Saturdays Pre Match Entertainment. ( The McLeish Out Demo).

[Vanilla]

While I would never normally criticise other fans for getting up off their arse and standing up for things they believe in (however misguided), all this protest will do is reinforce the mistaken belief that McLeish is not wanted because of his past association with Blues.  I'd save any anger for the man who has completely buggered things up, Randy Lerner.  It doesn't really matter who is in charge until Lerner sells, although we obviously stand a better chance of getting relegated with McLeish in charge.

Yes, Lerner. Bugger off and take all that money you've invested with you. How dare you give it managers to buy players with.

How quaint. No wonder you think Lerner's doing a good job if that's the sum total of your understanding of the situation.  I expected more if I'm honest.

The "sum total of my understanding of the situation" covers a lot more than looking at a few figures and forming an opinion based on my own prejudice. It includes such things as talking to experts in this field, asking questions of relevant parties, and, on the whole, being satisfied with the explanations given. 

Experts like Paul Faulkner I assume.   And what view did these "experts" give? That everything is going swimmingly?

No, experts such as accountants, football journalists specialising in the business side of the game, activists in supporter groups. Those sort of experts. They tend to agree that things could be better, but they could be a lot worse.

Remove the parts about football from the above statement and you could get a job as a PR guru for David Cameron.

[Jimmy Smash]

While I would never normally criticise other fans for getting up off their arse and standing up for things they believe in (however misguided), all this protest will do is reinforce the mistaken belief that McLeish is not wanted because of his past association with Blues.  I'd save any anger for the man who has completely buggered things up, Randy Lerner.  It doesn't really matter who is in charge until Lerner sells, although we obviously stand a better chance of getting relegated with McLeish in charge.

Yes, Lerner. Bugger off and take all that money you've invested with you. How dare you give it managers to buy players with.

How quaint. No wonder you think Lerner's doing a good job if that's the sum total of your understanding of the situation.  I expected more if I'm honest.

The "sum total of my understanding of the situation" covers a lot more than looking at a few figures and forming an opinion based on my own prejudice. It includes such things as talking to experts in this field, asking questions of relevant parties, and, on the whole, being satisfied with the explanations given. 

Experts like Paul Faulkner I assume.   And what view did these "experts" give? That everything is going swimmingly?

No, experts such as accountants, football journalists specialising in the business side of the game, activists in supporter groups. Those sort of experts. They tend to agree that things could be better, but they could be a lot worse.

I must say Dave, you're so far up their arses you hardly offer an objective opinion.

[bertlambshank]

Risso is right.

[dave.woodhall]

While I would never normally criticise other fans for getting up off their arse and standing up for things they believe in (however misguided), all this protest will do is reinforce the mistaken belief that McLeish is not wanted because of his past association with Blues.  I'd save any anger for the man who has completely buggered things up, Randy Lerner.  It doesn't really matter who is in charge until Lerner sells, although we obviously stand a better chance of getting relegated with McLeish in charge.

Yes, Lerner. Bugger off and take all that money you've invested with you. How dare you give it managers to buy players with.

How quaint. No wonder you think Lerner's doing a good job if that's the sum total of your understanding of the situation.  I expected more if I'm honest.

The "sum total of my understanding of the situation" covers a lot more than looking at a few figures and forming an opinion based on my own prejudice. It includes such things as talking to experts in this field, asking questions of relevant parties, and, on the whole, being satisfied with the explanations given. 

Experts like Paul Faulkner I assume.   And what view did these "experts" give? That everything is going swimmingly?

No, experts such as accountants, football journalists specialising in the business side of the game, activists in supporter groups. Those sort of experts. They tend to agree that things could be better, but they could be a lot worse.

I must say Dave, you're so far up their arses you hardly offer an objective opinion.

You put an argument across based on knowledge you've bothered to obtain, and you're "up their arses." Thank you for that contribution to the debate

[Jimmy Smash]

To be fair, you haven't offered any evidence... you've just said "I've spoken to some people." That's not fact, it's just you name dropping... except without the names.

[dave.woodhall]

It's not name dropping at all - over the years, since Randy first arrived (when, if anyone cares to remember, I was more cautious than most) I've spoken to a lot of people who know a lot more about this type of deal than I do, as after all it is part of my work. For example the Guardian's David Conn,  my own accountant who is also a Villa supporter, Peter Warrilow (Supporters Trust chair and retired bank manager), others at Supporters Direct and the FSF. They all tend to the belief that Lerner's time as owner has been on the whole positive and those who have asked have been reassured that the debt side offers no cause for concern. While there's no proof of the latter, there comes a time when you have to accept someone's word and nothing they've done so far would indicate otherwise.

[Jimmy Smash]

No one is denying that RL's first 5 years have been positive. However the tide has without a doubt turned. At what point do we accept that the policy of the club has become negative? Certainly the words and actions of the club's management seem to be travelling in opposite directions, even to the casual observer. I personally am of the opinion that the club needs to be held steady at this difficult time, this includes keeping the manager and supporting the board..

[dave.woodhall]

I agree with you, and I've never said any different except that I would rather wait to see what next summer brings than panic now.

[Jimmy Smash]

Who's panicking? Other than Stephen Warnock with the sun in his eyes? 

[dave.woodhall]

Panic might not be the right word. 'Protest' then.

[Jimmy Smash]

And so we return... to the beginning of the thread. Poetic, eh?

[saunders_heroes]

If the debt offers no real cause for concern just what the hell is Lerner playing at? He's risking our Premier League status with his antics over the last 18 months. We've gone from perennial top 6 contenders to relegation battlers in less than 2 years, and it seems that Lerner has no plans to stop he slump. In fact it looks like he's gonna continue his disinvestment of his money.
Is it any wonder why so many fans have turned on him when he looks so disinterested in the club these days? Dave, we realise you speak to people who are closer to things than we'll ever be, but why don't you seem as worried as the rest of us? To me the club looks like a car crash at the moment.

[dave.woodhall]

One tries one's best.

[Jimmy Smash]

If the debt offers no real cause for concern just what the hell is Lerner playing at? He's risking our Premier League status with his antics over the last 18 months. We've gone from perennial top 6 contenders to relegation battlers in less than 2 years, and it seems that Lerner has no plans to stop he slump. In fact it looks like he's gonna continue his disinvestment of his money.
Is it any wonder why so many fans have turned on him when he looks so disinterested in the club these days? Dave, we realise you speak to people who are closer to things than we'll ever be, but why don't you seem as worried as the rest of us? To me the club looks like a car crash at the moment.

Debt is a concern because RL basically owes himself £150 odd million quid, and he ain't going home until he gets it back. This is our real worry, and is why we aren't spending more than less than the gate money on players.

[willywombat]

Risso is right.

No he isnt