Lambert: I want to build a top team

[dave.woodhall]

What exactly did Houllier do that was so wrong?

His press conference on day 1 - "Its no Liverpool.. Villa belong 12th" - A club thats just finished 6th 3 years running and above Liverpool the season before. It was all downhill from there, how can  anyone defend him?

At least Eck never said a bad word about the club no matter how poorly we treated him.

He didn't say that.

[eastie]

What exactly did Houllier do that was so wrong?

His press conference on day 1 - "Its no Liverpool.. Villa belong 12th" - A club thats just finished 6th 3 years running and above Liverpool the season before. It was all downhill from there, how can  anyone defend him?

At least Eck never said a bad word about the club no matter how poorly we treated him.

He didn't say that.

e

He said usually between 6th and 12th if i recall correctly

[pauliewalnuts]

We signed Pires because we had a horrendous injury situation, and the transfer window was closed, meaning we could only sign unattached players.

I don't really understand people getting their knickers in a twist about that. If we'd signed someone for actual money at that age and given them a contract beyond the end of the season, then maybe, but it was a pretty sensible move to be able to get another body in when we were pretty desperate.

[pauliewalnuts]

What exactly did Houllier do that was so wrong?

His press conference on day 1 - "Its no Liverpool.. Villa belong 12th" - A club thats just finished 6th 3 years running and above Liverpool the season before. It was all downhill from there, how can  anyone defend him?

At least Eck never said a bad word about the club no matter how poorly we treated him.

He didn't say that.

e

He said usually between 6th and 12th if i recall correctly

He definitely said the bit about "of course, it's not a job on the level of Liverpool".

Think it is you want, but don't fecking say it. That's the sort of thing he never got.

[LeeB]

What exactly did Houllier do that was so wrong?

His press conference on day 1 - "Its no Liverpool.. Villa belong 12th" - A club thats just finished 6th 3 years running and above Liverpool the season before. It was all downhill from there, how can  anyone defend him?

At least Eck never said a bad word about the club no matter how poorly we treated him.

He didn't say that.

e

He said usually between 6th and 12th if i recall correctly

He definitely said the bit about "of course, it's not a job on the level of Liverpool".

Think it is you want, but don't fecking say it. That's the sort of thing he never got.

Yes, and he undermined himself by doing it. You'd think a man of his experience would play the political game a little better.

[Clampy]

Houiller did tend to put his foot in it on occasions. I did'nt think he was right for us but it would have been interesting to see would have happened had we got another season out of him.

[OzVilla]

GH is the classic phenomenon of becoming a better Manager by virtue of not being around and not being Eck.

Imo, he was a dreadful appointment on so many levels and guess what, one of the main reasons meant he couldn't see the season out - he only came on board in the September.

His love in at Plop and antics at Citeh were quite frankly unforgivable for any Villa Manager let alone one whose performance up to that time had been at best patchy.

If he was ever going to be Villa Manager it should have been after BL when we appointed JG instead.

[Irish villain]

Houllier said Villa's natural place was about 7th to 12th, at a time when we had been trying to make the step up from 6th to 4th. He arrived with a negative relationship with such players as Carew and Warnock (possibly Big Brad too?) and proved confrontational from day one. After MON's antics Villa needed stability for a season before taking a step to the next level. Instead we ended up in a relegation scrap until our form picked up in April. If you look at our leage position and points in Houllier's season it pretty much matches TSM or Lambert until about the end of March before picking up in the final seven games or so.

He was a bad appointment, just look at his record for blaming players. If Fergie has proved anything it's that you defend your players in public. Creating fall guys doesn't work.

Houllier did not understand Aston Villa and was never a good fit.

[supertom]

I believe it was 8-12th he said. But yes, it was a stupid thing to say after 3, 6th place finishes. That said, given we'd just sold our player of the year, he was right. He also identified pretty quickly that Stephen Ireland wasn't particularly interested. Obviously you don't want to set a difficult bar to achieve but he should have been so specific. We all knew we were going to regress, we didn't need to here it from our new manager.

To be honest, in retrospect, Houllier wasn't too bad. He had some good ideas. His problem was, he was past it in terms of management. If he'd been bought on to oversee a younger manager, it could have worked out better.

The liverpool love in didn't help or treating some cup games with enough respect. He did alienate half of the senior squad, but in fairness, I'm with GH on that one. A lot of them were fucking lazy. Our boy Gabby didn't get on with him either, but again, I'm with Houllier on this one. Gabby should have eased up on the muscle gain for the benefit of his biggest asset, his pace.

[Concrete John]

Houllier said Villa's natural place was about 7th to 12th, at a time when we had been trying to make the step up from 6th to 4th. He arrived with a negative relationship with such players as Carew and Warnock (possibly Big Brad too?) and proved confrontational from day one. After MON's antics Villa needed stability for a season before taking a step to the next level. Instead we ended up in a relegation scrap until our form picked up in April. If you look at our leage position and points in Houllier's season it pretty much matches TSM or Lambert until about the end of March before picking up in the final seven games or so.He was a bad appointment, just look at his record for blaming players. If Fergie has proved anything it's that you defend your players in public. Creating fall guys doesn't work.

Houllier did not understand Aston Villa and was never a good fit.

Our form from the Bent signing, so pretty much half the season, was top 6 level, which saw us climb from the relegation mix to 9th. 

I didn't want Houllier and think he did a bad job on balance, but I think he had us going in the right direction and it would be interesting to see where he would have taken us had he stayed.  But the biggest issue was his health, which turned out to be why he left.

I guess I'd class it as a strange appointment more than a bad one.

[Irish villain]

Houllier said Villa's natural place was about 7th to 12th, at a time when we had been trying to make the step up from 6th to 4th. He arrived with a negative relationship with such players as Carew and Warnock (possibly Big Brad too?) and proved confrontational from day one. After MON's antics Villa needed stability for a season before taking a step to the next level. Instead we ended up in a relegation scrap until our form picked up in April. If you look at our leage position and points in Houllier's season it pretty much matches TSM or Lambert until about the end of March before picking up in the final seven games or so.He was a bad appointment, just look at his record for blaming players. If Fergie has proved anything it's that you defend your players in public. Creating fall guys doesn't work.

Houllier did not understand Aston Villa and was never a good fit.

Our form from the Bent signing, so pretty much half the season, was top 6 level, which saw us climb from the relegation mix to 9th. 

I didn't want Houllier and think he did a bad job on balance, but I think he had us going in the right direction and it would be interesting to see where he would have taken us had he stayed.  But the biggest issue was his health, which turned out to be why he left.

I guess I'd class it as a strange appointment more than a bad one.

I probably was a bit harsh, you are right.

I've gone back and checked. We were on 34 points with seven games to go in the Houllier season and our form was like top four form in those remaining games.

I still think he gets off a  bit lightly on that score, 34 points with seven to go is relegation fight.

[pauliewalnuts]

Houllier failed us in lots of ways, however, having gone through a season of pain, but eventually improved markedly towards the end, we made the utterly bewildering decision to employ the anti-football relic McLeish.

Say what you like about the Houllier appointment, and there are plenty of reasons to look back and say it was a poor appointment, and a poor season, but the real damage to this club wasn't appointing him, it was throwing away the progress we'd made and appointing McLeish - totally inexplicable on a footballing level, and a perfect example of why those running the club don't know their arses from their elbows.

They managed to appoint a man who made no sense in terms of footballing continuity, and at the same time, placed a gigantic divisive wedge between club and fans.

[Concrete John]

Houllier failed us in lots of ways, however, having gone through a season of pain, but eventually improved markedly towards the end, we made the utterly bewildering decision to employ the anti-football relic McLeish.

Say what you like about the Houllier appointment, and there are plenty of reasons to look back and say it was a poor appointment, and a poor season, but the real damage to this club wasn't appointing him, it was throwing away the progress we'd made and appointing McLeish - totally inexplicable on a footballing level, and a perfect example of why those running the club don't know their arses from their elbows.

They managed to appoint a man who made no sense in terms of footballing continuity, and at the same time, placed a gigantic divisive wedge between club and fans.

The thing that got me about Mcleish more than anything was the finances.  He was on a hiding to nothing anyway, but a manager that unpopular needs to be given a fighting chance.  We made something like a £20m transfer profit that season and continued to slash the wages.  If nothing else, the prospect of a few decent signings gets the fans excited about the new season, which wasn't going to be the case with the anticipation of his defensive minded style.  It was so tight, we resorted to Jenas on loan in midfield. 

It was almost like he was there to oversee the cost cutting as he'd be massively unpopular anyway!

[Irish villain]

Houllier failed us in lots of ways, however, having gone through a season of pain, but eventually improved markedly towards the end, we made the utterly bewildering decision to employ the anti-football relic McLeish.

Say what you like about the Houllier appointment, and there are plenty of reasons to look back and say it was a poor appointment, and a poor season, but the real damage to this club wasn't appointing him, it was throwing away the progress we'd made and appointing McLeish - totally inexplicable on a footballing level, and a perfect example of why those running the club don't know their arses from their elbows.

They managed to appoint a man who made no sense in terms of footballing continuity, and at the same time, placed a gigantic divisive wedge between club and fans.

I think that's something we can all agree on. That decision also, in my view, calls into question earlier choices. Did they really employ Houllier as part of a dynamic strategy to drag us into the vanguard of European football or was it like the appointment a bit like TSM 'whatever fits our immediate need'?

[Dave]

"Aston Villa is not a club on the same level as Liverpool, let's be objective and honest.

It's a club that according to me has belonged between seventh and 12th place in the Premier League"

As Paulie says, think it by all means. But don't say it in your first press conference. Particularly when we've just finished the previous season ahead of wonderful, wonderful Liverpool.