Lost Dressing Room? - Update! (Nzogbia Row?)

[CJ]

We all know the defence needs a clear out - but realistically how is this going to happen? Dunne, Warnock and Collins are all on 4 year contracts which don't finish til August next year. There's been talk of Collins going to Blackburn, but who is really likely to buy Dunne or Warnock who are 32 and 30 respectively? And AMC won't sell Hutton as he bought him and won't want to admit he was wrong. Whatever we think about Houllier he would have cleared them out when they had some potential for moving elsewhere but now I fear we're stuck with them for another season.  Worrying

[Irish villain]

I'd let Collins and Warnock go but would keep Dunne. He could provide some key advice to Clark and any centre back we bring in. Dunne is still probably our best defender. Just watch him have a good Euro 2012. He has something to offer, even if not as a regular starting centre back anymore.

[taylorsworkrate]

Maybe he's not happy because we lost.

He said its the first time playing football he's been unhappy.

Surely he's used to us losing by now.

[Mazrim]

I have to disagree Irish Villain. He has nothing to offer. He's a lummox who has no appetite for anything other than pies now.
He'd be the first player out this summer if I had my way. And Warnock and Collins can follow.

As for N'Zogbia, I doubt this is his first time being unhappy playing football. Presumably he wasn't amazingly happy when engineering moves away from Newcastle and probably Wigan.
That said, he created a goal, was playing alright and was subbed for Heskey. I think I'd be non plussed too.

[ktvillan]

Dunne has been a liability in many recent games - how many penalties has he conceded?  Was it him at Chelsea?,  Bristol Rovers, then Arsenal?  Then the missing or weak headers that led to goals for QPR and Newcastle.  He plays fine for about 95% of most games, but undoes all the good work by dropping at least one almighty bollock.  We need to go abroad and find the next  Mellberg/Laursen/Bouma types and ship these dinosaurs out.   

[taylorsworkrate]

I have to disagree Irish Villain. He has nothing to offer. He's a lummox who has no appetite for anything other than pies now.
He'd be the first player out this summer if I had my way. And Warnock and Collins can follow.

As for N'Zogbia, I doubt this is his first time being unhappy playing football. Presumably he wasn't amazingly happy when engineering moves away from Newcastle and probably Wigan.
That said, he created a goal, was playing alright and was subbed for Heskey. I think I'd be non plussed too.

Bang on about N'Zogbia. He'd also had an excellent second half against QPR.

McLeish only needed to ask himself one question: Who is more likely to score or create a goal, Heskey or N'Zogbia?

We all know the answer to that one methinks.

[Matt C]

Dunne, Collins, Cuellar, Warnock, Hutton - I'd bin the lot and start again but doubt it will be that easy.

[Mazrim]

It will have to be done. We cant go another season with this defence.
So for the 4th time in 6 years or something we need an entirely new back 4 and probably a couple of back ups too. If the funds are not there for them we could be in big trouble.

A midfield general, a back 4 and a creative experienced forward (Keane?) are musts.

[Concrete John]

Regarding him walking out lets speculate for a second that he was verbally promised £xm a season to spend and that when he sat down at the start of one season that promised money wasn't available. He then states he thinks he'll struggle to push the club forward without that spend and decides his position is untenable. Both parties go to tribuneral and is settled (with MON happier of the two). This wouldn't be walking out in my opinion.

The only problem I have with that scenario is this discussion would not have taken place 5 days before the season started.  So, if it was untenable then both parties, for the good of the club, should have said so early summer and allow us to recruit a new manager properly.

[Concrete John]

I can't and won't defend his walking out, but his record while here is something that will always create debate.  £82m net over 4 years is not that great, when compared to the spending of those we were trying to catch.  And for that £82m net you have circa £50m value in three players who have since left.  The wages, of course, is another story and effectively detracts from the value of his signings as when we want to move them on nobody will pay them as much.  See Beye, Habib. 

MON is doing at Sunderland now (although these are early days still, lest we forget, Sunderland were bothering the top six not much more than a year ago when we had Bent off them) pretty much what he did when he came to us, and that is what he is good at. He's getting a team hanging around the arse end of the mid table bunch towards the top end of it.

Whatever your opinion on MON, it is hard to deny he's good at that.

The thing he struggles with, in my opinion, is moving a club on from that. To break the top four you need to know your stuff in the transfer market and play it cleverly (look at Spurs), and you need to be on top of your game tactically.

Those, in my opinion, are the two areas where MON is weakest

Being a great manager is also about leaving a legacy, and on that front he fails, leaving us as he did with a bloated but uneven squad with far too many ageing, average players on big money. That, incidentally, is exactly what he did at Celtic.

What I class that as is 'squad management', which basically amounts to sustainability and juggling things around.  His lack of rotation comes into this also, as does his unnecessary spending with the kids coming through. 

It's a fault, which the way he could motivate and get results hid to a degree.   

[Dante Lavelli]

I said it on the match thread so I'll say it here too.  I don't think Hutton has been that bad recently (Not saying he's been great) but he's basically been a bit better than a 3m fullback (that's what he cost right?) and we can't really ask much more than that.

I certainly think there are other priorities than replacing him next summer.

[TheBarneyArmy]

Tony Morley scored then gave the V sign with associated verbals to Ron Saunders. I wonder what the reaction would be to something like that today?

i remember seeing that, was that Dynamo Berlin away??? would have loved to have been a fly on the dressing room wall after that.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

Hutton has improved because Carlos is great at covering for him. I'd be tempted to give Carlos a contract extension, he certainly did a job on Ba yesterday, in fact, he's superb at man marking. I remember him putting Tevez in his pocket too. Add to that his passing has most certainly improved, something I think he's worked on since GH was here.

[themossman]

O'Neill is the turd polisher extraordinaire. Give him a bunch of players at random and he will get more out of them collectively than most of his peers. Ask him to do the clever stuff like budget properly, think long term, navigate the transfer market and it all falls apart. Which is ironic when you consider he sees himself as intellectually wasted on football.

[Concrete John]

I said it on the match thread so I'll say it here too.  I don't think Hutton has been that bad recently (Not saying he's been great) but he's basically been a bit better than a 3m fullback (that's what he cost right?) and we can't really ask much more than that.

I certainly think there are other priorities than replacing him next summer.

Agreed.

There have been plenty of players write off too soon by some and I hope and expect him to become one of them.