Aston Villa v Sunderland Post-Match Thread

[avfcpg]

Our performances thus far against Cardiff, West Ham, Hull, Sunderland, Norwich were worrying as we looked no better than any of them.

Even though none of them beat us.

I think we kind of lose sight of the reality of the premier league sometimes. Anyone below us or a perceived "poor" team we should be twatting week in and week out. Alas, it doesn't work like that...

Cardiff 2 vs 2 Man Utd
Hull 3 vs 1 Liverpool
Sunderland 1 vs 0 Man City

[brontebilly]

Our performances thus far against Cardiff, West Ham, Hull, Sunderland, Norwich were worrying as we looked no better than any of them.

Even though none of them beat us.

I think we kind of lose sight of the reality of the premier league sometimes. Anyone below us or a perceived "poor" team we should be twatting week in and week out. Alas, it doesn't work like that...

Cardiff 2 vs 2 Man Utd
Hull 3 vs 1 Liverpool
Sunderland 1 vs 0 Man City

The Villa side of the back end of last season would have twatted those five teams. Those were five truly awful games where an ounce of quality would prove the difference for either side. Gabby v Norwich and Bacuna v Cardiff were enough. The other three were risible.

All depends where you want to set the benchmark for expectations.

a) the Xmas of last year, 8-0 defeat etc
b) the end of last season scoring goals for fun

some here are using a and some are using b.

[dave.woodhall]

Our performances thus far against Cardiff, West Ham, Hull, Sunderland, Norwich were worrying as we looked no better than any of them.

Even though none of them beat us.

I think we kind of lose sight of the reality of the premier league sometimes. Anyone below us or a perceived "poor" team we should be twatting week in and week out. Alas, it doesn't work like that...

Cardiff 2 vs 2 Man Utd
Hull 3 vs 1 Liverpool
Sunderland 1 vs 0 Man City

I think this is what pisses me off most. The same people who say we're shit and we know we are, this time we're going down, yes I know I said it last time, the time before that and the time before that but this time we really definitely are going down, are invariably also the same ones to say we should be battering other teams without fail.

[Ads]

Our performances thus far against Cardiff, West Ham, Hull, Sunderland, Norwich were worrying as we looked no better than any of them.

Even though none of them beat us.

Or even scored a goal against us.

[Ads]

a) the Xmas of last year, 8-0 defeat etc
b) the end of last season scoring goals for fun

some here are using a and some are using b.

I think people are using last season and what went before to shape expectations. I haven't seen too many proclaim how great our current form is based on us not being beat 8-0. That's just daft.

[avfcpg]

If we are scoring goals for fun then we are usually shipping them for fun as well. Lambert seems to have addressed one problem at the cost of another and I have no problem with that, it's the way to build surely? Hopefully given time & patience (sacred commodity these days it seems), he will slowly address the other.

Given our flirt with danger last year I'm happy to get results first and performances second, but that's just my opinion. Spurs spent 90 million on "flair players" and yet we've scored 2 more goals than them this season... 

[Damo70]

Our performances thus far against Cardiff, West Ham, Hull, Sunderland, Norwich were worrying as we looked no better than any of them.

Even though none of them beat us.

I think we kind of lose sight of the reality of the premier league sometimes. Anyone below us or a perceived "poor" team we should be twatting week in and week out. Alas, it doesn't work like that...

Cardiff 2 vs 2 Man Utd
Hull 3 vs 1 Liverpool
Sunderland 1 vs 0 Man City

I think this is what pisses me off most. The same people who say we're shit and we know we are, this time we're going down, yes I know I said it last time, the time before that and the time before that but this time we really definitely are going down, are invariably also the same ones to say we should be battering other teams without fail.

If anyone reckons we are going down I would say that I don't tend to associate clean sheets, decent away form, the ability to come back from losing positions and a mid table position with teams heading for relegation.

[Ads]

There is a poster on this thread who has said we are going down every season for the past few years.

Can you guess who it is?

[eastie]

At this stage last season we had scored 10 goals from 13 games and conceded 22 so no doubt notonly has our points tally improved but our goal difference has considerably improved - it has not been pretty at times but we knew we had to tighten up the defence and have still scored more this season than we had last season at this stage.

[eastie]

There is a poster on this thread who has said we are going down every season for the past few years.

Can you guess who it is?

Rolf Harris?

[Ads]

Nope. Read the Southampton thread for a clue.

[TimTheVillain]

. However we need to address our obvious issues, one of which is the on-going lack of creativity from midfield. A decent quality creative midfielder will massively improve our results at home.

... AND he can be over 25 yrs of age too ...

[kippaxvilla2]

The fact that we are all still arguing and debating means that we care and expect better no matter how deluded we may appear - the day we accept just being in the Premiership as our reason for being we become the Albion. Keep ranting Villans!

I did attend hungover and it did have a numbing effect ;-)

Bang on. We shouldn't just be happy with just being in the PL. We're Aston Villa, not the Albion or Stoke etc. We are into our 4th season of struggle now, this hasn't happened in decades. We should demand better.

It isn't happening now. It might not suit your argument but we are in the top half.

In comparison to our average finish in the Premier League - leaving the last 3 seasons aside I think he may have a point.

If you are using an average you can't just ignore 3 years that don't suit the argument. In any case, surely it's rebuilding from the mess of the previous seasons that has the most bearing on where we are now.

Yes, a couple of bad results might see us slip down the table but equally a couple of decent wins might see us pull away. However, that's all conjecture and relies on other results to go a certain way. If we stick to the facts we're in the middle of the table.

But I think his point is that this has been the 4th season of struggle therefore we have gone backwards and he doesn't accept this is where we should be as a club.  But I might be wrong. 

I think my main point is that although we are in a better position and we are building slowly I think the excitement factor has gone a bit.  As daft as it sounds, when we were getting twatted and then we picked it up after Christmas last year it was exciting to see us attack teams the way we did - notwithstanding the obviously rankness of the defence.  I find it is very typical of Villa to fix one end of the pitch only for it to go temporarily at least wrong at the other.

[Concrete John]

All depends where you want to set the benchmark for expectations.

a) the Xmas of last year, 8-0 defeat etc
b) the end of last season scoring goals for fun

some here are using a and some are using b.

I think you have to view it over the course of the whole season, as that's the only way that really matters.  So it's the ups and downs of 12/13 balancing off to where we actually finished.

That makes this season look better so far, even if it isn't as exciting.

And on another point, I don't think our defensive improvements are the reason for the attack getting blunted, despite some people immediately linking the two.  For me, Benteke's lack for form since the injury is why we're struggling to score and that's nothing to do with us stopping to shift daft goals at the other end.

[supertom]

If Benteke hits form then we turn draws into wins. He looks a long way off right now, but hopefully he'll hit a purple patch soon.
When we were bloody ordinary under McLeish, Bent looked likely to nick us a goal. In fairness that tactic, while fucking awful on the eyes, did work up until Jan. When we lost Bent of course, the game plan was buggered and we fell from solid in mid-table to surviving by the skin of our teeth.
Likewise we were pretty ordinary under Gregory, but we had players like Merson, and later, JPA with a touch of flair and the ability to turn dour games.
We've got the basis to be like this again. It might not be pretty, but we will be comfortable I suppose.

What we certainly need more than anything is to really work bloody hard on our basics. Some of our passing has been horrifically inept. Simple passes. A good coach brought in could make a difference and help give our boys a lesson in passing, movement and some composure. We're not expecting to be the new Arsenal, but if you're a professional footballer, there's no excuse for the amount of unforced, basic errors we've been making lately.