Mark Hughes Quits Fulham

[Damo70]

Ancelotti has managed

Regianna, Parma, Juve , Milan and Chelsea

Now , from reading Wiki - he had success as EVERY club. Regianna - promoted, Parma 2nd , Juve 2nd, Milan League winners, Champs league winners, Chelsea league winners cup winners, 2nd.

success at EVERY club - in fact, with Ancelotti - finishing 2nd seems to be deemed a failure. And don't tell me he was at big clubs. all the teams he took over had won BUGGER ALL - and there was a reason he got the job - coz the predessor had been sacked ! - he then got those clubs challenging, which they wasn't before he came.

Benitez

Took over a good Valencia - WON the league , finished 5th, WON the league and Uefa Cup - thus maintaining success over 3 years, which means you cant just put it down to what he inherited. He then went to Liverpool, where he took over an OKish side, and they got to 5th and a cup final (better than we have acheived for a while) , he then WON the Euro cup mainly with the side he inherited granted, but then BUILT his own side and 5 years later pushed Man U to the final two weeks of the season.

Thus - sustained success over 5 yrs - building his side.

Hughes - over last 7 yrs

Wales - didn't acheive anything before jumping ship at first opportunity for Blackburn
Blackburn - got to 7th - then jumped ship as soon as as Man City offerred him a better opportunity
Man City - sacked after underperforming (open to debate I admit) but still spent nearly 100m and acheived nowt
Fulham - quit after one year as soon as (it appeared) an opportunity came
Villa ? - well if it is - 5th job in 7 years ?

So where is this evidence that Hughes is "better suited to Villa where we are now" - he has NO credentials for building sides - he has never stayed at anywhere long enough to build a team. it seems to me we are looking at the "possibility" with Hughes. Well if thats the case,we might as well get Alex McLeish ! - he has all the hallmarks of Hughes, only he has won things !

So - he isn't a "long term" manager, he hasn't built a side , he has never won anything

THAT is why he is not as good as Benitez and Ancelotti

I rest my case for the prosecution your honour !!!

I agree 100% with what you say about Ancelotti, he has been successful at every club he has managed, big or small. I think your spin on Hughes is the glass half empty version as opposed to half full version I would give but you are right with what you say. But Benitez? That was the happy half of the story you gave there. Extremadura? Osasuna? Tenerife? Valadolid? You edited out those chapters. And he did go a bit  'yampi' in the last year at Liverpool didn't he?

[holtepaul]

/////

I am dumb founded by this apparent "logic"

Vialli won more than Taylor, but Taylor was more suitable for Watford ?  - what the hell ?

What Vialli acheived was as a player , and a player only. He took over a good Chelsea side, and won a cup as a manager fair play, but he acheived no more than the manager before or after him.

Players dont always make managers that is true, if it was, Roy Keane would be taking over from Fergie now.

But Taylor took Lincoln up, took Watford up many times, got Watford to an FA Cup final, got Watford to 2nd , got Villa up, got Villa to 2nd , took over the English National team.

Then took over at Watford again (after proving what a bloody good manager he was with all the above) and took them up again.

This arguament is getting sillier and sillier.

Good managers become good managers because they achieve , when they achieve , they become great managers - thats why people want them.

I am sick of Villa having "managers with potential". Wasn't Little, Gregory, O'Leary and O'Neill all supposed to have had potential ?.

Time to get a real manager in !

[not3bad]

Ancelotti has managed

Regianna, Parma, Juve , Milan and Chelsea

Now , from reading Wiki - he had success as EVERY club. Regianna - promoted, Parma 2nd , Juve 2nd, Milan League winners, Champs league winners, Chelsea league winners cup winners, 2nd.

success at EVERY club - in fact, with Ancelotti - finishing 2nd seems to be deemed a failure. And don't tell me he was at big clubs. all the teams he took over had won BUGGER ALL - and there was a reason he got the job - coz the predessor had been sacked ! - he then got those clubs challenging, which they wasn't before he came.

Benitez

Took over a good Valencia - WON the league , finished 5th, WON the league and Uefa Cup - thus maintaining success over 3 years, which means you cant just put it down to what he inherited. He then went to Liverpool, where he took over an OKish side, and they got to 5th and a cup final (better than we have acheived for a while) , he then WON the Euro cup mainly with the side he inherited granted, but then BUILT his own side and 5 years later pushed Man U to the final two weeks of the season.

Thus - sustained success over 5 yrs - building his side.

Hughes - over last 7 yrs

Wales - didn't acheive anything before jumping ship at first opportunity for Blackburn
Blackburn - got to 7th - then jumped ship as soon as as Man City offerred him a better opportunity
Man City - sacked after underperforming (open to debate I admit) but still spent nearly 100m and acheived nowt
Fulham - quit after one year as soon as (it appeared) an opportunity came
Villa ? - well if it is - 5th job in 7 years ?

So where is this evidence that Hughes is "better suited to Villa where we are now" - he has NO credentials for building sides - he has never stayed at anywhere long enough to build a team. it seems to me we are looking at the "possibility" with Hughes. Well if thats the case,we might as well get Alex McLeish ! - he has all the hallmarks of Hughes, only he has won things !

So - he isn't a "long term" manager, he hasn't built a side , he has never won anything

THAT is why he is not as good as Benitez and Ancelotti

I rest my case for the prosecution your honour !!!

I agree 100% with what you say about Ancelotti, he has been successful at every club he has managed, big or small. I think your spin on Hughes is the glass half empty version as opposed to half full version I would give but you are right with what you say. But Benitez? That was the happy half of the story you gave there. Extremadura? Osasuna? Tenerife? Valadolid? You edited out those chapters. And he did go a bit  'yampi' in the last year at Liverpool didn't he?

And Hughes got Blackburn to 6th. 

[TimTheVillain]

Let's compare managerial records:

Ancelotti

Trophies

Juventus
Intertoto Cup: 1 1999

Milan
Serie A: 1 2004
Coppa Italia: 1 2003
Supercoppa Italiana: 1 2004
UEFA Champions League: 2 2003, 2007
UEFA Super Cup: 2 2003, 2007
FIFA Club World Cup: 1 2007

Chelsea
Premier League: 1 2009–10
FA Cup: 1 2010
Community Shield: 1 2009

Awards

Serie A coach of the Year: 2001, 2004
Albo Panchina d'Oro: 2002–03, 2003–04
UEFA Manager of the Year: 2002–03
World Soccer Magazine Manager of the Year: 2003
The World's best Club Coach 2007
Premier League Manager of the Month : November 2009, August 2010, March 2011, April 2011[15]
UEFA Champions League Manager of the Year: 2002–03

Benitez

Trophies

Real Madrid U-19s
Spain U-19 League (1): 1993
Spain U-19 Cup (2): 1991, 1993

Extremadura
Segunda División Promotion (1): 1997–98

Tenerife
Segunda División (1): 2000–01

Valencia
La Liga (2): 2001–02, 2003–04
UEFA Cup (1): 2003–04

Liverpool
UEFA Champions League (1): 2004–05
FA Cup (1): 2005–06
FA Community Shield (1): 2006
UEFA Super Cup (1): 2005

Internazionale
Supercoppa Italiana (1): 2010
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2010

Awards

Don Balón Award (1): 2001–02
UEFA Manager of the Year(2): 2003–04, 2004–05
FA Premier League Manager of the Month (5): November 2005, December 2005, January 2007, October 2008, March 2009

Hughes

Trophies
None

Awards
None


I'd say that there is evidence of career progression and having a good record at a lower level in Benitez' case, a consistent record from Ancelotti.

In addition, both Benitez and Ancelotti have been recognised as being the best coach/manager on a number of occasions.

I'd say it's a fact that Hughes isn't as good as the others.

It's hard to argue that Hughes could be considered to be a better manager whichever way you look at it.

Hughes could arguably have done well at Citeh given the chance.

He hasn't exactly had the same opportunities as Ancelloti has he ?

[adrenachrome]

/////

I am dumb founded by this apparent "logic"

No doubt: and it takes a strong man to admit it.

More power to your cider raising elbow.

[holtepaul]

Tim the Villain

You are right - he could hav edone - but the issue is - he didn't !

Dr Jo could have done a job at the Villa given time , Roy Hodgson could have done a job at Liverpool given time, Avram Grant could have done a job at West Ham given time.

Point is - they didn't !

[Legion]

So could Houllier at Aston Villa.

[holtepaul]

So could Houllier at Aston Villa.

Very true

[ozzjim]

Tim there are reasons coaches are not given a chance though. Hughes had 18 months and they looked like they were struggling to get top 4 after a lot of money spent, so they got in Mancini, who has had 18 months, won the FA Cup and finished 3rd. Harsh on Hughes maybe, but he was at Fulham last season for a reason. The hopping about, and doing ok with mid table sides is not taking a side further and proving yourself capable of taking a club to the next step. When looking at the 3, Ancelotti and Benitez are far more proven managers than Hughes.

[Risso]

Very doubtful.

[KevinGage]

/////

I am dumb founded by this apparent "logic"

 
There's at least part of that statement I wouldn't disagree with.

Vialli won more than Taylor, but Taylor was more suitable for Watford ?  - what the hell ?

What Vialli acheived was as a player , and a player only. He took over a good Chelsea side, and won a cup as a manager fair play...

  Contradict yourself, much?

But Taylor took Lincoln up, took Watford up many times, got Watford to an FA Cup final, got Watford to 2nd , got Villa up, got Villa to 2nd , took over the English National team.

Then took over at Watford again (after proving what a bloody good manager he was with all the above) and took them up again.

So there is more to being a good manager than trophies won elsewhere?

This arguament is getting sillier and sillier.

Agreed. But if you will tie yourself in knots...

[ozzjim]

Anyhow.... away from this debate, Hughes' detestable agent Joooorabaabbachian has been on Sky saying he wants a club that are going to win trophies. Erm... Mark... you had one and drew too many games mate... they sacked you. Doesn't care if it is here or abroad, but want a club challenging for titles. He has a seriously over inflated opinion of his achievements thus far if he thinks he is going to walk into that kind of job anywhere other than Chelsea, who may take him with Hiddink as DOF to step in if he is screwing it up.

[Damo70]

To be honest, all I'm really worried about is the fact that McLaren is still hovering around the favourites positions with the bookies. That means that a fair number of people are actually putting money on him getting the job. Bluenoses, got to be, surely?

[KevinGage]

I'll sleep a lot better if/when McLaren takes the Fulham job (or any other vacancy outside of B6) that's for sure.

[gervilla]

I'll sleep a lot better if/when McLaren takes the Fulham job (or any other vacancy outside of B6) that's for sure.

You are not alone .