Just when you think that things couldn't get any worse....

[Clampy]

Noble is West Ham's Gerrard I suppose. A local boy with no intention of leaving his boyhood club or jellied eels. Unlike Gerrard though he's a nothing to shout about midfielder who's done well for himself.

[Chris Smith]

What i want in the main is to see my side win games, if we win with style all the better but the result means more than the performance .

The days of george grahams boring arsenal grinding out 1-0 wins would suit me as long as we win - we all want to win and score loads of goals with free flowing football but give me a scrappy 1-0 win over a 3-3 draw anyday.

Funny how Allardyce is suddenly flavour of the month when O'Neill was regularly slagged off for his own pragmatic approach.

I suppose options begin to run out after a while for those who serially want the manager sacked. It won't be long before the Pulis bandwagon gets going.

The main objection with O'Neill, as you well know, was that he was spending money hand over fist on players who weren't worth the money, and that he appeared to have reached his glass ceiling.  As we were constantly being reassured by the likes of Krulak that money spent and losses weren't a problem, it wasn't unreasonable for Villa fans to hope for a manager that looked capable of taking us the extra step into the top 4.  The fact that we were lied to by the likes of Krulak and the club has since imploded doesn't make that view unreasonable.

That's a dressing up of the argument after the event when in fact a regular criticism was that the football was dull and unimaginative.

Allardyce is not the answer unless the question is "name a fat ugly bastard from Dudlley synonymous with turgid football".

[eastie]

Noble is West Ham's Gerrard I suppose. A local boy with no intention of leaving his boyhood club or jellied eels. Unlike Gerrard though he's a nothing to shout about midfielder who's done well for himself.

I think nolan is more the ,main man in west hams midfield- i would certainly like him at villa.

[pauliewalnuts]

That's a dressing up of the argument after the event when in fact a regular criticism was that the football was dull and unimaginative.

And that is specifically the thing I don't understand.

People who were moaning about the quality of football under O'Neill - when that turgid football got us sixth three years in a row - now prepared to put up with a style that makes O'Neill's look amazing by comparison, and purveyed by a manager who traditionally occupies the mid level of the table at best.

It is precisely what you said, just the reflection of the next stop in the ongoing managerial merry-go-round, and if it weren't Allardyce, no doubt it'd be Pullis next.

I also find it hard to accept the fact that some of the very same people who were pointing out - rightly - how terrible we were last season under McLeish seem to think that, actually, that should have been magically brushed aside, and that one season is enough to recover from it.

It isn't, and it was never going to be, and yes, the odds were probably on things continuing to get worse for a fair old while before they started to get better.

I guess it is all about opinions, but I am somewhat glad to see that a decent chunk of the Villa support is prepared to stay calm and not panic and start calling for the appointment of managers they wouldn't have thought twice about taking on a few months ago.

And, FWIW, I don't even think Allardyce is one of the most harebrained suggestions.

Those would be the ones calling for the appointment of John Gregory or Brian Little or whichever combination of people who used to play for us, because they "love the club", despite their total lack of experience in management at this level.

It's like they didn't spot what happened when Newcastle tried that with Shearer.

[pauliewalnuts]

Noble is West Ham's Gerrard I suppose. A local boy with no intention of leaving his boyhood club or jellied eels. Unlike Gerrard though he's a nothing to shout about midfielder who's done well for himself.

I think nolan is more the ,main man in west hams midfield- i would certainly like him at villa.

Nolan does nothing but look for the knock downs from the witless balls into the box.

Still, if you got your dream Allardyce appointment, I suspect you'd be happy, as Nolan would be the first face through the door.

[glasses]

Noble is West Ham's Gerrard I suppose. A local boy with no intention of leaving his boyhood club or jellied eels. Unlike Gerrard though he's a nothing to shout about midfielder who's done well for himself.

I see him more as a Lee Hendrie type. Half decent one club player who never looked like he could play at a higher level.

Gerrard had been carring Liverpool for years up until about two years ago.

[Risso]

But you've seen KEA play.  And Bannan.  Anybody worse than those two isn't going to be playing for a Premier League Club in all honesty.

This the same Mark Noble who was part of their last relegated side, yes? And who now plays in one of two most redundant midfields in the country?

How is their midfield redundant?  Noble and Nolan are two of their three top scorers, and Nolan on average attempts nearly twice as many passes a game as any of our midfielders including Westwood, with a similar completion rate of around 80%.  Even Nolan whose job it is to get into the box and score makes as many passes as any of our midfield.  Honestly, there's opinions and all, but what exactly are you basing yours on, as they're at complete odds with the actual facts.

[eastie]

Noble is West Ham's Gerrard I suppose. A local boy with no intention of leaving his boyhood club or jellied eels. Unlike Gerrard though he's a nothing to shout about midfielder who's done well for himself.

I think nolan is more the ,main man in west hams midfield- i would certainly like him at villa.

Nolan does nothing but look for the knock downs from the witless balls into the box.

Still, if you got your dream Allardyce appointment, I suspect you'd be happy, as Nolan would be the first face through the door.

Right where the hell did i say allardyce was a dream appointment - i could compile a list of managers id take of whom rangnick and poyet would be on - allardyce would not be in my top 10 choices- he would as i said however be better than the current incumbent mr lambert.

You were on loads of match threads last month after games agreeing lambert should go, now youve changed your tune and backed lambert- ive never said allardyce would be a dream manager , just better than lambert .

[Risso]

That's a dressing up of the argument after the event when in fact a regular criticism was that the football was dull and unimaginative.

And that is specifically the thing I don't understand.

People who were moaning about the quality of football under O'Neill - when that turgid football got us sixth three years in a row - now prepared to put up with a style that makes O'Neill's look amazing by comparison, and purveyed by a manager who traditionally occupies the mid level of the table at best.

It is precisely what you said, just the reflection of the next stop in the ongoing managerial merry-go-round, and if it weren't Allardyce, no doubt it'd be Pullis next.

I also find it hard to accept the fact that some of the very same people who were pointing out - rightly - how terrible we were last season under McLeish seem to think that, actually, that should have been magically brushed aside, and that one season is enough to recover from it.

It isn't, and it was never going to be, and yes, the odds were probably on things continuing to get worse for a fair old while before they started to get better.

I guess it is all about opinions, but I am somewhat glad to see that a decent chunk of the Villa support is prepared to stay calm and not panic and start calling for the appointment of managers they wouldn't have thought twice about taking on a few months ago.

And, FWIW, I don't even think Allardyce is one of the most harebrained suggestions.

Those would be the ones calling for the appointment of John Gregory or Brian Little or whichever combination of people who used to play for us, because they "love the club", despite their total lack of experience in management at this level.

It's like they didn't spot what happened when Newcastle tried that with Shearer.

Harking back to O'Neill is utterly irrelevant as he worked under circumstances that will never be repeated under Lerner.  Until Lerner sells, then I'd rather stay in the Premier League, and I think Allardyce would give us a better chance of that than Lambert.  Lambert and his kids aren't going to turn us into a footballing academy based on loads of wonder kids, he's going to turn us into an absolutely skint Championship level team.  Allardyce wouldn't be my dream appointment by a long way, but I do think that he'd do a better job than Lambert who has been farcically bad.

[PaulWinch again]

Allardyce would be horrible, and also he tends to sign quite a lot of older players on high wages. If Lambert was to go, I'm sure we can be a bit more inventive than Allardyce.

[LeeB]

But you've seen KEA play.  And Bannan.  Anybody worse than those two isn't going to be playing for a Premier League Club in all honesty.

This the same Mark Noble who was part of their last relegated side, yes? And who now plays in one of two most redundant midfields in the country?

How is their midfield redundant?  Noble and Nolan are two of their three top scorers, and Nolan on average attempts nearly twice as many passes a game as any of our midfielders including Westwood, with a similar completion rate of around 80%.  Even Nolan whose job it is to get into the box and score makes as many passes as any of our midfield.  Honestly, there's opinions and all, but what exactly are you basing yours on, as they're at complete odds with the actual facts.

I'm basing it on what I see, I'll leave the number crunching to you mate.

[Concrete John]

That's a dressing up of the argument after the event when in fact a regular criticism was that the football was dull and unimaginative.

And that is specifically the thing I don't understand.

People who were moaning about the quality of football under O'Neill - when that turgid football got us sixth three years in a row - now prepared to put up with a style that makes O'Neill's look amazing by comparison, and purveyed by a manager who traditionally occupies the mid level of the table at best.

It is precisely what you said, just the reflection of the next stop in the ongoing managerial merry-go-round, and if it weren't Allardyce, no doubt it'd be Pullis next.

I also find it hard to accept the fact that some of the very same people who were pointing out - rightly - how terrible we were last season under McLeish seem to think that, actually, that should have been magically brushed aside, and that one season is enough to recover from it.

It isn't, and it was never going to be, and yes, the odds were probably on things continuing to get worse for a fair old while before they started to get better.

I guess it is all about opinions, but I am somewhat glad to see that a decent chunk of the Villa support is prepared to stay calm and not panic and start calling for the appointment of managers they wouldn't have thought twice about taking on a few months ago.

And, FWIW, I don't even think Allardyce is one of the most harebrained suggestions.

Those would be the ones calling for the appointment of John Gregory or Brian Little or whichever combination of people who used to play for us, because they "love the club", despite their total lack of experience in management at this level.

It's like they didn't spot what happened when Newcastle tried that with Shearer.

Harking back to O'Neill is utterly irrelevant as he worked under circumstances that will never be repeated under Lerner.  Until Lerner sells, then I'd rather stay in the Premier League, and I think Allardyce would give us a better chance of that than Lambert.  Lambert and his kids aren't going to turn us into a footballing academy based on loads of wonder kids, he's going to turn us into an absolutely skint Championship level team.  Allardyce wouldn't be my dream appointment by a long way, but I do think that he'd do a better job than Lambert who has been farcically bad.

It's language like that that gets me - it seems to just be going for shock value.  If he's been farcically bad, then that suggests we should be much further up the table than we are.  He had a relatively small amount of money to try and turn around the fortunes of a club in steep decline, yet people say things like that, and advocate managers like Poyet over him. 

[Risso]

But you've seen KEA play.  And Bannan.  Anybody worse than those two isn't going to be playing for a Premier League Club in all honesty.

This the same Mark Noble who was part of their last relegated side, yes? And who now plays in one of two most redundant midfields in the country?

How is their midfield redundant?  Noble and Nolan are two of their three top scorers, and Nolan on average attempts nearly twice as many passes a game as any of our midfielders including Westwood, with a similar completion rate of around 80%.  Even Nolan whose job it is to get into the box and score makes as many passes as any of our midfield.  Honestly, there's opinions and all, but what exactly are you basing yours on, as they're at complete odds with the actual facts.

I'm basing it on what I see, I'll leave the number crunching to you mate.

You must be watching a different team then, the 'numbers' only back up what actually happens.

[eastie]

Concrete john i have copied and saved your last post - lets hope we are both around  in 4 years and we will see where lambert and poyet are - i suggest that poyet will be managing chelsea or spurs while  lambert will be maybe scratching around at some lower league club - time will tell my friend.

[Concrete John]

Stats showed NRC had a great pass compleption rate for us.

Just saying.