Press-ure's off

[Percy McCarthy]

One runner who always gets overlooked is Lasse Viren, who did exactly what Bolt did by winning two events at successive Olympics.

Pity the suspicion of blood doping hangs over his record.

Don't they all?

Unfortunately, yes.

It is a shame that you go to work after seeing a great race and half the people discussing it sum it up as 'yeah, great masking agent'.

[Risso]

You can rightly compare Bradman with the other batsmen of the time, but not everybody since, and certainly not other sports with different systems of measurement.  It's completely meaningless.

...says the bloke who just said 0.5 seconds = 1000 runs.

I was giving that as an example of just how truly ridiculous your assertion is that Usain Bolt needs to be twice as quick as everybody else to be compared with Bradman.  If we're going to just pick one measure from cricket as the basis for greatness and ignore historical context and any other factors, then with a mere 7,000 test runs, Bradman has scored less than half the runs that Tendulkar has.  He is therefore statistically, only half as good.  Don't bother mentioning the number of games he played or who against, because apparently that isn't important.  And don't get me started on his atrocious bowling record. 

[TopDeck113]

Just one comment on the Bradman debate, I can remember a similar discussion on TMS years ago and someone opined that Bradman probably got some very favourable umpiring calls, especially in home Tests.  It would be a brave umpire who would raise his finger when thousands of Aussies were in the ground to see The Don bat all day. Of course it is purely speculation, but perhaps neutral umpires and video referral might have made a dent on his average.  Doubt it would have been a 50 run difference though! 

[Percy McCarthy]

You can rightly compare Bradman with the other batsmen of the time, but not everybody since, and certainly not other sports with different systems of measurement.  It's completely meaningless.

...says the bloke who just said 0.5 seconds = 1000 runs.

I was giving that as an example of just how truly ridiculous your assertion is that Usain Bolt needs to be twice as quick as everybody else to be compared with Bradman.  If we're going to just pick one measure from cricket as the basis for greatness and ignore historical context and any other factors, then with a mere 7,000 test runs, Bradman has scored less than half the runs that Tendulkar has.  He is therefore statistically, only half as good.  Don't bother mentioning the number of games he played or who against, because apparently that isn't important.  And don't get me started on his atrocious bowling record. 

You mentioning his bowling record says nothing about my argument - I haven't mentioned Bolt's 1500 metres time or anything stupid like that.

I'm not ignoring historical context, I think it makes Bradman's record look even better. You, on the other hand, choose to ignore all that makes Bradman's record even more remarkable, like equipment, coaching, nutrition, fitness and probably the biggest (amongst many) disadvantage he suffered against the modern player, pitches. At the same time, you highlight everything that (you think)  tarnishes his statistics. Another contradiction, in one breath saying he played constantly against the other best team, and in the next saying his record is down to the weakness of India and others. You also ignore the remarkably consistent statistics of every great player (but one) from every era, which is ultimately what proves the credility of those stats.

I think it would be reasonable to say that Jesse Owens might be able to compete with Bolt if he had access to all the advantages that the modern sprinter enjoys. It would be a volte-face then, if I denied that the same applies to Bradman. So, taking all historical context into account, I think he would be even further ahead if he played now.

[PeterWithesShin]

C B Fry is a good shout. Played for England at football and cricket, and was joint long jump world record holder.  He also played rugby to a reasonable level.

Let's see Bradman or Bolt match that. Bet they can't even jump backwards onto a mantlepiece . Another great episode of QI.

[Exeter 77]

Let's see Bradman or Bolt match that. Bet they can't even jump backwards onto a mantlepiece . Another great episode of QI.

Or be offered the throne of Albania!

[RunRickyRun]

C B Fry is a good shout. Played for England at football and cricket, and was joint long jump world record holder.  He also played rugby to a reasonable level.

Let's see Bradman or Bolt match that. Bet they can't even jump backwards onto a mantlepiece . Another great episode of QI.

Max Woosnam was the greater sportsman but, sadly, is less celebrated. He won Gold and Silver at the Olympics, won a doubles title at Wimbledon, captained England at football and Britain in the Davis Cup, scored a century at Lords and compiled a 147 at snooker.

As for sprinters, Bob Hayes has to be up there with the greatest of all time. He ran 9.91 (wind assisted) in Tokyo in 1964 on a cinder track, which was only beaten (legally) at the Olympics 32 years later and, during his short career, was only ever beaten twice over 100m and 100 yards.

[danlanza]

C B Fry is a good shout. Played for England at football and cricket, and was joint long jump world record holder.  He also played rugby to a reasonable level.

Let's see Bradman or Bolt match that. Bet they can't even jump backwards onto a mantlepiece . Another great episode of QI.

Max Woosnam was the greater sportsman but, sadly, is less celebrated. He won Gold and Silver at the Olympics, won a doubles title at Wimbledon, captained England at football and Britain in the Davis Cup, scored a century at Lords and compiled a 147 at snooker.

As for sprinters, Bob Hayes has to be up there with the greatest of all time. He ran 9.91 (wind assisted) in Tokyo in 1964 on a cinder track, which was only beaten (legally) at the Olympics 32 years later and, during his short career, was only ever beaten twice over 100m and 100 yards.

Bloody Hell. That is knowledge.

[Broughty-Villian]

It's ephemeral to make assumptions and comparisions of sportsmens greatness whithout the knowledge of achievemnet from each era. It's almost impossible to compare cricket players from different generations, let alone crossing over sports.
e.g uncovered pitches.

you could try a top 10 list...i'd add Michael Johnson

[PeterWithesShin]

C B Fry is a good shout. Played for England at football and cricket, and was joint long jump world record holder.  He also played rugby to a reasonable level.

Let's see Bradman or Bolt match that. Bet they can't even jump backwards onto a mantlepiece . Another great episode of QI.

Max Woosnam was the greater sportsman but, sadly, is less celebrated. He won Gold and Silver at the Olympics, won a doubles title at Wimbledon, captained England at football and Britain in the Davis Cup, scored a century at Lords and compiled a 147 at snooker.

While impressive, his century Lord's was only in a schools match and his Olympic medals were for tennis in which his main achievements (Olympics and Wimbledon) were all for doubles.

[Broughty-Villian]

or Alf Tucker (The Tough of the Track)

[TRO]

I see that shit bloke just did a WR time with his mates in the 100m relay .

[PeterWithesShin]

I see that shit bloke just did a WR time with his mates in the 100m relay .

Please show where people said he was shit in this thread. Otherwise I might just think you're trolling and deliberately trying to wind folks up.

[TRO]

Readit from the start then.

[PeterWithesShin]

Readit from the start then.

Show me where someone said he was shit. It's a simple enough request, or are you deliberately trying to wind people up?