Concrete Ron

[KevinGage]

Look back on this site alone and see the criticism Vlaar has got for his performances since he joined us. Think of the type of wage he would have had to be offered not to have opted to hang on until after the World Cup. Now imagine the stick the club would have got if they'd offered him such a contract.

He was much improved, even going into the first half of the last campaign to justify an increase - or at least an offer.

And even we weren't wholly convinced that he was the man to build the backline around longterm,  tying him to a new deal would strengthen our bargaining position in the event that he had a decent World Cup and offers came in.

Similar to what Gregory did in his first year, securing contracts for the likes of Scimeca and Charles meant that we got reasonable money for them, rather than let them walk away for nowt.  You don't only offer contracts to your best players, though Vlaar and Delph clearly are in that bracket for us at present. 

[dave.woodhall]

Look back on this site alone and see the criticism Vlaar has got for his performances since he joined us. Think of the type of wage he would have had to be offered not to have opted to hang on until after the World Cup. Now imagine the stick the club would have got if they'd offered him such a contract.

He was much improved, even going into the first half of the last campaign to justify an increase - or at least an offer.

And even we weren't wholly convinced that he was the man to build the backline around longterm,  tying him to a new deal would strengthen our bargaining position in the event that he had a decent World Cup and offers came in.

Similar to what Gregory did in his first year, securing contracts for the likes of Scimeca and Charles meant that we got reasonable money for them, rather than let them walk away for nowt.  You don't only offer contracts to your best players, though Vlaar and Delph clearly are in that bracket for us at present. 

Which is exactly what got us into this mess.

[RussellC]

Despite how highly rated Vlaar is by any of us, it was painfully obvious how important he was to the team even in the early stages of last season. This isn't a situation like MON and Beye, this is our Captain, and most solid defender.

I also don't think that the fact we were going through the process of disciplining / sacking two members of the coaching staff justifies or excuses the club putting these contract offers on the back-burner (if that was at all the case). There club should be able to deal with 2 completely separate situations at the same time, as all businesses are at some point required to.

[PeterWithesShin]

I can just imagine the reaction if we'd stuck him on a 4 year 50K a week contract at Christmas and he broke down injured again, or had a crap World Cup. Neither of which many of us would have bet against as a distinct possibility at the time. It's also worth remembering that some players don't like to have contracts talks during a season, for all we know it may have Ron and his agent who wanted to wait.

[KevinGage]

Look back on this site alone and see the criticism Vlaar has got for his performances since he joined us. Think of the type of wage he would have had to be offered not to have opted to hang on until after the World Cup. Now imagine the stick the club would have got if they'd offered him such a contract.

He was much improved, even going into the first half of the last campaign to justify an increase - or at least an offer.

And even we weren't wholly convinced that he was the man to build the backline around longterm,  tying him to a new deal would strengthen our bargaining position in the event that he had a decent World Cup and offers came in.

Similar to what Gregory did in his first year, securing contracts for the likes of Scimeca and Charles meant that we got reasonable money for them, rather than let them walk away for nowt.  You don't only offer contracts to your best players, though Vlaar and Delph clearly are in that bracket for us at present. 

Which is exactly what got us into this mess.

I disagree.  Securing your better players on decent contracts should be the aim of pretty much every club.  It's when the likes of Stephen Ireland, Charles N'Zog and co are your biggest earners that you have problems.

[dave.woodhall]

Look back on this site alone and see the criticism Vlaar has got for his performances since he joined us. Think of the type of wage he would have had to be offered not to have opted to hang on until after the World Cup. Now imagine the stick the club would have got if they'd offered him such a contract.

He was much improved, even going into the first half of the last campaign to justify an increase - or at least an offer.

And even we weren't wholly convinced that he was the man to build the backline around longterm,  tying him to a new deal would strengthen our bargaining position in the event that he had a decent World Cup and offers came in.

Similar to what Gregory did in his first year, securing contracts for the likes of Scimeca and Charles meant that we got reasonable money for them, rather than let them walk away for nowt.  You don't only offer contracts to your best players, though Vlaar and Delph clearly are in that bracket for us at present. 

Which is exactly what got us into this mess.

I disagree.  Securing your better players on decent contracts should be the aim of pretty much every club.  It's when the likes of Stephen Ireland, Charles N'Zog and co are your biggest earners that you have problems.

better players...Scimeca and Charles.

[PeterWithesShin]

Surely then we should have given Ireland a new contract when he had a few good months under McLeish and was player of the year? Vlaar has been inconsistent for us and the main reason we are now so worried is because of his World Cup performances, which I doubt many of us saw coming. Hindsight is wonderful, the club don't have that though.

And as I have said, it may even have been his choice to wait, we don't know for sure, which the club can do sod all about.

[KevinGage]

Look back on this site alone and see the criticism Vlaar has got for his performances since he joined us. Think of the type of wage he would have had to be offered not to have opted to hang on until after the World Cup. Now imagine the stick the club would have got if they'd offered him such a contract.

He was much improved, even going into the first half of the last campaign to justify an increase - or at least an offer.

And even we weren't wholly convinced that he was the man to build the backline around longterm,  tying him to a new deal would strengthen our bargaining position in the event that he had a decent World Cup and offers came in.

Similar to what Gregory did in his first year, securing contracts for the likes of Scimeca and Charles meant that we got reasonable money for them, rather than let them walk away for nowt.  You don't only offer contracts to your best players, though Vlaar and Delph clearly are in that bracket for us at present. 

Which is exactly what got us into this mess.

I disagree.  Securing your better players on decent contracts should be the aim of pretty much every club.  It's when the likes of Stephen Ireland, Charles N'Zog and co are your biggest earners that you have problems.

better players...Scimeca and Charles.

And I did say in that original post that it's not only your best players you look to secure on decent contracts.  But they should be the priority, I don't see how that is a particularly reckless strategy to follow.      Look at the Newcastle side that went down and most of their best earners were peripheral players, the likes of Duff, Owen, Butt, Alan Smith, Barton and loads of other shite.  That's the issue.

That screws you when you try to sign new players. Because they will often want parity with the top earners. Or causes resentment amongst the players who do actually contribute.  For the past few seasons, we've had a similar scenario, with Warnock, Heskey, Hutton, Ireland, Bent, N'Zog and Given all being amongst the top earners. 

It's not an exact science, a player that has a good season or two from us might then have a 'mare.  But if previous deals teach us anything, it should be to place less reliance on paying big wages based on what a player has done elsewhere.  Equally, we don't operate in a bubble and can't pay players with big reputations less than the market value to join us, just because we're Aston Villa.   But we can - or should- try to ensure that players who have actually done well for us get rewarded with better deals.

[themossman]

Ex-fucking-actly. Everyone is talking although the prospect of him being in the team of the tournament at the WC should have been factored in, when not one person on here would have called it. The contract situation only looks mad in the context of that unforeseeable event. Also bear in mid he hasn't even left yet so we might still have the best of both worlds.

[themossman]

I'd also add... Why is this a cause for hand wringing? Worst case scenario we get an unexpectedly large fee for a player with a short contract who most were still 50/50 about before the WC, best case we get a captain full of confidence and all the good PR that goes with keeping hold of sought after players.

[dave.woodhall]

Look at it from the other side. You're a regular in a major international side. Your club are in a relegation battle and according to their supporters going to hell in a handcart. How are they going to get you to sign a new contract - thumbscrews?

[KevinGage]

True, you can't make a player sign.  And if he has any sort of reasonable advice from his agent, he might have been told to hold off. 

But it looks like we haven't even offered him one in the first place. 

[peter w]

But we didn't know what we could offer,if anything, towards the end of the season until we were safe. At which point he was getting ready for the World Cup. Around Xmas and onwards we needed him to focus on getting safely to the magical mythical safety of 40 points. Any earlier than that and we'd be waiting to see how his injuries were.

[KevinGage]

Whilst that makes sense on one level, players often agree to join clubs (or extend contracts) with a relegation release clause.

We were also closer to mid table than the relegation spots back in Autumn.

I take on board that he had issues adapting in his first season too, but even then, we looked a better side with him than without him.

[Dave]

But we didn't know what we could offer,if anything, towards the end of the season until we were safe. At which point he was getting ready for the World Cup. Around Xmas and onwards we needed him to focus on getting safely to the magical mythical safety of 40 points.

A figure we'll finally end up hitting sometime around the end of August 2014 (hopefully)