Why was McLeish sacked?

[Ger Regan]

Well off the top of my head there's chelsea at home this season, liverpool away (twice), arsenal away, sunderland at home last season, some excellent football and brilliant goals scored. I'm not denying the shit that has also gone on, but what I've listed alone is better than anything that mcleish did.

So what, every team in the land however poor they are gets the occasional decent result and performance, and McLeish and Lambert are no different.
They both inflicted pain onto Villa, and one of them is still here as well!

The discussion was to do with a comparison of mcleish and lambert. My view is that Lambert has done more in his time here than TSM managed, and the items listed above alone would, imo, back that claim up.

To say that there have been absolutely no positives in Lambert's time is equally as laughable as if someone was to try and argue that everything is brilliant.

[Irish villain]

In fairness, he's  not the only one guilty of that on here over the years.

I'm sure we all apologise for the level of our debate not being up to the standards you expect.

I wasn't making a comment about the quality of debate.

[Dave Clark Five]

The fact that there's only one single person on this forum who feels that McLeish was harshly treated says it all really.

To be fair, Dan seems to agree as well, so that's two people. But based on his conspiracy nonsense he does seem to be the suggestible type.

No need to be so dismissive of people who you don't even know.

[bertlambshank]

Well off the top of my head there's chelsea at home this season, liverpool away (twice), arsenal away, sunderland at home last season, some excellent football and brilliant goals scored. I'm not denying the shit that has also gone on, but what I've listed alone is better than anything that mcleish did.

So what, every team in the land however poor they are gets the occasional decent result and performance, and McLeish and Lambert are no different.
They both inflicted pain onto Villa, and one of them is still here as well!

The discussion was to do with a comparison of mcleish and lambert. My view is that Lambert has done more in his time here than TSM managed, and the items listed above alone would, imo, back that claim up.

To say that there have been absolutely no positives in Lambert's time is equally as laughable as if someone was to try and argue that everything is brilliant.

Do you still feel the same after today?

[SoccerHQ]

That line-up at Norwich.

Given
Warnock
Dunne
Collins
Clark
Cuellar
Lichaj
Ireland
Herd
Heskey
Gabby

After less than 25 mins we were 2 down, so needing goals he brought on Bannan, then Gardner, then Baker. That more than even Spurs away summed him up. It's spectacularly shit at times under Lambert, but i'm never as embarrassed by us as I was under McLeish. I'm sure many will feel differently, but i'd rather lose 8-0 at Chavski by being naive nutters who went for it even when getting battered than lose 2-0 at Spurs having started the match hoping for a 0-0.

I'm trying to work out who actually played where in that team. From memory we finished that year with Clark, Warnock and Herd all in midfield essentially just to propect the back 4 even more. I think everyone just accepted it at that point as we were so deep in relegation trouble that was our best bet to just grind out draws. But yeah it does say a lot that the Norwich game we were actually safe and he still played the same ultra defensive teams. Maybe DC5 can ask him why he fielded that team at Norwich when he nexts sees him over the garden hedge in Dorridge?

The funny thing is at the start of that season we actually started the season with CNZ, Gabby, Bent and Heskey in the team so essentially 4 attack minded players. But even those were negative as Heskey was in central midfield for some reasons and CNZ and Gabby were told to protect the full back first and foremost hence why even with those teams we struggle to score and create during the open weeks and why Bent was often isolated.

Alex McLeish was a decent man and certainly respected our club and traditions much more than O'Leary. But he's admitted himself he underestimated the level of vitriol when he moved across Birmingham.

When he was signed we all knew the sort of season we'd get from him aswell, a mid table grind short of excitement which was what it pretty much was until we lost Bent in March and then had a downward spiral.

Paul Lambert got very lucky following McLeish as many of his results have not been better at all.

Conversley Houllier was unlucky he followed MON when fans were still demanding top 6 finishes. If say we'd gone for a bamboozling McLeish type appointment straight after Mon and then appointed Houllier then GH wouldn't have had half as much stick as he received as people were in shock dealing with a relegation battle a year after challenging for a top 4 spot. Now it seems par for the course.

Houllier was the right type as manager (continental, emphasis on youth, possession football, good links abroad) but just the wrong person given he was in semi retirement and had his health issues.

As Paulie always correctly points out it made complete sense we then went after a younger version like Martinez to continue this vision and when he rejected it the board panicked and went back to the British model of counter attacking football and few home wins.

[ChicagoLion]

McLeish was sacked because he was not good enough.

Lambert is not good enough but they were considering offering him a new contract.

Lambert is no better than McLeish. He might even be worse.

[ez]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

[rob_bridge]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

[supertom]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

To be honest, right now I'm looking back at the O Leary reign with a lot more fondness.
That's quite depressing to say that. Not even just his first season but an average second, and poor third season, the latter of which was better than the last 3 years to be honest. DOL buggered off having finished on 42 points. I can't see Lambert even "achieving" that. Very sad state of affairs.
Plus as bad as Doncaster was, it was a footballing masterclass compared to Bradford.

[Rudy65]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

Jumping about 5 places on the last day of the season helped to paper over the cracks

[OzVilla]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

To be honest, right now I'm looking back at the O Leary reign with a lot more fondness.
That's quite depressing to say that. Not even just his first season but an average second, and poor third season, the latter of which was better than the last 3 years to be honest. DOL buggered off having finished on 42 points. I can't see Lambert even "achieving" that. Very sad state of affairs.
Plus as bad as Doncaster was, it was a footballing masterclass compared to Bradford.

It wasn't the results that ade me feel the way I did about DOL, it was his attitude towards us.

In short, DOL was and is a Cnut who I having nothing but complete contempt for. I'll never feel that way about TSM or PL whatever happens.

[SheffieldVillain]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

To be honest, right now I'm looking back at the O Leary reign with a lot more fondness.
That's quite depressing to say that. Not even just his first season but an average second, and poor third season, the latter of which was better than the last 3 years to be honest. DOL buggered off having finished on 42 points. I can't see Lambert even "achieving" that. Very sad state of affairs.
Plus as bad as Doncaster was, it was a footballing masterclass compared to Bradford.

It wasn't the results that ade me feel the way I did about DOL, it was his attitude towards us.

In short, DOL was and is a Cnut who I having nothing but complete contempt for. I'll never feel that way about TSM or PL whatever happens.

Completely agree with every word of that. I have never and don't think I ever could ever again despise a manager as much as I did O'Leary by the end of his stay.

[rob_bridge]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Yes and some people look back on the Houllier / Mcallister reign with fondness.

Jumping about 5 places on the last day of the season helped to paper over the cracks

It helped that every single result went for us on the last day.

Psycologically the most important one for some Villa fans with Blosers getting relegated.

Then again who was laughing (even harder) 6 weeks later.

[not3bad]

That line-up at Norwich.

Given
Warnock
Dunne
Collins
Clark
Cuellar
Lichaj
Ireland
Herd
Heskey
Gabby

After less than 25 mins we were 2 down, so needing goals he brought on Bannan, then Gardner, then Baker. That more than even Spurs away summed him up. It's spectacularly shit at times under Lambert, but i'm never as embarrassed by us as I was under McLeish. I'm sure many will feel differently, but i'd rather lose 8-0 at Chavski by being naive nutters who went for it even when getting battered than lose 2-0 at Spurs having started the match hoping for a 0-0.

This.

Just the grinding, soul destroying knowledge that when Villa went behind our main aim would be to limit the damage. Villa's darkest season while I've supported them. Extenuating circumstances? Yes. Nice guy? I've no reason to doubt it. We gave him a hard time because he came from the Blues? Utter, utter bollocks.

[SoccerHQ]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/may/14/alex-mcleish-sacking-aston-villa

Anyone see Lerner's comments in that blog?