Sad, sad, sad

[Ger Regan]

Alcoholics will find ways and means of finding drink, with or without the help of barmen or idiotic punters. And it's beyond simplistic to just say 'don't buy drinks for the likes of x, y or z', what about the many more alcoholics not in the public eye?

[Chap]

I noticed the mention of the word Agent in the article, need we say more, that's the last thing he needs

[eamonn]

Funny, I saw the word and felt a bit relieved that he's at least not completely on his own with all this.

[dave.woodhall]

Agents get a bad press but sometimes they look after more than their clients' income.

[Andy_Lochhead_in_the_air]

Solicitor Donal Farrelly said McGrath sometimes turned to drink to cope with a debilitating disorder whereby he suffers acute anxiety during social occasions.

He is basically a shy guy. Making decisions with a football as 80,000 people watch was easy for him, I guess because it was something he was very very good at and he was in control of the situation. But expressing yourself standing around with a small group of people engaged in small talk can petrify him. Does the shyness/anxiety come from a fear you are going to say something daft or feeling you have nothing worthwhile to contribute to the conversation ?
When I have seen interviews with him he has always just come across a nice quiet unassuming modest guy. Maybe he feels he is expected to put on a great show in front of people just as he used to put on a great show every week on the pitch.

[peter w]

"Agents get a bad press but sometimes they look after more than their clients' income. "

It may be quite trite to agree and say that yes, they have their own income to look after. but, I agree with the point. Its a bit like Saul in Breaking Bad.

[Villadroid]

I suppose there is a hint of self-interest in our wish to see Paul find a cure for his obsession with drink.

We wish to have as many reasons to carry on admiring him in his retirement at we did during his career, and so we can't help wishing there was a quick fix to his problems and he could find a way to maintain his dignity as well as his reputation.

Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.

So I don't think the self-medication route is particularly helpful because if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.

My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.

He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.

There are plenty of people who would pay to hear him speak and as Warren Buffet found out, public speaking can be taught.

And if an autistic person like Temple Grandin can learn to do it, then so can Paul McGrath.

Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.

In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.

I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.

And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.

[Chico Hamilton III]

if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.

I don't imagine many people on here would have experienced anything like the trauma of being a chronically shy black kid in an Irish orphanage in the 1970s.

[peter w]

he is ont he public speaking circuit. however, his problem is a lot to do with his crippling shyness. In certain situations he has stated that he gets panic attacks which leads to the drinking starting again.

[olaftab]

if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.

I don't imagine many people on here would have experienced anything like the trauma of being a chronically shy black kid in an Irish orphanage in the 1970s.

Good point Chico.

[russon]

Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.

My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.

He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.

Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.

In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.

I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.

And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.

This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".

Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.

[supertom]

If he showed the same sort of determination and focus he did on the pitch, to kick this thing in the ass he'd come out a winner. That's one of the saddest parts of it. I hope he sorts himself out. I think the trouble too for some people who suffer from alcoholism is not cutting it out altogether. It gets to a point that you just need to cut it out of your life completely because one pint here and there might seem harmless enough but it can set the ball rolling on another binge.

It's not impossible though. Others have overcome this, so hopefully God will too. If he doesn't he'll not have many years left unfortunately. Now is the time to do it though.

[Villadroid]

Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.

My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.

He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.

Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.

In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.

I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.

And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.

This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".

Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.

This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".

Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?

[russon]

Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.

My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.

He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.

Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.

In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.

I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.

And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.

This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".

Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.

This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".

Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?

I see you've chosen to use the word boozers, what does that mean because it'll help me understand where you're coming from? Alcoholics like to refer to 'boozing'  and 'social drinking' to pretend they are just like everyone else that 'likes a drink' when in fact they're in denial of the fact that they have become powerless over alcohol. Sporting Chance was set up for ex-sports people yes but access to places like that isn't exclusive in that it's simply a rehab place for footballers etc. There are many hostels/rehabs for the general public too they just aren't as well known.

[Villadroid]

Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.

My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.

He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.

Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.

In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.

I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.

And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.

This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".

Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.

This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".

Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?

I see you've chosen to use the word boozers, what does that mean because it'll help me understand where you're coming from? Alcoholics like to refer to 'boozing'  and 'social drinking' to pretend they are just like everyone else that 'likes a drink' when in fact they're in denial of the fact that they have become powerless over alcohol. Sporting Chance was set up for ex-sports people yes but access to places like that isn't exclusive in that it's simply a rehab place for footballers etc. There are many hostels/rehabs for the general public too they just aren't as well known.

Boozers?

I would define it as all those drinkers who don't quite manage to screw their lives up entirely by failing to keep a job or wrecking their relationships but generally live lives which are dominated by drink and create misery for everyone about them by being selfish SOBs.

The fact that they do not lose their jobs or get kicked out by their family is largely down to the tolerance of their colleagues and family which amounts to co-dependence in many cases.

This is where the manipulation comes in, as in between their bouts of boozing, boozers will do the full mea culpa, with tears and their best 'helpless victim' act, claiming they need someone to rescue them.

Having negotiated forgiveness they will go through a short period of sobriety before starting the process all over again.

I would reserve the term "alcoholic" for those few people who can be shown to have reached the stage of total chemical dependency where withdrawal produces seizures and DTs.