Cardiff City v Aston Villa Post-Match Thread

[Irish villain]

When we stumble across the line in thirteenth or fourteenth in May about two points clear of the five or six clubs bunched below us, we really need to take a good, long, honest look at ourselves and ask if this cycle of shite is acceptable for a club like ours.

As ever Irish, I completely agree! And do you think anyone will actually do that or enact any of the serious changes that are needed? Not on your bloody life. We just lurch from one game to the next, seemingly not in control for one second of how we play at any given point in a game, forever destined to lurch between about 10th and 15th. If we're lucky. Our expectations have been dumbed down brilliantly by someone and I'm never quite sure how it happened...

Thanks richard, it's always reassuring to know one isn't just talking to one's self!I still think the Houllier season (and not blaming him entirely, it was a vicious cocktail) and how quickly we went from challengers to no-hopers really shook the club and sent it into a bit of a tailspin. Every since threat year the threat of relegation has haunted the club. I first smelt it the night Rapid  Vienna beat us when Kevin Mac was in charge. I can't describe it any better than that.

[tomd2103]

I can't help but feel that if the managers were swapped there would have been no doubt about the result. Just a hunch, but it looked to me like one of those games where their tactics were better than ours, our players were better than theirs, so the game ended equal.

Their tactics were to rely on us to miss numerous chances?

Oh no, their tactics were to control the midfield which they did first half, in spite of what we learned second half - that their players are rubbish.

Think the OGS myth is being deconstructed this season Monty.  The Man Utd love-in has hidden the fact that his time at Cardiff has been terrible so far.  To try and stave off relegation by bringing in young ex-Manchester United academy players is probably not the best way to go. 

[Olof's Beard]

A frustrating match and the reaction on here reflects that but trying to look at it objectively, it was a good performance.  We started brightly but lost our way in the first half.  Second half, we got the ball down and played, Delph and Westwood took complete control of the midfield and we put together some great approach play.  It's just a shame we couldn't fine a finishing touch, partly because Cardiff's centre halves - particularly Turner defended the box so well and partly because our own forwards look utterly devoid of confidence.  Marshall then pulls off the save of the season when we are first to a ball into the box.

Really frustrating not to win but most of the players had a good game.  Baker was occasionally clumsy but generally solid.  Vlaar has become one of the best centre halves in the league and as we all know is absolutely crucial.  Bacuna had some poor moments interspersed with some great ones.  Delph is truly a great footballer with exceptional touch and he was matched by Westwood in the second half.  Albrighton looks positive and much more like the player who first burst on to the scene, although he was breathing through his arse towards the end.  Benteke and Gabby won us so many games last season by being incredibly efficient in front of goal, how typical that both looked out of sorts in the penalty area on the same day, in a game that was there for the taking.  Gabby is usually a good instinctive finisher so I am stunned he ballsed up that change by not taking it first time.  Bizarre.

[Monty]

I can't help but feel that if the managers were swapped there would have been no doubt about the result. Just a hunch, but it looked to me like one of those games where their tactics were better than ours, our players were better than theirs, so the game ended equal.

Their tactics were to rely on us to miss numerous chances?

Oh no, their tactics were to control the midfield which they did first half, in spite of what we learned second half - that their players are rubbish.

Think the OGS myth is being deconstructed this season Monty.  The Man Utd love-in has hidden the fact that his time at Cardiff has been terrible so far.  To try and stave off relegation by bringing in young ex-Manchester United academy players is probably not the best way to go. 

His transfer dealings have been terrible to the point of corrupt, but his tactics tonight were pretty good.

[pauliewalnuts]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

We're not comfortable but West Ham have had a fantastic run and we've fallen the grand total of 1 place in the league.  People keep talking about how many points away from relegation we are but for us to end up in trouble would mean 7 out of 9 teams below us go on runs like West Ham's.

It's just not going to happen.

It's not just about relegation. I don't think we'll be relegated, but since when did we define ourselves on how awful other teams are? It's not acceptable for Aston Villa to say 'we're alright because a few other teams are worse'. It's pathetic, we should aspire to a bit more than that.

It's not even true.

West Ham were firmly in the bottom three. Sunderland are in 18th place tonight, have a game in hand on us, and are four points behind us.

I don't have any truck with the "we're doomed" faction, but you can say it's not about points all you like - it quite clearly is. When the gap between you and the relegation places is four points, you're talking about a gap which can be closed - mathematically - inside two rounds of fixtures.

We've won 2 of our last 11 games. If you think that run of form, combined with the table as it is at the moment, requires a significant turn of events for us to find us down there, in it, then you've got balls of steel.

Even if you insist that it'd require an amazing turn of events for us to find ourselves in the relegation places, what about the concept that we should have ambition beyond fighting relegation every year?

We spent all of last season doing that. Aren't we supposed to be improving?

[saunders_heroes]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

We're not comfortable but West Ham have had a fantastic run and we've fallen the grand total of 1 place in the league.  People keep talking about how many points away from relegation we are but for us to end up in trouble would mean 7 out of 9 teams below us go on runs like West Ham's.

It's just not going to happen.

My point is though, if a club can string a couple of wins together they can shoot up the league. It's happened with West Ham who are now above us. It could happen with other teams below us, that's why we're not comfortably mid-table.
We can't win games and it's a massive problem.

[ez]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

They just played 2 poor sides. So did we.

[The Left Side]

Should have won it easily, especially looking at Gabby's delayed effort and Bacuna going through plus their keeper having the game of his life... 2 points dropped but better than a loss.

[mike]

It's not so much rampant depression. It's that you come through games and you look at West Ham, Cardiff, Newcastle, Norwich and think well we should be getting at least 7 points there. Now in order to do that we need to win the next two games. Our performance against West Ham and our first half here are nowhere near acceptable. In the second half at least we appeared to realise we need to pass the ball, but how many times until Lambert actually learns that's the way for us to succeed?

I don't think it's Lambert telling them to play crap, I just think the players aren't very good.  But we should have enough to stay up and then he needs to buy some decent players in the Summer.

That's what I thought last year and look what he bought.

I think most of them are capable, we've seen that from them a number of times. It's just consistency, and I wonder if confidence plays a big part?

So if it's not the players is it the manager?

[shipscat]

Oh and I've love Ben Turner as competition for Vlaar and Okore, he was exceptional and his positioning was brilliant.

Probably a game in a million?
If he were that good every week, they wouldn't be in the shit they are in.

As possibly mentioned already,but I'm half way through the replies.He's one of the sullen,stinking unwashed heathens.

I thought we deserved all 3 points tonight.For the first time ever I was subjected to BT's "analysis",but I thought they slightly shaded,as you'd expect being at home,the first half,with a very good Villa controlled second half.They hardly got out of their half for the final 45.

Vlaar was imperious throughout,Gabby doesn't appear totally sharp,but you know he'll win us a big game at some point before the end of the season.Whatever the coaching team/Lambert tweaked at half time certainly gave us the initiative and control of the second.

[saunders_heroes]

4 points above the relegation zone. Just 4 points. How can we be possibly be comfortable in mid-table.
It's gonna be a nervy last 12 or so games.

[PaulWinch again]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

We're not comfortable but West Ham have had a fantastic run and we've fallen the grand total of 1 place in the league.  People keep talking about how many points away from relegation we are but for us to end up in trouble would mean 7 out of 9 teams below us go on runs like West Ham's.

It's just not going to happen.

It's not just about relegation. I don't think we'll be relegated, but since when did we define ourselves on how awful other teams are? It's not acceptable for Aston Villa to say 'we're alright because a few other teams are worse'. It's pathetic, we should aspire to a bit more than that.

It's not even true.

West Ham were firmly in the bottom three. Sunderland are in 18th place tonight, have a game in hand on us, and are four points behind us.

I don't have any truck with the "we're doomed" faction, but you can say it's not about points all you like - it quite clearly is. When the gap between you and the relegation places is four points, you're talking about a gap which can be closed - mathematically - inside two rounds of fixtures.

We've won 2 of our last 11 games. If you think that run of form, combined with the table as it is at the moment, requires a significant turn of events for us to find us down there, in it, then you've got balls of steel.

Even if you insist that it'd require an amazing turn of events for us to find ourselves in the relegation places, what about the concept that we should have ambition beyond fighting relegation every year?

We spent all of last season doing that. Aren't we supposed to be improving?

Completely agree and what's even more ridiculous is that our board/manager thought it was ok not to address our central defensive and creative issue in January. We're 11th but it's completely irrelevant when you look at the points difference between 11th-18th. Do Villa look like winning two on the bounce?

[Ad@m]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

We're not comfortable but West Ham have had a fantastic run and we've fallen the grand total of 1 place in the league.  People keep talking about how many points away from relegation we are but for us to end up in trouble would mean 7 out of 9 teams below us go on runs like West Ham's.

It's just not going to happen.

My point is though, if a club can string a couple of wins together they can shoot up the league. It's happened with West Ham who are now above us. It could happen with other teams below us, that's why we're not comfortably mid-table.
We can't win games and it's a massive problem.

But one team doing it is one thing.  Seven doing it is a another matter entirely.

We're not safe, of course we're not.  I'm also not happy that our 'ambition' for this season is to stay up.  But we have to be realistic about where we're coming from and the time it takes to get to where we want to be.  You simply can't rebuild a side whilst reducing the wage bill and expect to go from relegation fodder to challenging for Europe in a season.

[Villa in Denmark]

Oh and another one, will someone please tell our players that when they get in the box, attack the f&%$ing ball. Don't wait for it to come to you, any half decent centre half will nick the ball off you.

[PaulWinch again]

West Ham were in the relegation zone just a week ago, now they're above us in the top half. Anyone who thinks we're comfortably mid-table are living in cloud cuckoo land. We need wins.

We're not comfortable but West Ham have had a fantastic run and we've fallen the grand total of 1 place in the league.  People keep talking about how many points away from relegation we are but for us to end up in trouble would mean 7 out of 9 teams below us go on runs like West Ham's.

It's just not going to happen.

My point is though, if a club can string a couple of wins together they can shoot up the league. It's happened with West Ham who are now above us. It could happen with other teams below us, that's why we're not comfortably mid-table.
We can't win games and it's a massive problem.

But one team doing it is one thing.  Seven doing it is a another matter entirely.

We're not safe, of course we're not.  I'm also not happy that our 'ambition' for this season is to stay up.  But we have to be realistic about where we're coming from and the time it takes to get to where we want to be.  You simply can't rebuild a side whilst reducing the wage bill and expect to go from relegation fodder to challenging for Europe in a season.

There should be a big gap between ambitions of qualifying for Europe and staying up and at the minute we don't appear to have progressed much beyond trying to stay up.