Randy Lerner

[Risso]

Or instead of getting relegated we could do what Spurs did a few years back while hovering over the relegation zone and get our act together and put in a decent run now creating the confidence for next season.
During the summer we can add some more quality and finally our last few years of dross are behind us.

That'd be my preferred option.

Relegation would be fecking horrible. Newcastle came back up largely because they held on to pretty much all their better players. There's no guarantee we would do the same.

Without wishing to piss on your bonfire, you do realise that the Spurs revival came about as a result of sacking their underperforming manager in October of that year?  After he'd won them the League Cup as well. It's not about sticking with rubbish managers come what may, it's about appointing the right man, and I can't see anything that suggests Lambert is moving us in the right direction.  Spurs haven't really looked back, although of course it does require the owner not to be a complete div as well.

What has that got to do with my mention of Newcastle managing to bounce back?

I entirely understand the fact that Spurs managed to avoid relegation and turn things around by replacing the manager, but then again, I could give you plenty of examples of teams that went to shit when replacing their manager to try to stave off relegation.

Also, you said yourself - they replaced their manager in *October*

Seeing as we can't wind the clock back, we're faced with what to do about our manager in January. For all the thousands of words you've used to expound on your belief Lambert deserves the bullet, the best you can do as an alternative is Di Matteo, with the proviso he's been spending his time off scouting and preparing a list of transfer targets, and we can get him in toute de suite.

Honestly, you're all over the shop on this one.

I totally understand you're angry about things, and it hasn't passed me by that our league results have been dreadfully poor this season. you keep on telling us this as if we're supposed to have not noticed it or something,  but beyond satisfying your blood lust, I honestly can't see what changing manager two days into the January transfer window is going to do to help us.

You've given him half a season. That's not nearly enough. in the next breath you'll be complaining about us not spending enough money, ignoring the fact that sacking Lambert would mean wasting yet more money on manager compensation.

The post you quoted said "We could do what Spurs did" to which you replied "That would be my preferred option."  I think it's entirely relevant that they replaced one under performing manager who was leading them towards relegation, with somebody better.  Changing the manager would achieve the result of not having Paul Lambert in charge any more, which in my opinion is going to lead to us getting relegated, as he clearly cannot either motivate or organise the team very well, as the results to date indicate.  People like you keep on going on about "seeing what he's trying to do" but what is that?  I can see what someone like Rodgers is trying to achieve at Liverpool and he does seem to be making progress, but Lambert started badly, and has got progressively worse.

[tomd2103]

Or instead of getting relegated we could do what Spurs did a few years back while hovering over the relegation zone and get our act together and put in a decent run now creating the confidence for next season.
During the summer we can add some more quality and finally our last few years of dross are behind us.

That'd be my preferred option.

Relegation would be fecking horrible. Newcastle came back up largely because they held on to pretty much all their better players. There's no guarantee we would do the same.

Without wishing to piss on your bonfire, you do realise that the Spurs revival came about as a result of sacking their underperforming manager in October of that year?  After he'd won them the League Cup as well. It's not about sticking with rubbish managers come what may, it's about appointing the right man, and I can't see anything that suggests Lambert is moving us in the right direction.  Spurs haven't really looked back, although of course it does require the owner not to be a complete div as well.

What has that got to do with my mention of Newcastle managing to bounce back?

I entirely understand the fact that Spurs managed to avoid relegation and turn things around by replacing the manager, but then again, I could give you plenty of examples of teams that went to shit when replacing their manager to try to stave off relegation.

Also, you said yourself - they replaced their manager in *October*

Seeing as we can't wind the clock back, we're faced with what to do about our manager in January. For all the thousands of words you've used to expound on your belief Lambert deserves the bullet, the best you can do as an alternative is Di Matteo, with the proviso he's been spending his time off scouting and preparing a list of transfer targets, and we can get him in toute de suite.

Honestly, you're all over the shop on this one.

I totally understand you're angry about things, and it hasn't passed me by that our league results have been dreadfully poor this season. you keep on telling us this as if we're supposed to have not noticed it or something,  but beyond satisfying your blood lust, I honestly can't see what changing manager two days into the January transfer window is going to do to help us.

You've given him half a season. That's not nearly enough. in the next breath you'll be complaining about us not spending enough money, ignoring the fact that sacking Lambert would mean wasting yet more money on manager compensation.

The post you quoted said "We could do what Spurs did" to which you replied "That would be my preferred option."  I think it's entirely relevant that they replaced one under performing manager who was leading them towards relegation, with somebody better.  Changing the manager would achieve the result of not having Paul Lambert in charge any more, which in my opinion is going to lead to us getting relegated, as he clearly cannot either motivate or organise the team very well, as the results to date indicate.  People like you keep on going on about "seeing what he's trying to do" but what is that?  I can see what someone like Rodgers is trying to achieve at Liverpool and he does seem to be making progress, but Lambert started badly, and has got progressively worse.

I know your post was meant for someone else, but one of the downfalls of sacking Lambert now would mean we would have to cough up another few million in compensation which could have been spent on players.  Also, who would we realistically get in to replace him?  If it is a manager from another club, then that's likely to be another hefty pay out in compensation.

As for the point about Rodgers, he inherited a far stronger squad than Lambert did and look at some of the poor results he has been getting.  A few horror shows aside, I think there has been progress at Villa this season, it's just that Lambert hasn't currently got the personnel to make significant strides forward and we have had some bad luck with injuries. 

We can make a better assesment of Lambert after this transfer window, as it is pretty clear which areas of the team need to be addressed.       

[ROBBO]

Surely it's not lets blame the manager again?

[davevillan]

I look forward to the contributions of you both.

Feel free to use any of my posts, especially the ones about stupid Americans.

That's 280,000,000 of them. Can you narrow it down a bit please?

But is he right or is he wrong?
Have Lerner's decision's been stupid?

He is of course right. Lerner has made stupid decisions. Starting conflict with O'Neill at the wrong time. Allowing Faulkner to sell Barry, Milner and Young. Appointing Houllier and than McLeish. The correct decision was to appoint Lambert however he messed that up with the drastic change of direction. You can not do this in this League as rivals will eat you up and that is what's happening now.

So would you have rather let Barry & Young walk away for nothing 12mths later. It was clear they werent going to sign a new contract.
We kept Barry for and extra 12mths as it was, but due to the contracts running down of both, it was sell or let them leave on a Bosman!

[Boz]

I look forward to the contributions of you both.

Feel free to use any of my posts, especially the ones about stupid Americans.

That's 280,000,000 of them. Can you narrow it down a bit please?

But is he right or is he wrong?
Have Lerner's decision's been stupid?

He is of course right. Lerner has made stupid decisions. Starting conflict with O'Neill at the wrong time. Allowing Faulkner to sell Barry, Milner and Young. Appointing Houllier and than McLeish. The correct decision was to appoint Lambert however he messed that up with the drastic change of direction. You can not do this in this League as rivals will eat you up and that is what's happening now.

So would you have rather let Barry & Young walk away for nothing 12mths later. It was clear they werent going to sign a new contract.
We kept Barry for and extra 12mths as it was, but due to the contracts running down of both, it was sell or let them leave on a Bosman!

Spot on.

If a player is determined to leave there's not much point keeping an unhappy player as well letting them go on a Bosman. The same with Cahill back along, MON had to let him go because he couldn't promise him regular first team football, although in hindsite, perhaps he should have.

[pauliewalnuts]

Or instead of getting relegated we could do what Spurs did a few years back while hovering over the relegation zone and get our act together and put in a decent run now creating the confidence for next season.
During the summer we can add some more quality and finally our last few years of dross are behind us.

That'd be my preferred option.

Relegation would be fecking horrible. Newcastle came back up largely because they held on to pretty much all their better players. There's no guarantee we would do the same.

Without wishing to piss on your bonfire, you do realise that the Spurs revival came about as a result of sacking their underperforming manager in October of that year?  After he'd won them the League Cup as well. It's not about sticking with rubbish managers come what may, it's about appointing the right man, and I can't see anything that suggests Lambert is moving us in the right direction.  Spurs haven't really looked back, although of course it does require the owner not to be a complete div as well.

What has that got to do with my mention of Newcastle managing to bounce back?

I entirely understand the fact that Spurs managed to avoid relegation and turn things around by replacing the manager, but then again, I could give you plenty of examples of teams that went to shit when replacing their manager to try to stave off relegation.

Also, you said yourself - they replaced their manager in *October*

Seeing as we can't wind the clock back, we're faced with what to do about our manager in January. For all the thousands of words you've used to expound on your belief Lambert deserves the bullet, the best you can do as an alternative is Di Matteo, with the proviso he's been spending his time off scouting and preparing a list of transfer targets, and we can get him in toute de suite.

Honestly, you're all over the shop on this one.

I totally understand you're angry about things, and it hasn't passed me by that our league results have been dreadfully poor this season. you keep on telling us this as if we're supposed to have not noticed it or something,  but beyond satisfying your blood lust, I honestly can't see what changing manager two days into the January transfer window is going to do to help us.

You've given him half a season. That's not nearly enough. in the next breath you'll be complaining about us not spending enough money, ignoring the fact that sacking Lambert would mean wasting yet more money on manager compensation.

The post you quoted said "We could do what Spurs did" to which you replied "That would be my preferred option."  I think it's entirely relevant that they replaced one under performing manager who was leading them towards relegation, with somebody better.  Changing the manager would achieve the result of not having Paul Lambert in charge any more, which in my opinion is going to lead to us getting relegated, as he clearly cannot either motivate or organise the team very well, as the results to date indicate.  People like you keep on going on about "seeing what he's trying to do" but what is that?  I can see what someone like Rodgers is trying to achieve at Liverpool and he does seem to be making progress, but Lambert started badly, and has got progressively worse.

My preferred option was not to get relegated and to rebuild from there. I wasn't aware that was something only Spurs have managed to do. Like I said, you can point at Spurs and what they did, or you can point at far more clubs who changed their manager at this time of the season, and still got relegated.

What is he trying to do?

He's trying to get us passing the ball, giving it away less, and fighting hard to win the ball back when we don't have it.

You can't have seen Swansea (h), Arsenal (h), Norwich (COC), Man City (COC), Newcastle (a), Man U (h) if you haven't noticed us trying to do that (and succeeding at times).

We get your point, you don't like the manager, you (although it genuinely does seem to be only you) want him sacked ASAP, but it's hard to take you seriously when you start saying you can't see what he's trying to do, or even spot any signs of us playing well this season.

We've had a tough run of late. Some of us said that would be the case at the start of the season - a year of ups and downs - which is something else you tore into people about, but that's exactly the way it has turned out.

[Risso]

All managers want to achieve those things though, surely (with the possible exception of the aforementioned McLeish, and maybe Pulis).  How is that any different from what any of the other bottom team managers want to achieve, eg Martinez, Redknapp or Matt Lucas?  The point is that he isn't doing any of it very well, and our average possession for the season is 44%, and in the last match it was a miserable 30%.  Our pass success rate isn't very good either.  In fact, other than Reading at home, I'm struggling to find a game where we've had the majority of the possession.  About the one thing he's got right is the purchase of Benteke, as most of the teams in the bottom half have better possession and pass completion stats than us, but Benteke has made up for this with his goals.

[PeterWithe]

Has a club ever sacked a manager and paid him compensation before they'd even agreed the fee for compensating the club he came from?

[Mazrim]

It isnt just Benteke. He's made other good signings. Lowton, Westwood, resigning Guzan..etc.
And there have been several games where we had the lions share of possession. Stoke, Reading, Norwich etc...
It just hasn't been happening more recently, possibly because we're missing some players.

[Jockey Randall]

The thing I don't understand is some people seem to think he's interhited a top 6 squad and has taken us backwards. Everybody knew at the time that squad Spurs were underachieving massively and were in a false position. They just needed the right man in to turn them around which they did. With the quality of our squad I'd say we're around about where we should be, but to give the manager half a season to turn things around is complete madness imo. Some of his signings are about the only bright points in the squad at the moment.

[paul_e]

The thing I don't understand is some people seem to think he's interhited a top 6 squad and has taken us backwards. Everybody knew at the time that squad Spurs were underachieving massively and were in a false position. They just needed the right man in to turn them around which they did. With the quality of our squad I'd say we're around about where we should be, but to give the manager half a season to turn things around is complete madness imo. Some of his signings are about the only bright points in the squad at the moment.

I disagree, with the quality of the squad we've been able to choose from for large parts of the season, given injuries and attitude, then we're where we should be, but on paper the squad should be doing better, the senior players in the squad have all let us down for one reason or another this year, other than maybe Holman and Guzan but despite their age they're both inexperienced at playing in the premier league.

[Risso]

He inherited a squad that even McLeish kept up, and then had £25m to spend on it.  He hasn't been able to get the best out of Ireland, N'Zogbia, Gabby or Bent, when even McLeish got 9 goals out of Bent in 20 league appearances.

[Chris Smith]

He inherited a squad that even McLeish kept up, and then had £25m to spend on it.  He hasn't been able to get the best out of Ireland, N'Zogbia, Gabby or Bent, when even McLeish got 9 goals out of Bent in 20 league appearances.

That's slightly disingenuous. How many of the squad from last season are actually available to him? Some left before he arrived, others have been injured and the captain is ill. It's a scratch team at he moment.

[Risso]

He inherited a squad that even McLeish kept up, and then had £25m to spend on it.  He hasn't been able to get the best out of Ireland, N'Zogbia, Gabby or Bent, when even McLeish got 9 goals out of Bent in 20 league appearances.

That's slightly disingenuous. How many of the squad from last season are actually available to him? Some left before he arrived, others have been injured and the captain is ill. It's a scratch team at he moment.

The following players were those from last season with more than 15 appearances:

Given
Bent
Collins
Dunne
Gabby
Hutton
Warnock
N'Zogbia
Petrov
Cuellar
Albrighton
Herd
Ireland

Of those, it was Lambert's decision to sell Collins, and to ditch Warnock and Hutton without giving them a chance to redeem themselves.  Just about everybody else has been available to him except Petrov, who was never going to play this season of course, and was replaced by the woeful KEA.

[Mazrim]

KEA was arguably our best player for the first month or two and is still adjusting to this league/.country/culture etc. Yes he's having a slump but I don't agree that he's woeful.