Ashley Young - tell it how you see it

[Mazrim]

Ash wins a lot of free kicks in or around the box.

That will be worth a lot of goals to ManUre as Ash won't be taking the resulting free kick

Ye totally agree

Have you been on the Mead?

Verily.

[Chris Smith]

I don't think Ash is much of a passer at all. His crossing flits between dodgy and brilliant. 3 years ago his crossing was exceptional, so I don't get why his delivery has become so erratic of late.

He just lacks the vision and cuteness to pick out the telling passes in the final third. I don't think he's clever enough for the 2nd striker role. In fact I struggle to remember a really standout game he's had playing there. Ironically when he played there for England, he looked far better, so perhaps it's not entirely his own fault that his form is very patchy.

For me, sell him, and play the best formation that suits our best 11, with players playing in their best positions. Clearly, Ash, Downing and Albrighton in the same side doesn't work. Right now, given the choice of which two to play, I'd go for Stewie and Mark. They've been the form players this season.

Tom, I really don't think you have been watching closely enough. He's always had the vision now with he signing of Bent he has a player making the runs to match it. He must have put him through 4 times in the Bolton game alone.

He's directly involved in such a high percentage of our goals that I'm  slightly flabbergasted that people can't see it.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

I don't think Ash is much of a passer at all. His crossing flits between dodgy and brilliant. 3 years ago his crossing was exceptional, so I don't get why his delivery has become so erratic of late.

He just lacks the vision and cuteness to pick out the telling passes in the final third. I don't think he's clever enough for the 2nd striker role. In fact I struggle to remember a really standout game he's had playing there. Ironically when he played there for England, he looked far better, so perhaps it's not entirely his own fault that his form is very patchy.

For me, sell him, and play the best formation that suits our best 11, with players playing in their best positions. Clearly, Ash, Downing and Albrighton in the same side doesn't work. Right now, given the choice of which two to play, I'd go for Stewie and Mark. They've been the form players this season.

Tom, I really don't think you have been watching closely enough. He's always had the vision now with he signing of Bent he has a player making the runs to match it. He must have put him through 4 times in the Bolton game alone.

He's directly involved in such a high percentage of our goals that I'm  slightly flabbergasted that people can't see it.

Don't use the word 'flabbergasted' Chris, you wouldn't use that in real life, methinks.
I still say he's more productive on the wings.

Anybody got stats for assists and goals in the last 3 seasons?

[barrysleftfoot]

   I'm not quite sure that AYoung has the quality in the pass though Chris.

   Against Fulham , and indeed Bolton , and every game since Bent has got here, there have not been that many quality passes that put him through, not needing to take a touch and score.I was an advocate of ASh in that role, but i'm not sure he has the quality to play there.He might be as good as we get, but maybe the time to sell, take a gamble on a good and upandcoming youngster a la Taaabaret etc, may be the time.

  An example of what i mean was aginst Bolton, Bent had made a move and made an extra yard on Wheater, a good passer would have put him through on goal.He had to wait as the weight of the pass was not good enough, and Wheater got back.To get the best out of Young we need better service than AYoung can provide.

[Chris Smith]

Actually I used flabbergasted only the other day to a woman at work, so ner, ner, ner, ner, ner.

[Mazrim]

Life is a Taaabaret my friends, life is a Taaaaaaabaret!

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Actually I used flabbergasted only the other day to a woman at work, so ner, ner, ner, ner, ner.

WOMAN 'Are you here to clean the bins out.'
CHRIS 'I'm a manager here!'
WOMAN 'I'm flabbergasted!'
CHRIS 'Why would you be flabbergasted? I multi task'

[Chris Smith]

  An example of what i mean was aginst Bolton

He put him through one on onei n the first few minutes only for Bent to get his feet tangled up and fuck it up.

To my mind he's our best player and his current role keeps him involved in the game more and makes us a more effective attacking force. If we gad a better option then I'd say put him back on the wing but we don't.  Although in Downing and Albrighton we do have players to play the wide role effectively.

[Concrete John]

It's his first season in this position and that's during a time when we've struggled.  All things considered he's done OK, but not as good as when he played wide.

Whether or not he'd get better there next season when we're (hopefully) playing better I don't know, but it's unfortunately probably quite accademic anyway.

[adrenachrome]

Don't use the word 'flabbergasted' Chris, you wouldn't use that in real life, methinks.
I still say he's more productive on the wings.

Egad sir, by my troth I see what you did there you slippery jackanapes.

On the substantive issue, I agree with Smudger with regards to this one.

[cdward]

As he's fucking off, I can see no reason to carry on pandering to him by having him play behind Bent.
Stick him on the wing where he can cause most damage, get Heskey up front with Bent.

I don't understand where this idea that picking him  to play the support striker role is pandering to him. The manager has tried him in both positions and, quite rightly, realised that he's more effective in the middle.

I disagree, the manager has tried Gabby in both positions, realised he is less effective on the wing, yet, kept him there because he prefers to pander to AY.
Playing 2 players out of position to keep one happy, you may not see as pandering, but in my opinion this has hampered the progress of Gabby. By giving in to a player who will be off in the summer, against a player who has just committed himself to the club for 5 years sends out the wrong signals, again.
This as well as giving him the captains armband, and letting him take the penalties, seems like pandering to me. Seeing as he missed the last one, who will take our next penalty?

Can't see SAF liking the petulance of AY, but he would certainly win a lot of free kicks and penalties at OT.

[Merv]

You don't think Ferguson would like Ashley's penchant for complaining to the ref? That'll probably convince Ferguson to sign him...

Seriously, this 'petulance' of Young's is overstated - his attitude is, I think, pretty solid. By all accounts he's a lively, positive character in the dressing room and he doesn't shirk his work on the pitch; his workrate is fantastic, especially for a forward player. His appearance record is superb. He likes the odd appeal to the officials but really, let's not make out he's a problem player. If he is running down his contract, looking for a summer move, then he's hardly in cruise control, simply earning his money and biding his time. He actually looks like one of the few who really wants us to win games, and goes about trying to do that.

[Chris Smith]

Playing 2 players out of position to keep one happy, you may not see as pandering, but in my opinion this has hampered the progress of Gabby. By giving in to a player who will be off in the summer,

Or, and I know this going to sound mad, perhaps the manager really does think it his best position. Sorry for throwing such off the wall ideas into the discussion but i've been shopping and it has sent me a bit crazy.

It's quite interesting to see how much everyone is indoctrinated into 4-4-2. I can't see us going back to it any time soon so we might as well stop thinking of players being " out of position" and start realising that they are going to need more than one string to their bow.

[Chris Smith]

Actually I used flabbergasted only the other day to a woman at work, so ner, ner, ner, ner, ner.

WOMAN 'Are you here to clean the bins out.'
CHRIS 'I'm a manager here!'
WOMAN 'I'm flabbergasted!'
CHRIS 'Why would you be flabbergasted? I multi task'

That was the time before, this one was when I found out our big boss isn't going to have a job under the cuts.

[TheSandman]

I'm shocked.

All the best Ash. Not quite sure if you are good enough to perform at the very highest level especially on the last two seasons form but you've been a decent servant to the club for the past few years.

We'll probably be a better side for not having to accommodate him in the hole as we can either improve our defence by picking another midfielder or score more goals by selecting someone who can get more goals there.

Have they changed the Premier League balls recently? That might explain the free kicks.