The Martin O'Neill thread (with added sacking #2188)

[not3bad]

Anyone seen Garth Crooks's team of the week?  Central defense: Ciaran Clark and Gary Cahill.  What might have been...

[Risso]

It was a good piece Chelts, but for emphasis you could have mentioned the wage bill at Spurs!

[hilts_coolerking]

It was a good piece Chelts, but for emphasis you could have mentioned the wage bill at Spurs!

As terrifying as that is to recall, it's a good example of a poster for whom O'Neill could do no wrong.  He was more ready to believe that Spurs were cooking their books than he was to believe in the possibility that O'Neill was throwing an awful lot of money at some very average players.

[OzVilla]

Fuck me it's a feeding frenzy. It reminds me of when I walked into the pubs on Chelmsley after they'd beaten us.

Not that I had to worry about that when O'Neill was manager.

As one of the people who backed MoN quite strongly until the last few months, I think for me the problem is, for all the good things he did, it's hard to look at the current squad, compare it to the cash spent in the last 6 years and not think he made a bit of a mess of things.

I was happy with how things went but there was never any long-term planning and over the last 2 years we've seen just how little plan there was.

Quite but isn't that more the fault of Lerner than MON.  It's impossible to defend some of MON's signings and their short termism but the financial running of the Club should have been Lerner's domain imo.

[WarszaVillan]

Less than an hour and I took lunch towards when I was supposed to be leaving for the day!

Dave - If you want top open up old wounds and use that for the Chrimbo edition you are welcome.

Perhaps as an open letter to their fans if so.

What just an open letter? No this should get a literary prize. It should be printed in the thousands and distributed to the masses. It will become a guide for all of us who suffered the delusions of being a disciple of Saint Martin. We shall gather in Greg Nash's bunker and read the great text before being shown Eastie's 24 hour SkySport compilations of the infidel's interviews. I repent my ways, I just thank you that you allowed me to see how I had trodden this treacherous path.

Ooh, get you. I have to hit the shower pre work but I so wish you had turned in an hour ago to actually debate this.

The guy that told me I cant possibly know more about the goings on at the club than you because you didnt know it yourself and, if I did, I would have played ITK cards with all und sundry to prove my point.

I have of course given Dave W scoops in the past, as well as Mods on here, but dont let that get in the way of you defending your great pal, Marty.

Will respond tomorrow (after talking to my agent of course).

Love, Stu xx

Only joshing, its a nicely written article. But it has all gone a bit weird here recently. And I'm sorry that I'm still pals with Martin, I'm trying not to like him I really am

[ozzjim]

I think Lerner backed his man in a naive manner, but the money spent should have had a much wider reaching legacy than 28 months later down to kids and bare bones, even after the further investment of what, 60-70 million since MON left. The myth the spending just stopped is peddled regularly, but it didn't just stop at all, and has been significant since he left just to hold together a squad, as what MON built was a team, with a group of the highest paid journeymen subs in the league that have financially crippled us since. Although pretending Given, Ireland, Hutton and NZogbia are not part of that problem too would be wrong.

Lerner gets a lot of stick, but his biggest errors have been the managers appointed after MON and if anything backing MON too much, which is harsh to label him with. I have a lot of sympathy for him. He backed Houllier, Eck and has Lambert, unfortunately it is only the latter who appeared to grasp that the money is finite and needs to be used to build a squad of footballers, which is still a work in progress. I do wonder how much of the spending MON made was under the guise of "say no and I am out of here" which looked to be the likely reason he eventually took his ball off home. I mean, having got Cuellar and Luke Young, when he asked for 50k for week for Beye to play at right back, had Lerner questioned it what would have been the response from Martin??! Not favourable you have to the think. Poor decisions have hurt Lerner, but he has unreservedly backed his managers until this summer, when the club looked for a manager to work in a much different way, and Lambert has an appetite to do so thankfully. I am looking forward to the next 3 - 5 years much more now than I was on the day before Martin left, despite the current league position.

[Jarpie]

I think Lerner backed his man in a naive manner, but the money spent should have had a much wider reaching legacy than 28 months later down to kids and bare bones, even after the further investment of what, 60-70 million since MON left. The myth the spending just stopped is peddled regularly, but it didn't just stop at all, and has been significant since he left just to hold together a squad, as what MON built was a team, with a group of the highest paid journeymen subs in the league that have financially crippled us since. Although pretending Given, Ireland, Hutton and NZogbia are not part of that problem too would be wrong.

Lerner gets a lot of stick, but his biggest errors have been the managers appointed after MON and if anything backing MON too much, which is harsh to label him with. I have a lot of sympathy for him. He backed Houllier, Eck and has Lambert, unfortunately it is only the latter who appeared to grasp that the money is finite and needs to be used to build a squad of footballers, which is still a work in progress. I do wonder how much of the spending MON made was under the guise of "say no and I am out of here" which looked to be the likely reason he eventually took his ball off home. I mean, having got Cuellar and Luke Young, when he asked for 50k for week for Beye to play at right back, had Lerner questioned it what would have been the response from Martin??! Not favourable you have to the think. Poor decisions have hurt Lerner, but he has unreservedly backed his managers until this summer, when the club looked for a manager to work in a much different way, and Lambert has an appetite to do so thankfully. I am looking forward to the next 3 - 5 years much more now than I was on the day before Martin left, despite the current league position.

I can understand why they let MON to have free reins as he was basicly touted as The Next Brian Clough. I try to look at the years of MON with objectivity, and when you look at the signings he made and how much he burned the money on them it just pains me thinking what kind of signings we could've made with that money. I don't hate MON and his time at Villa but I see it much more as "What could have been" and completely wasted potential.

I don't think no one can argue that Lerner haven't backed his managers, even TSM got decent transfer kit, but I have to wonder if TSM didn't think he needed to spend more to replace both Young and Downing, or didn't Lerner give him more to either transfers or salaries.

[FrankyH]

I think Lerner backed his man in a naive manner, but the money spent should have had a much wider reaching legacy than 28 months later down to kids and bare bones, even after the further investment of what, 60-70 million since MON left. The myth the spending just stopped is peddled regularly, but it didn't just stop at all, and has been significant since he left just to hold together a squad, as what MON built was a team, with a group of the highest paid journeymen subs in the league that have financially crippled us since. Although pretending Given, Ireland, Hutton and NZogbia are not part of that problem too would be wrong.

Lerner gets a lot of stick, but his biggest errors have been the managers appointed after MON and if anything backing MON too much, which is harsh to label him with. I have a lot of sympathy for him. He backed Houllier, Eck and has Lambert, unfortunately it is only the latter who appeared to grasp that the money is finite and needs to be used to build a squad of footballers, which is still a work in progress. I do wonder how much of the spending MON made was under the guise of "say no and I am out of here" which looked to be the likely reason he eventually took his ball off home. I mean, having got Cuellar and Luke Young, when he asked for 50k for week for Beye to play at right back, had Lerner questioned it what would have been the response from Martin??! Not favourable you have to the think. Poor decisions have hurt Lerner, but he has unreservedly backed his managers until this summer, when the club looked for a manager to work in a much different way, and Lambert has an appetite to do so thankfully. I am looking forward to the next 3 - 5 years much more now than I was on the day before Martin left, despite the current league position.

I cant find the quote , but didn't Lerner refer to O'Neill "as practically a director" or words to that effect ?

[kingshirker]

If its on a Sunderland blog they have played copy and paste. I only posted it here.

 Cheltenhamlion: Just to clarify, I copied and pasted it at Salut! Sunderland,because I interpreted your words -  "Here is my take on things if you wanted to share it with your fellow fans" - as an invit ation to do so.

[cheltenhamlion]

I am more than happy to give the board a kicking where due and they are most certainly not blameless in the sorry charade of the last two or three years. I just find it hard to accept that some people still refuse to believe MON ever did any wrong.

[oldtimernow]

A good analysis of the reasons for the plight we found ourselves in.

Wonder if this is the revisionism that MON referred to last weekend as opposed to the 'truth' pedalled by his media buddies?

May I forward it to all those friends who continue to say what a good manager he was and why were we so daft as to force him out?

[Brend'Watkins]

I am more than happy to give the board a kicking where due and they are most certainly not blameless in the sorry charade of the last two or three years. I just find it hard to accept that some people still refuse to believe MON ever did any wrong.

I don't think there is anybody on here in that camp.

There are those who might still like him to be here, and are happy with how the team did results wise overall while he ran the show but "did no wrong".  Not even MON himself would admit to that.

I'm glad he's gone now because like many I think he hit a ceiling and couldn't do a very important part of the job resulting in him walking out on us. 

However, I thank him for those results against our neighbours and that away win at Old Trafford, something I thought I'd never see.  I even think that had Phil Dowd done his job properly in the League cup final we might well have celebrated a trophy under his tenure.  That been the case, we wouldn't now be as hard on him.

[damon loves JT]

I would like to take this opportunity to thank all the brave freedom-fighters who were the first to say that Marton O'Neill was a wanker.

Your courage was not in vain.

[oldtimernow]

Power to the Revolution!.........Comrades

[cheltenhamlion]

I think you are right about the League Cup, Bren. Had all that money resulted in silverware we might be a little less harsh in our condemnation.

Its still bloody difficult to get past the timing of his departure mind.