The Paul Lambert thread - poll reset after our capitulation to Hull

[SoccerHQ]

I much preferred his transfers to O'Neill's.

It shouldn't be as black and white as O'Neill 6th 6th 6th transfers brilliant and Lambert 15th 16th 15th transfers awful.

Paul Lambert signed some good players infact if we're talking about Benteke very good players for in today's market very little.

Martin O'Neill wasted untold millions on people like Beye, Harewood, Shorey, Sidwell, Knight etc but of course when you're finishing 6th you can get away with it as he was obviously better than Lambert at other aspects such as keeping players fit, motivating the main first 11 abd formulating a simple game plan that could beat 75% of the premier league.

The above players caused us untold issues after he left, far more than someone like Antionio Luna signed for 1m and on 15k a week or Yacouba Sylla will.

[SoccerHQ]

He also signed Jordan Bowery who was so out of his depth I felt sorry for him.

Yeah didn't understood that one but he still started a couple of premier league games we won in the first season so you could argue he was a little better than Salifou who was another baffling signing as amusing as his chant and cult hero status were.

[not3bad]

El Ahamadi - Crap
Lowton - Crap
Bennett - Crap
Vlaar - Ok
Bowery - Crap
Benteke - Good
Westwood - Ok
Sylla - Crap
Tonev - Crap
Bacuna - Ok
Okore - Ok
Luna - Crap
Helenius - Crap
Steer - Ok too early to judge
Kozak - Ok too early to judge
Cole - Crap
Senderos - Ok too early to judge
Cissokho - Ok
Richardson - Ok
Sanchez -Ok
Gil - Ok too early to judge

Hardly a glowing reference, his transfer dealings look mainly Ok, add to that he couldn't manage a fart, was personally very dull and uninspiring and didn't think coaches were important I'd sum up his whole reign as almost entirely incompetent.

I feel that Bennett may come back and surprise us, pleasantly.
Helenius cannot be judged on his one one or two appearances.
Okore - too early to judge, given his injury.

I think you've been harsh generally, above.

Ridiculously harsh. Vlaar has looked a fantastic buy at times, so has Sanchez (3 MOM in succession) Gil looks highly promising, and you can't judge Helenius because he got less than 5 minutes in the first team and cannot be blamed for coming down with a serious illness. Lowton crap? The goal against Stoke alone makes him better than that.

[SoccerHQ]

Lambert's problem wasn't so much the players he did sign as those he didn't.

Lambert's problem was rubbish counter attacking football constantly played at home that resulted in barely 5 wins at home a season, constant loyalty to Gabby and Weimann which mean they averaged 30 starts a season, poor performances in the cups, not being able to organise a defence for a lot of his time here.

Martin O'Neill also produced limited counter attacking football but that was still good enough to beat 75% of the premier league when he was here but to me there are more elements to whether a manager is good or not than just whether his transfer record is good or not.

There are plenty of managers in the PL who sign poor players yet can organise them into a reasonably effect group.

Newcastle for example to me do not have a better squad than us yet they've been comfortably mid table last few season. Pulis wasted a lot of money at Stoke but again they were comfortably mid table.

Lambert signed some good players but just couldn't get them to play in a cohesive unit for many reasons and finally was put out of his misery.

[SoccerHQ]

El Ahamadi - Crap
Lowton - Crap
Bennett - Crap
Vlaar - Ok
Bowery - Crap
Benteke - Good
Westwood - Ok
Sylla - Crap
Tonev - Crap
Bacuna - Ok
Okore - Ok
Luna - Crap
Helenius - Crap
Steer - Ok too early to judge
Kozak - Ok too early to judge
Cole - Crap
Senderos - Ok too early to judge
Cissokho - Ok
Richardson - Ok
Sanchez -Ok
Gil - Ok too early to judge

Hardly a glowing reference, his transfer dealings look mainly Ok, add to that he couldn't manage a fart, was personally very dull and uninspiring and didn't think coaches were important I'd sum up his whole reign as almost entirely incompetent.

I feel that Bennett may come back and surprise us, pleasantly.
Helenius cannot be judged on his one one or two appearances.
Okore - too early to judge, given his injury.

I think you've been harsh generally, above.

Ridiculously harsh. Vlaar has looked a fantastic buy at times, so has Sanchez (3 MOM in succession) Gil looks highly promising, and you can't judge Helenius because he got less than 5 minutes in the first team and cannot be blamed for coming down with a serious illness. Lowton crap? The goal against Stoke alone makes him better than that.

We signed Ron Vlaar for 2m less than we signed Zat Knight and 7m less than Curtis Davies.

He infuriates with his injuries but how many premier league managers could sign a regular international CB for one of the top nations in world football for just 3m?

Jores Okore could be a fantastic centre half for this club, again 3-4m that's not a lot in today's market. That was a blow to Lambert to lose him for the whole season, I feel last year would've been more comfortable if he'd stayed fit.

All the rest were mostly squad punts but the problem was of course they were then played in the first 11 with many not proving good enough.

But compare how much they all cost to Sidwell, Beye, Heskey, Harewood, NRC, Davies, Knight etc.

[Mister E]

Lambert's problem wasn't so much the players he did sign as those he didn't.

Well, maybe.
In the end he got found out for his apparent absence of coaching and motivational capability, IMO. Sherwood is - it appears - demonstrating this amply. Same players, different outcome.

[supertom]

Okore has generally been good this season. He's got the odd rick in him, but given his age and experience, that's no surprise. When he's good he's very good and he's got all the attributes. Lowton has also been in good form since coming in at Left back, so he may well still have a future here.

In one respect I do feel that Lambert went for quantity over quality. Taking into consideration the players we've either sold on or loaned out, Sylla, Tonev, Bowery, KEA, Luna, Bennett and Helenius, that's 7 players right there. At what, 13-15 mill (ish), maybe 10-20k wage each.

I'd rather have bought in maybe 2-3 half decent players as opposed to the above, and had a little more faith in some of our own youngsters.

He's had blotches in the transfer department, like any manager. His success rate is similar to O Neills perhaps. I dunno, O Neill had more signings who could (and did) turn big profits. Young, Milner and Downing for example. Lamberts only really got Benteke who could turn a significant turnaround. Bar Delph he's the only one in our side who could fetch over 10 million. But conversely, O Neill's flops were almost all expensive and ridiculously paid. All told he probably broke even. We made a bomb on Young, Milner and Downing. I don't think he's entirely to blame for our financial problems. After all we still had money in the pot to pay 18-24 mill for Benty, as well as 7.5 on Makoun that year. Having sold Milner and with the impending Young sale (followed by the unexpected Downing sale). We still forked out 9.5 on Zogbia.
I still blame Randy's naivety and set up for our problems. After all, he signed the cheques that O Neill needed.

[silhillvilla]

Lamberts best work was his clearing out tossers like warnock dunne Collins etc and his signings overall I'd say were good.
He just didn't know how to manage them.

[Risso]

He infuriates with his injuries but how many premier league managers could sign a regular international CB for one of the top nations in world football for just 3m?

Well hopefully one of them will this summer.  Even better for them if they do, they'll be getting the waste of space for free.

[Toronto Villa]

The outstanding form of Clark and the improving form of Okore (22 let's not forget) is making losing Vlaar a non issue. We do need to find a CB in the summer if Senderos doesn't or cannot come back. Baker with one other of PL quality and the emerging Donacien makes for a very solid set of players at that position.

[PeterWithe]

I wouldnt be at all surprised to see Sherwood, if we stay up, go for Caulker from QPR. I was looking for something else and came across an article with Sherwood raving about what a great character he has.

[SoccerHQ]

If there's any hint of Spurs selling Andros Townsend this summer we'll be in for him like a shot as Sherwood has mentioned him about five times in various interviews.

Beyond that I don't know what our transfer policy will be this summer. At a guess I'd imagine we'll still concentrate on getting young players in.

[Toronto Villa]

If there's any hint of Spurs selling Andros Townsend this summer we'll be in for him like a shot as Sherwood has mentioned him about five times in various interviews.

Beyond that I don't know what our transfer policy will be this summer. At a guess I'd imagine we'll still concentrate on getting young players in.

I think he wants Grealish or Sinclair to be his Townsend. I mean why spunk 7-8m on Townsend when you have the we have for a combined 3m say, and N'Zogbia coming back into things? Townsend is good but I'd rather develop the players we have.

[pauliewalnuts]

Lambert's problem wasn't so much the players he did sign as those he didn't.

Lambert's problem was rubbish counter attacking football constantly played at home that resulted in barely 5 wins at home a season, constant loyalty to Gabby and Weimann which mean they averaged 30 starts a season, poor performances in the cups, not being able to organise a defence for a lot of his time here.

Martin O'Neill also produced limited counter attacking football but that was still good enough to beat 75% of the premier league when he was here but to me there are more elements to whether a manager is good or not than just whether his transfer record is good or not.

There are plenty of managers in the PL who sign poor players yet can organise them into a reasonably effect group.

Newcastle for example to me do not have a better squad than us yet they've been comfortably mid table last few season. Pulis wasted a lot of money at Stoke but again they were comfortably mid table.

Lambert signed some good players but just couldn't get them to play in a cohesive unit for many reasons and finally was put out of his misery.

Oh, I totally agree with all of that, I was talking purely with reference to signings, which is what was being discussed at that point.

All that shit counter attacking football at home when people aren't attacking you, that's something we're very familiar with, MON may have won a lot more matches than Lambert did, but if you look at his spell, we were miles better away from home than at home for the whole four years.

basically, even when our owner was pouring money in and we were doing well in the league, we still managed to do it in a way which was crap to watch at home (I remember seeing that in both his last seasons, we leathered Bolton 4 or 5 nil at home, and similarly took a big tally from someone else, but for the other 17 home games we averaged out at a goal a game, which is dog shit.

re his signings, it wasn't the fact he signed the likes of Bowery or Bennett or Luna which did for us, it was the fact that he didn't sign the players we really needed.

It's alright taking a punt on Helenius or Bowery, but not if those are punts in positions where you really need people.

I never understood why so many people thought we had a decent summer window, for example. Senderos, Richardson, Cole? Those to me look like signings preparing for a season in the Championship.

One of the main emotions I'll remember from the Lambert era is the feeling of disappointment when a transfer window closed.

[Rudy65]

I wouldnt be at all surprised to see Sherwood, if we stay up, go for Caulker from QPR. I was looking for something else and came across an article with Sherwood raving about what a great character he has.

Would be a good signing