Newcastle United v Aston Villa Post-Match Thread

[pauliewalnuts]

Useless substitutions by Mcleish!! Bent should of scored a Hat Trick today!! Should have won the game easy!! I bet Keane wishes someone was on the same wavelength!!

Poor display today by Warnock, Petrov, Bent, Hutton!!

Gutted

I have to say, I was massively nonplussed when McLeish brought Robbie Keane in, but I have been extremely impressed by the bloke.

However, I think the most notable thing is how he has been used to playing with players who understand the need for movement off the ball, and move into space, and you sometimes see the frustration in him when players don't give him options as he has the ball and is looking for somewhere to pass it.

It really brings home how unused we are to moving off the ball, It is easier to retain possession when it is about a player with the ball AND others moving into space to receive it, rather than a player with the ball at his feet looking up and seeing no options.

[hawkeye]

its simple, look at Keanes head, he is allways looking around before and when he is on the ball, Ireland is the only player on the same wavelength

[pauliewalnuts]

I remember seeing Ireland doing exactly the same thing in his first games for us, too.

[villadelph]

I remember seeing Ireland doing exactly the same thing in his first games for us, too.

Look up for teammates to pass to?

[pauliewalnuts]

I remember seeing Ireland doing exactly the same thing in his first games for us, too.

Look up for teammates to pass to?

I remember seeing him move into space and get frustrated that nobody was on the same wavelength as him, and look to make passes but see nobody making themselves available for him in his first few matches for us, yes.

That's not making excuses for everything that has happened with him, far from it, but I do think that when you see players who are used to more dropped into the way we play, they stand out.

You can see our lack of movement from throw ins, even, and it has been this way for years now, under GH and MON.

[Somniloquism]

McInally made the point in commentary about lack of movement and showing when Warnock looked up and saw no movement so turned inside and passed it to their player in the centre circle. I understood the point although couldn't understand why it meant he needed to pass it to Ba because of it.

[frank]

Just got in, 18 hours after leaving home, and am too tired to read the whole thread but I do want to make a point about the substitution of Heskey for N'Zogbia. Like everyone around me, I was very surprised, and I could understand the chants of "You don't know what you're doing". But it was in fact an effective substitution. Whereas Bent had (again) won very little in the air, Heskey won just about everything, he found good positions and he passed quickly and neatly. He was involved in most of the moves towards the end when we looked very dangerous. He gave us another option - a different one from N'Zogbia, but a valuable one.

[Greg N'Ash]

thats all very well frank , but looking dangerous is a bit dffierent from putting the ball in the net and the one thing you're near enough guaranteed from emile is he wont score or make a goal

oh and fairplay for actually going. mental.

[paul_e]

I remember seeing Ireland doing exactly the same thing in his first games for us, too.

Look up for teammates to pass to?

I remember seeing him move into space and get frustrated that nobody was on the same wavelength as him, and look to make passes but see nobody making themselves available for him in his first few matches for us, yes.

That's not making excuses for everything that has happened with him, far from it, but I do think that when you see players who are used to more dropped into the way we play, they stand out.

You can see our lack of movement from throw ins, even, and it has been this way for years now, under GH and MON.

This is the big thing I've been banging on about all season, and is the same reason why I have no respect for McLeish and can't see any major improvements if he stays with us long term, what we're seeing now is as good as it's going to get.

We have all these great young kids coming through an academy and reserve setup where they play athletic pass and move football then we put them into the team and they see lots of statues and runs down the wing and not a lot else.

I agree Ireland and Keane have both done the whole 'look up, wave arms at people who are standing still behind an opposition player, give up and try to beat a man' I've also seen Bannan and Albrighton do it and I'm expecting to see the same from Gardner once he's given more than a few minutes at the end of a game.

It was no suprise to see the improvement Gardner made as he came on, as he was making space.  he had 2 chances and maybe should've done better with the 2nd (the first was a poor pass to him that meant it'd have been a wonder strike to stand a chance) but both of them were effectively one-two, where he passed then found space to get it back.  If we could get him, Bannan and Ireland playing together in there I think we could see a huge improvement.

[Dave Clark Five]

So there is hope. Sooner or later we will give someone a good thrashing. There is plenty of skill in there. I think Warnock needs a new pair of boots or studs as he can't stay on his feet for long.

[Stu]

Why would Keane want to stay?

Because playing in England is better than going to Vancouver, Houston and Columbus, Ohio on the weekends?

Um. Is it fuck?

Want Keane to stay though, and credit to McLeish, I thought it was a nothing loan.

[Stu]

Outrageous abuse of the position of Moderator. There's nothing offensive about these posts. On a little power trip Paulie?

Thanks, but read the first paragraph of the rules, then think about how that sits with telling telling people theyre "talking out of their arse" because they disagree.

If youre not happy with that, take it up with another moderator by pm.

Have done so. Ive reported your comment to a mod. If it comes to you, please forward my comment to another Mod.

Paulie is a very aggressive Mod, that's for sure.

You should see him outside Satchwell's on a Saturday night. I heard he ripped some bloke's eyes out because the guy opened a window. Mental.

[Stu]

It is the place to discuss it, but I was alluding to your point about come the end of the season it says we lost to Newcastle and doesn't mention how we played. As far as I can see, the result has happened and the result stands now as it does the end of the season. Your point is that we lost and that's it. It won't matter whether we played fantastic or crap (which it doesn't). However, my point to you is, why are you now discussing the game when it doesn't matter, because in your opinion, when a game is done, that's it?

Obviously, but it's equally applicable though, isn't it? I don't see how your reckoning of the result differs from mine that much to be honest. I am pissed, mind.

[brontebilly]

Subs didnt really work out apart from Gardner but not really McLeish's fault. Nzogbia was incredibly frustrating. Fair enough he got the assist but he should have got even more of them. Ireland going off hurt us as Keane and himself were linking well. We couldnt get Keane on the ball in the second half and as a result didnt create that many chances. Main issue in the team is there is no one to get on the ball from the back. Guthrie was far better at getting on the ball than Petrov in particular. Warnock was asleep for the first goal and the second Hutton, Cuellar and Dunne all should have stopped the ball getting to Cisse.
At times in the first half we played some great stuff. Keane was key. Ireland and Bannan when he came on obviously not too happy on the right but when we kept it on the floor we opened them up at will almost in the first half. Think there is the makings of a good side there but the mix still isnt right.

Given 6 - did he even have a save?
Hutton 6 - better defensively but should have stopped cross coming in. Better on the ball than usual but was hoping he might push on a little more
Cuellar 5 - didnt think he was great. got lost positionally a couple of times
Dunne 5 - Wouldnt fault him for the first but he had to get a touch on the ball before the second. He is struggling a bit with the new style of play but midfielders need to become available too. Stupid booking and a few stupid mistakes. He gets a very hard time from some on here
Warnock 5 - not too bad. Asleep for the first and might have even got a red for that kamikaze lunge on Taylor. Alright apart from that but needs replacing in the summer
Ireland 6 - tidy on the ball as always. bit of heart wouldnt go astray at times but we miss him when he isnt on the pitch. unlucky with a good effort just drifted wide.
Petrov 4 - very disappointing again for me. hardly involved. tidy from broken play but half arsed tracking back and needs to start getting the ball from the back
Clark 4 - game passed him by I thought. Good bit to learn about constructive midfield play. Shielded the defence well but we needed more than that.
Nzogbia 6 - where do you even start. hoping a switch will go off in him soon and it will all come together. In the first half he was our most likely source of a goal but lazy as hell at others times, stupid shot selections and his deliveries were generally awful, assist aside
Keane 7 - excellent in the first half but couldnt get involved in the second. Very clever player and we will miss him a lot when he goes.
Bent 6 - a host of chances, movement was good generally. Started off terribly with his touch all over the place. On another day could have had a hat trick. To be fair they were all good saves

Bannan 5 - tried his best but no real impact until he started wandering late on. Nice ball in for Gardner
Heskey 5 - no point putting him on wing. No point to him playing generally Im afraid. Might be his last appearance for a while.
Gardner 6 - should have scored the equaliser but panicked. Got involved on the ball and does break into the box well. Shades of Lampard about him. Can definitely see him getting goals but midfield like at Wolves could be overrun if he were in the centre. Would have brought him on the right instead of Bannan

[Percy McCarthy]

Even our best players are too one-dimensional. Bent scores goals but does absolutely fuck all else. It's why I prefer Gabby. Bent is definitely a better finisher but Gabby beats him hands down in all other aspects of forward play and scores as well, just a few less. In principle, even when he is on a decent scoring run, swapping Bent for a solid defence would still be of more value to us points wise. Ireland is good going forward but is a liability the other way. Then again, the defence don't even have one dimension they are good at.