Villa being discussed at length on Talksport right now

[Hookeysmith]

The more I think about it, the more I think that the players GH had targeted to move on need to leave before we get anywhere.

Despite all his (mostly PR related) gaffes and faults, Houllier had the right idea and was, I believe, taking us in a good direction. I think his intention was to ship out a lot of the hoofers and loafers and bring in some more proper footballers (funds allowing)  People who write his reign off as as disaster are well wide of the mark in my view, and the football, whilst not perfect,  was way better to watch than this sub-MON negative anti-football we're having to endure now.  It really was bad luck when his ticker played up again.

Agree intirely

[nick harper]

I think the defence get unfairly maligned at times. ...The problems lie in a lack of movement and poor quality in midfield. None of them are prepared to take the ball off the back four and take responsibility ... which is why I couldn't understand why Petrov didn't start on Sat.

Agree with you about Petrov on Saturday but the rest I think is wrong.
My 'take' is that our potential potency in the MF is being negated by crap defending: not the "ugly" stuff as you say but in ball-distribution and player positioning. It means the MF are either cut out of the game (by the long hoof) or spending too much time covering for their defensive colleagues.
The team needs a new back four, frankly; one in which Clark is a fixture and in which we have dependable FB who can both attack and defend.
When we get to the end of the various short-term loan periods in January, and with Lichaj fit again, the manager should be bold and play some of these young assets; trade on their enthusiasm, fitness and association with the club to get the extra performance required; maybe retaining Dunne alongside Clark as the experienced player.

A defender is stuck between a rock and a hard place if he has the ball and no-one is within thirty yards of him.

I'm not excusing the hoof which is symptomatic of Collins in particular, but the longer you are forced to hit it, the less likely it is to reach its target. The midfiled are not working hard enough to create the space to move the ball around the pitch.

I can only assume that McLeishwants the ball in the opposition half as quickly as possible and play the percentages. We don't have those players (other than Heskey) whcih means we keep giving it back.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

Its just so depressing whenever i see another game

last night both Fulham and 'The Mighty Reds YNWA' you could see the formation, you could see their style of play and the game ebbed and flowed backwards and forwards and although not the best game in the world it was pleasant on the eye and enjoyable.

Ours is just painful to watch

I was asked if this is the worst i have seen us play and i have to admit it is

I've been saying that for years, we're a sight for sore eyes, no structure, formation, tactics, it's all so bloody backward. It's hard to imagine now but in the last few games under GH/GMc we scored goals that led from a 16, 17 and 19 pass build up. We don't even want the ball now. The Spurs game and the first half against Man Utd were indeed, as somebody earlier mentioned, a Villa team waving a big white flag.

There's a complete lack of confidence in the team, nobody wants the ball, nobody moves to receive it and the worst thing is, I'm really struggling to see how it's all going to be fixed.

[Concrete John]

I think the defence get unfairly maligned at times. ...The problems lie in a lack of movement and poor quality in midfield. None of them are prepared to take the ball off the back four and take responsibility ... which is why I couldn't understand why Petrov didn't start on Sat.

Agree with you about Petrov on Saturday but the rest I think is wrong.
My 'take' is that our potential potency in the MF is being negated by crap defending: not the "ugly" stuff as you say but in ball-distribution and player positioning. It means the MF are either cut out of the game (by the long hoof) or spending too much time covering for their defensive colleagues.
The team needs a new back four, frankly; one in which Clark is a fixture and in which we have dependable FB who can both attack and defend.
When we get to the end of the various short-term loan periods in January, and with Lichaj fit again, the manager should be bold and play some of these young assets; trade on their enthusiasm, fitness and association with the club to get the extra performance required; maybe retaining Dunne alongside Clark as the experienced player.

I think the defence get unfairly maligned at times. Agreed they're not the best footballers in the world but they do the defensive ugly side pretty well. All are prepared to throw their bodies in the way for the team and our defensive record is improved this season.

The problems lie in a lack of movement and poor quality in midfield. None of them are prepared to take the ball off the back four and take responsibility. Houllier made that a cornerstone of the way he wanted the team to play and we kept the ball much better as a result.

Confidence is also key of course and most of the players, particularly the younger ones, look like they don't want the ball at the moment - which is why I couldn't understand why Petrov didn't start on Sat.

I sort of agree with that.  Nobody can deny McLeish has a 'safety first' attitude, so with a defence that seems so fragile the midfield is quite restricted, which leaves our biggest asset, Darren Bent, isolated.  If we can spend in January, I'd be looking for a DCM and CB who can marshall those sections of the pitch and organise our side.  The hope being that that then gives the platform for the likes of Gabby, Bannan, Albrighton and N'Zogbia to play 5-10 yards further forward.

[eastie]

with the euros in the summer if i was darren bent id be seriously thinking about asking for a move - the attractions that leds to his signing for the club seem to be all gone and he is left scrapping for titbits.

[LeeB]

During the first half Saturday, Warnock sold the man closing him down a nice dummy and opened up a bit of space down the left flank. Looking up the pitch you saw Gabby running away from him at the speed of light (not knocking him, that's most likely what he's told to do) and not another Villa player within 40 yards to pass to.

It was us under McLeish in a nutshell, the only option Warnock had was to belt it up the line and he couldn't even manage that, spooning it out of play.

What made me even more angry was that the incident had made feel sympathy for that useless prick Warnock.

[pauliewalnuts]

During the first half Saturday, Warnock sold the man closing him down a nice dummy and opened up a bit of space down the left flank. Looking up the pitch you saw Gabby running away from him at the speed of light (not knocking him, that's most likely what he's told to do) and not another Villa player within 40 yards to pass to.

It was us under McLeish in a nutshell, the only option Warnock had was to belt it up the line and he couldn't even manage that, spooning it out of play.

What made me even more angry was that the incident had made feel sympathy for that useless prick Warnock.

The aimless booting up field is the most spirit sapping thing about where we are today.

I found myself on Saturday wincing every time we had the ball, pretty much, because I just *knew* it was going to happen

[LeeB]

For all those questioning where Bent would go, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if Sunderland came back for him.

Their form has been shocking since he left, a new big name manager and renewed ambition and it might tempt him.

[pauliewalnuts]

Nah, the crowd decided they hated him the minute he left, not much chance of that.

Newcastle, maybe. Also, he was apparently keen on a move from Sunderland to a Turkish club before we came in for him.

[LeeB]

During the first half Saturday, Warnock sold the man closing him down a nice dummy and opened up a bit of space down the left flank. Looking up the pitch you saw Gabby running away from him at the speed of light (not knocking him, that's most likely what he's told to do) and not another Villa player within 40 yards to pass to.

It was us under McLeish in a nutshell, the only option Warnock had was to belt it up the line and he couldn't even manage that, spooning it out of play.

What made me even more angry was that the incident had made feel sympathy for that useless prick Warnock.

The aimless booting up field is the most spirit sapping thing about where we are today.

I found myself on Saturday wincing every time we had the ball, pretty much, because I just *knew* it was going to happen

It made me think back to a quote from Andy Gray I think it was, about Billy McNeill's time as manager, something like "When you got the ball and looked up to pass, all you saw were backsides disappearing up the pitch

[LeeB]

Nah, the crowd decided they hated him the minute he left, not much chance of that.

Newcastle, maybe. Also, he was apparently keen on a move from Sunderland to a Turkish club before we came in for him.

Crowds always behave like that. They'd piss themselves if they bought him back, the prodigal son returns, proves we're bigger than Villa etc..

[SoccerHQ]

That Mark Saggers on there is a total tit. I remember around April last year he had us getting relegated and last night he was on his high horse once again about Villa fans and their "ridiculous expectations." When Stan then mentioned why wasn't he having a go at Everton fans for the same reasons, he moved quiet and quickly moved on.

[SoccerHQ]

Stan made one interesting point that had some merit. Said Bent is a luxury we are not presently utilising. Would probably be better off if we sold him for £25m, and spent the money on two good attacking fullbacks, or two good midfielders. Difficult to disagree, in my opinion.

True but then we'd be back to square one, creating all these chances but no one really to finish especially if Gabby loses form.

Bent is absoulutely the right striker for us but at the wrong time, MON should've signed him at some point, it still amazes me he didn't sign him or Defoe who we were strongly linked with at one stage.

[JUAN PABLO]

Sell Bent!!???  Why because the manager is dire and cannot bring him into the game.  Do me a favour......lets get rid of the problem and thats AM.

The manager sells Bent and then he will buy people like Guthrie . I couldnt trust with the money .

[JUAN PABLO]

The more I think about it, the more I think that the players GH had targeted to move on need to leave before we get anywhere.

Despite all his (mostly PR related) gaffes and faults, Houllier had the right idea and was, I believe, taking us in a good direction. I think his intention was to ship out a lot of the hoofers and loafers and bring in some more proper footballers (funds allowing)  People who write his reign off as as disaster are well wide of the mark in my view, and the football, whilst not perfect,  was way better to watch than this sub-MON negative anti-football we're having to endure now.  It really was bad luck when his ticker played up again.

The Villa v Manure game from last season seems light years away .