Protest ?

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Why is calling someone's behaviour who runs away from something they've been doing cowardly an insult compared to labelling someone a stroppy toddler for wishing to protest against something they don't like?

Adam.

I don't think the General has run away from anything.
I thinks it's more a case of the local and national media sifting through his thread on H&V, Villatalk and that other piddling one and extracting sound bites which are then taken wildy out of context.

It was causing the club's image too much harm and it would be nightmarish to imagine what they'd have printed after the last few weeks of being in the doldrums.

Best all round that he's took a break.

[pauliewalnuts]

Why is calling someone's behaviour who runs away from something they've been doing cowardly an insult compared to labelling someone a stroppy toddler for wishing to protest against something they don't like?

Adam.

I don't think the General has run away from anything.
I thinks it's more a case of the local and national media sifting through his thread on H&V, Villatalk and that other piddling one and extracting sound bites which are then taken wildy out of context.

That's the point upon which Adam's entire argument flounders.

The General didn't run away from anything, he didn't ask to stop doing the forums, and nor did the club.

We suggested that it made sense to take a break, as two things were happening.

Firstly, things were getting lifted by the media, taken out of context and used against the club, which thus made it very difficult for him to talk freely about anything

Secondly - and this is more something which has come up of late given recent results - after four years of asking people not to ask him questions on playing matters, and getting roundly ignored, this led to a point where the thread was wrecked by people stamping their feet, losing their tempers and shouting at him.

So, calling his absence from the forums (well, at least this one, I don't know anything about the other, shit forums) "cowardly" is not only disrespectful and childish, it is also fundamentally flawed from the off, as Adam is assuming it was something initiated by him, when it wasn't.

Hopefully that clears it up.

[dave.woodhall]

Why is calling someone's behaviour who runs away from something they've been doing cowardly an insult compared to labelling someone a stroppy toddler for wishing to protest against something they don't like?

And please explain how you interpret your second sentence as relevant to me and this dialogue we've been having?

There's a bit of a difference between saying someone is acting like a kid having a tantrum when they're saying we should protest because they don't like the manager, and accusing someone else of acting in a cowardly fashion when they are doing something that's best for all concerned.

You were talking about freedom of speech, and then made some strange reference to me going through your posts, as though you didn't believe I should.

[villa for life]

it's a tough one...it's all perspective and as with every post on this forum, each one is received in the context of the last result - there is no constant, only flux. In a few months time, if we are still where we are...it could be argued that those who 'stifled/belittled' a protest..did not act in the best interests of the club..only time will tell.

[sfx412]

So, calling his absence from the forums (well, at least this one, I don't know anything about the other, shit forums) "cowardly" is not only disrespectful and childish, it is also fundamentally flawed from the off, as Adam is assuming it was something initiated by him, when it wasn't.

Hopefully that clears it up.

Rather coincidental that all the forums lost his excellent contributions then, at nigh on exactly the same time.

Smoke and mirrors perhaps, although whilst I fully understand the stupid reactions and comments of some more than justified his departure, for a time, I do think, that his absence came about because it suited, and subsequent results could be said to have justified it.

Still a great idea, but one that cannot help but be ruined by those with no thought for the greater good.

[Risso]

The General took a break in the summer because his words were being picked up and misconstrued by the press.  He then came back after his break and did exactly the same thing.  Cowardly no, a bit daft, possibly.

[adam#1]

Why is calling someone's behaviour who runs away from something they've been doing cowardly an insult compared to labelling someone a stroppy toddler for wishing to protest against something they don't like?

And please explain how you interpret your second sentence as relevant to me and this dialogue we've been having?

There's a bit of a difference between saying someone is acting like a kid having a tantrum when they're saying we should protest because they don't like the manager, and accusing someone else of acting in a cowardly fashion when they are doing something that's best for all concerned.

You were talking about freedom of speech, and then made some strange reference to me going through your posts, as though you didn't believe I should.

Not at all, feel free to read anything I've posted, I just thought it showed strong commitment to the debate  we were having for you to spend the time trawling through all my posts to find something to pick apart(...and perhaps a strong desire on you part to defend yourself by seeking out to undermine me and using the classical debating tactic of seeking to deflect the point and focus away from discussing what you'd said to something I'd said?)

I continue to maintain that to cease communicating with the fans in the same method when times are tough appears in my eyes a cowardly act regardless of who was responsible for the decision to cease communication - it is the act of stopping that is cowardly, not necessarily the General.

There are ways around the media not picking apart every statement - perhaps by not being overly contentious may help to start with....

The General is a big boy and I'm sure can take being called a coward by me if that's how this is interpreted. Dave knows very little about the PMK1981 when he chooses to call him a stroppy toddler and his insult could well stifle this guy's contribution in the future - i.e. ending his legitimate right to free speech on this forum. I very much doubt the General would keep away if he thought I'd called him a coward...As a leading member of this board and a very significant figure on here, he carries a strong authority position whether he likes it or not and I'd have thought had a responsibility to encourage debate and differing points of view, not seek to stifle them through insulting people who profer opinion that he disagrees with. But hey, I'm just one of the masses, so I guess the H+V clique will continue to defend his stance and position.

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Dave knows very little about the PMK1981 when he chooses to call him a stroppy toddler and his insult could well stifle this guy's contribution in the future

THE THING IS WE DIDNT PLAY ANY BETTER THAN WE DID AGAINST SUNDERLAND,  ONLY THING IS THAT THE OPPONENTS WE POOR,  IF WE PLAY LIKE THAT ON SUDNAY WE ARE FUCKED, BUT I HOPE WE DO AND THAT WAY HOULLIER GETS THE SACK.

PS.  HOULLIER WAS TOLD TO SIGN THAT PLAYER BY THE SCOUTS,  HOULLIER CANT TAKE THE CREDIT

[Chris Smith]

Adam, you're making a bit of a prat of yourself now. Have you ever heard the phrase 'discretion is the better part of valour'? By posting the General had started to cause problems for the club. That's because much of what he tried to say was being wilfully misinterpreted by others much the same as you are doing now.

[pauliewalnuts]

So, calling his absence from the forums (well, at least this one, I don't know anything about the other, shit forums) "cowardly" is not only disrespectful and childish, it is also fundamentally flawed from the off, as Adam is assuming it was something initiated by him, when it wasn't.

Hopefully that clears it up.

Rather coincidental that all the forums lost his excellent contributions then, at nigh on exactly the same time.

Smoke and mirrors perhaps, although whilst I fully understand the stupid reactions and comments of some more than justified his departure, for a time, I do think, that his absence came about because it suited, and subsequent results could be said to have justified it.

Still a great idea, but one that cannot help but be ruined by those with no thought for the greater good.

Like I said, I can't speak for VillaSquawk or Fear's horrific banterandracismfest, but that's what happened here.

[adam#1]

Chris - The point I raised initially was all about Dave's insulting of someone who sought to post a point of view and the impact of that upon free speech etc given Dave's position. It now seems that its been turned around into discussing my calling an action to cease communicating with fans when the going gets tough a cowardly act - it seems Dave has successfully deflected away the debate from being about his name calling to this. Thats a shame.

[Ger Regan]

Chris - The point I raised initially was all about Dave's insulting of someone who sought to post a point of view and the impact of that upon free speech etc given Dave's position. It now seems that its been turned around into discussing my calling an action to cease communicating with fans when the going gets tough a cowardly act - it seems Dave has successfully deflected away the debate from being about his name calling to this. Thats a shame.

When the point of view is as flawed and counter-productive as the original suggestion, then it deserves all the scorn it gets, imo.

[dave.woodhall]

You're the only one talking about insults, and also the one who brought the general into it. And I'm the one who deflected the debate.

[adam#1]

I am the one talking about insults. You are the one who brought the General into it by trawling through my posts from another thread that you brought over onto this thread to raise in your defence by criticising me - perhaps you'd care to take the time to go back through this thread to clarify that - I'm sure it won't take you as long as it did to trawl through my previous posts to seek out one with which to criticise me.

I stand by my view that you aer seeking deflection of the debate by raising another point.

[Ger Regan]

Nobody's free speech is being curtailed - but I'd have thought one of the senior members of this forum would show better leadership than stooping to insult when he doesn't agree with a posters point of view.

FWIW, I agree with you, I can't see that now is the time to protest. I'm sure, despite bowing out from interacting on this message baord (somewhat cowardly in my opinion) when the going gets tough, fan opinion is being monitored on these forums. A protest is likely to give the players an excuse not to perform and also to distract them away from the effort they need to put in to get us out of this mess.

So you didn't say this on this thread? I'm confused?