready now. Would buying one player instead of those two as an example, have got us someone closer to being able to step into a Premiership side? Difficult to say.

In the case of Stan, we could all see there was a talented player there and he achieved a lot for Celtic. Helenius I'd personally like to see a little more of. As for Tonev, I just don't see any signs there that he'll make it. That is based off 10 or so games, whatever it is, but he's looked more or less the same in every game. Not great at running with the ball at his feet, but okay if he knocks it past a full back and runs, poor decision making (that of course can improve), erratic delivery,  poor touch. As an aside I thought Carruthers for example was more impressive in his brief cameos under Mcleish. Likewise I feel Albrighton is far more worthwhile at this level, given a choice between the two.

But that is part of our problem. Lambert has still had money to spend in his two seasons here. We just haven't bought enough players who were premier league ready. Again though, if our budget this summer is going to be similar to the last two summers, then he's got to buy better...if of course he's still here.

[ozzjim]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

Spot on. Looking at our midfield, had we spent 5 million on Huddlestone and Livermore like Hull did last summer, I reckon we would be 10 points better off now they are that much better than our options and ability. It is not like the players are not out there, there is simply an unwillingness to buy the obvious that would improve the team.

[tomd2103]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

Spot on. Looking at our midfield, had we spent 5 million on Huddlestone and Livermore like Hull did last summer, I reckon we would be 10 points better off now they are that much better than our options and ability. It is not like the players are not out there, there is simply an unwillingness to buy the obvious that would improve the team.

I think it's more to do with wages to be honest.

[olaftab]

I was thinking that somehow we may manage to keep this thread free from "Lambert is shit" comments but obviously not!

[eastie]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

Spot on. Looking at our midfield, had we spent 5 million on Huddlestone and Livermore like Hull did last summer, I reckon we would be 10 points better off now they are that much better than our options and ability. It is not like the players are not out there, there is simply an unwillingness to buy the obvious that would improve the team.

I think it's more to do with wages to be honest.

I disagree, I think its lambert who wants this young and hungry policy and who has been reluctant to buy experienced players - he is given a free reign on the football side and although we cannot pay top dollar wages I'm sure we could have got better quality in - lambert chooses the targets .

[Mister E]

I don't understand why people think the likes of Tonev (who admittedly has shown very little), or Helenius (who has barely had a chance) are the problem. They're not.

The problem isn't the players we did sign. It is the players we didn't sign.

Tonev may come good, I hope he does, but we shouldn't be relying on a bloke pulled from the Polish league (or was it the Bulgarian league, can't remember) to perform well immediately after being dropped into one of the toughest leagues in the world.

That's the problem, not Tonev himself.

Lest we forget, Petrov, who slowly but surely became a vital player for us, had two pretty unimpressive seasons to start with, and he'd moved from Celtic, not from a markedly different league.

Spot on. Looking at our midfield, had we spent 5 million on Huddlestone and Livermore like Hull did last summer, I reckon we would be 10 points better off now they are that much better than our options and ability. It is not like the players are not out there, there is simply an unwillingness to buy the obvious that would improve the team.

I think it's more to do with wages to be honest.

I disagree, I think its lambert who wants this young and hungry policy and who has been reluctant to buy experienced players - he is given a free reign on the football side and although we cannot pay top dollar wages I'm sure we could have got better quality in - lambert chooses the targets .

I think it's even simpler than that. He brought Vlaar and KEA as his experienced players and seems to believe that the likes of Westwood will develop such that buying other experienced players is not necessary.
It's a shame about Huddlestone and the others signed last summer, because he's exactly the type of player we lack. Our reluctance to buy comes from Lambert's stubbornness rather than budget IMO.

[eastie]

Although Vlaar and kea were experienced they were not experienced in this league and it has taken time to settle in vlaars case - as for kea the less said the better

[brian green]

I think Lambert is stubborn, but that is neither here nor there.   Good managers have to have a stubborn streak, there never was a great manager who did not have one.   Likewise I don't think the modest budget is the problem I think it is the mind set of the approach to the transfer windows which has been at fault.   As I have said on another thread the problem with trying to get low-priced, low-wages players is that you have to get so many of them to get a Benteke, Vlaar or Okore.   When injury and loss of form hit the winning bets, the losing bets assume a disproportionate importance.   The princess has to kiss a lot of frogs before she gets the happy ever after.

[Clampy]

Although Vlaar and kea were experienced they were not experienced in this league and it has taken time to settle in vlaars case - as for kea the less said the better

I think KEA has been ok this season, well away from home anyway. Maybe not the quality we need in there but he's improved.

[brian green]

He doesn't half have a long way to go though Clamps.

[saunders_heroes]

Although Vlaar and kea were experienced they were not experienced in this league and it has taken time to settle in vlaars case - as for kea the less said the better

I think KEA has been ok this season, well away from home anyway. Maybe not the quality we need in there but he's improved.

He's total garbage. Let's not pretend otherwise.

[Clampy]

He doesn't half have a long way to go though Clamps.

Maybe, but he does look a bit more confident away from home. Like I said, maybe not quite the quality we need in there but he's been no worse than Westwood and Sylla at times.

[saunders_heroes]

He doesn't half have a long way to go though Clamps.

Maybe, but he does look a bit more confident away from home. Like I said, maybe not quite the quality we need in there but he's been no worse than Westwood and Sylla at times.

Damned with faint praise.