Barry "Messi" Bannan - again

[SoccerHQ]

I think that's a fair assumption Vancouver.

That and if you don't fit the game profile, you won't even make the bench. Lichaj was on the bench for the Stoke game as our defensive backup for some reason.

[ROBBO]

I don't think Bannon has been a scapegoat at all, he has had more chances than most to cement his place in the side. We hoped he could be the player with the killer through ball as technically he is better than most in the side but in my mind irespcective of his off field antics he has been a disappointment, and why he was allowed to keep taking those floating corners is beyond me.

[Toronto Villa]

Its seem to me that PL really looks at the work put into the training session and picks the players that he thinks are fit, training well and raring to go. If Bannan isnt really in the zone then he wouldn't get a look in until he does. I would like to think that anyway

Hey Vancouver, I'm in Vancouver. Lovely weather you are having here

[Vancouver]

Its seem to me that PL really looks at the work put into the training session and picks the players that he thinks are fit, training well and raring to go. If Bannan isnt really in the zone then he wouldn't get a look in until he does. I would like to think that anyway

Hey Vancouver, I'm in Vancouver. Lovely weather you are having here

It always is here for long?

[supertom]

I think Barry's time has passed. He's just not good enough for this level. I know he's got good technique but he's not got enough else to his game. Lets face it, if Whittingham has been plying his trade in the championship for 5-6 years now despite having excellent technical ability, then BB is probably headed there now. Whitts is a much better player too. He's developed into a decent player and he'll do very well in the top flight next season I think.

For me, Barry's delivery isn't good enough. For someone who has the ability to pick someone out and ping a perfect 60 yard pass, you'd expect his success ratio to be better. His set pieces are a constant disappointment too. For him to succeed without being physically the biggest, or the quickest he's got to be making more happen. Beckham would score half a dozen a season or so at Utd, sometimes double figures. He'd get 10-20 assists normally too. Again he wasn't reliant on pace. Granted physically he was very fit, and quite strong too.

Bannan's had his chance at this level and I'm afraid it's not for him. He's had some good games this season. Mostly he's been anonymous. How many goals? How many assists? Not nearly enough for someone who's supposed to be creative. The occasionaly hollywood ball doesn't a good player make.

If you're rating his season you'd say it's been a 5/10. 

[peter w]

Better than most, then.

[dekko]

I think Barry's time has passed. He's just not good enough for this level. I know he's got good technique but he's not got enough else to his game. Lets face it, if Whittingham has been plying his trade in the championship for 5-6 years now despite having excellent technical ability, then BB is probably headed there now. Whitts is a much better player too. He's developed into a decent player and he'll do very well in the top flight next season I think.

For me, Barry's delivery isn't good enough. For someone who has the ability to pick someone out and ping a perfect 60 yard pass, you'd expect his success ratio to be better. His set pieces are a constant disappointment too. For him to succeed without being physically the biggest, or the quickest he's got to be making more happen. Beckham would score half a dozen a season or so at Utd, sometimes double figures. He'd get 10-20 assists normally too. Again he wasn't reliant on pace. Granted physically he was very fit, and quite strong too.

Bannan's had his chance at this level and I'm afraid it's not for him. He's had some good games this season. Mostly he's been anonymous. How many goals? How many assists? Not nearly enough for someone who's supposed to be creative. The occasionaly hollywood ball doesn't a good player make.

If you're rating his season you'd say it's been a 5/10.

I think this is a fair assessment.  I wouldn't be averse to keeping him around another season just for squad depth (as I doubt he's on much money) but agree that his future is probably in the championship/with Celtic.

I would love to be proven wrong though - if he could pull off assists like that huuuge crossfield pass to Albrighton a couple of years ago on a regular basis he'd be a real weapon.

[Clark W Griswold]

He's shit.

[paul_e]

I think Barry's time has passed. He's just not good enough for this level. I know he's got good technique but he's not got enough else to his game. Lets face it, if Whittingham has been plying his trade in the championship for 5-6 years now despite having excellent technical ability, then BB is probably headed there now. Whitts is a much better player too. He's developed into a decent player and he'll do very well in the top flight next season I think.

For me, Barry's delivery isn't good enough. For someone who has the ability to pick someone out and ping a perfect 60 yard pass, you'd expect his success ratio to be better. His set pieces are a constant disappointment too. For him to succeed without being physically the biggest, or the quickest he's got to be making more happen. Beckham would score half a dozen a season or so at Utd, sometimes double figures. He'd get 10-20 assists normally too. Again he wasn't reliant on pace. Granted physically he was very fit, and quite strong too.

Bannan's had his chance at this level and I'm afraid it's not for him. He's had some good games this season. Mostly he's been anonymous. How many goals? How many assists? Not nearly enough for someone who's supposed to be creative. The occasionaly hollywood ball doesn't a good player make.

If you're rating his season you'd say it's been a 5/10.

I think this is a fair assessment.  I wouldn't be averse to keeping him around another season just for squad depth (as I doubt he's on much money) but agree that his future is probably in the championship/with Celtic.

I would love to be proven wrong though - if he could pull off assists like that huuuge crossfield pass to Albrighton a couple of years ago on a regular basis he'd be a real weapon.

Does a ball like that need to be an assist?  Play a wideplayer in with one of those, and he crosses for someone else to tap home does the crossfield pass become less valuable?

As far as I'm concerned when we had runs of looking like a good (or at least potentially good) side it has coincided with Bannan having a run of starts because he does put himself into positions to affect the game.  Too often he's made mistakes when he's done that but I think we should give him a bit more time.  I think he can become a very good player and I'm not ready to give up on him yet.

Constructive arguments against him like that posed by Clark W above only serve to strengthen my belief that a fair amount of the criticism he gets is based on who he is off the field rather than what he does on the field.

As for a rating out of 10 - I'd give him 6, but that's also what I'd give to most of the rest of the team (guzan, benteke and weimann all deserve more and a case can be made for 1-2 others).  That's why I think the criticism is so unfair, he's been no better or worse than 3/4s of the squad and yet only really him and Bennett have been regularly slated for their performances.

[supertom]

Fair enough, BB has been no better or worse than most in our squad, but lets face it, a lot of our players don't seem to cut the mustard at this level.

Personal I'd be wanting to develop a couple of our younger players as opposed to Bannan. Gardner for example. I know wee Barry is only 23. It's not excactly over the hill, but by now, having been in and around the first team squad for 3-4 years now (more regular in the last 2) he should have had more impact.

As for assists. Yes I do believe BB needs to be offering more. Even if he plays the Gareth Barry sort of role. Barry still probably made 10 goals a season and would score over 5 often. All importantly too, his contribution from set pieces was far superior. The more key thing to me was his choice of pass. His ability to release the right long pass, pin point to get us on the front foot. BB's decision making has improved but it's still not good enough.

Again, like a lot of our home grown, it boils down to this. Gareth Barry broke through at 17 and looked very good right from the off. By 23 he was a rock solid, established Prem performer. The likes of Gaz Baz are who our midfielders should be aspiring to emulate. For me BB is too far behind. I'd cash in while we can. A couple of mill would be good business and we could get someone with a more rounded game.

[adrenachrome]

One thing which he can do, and what is sorely needed in our current set up, is to change the tempo of our passing. We knock the ball around a lot now, to the joy of those who like this kind of thing and the distraction of those who do not, but the pace is usually constant. BB has this in his locker, to use the vernacular, but he also has a tendency to be way off the opposition player he is supposed to be marking. I don't think this is laziness, as he puts plenty of effort in, or lack of interest, but we cannot carry any passengers.

I am fairly sure that PL would dearly like to have a BB at his full potential and has given the lad plenty of opportunity. I am even surer that if he does let him go, it will have very little to do with a section of our support's disgruntlement. 

[paul_e]

One thing which he can do, and what is sorely needed in our current set up, is to change the tempo of our passing. We knock the ball around a lot now, to the joy of those who like this kind of thing and the distraction of those who do not, but the pace is usually constant. BB has this in his locker, to use the vernacular, but he also has a tendency to be way off the opposition player he is supposed to be marking. I don't think this is laziness, as he puts plenty of effort in, or lack of interest, but we cannot carry any passengers.

I am fairly sure that PL would dearly like to have a BB at his full potential and has given the lad plenty of opportunity. I am even surer that if he does let him go, it will have very little to do with a section of our support's disgruntlement. 

I agree with this bit, which is why I'd like to see him have 5-6 games in a row in the more attacking role.  In the deeper role his concentration defensively lets him down along with his willingness to play it a bit riskier, he also passes to space rather than feet, which is much more suitable higher up the pitch.

The biggest problem is that someone got the idea of being a Pirlo style 'quarterback' into his head and he's been trying to fill that role for a few years (and both Lambert and TSM seem to have encouraged it)

[supertom]

One thing which he can do, and what is sorely needed in our current set up, is to change the tempo of our passing. We knock the ball around a lot now, to the joy of those who like this kind of thing and the distraction of those who do not, but the pace is usually constant. BB has this in his locker, to use the vernacular, but he also has a tendency to be way off the opposition player he is supposed to be marking. I don't think this is laziness, as he puts plenty of effort in, or lack of interest, but we cannot carry any passengers.

I am fairly sure that PL would dearly like to have a BB at his full potential and has given the lad plenty of opportunity. I am even surer that if he does let him go, it will have very little to do with a section of our support's disgruntlement. 

I agree with this bit, which is why I'd like to see him have 5-6 games in a row in the more attacking role.  In the deeper role his concentration defensively lets him down along with his willingness to play it a bit riskier, he also passes to space rather than feet, which is much more suitable higher up the pitch.

The biggest problem is that someone got the idea of being a Pirlo style 'quarterback' into his head and he's been trying to fill that role for a few years (and both Lambert and TSM seem to have encouraged it)

That is a fair point. The thing about the Pirlo type quarterback role too, is that it's actually quite rare, and certainly there's few players around, if any, who do that role as effectively. Even Beckham was occasionally touted to adopt a similar role but was never as effective in it.

Between now and the end of the season, we should be playing a midfield 3. The more free role would be most suited to BB because Zogbia just leaves the mid too exposed. When we play Zog, Gabby, Weimann and Tekkers we're basically playing a 4-2-4. Lets face it, Ireland is a ghost now. He's got the ability to play that role but not the attitude.

If Bannan gets his chance in the next 4 games, he's possibly playing for his career. I'd rather see him making killer passes in the final third rather than hitting hopefully 50 yarders so often. He's got the ability to hit them from distance too which he needs to make more use of.

But in all honesty we're just short of quality in midfield. For the level we want to be any how.

[Matt C]

I still think Bannan will turn out to be a half decent player, I just don't think it will be with us.

[Vancouver]

I can see him heading to somewhere like Middlesborough