0% Villa: Benitez sacked (Confirmed p.6)

[Rip Van We Go Again]

Chris Smith today issued a statement to say that he does not want to be considered for the role of Lord Emperor of Mars.

I guess you getting that job would mean you wouldn't be able to frequent the site.

Feel free to call me for a reference.

[Concrete John]

I think we did as 'well' as we did in spite of MON not because of him.

So, Gabby aside, it's players he's signed, where he picks the side and tactics and where it's his coaches.  How can anything, good or bad, NOT be down to MON?

As I said, that's the bit where we fundementally disagree.

[Quiet Lion]

klinsmann, rijkaerd, hodgson,bilic, van gaal,pellegrini, van basten, magath,moyes and dalglish would all do a better job than o neill!

I thought you were serious for a minute

[MoetVillan]

He has to be serious, surely they are all managers that have been able to break the top four in the premier league and keep the team there season in, season out

[Greg N'Ash]

Chris Smith today issued a statement to say that he does not want to be considered for the role of Lord Emperor of Mars.

I guess you getting that job would mean you wouldn't be able to frequent the site.

Feel free to call me for a reference.

aye me 'n all. i've often said chris is on another planet to the rest of us.

[peter w]

I think we did as 'well' as we did in spite of MON not because of him.

So, Gabby aside, it's players he's signed, where he picks the side and tactics and where it's his coaches.  How can anything, good or bad, NOT be down to MON?

As I said, that's the bit where we fundementally disagree.

because ultimately its down to the ability of the players. MON has constrained them with poor tactical decisions but their own ability as got him off the hook at times.

[Concrete John]

I think we did as 'well' as we did in spite of MON not because of him.

So, Gabby aside, it's players he's signed, where he picks the side and tactics and where it's his coaches.  How can anything, good or bad, NOT be down to MON?

As I said, that's the bit where we fundementally disagree.

because ultimately its down to the ability of the players. MON has constrained them with poor tactical decisions but their own ability as got him off the hook at times.

Yet you give no credit to him for recruiting these players, who can get 6th despite a poor manager due to their ability, which is what you are saying?

[MoetVillan]

Sorry Peter, i cant agree with that, the stats dont either

[peter w]

I think we did as 'well' as we did in spite of MON not because of him.

So, Gabby aside, it's players he's signed, where he picks the side and tactics and where it's his coaches.  How can anything, good or bad, NOT be down to MON?

As I said, that's the bit where we fundementally disagree.

because ultimately its down to the ability of the players. MON has constrained them with poor tactical decisions but their own ability as got him off the hook at times.

Yet you give no credit to him for recruiting these players, who can get 6th despite a poor manager due to their ability, which is what you are saying?

I have never criticised him for any transfer dealings and credit is due where he has had successes. he has taken us from being a mediocre side with no direction, and with Randy, has turned us into top 6 contenders. That is very commendable.

He also has turned us into one of the better teams defensively.

What I am saying is that his abilities as a manager are now matched with the position we are in. I am not, nor have i ever sdaid, that he's shit or lacks any ability whatsoever. I am stating that he cannot go beyond this point and isn't good enough as a manager to ruen this team into a team that regularly wins.

is it only 2 seasons ago we were talking about us as a secret? that we knew there was a fresh, pacy, attractive to watch Aston villa just bubbling under waiting to be unleashed and hit teams and with the right additions we would surely be looking to hit the top 4?

Take away Tottenham, man city, etc does that team bare any resemblance to what we saw from about january onwards in 08-09 never mind last season?

No, we need a manager that isn't slowly start to get it wrong in terms of selection and team set-up. We need a manager who won't tinker too much with positions, we need a manager that knows who our best player as and build the team around him. We need a change.

[peter w]

Sorry Peter, i cant agree with that, the stats dont either

The stats can read whatever you want them to.

[Chris Smith]

Chris Smith today issued a statement to say that he does not want to be considered for the role of Lord Emperor of Mars.

I guess you getting that job would mean you wouldn't be able to frequent the site.

Feel free to call me for a reference.

aye me 'n all. i've often said chris is on another planet to the rest of us.

So Mr Smith, can you supply references?

Erm, well there's an Internet fantasist called Greg who keeps a scrapbook and never leaves his bedroom and there's Sarah Falkland's stalker.

[not3bad]

Chris Smith today issued a statement to say that he does not want to be considered for the role of Lord Emperor of Mars.

I guess you getting that job would mean you wouldn't be able to frequent the site.

Feel free to call me for a reference.

aye me 'n all. i've often said chris is on another planet to the rest of us.

So much for the coalition!

[Concrete John]

I have never criticised him for any transfer dealings and credit is due where he has had successes. he has taken us from being a mediocre side with no direction, and with Randy, has turned us into top 6 contenders. That is very commendable.

He also has turned us into one of the better teams defensively.

What I am saying is that his abilities as a manager are now matched with the position we are in. I am not, nor have i ever sdaid, that he's shit or lacks any ability whatsoever. I am stating that he cannot go beyond this point and isn't good enough as a manager to ruen this team into a team that regularly wins.

is it only 2 seasons ago we were talking about us as a secret? that we knew there was a fresh, pacy, attractive to watch Aston villa just bubbling under waiting to be unleashed and hit teams and with the right additions we would surely be looking to hit the top 4?

Take away Tottenham, man city, etc does that team bare any resemblance to what we saw from about january onwards in 08-09 never mind last season?

No, we need a manager that isn't slowly start to get it wrong in terms of selection and team set-up. We need a manager who won't tinker too much with positions, we need a manager that knows who our best player as and build the team around him. We need a change.

How can you say his abilities as a manager are matched with the position we are in, yet state that he was more hinderance than help in getting into that position?

Without stats to hand, I would say we ARE a team that regularly wins.  We all know there were too many home draws to get into 4th, but add up the home games we did win and the numerous away victories and I'd say we do win regularly, just not quite regularly enough.

We were fresh and pacy.  However teams have sussed us out to an extent and we need to add other dimensions to our game beyond an over reliance of pace and wing play.  It's an area he does need to address.  As for exciting, it's always subjective when we talk about entertainment value, but I feel we are no worse to watch now than two years ago.  Just that we're less effective at times and with a better defence get confused for boring.

And I still think that with the right additions we'll get into 4th.  Some would call that stagnation, which they may have a point about, but we do seem to be getting closer, so things are surely moving in the right direction.

'take away Totenham and Man City'?  Not sure what your point is here, but if we did we would be 4th!!  

As for the last paragraph we could debate those points all day.  Lets just say I don't see a manager getting it slowly wrong, but I do see a manager that has so far failed to address some key issues, or at least failed to address them successfully.  That doesn't mean he won't or can't or that someone else would.  And even if they did, would they do so to the detriment of the things we have in place that are working for us so well?

[eastie]

I'd substitute your fresh and pacy for predictable and boring!

[peter w]

 
  How can you say his abilities as a manager are matched with the position we are in, yet state that he was more hinderance than help in getting into that position?

Without stats to hand, I would say we ARE a team that regularly wins.  We all know there were too many home draws to get into 4th, but add up the home games we did win and the numerous away victories and I'd say we do win regularly, just not quite regularly enough.

We were fresh and pacy.  However teams have sussed us out to an extent and we need to add other dimensions to our game beyond an over reliance of pace and wing play.  It's an area he does need to address.  As for exciting, it's always subjective when we talk about entertainment value, but I feel we are no worse to watch now than two years ago.  Just that we're less effective at times and with a better defence get confused for boring.

And I still think that with the right additions we'll get into 4th.  Some would call that stagnation, which they may have a point about, but we do seem to be getting closer, so things are surely moving in the right direction.

'take away Totenham and Man City'?  Not sure what your point is here, but if we did we would be 4th!!  

As for the last paragraph we could debate those points all day.  Lets just say I don't see a manager getting it slowly wrong, but I do see a manager that has so far failed to address some key issues, or at least failed to address them successfully.  That doesn't mean he won't or can't or that someone else would.  And even if they did, would they do so to the detriment of the things we have in place that are working for us so well?

MON got us to 6th place which was admirable when taking his starting point into consideration. However, he has failed to get the best out of a team that was good enough to get more points last season. My point was that we finished 6th last season in spite of the manager, not because of him.

As for your second paragraph I think its a matter of defining winning regularly. I'm talking about league wins here and for me winning half of our league games is an absolute must with the quality we have available. But we struggle to do that and that just isn't good enough in a team that at one point in 08-09 had 6 or 7 players in the England squad. now the team isn't responding. Not in the way it should be after another seasons experience. Something isn't working in the way it should be for a top team.

as for being sussed out - well yes and no. teams double up on Ash and know we are pacy so defend deeper without doubt. yet, teams know Tottenham also, and man City, Everton, etc but over a season the better teams overcome these issues and wwin more games than not. Yes, you get the odd result or two that go against you, but in the main class shows. We have not had much of an idea at home how to overcome sides sitting in against us at home all season. And as for some games like Wolves, Sunderland, West Ham, Wigan, apart from some spells the away side have looked like they could play us on an even playing field. That's not just 'the odd team' that's having a lack of beleif, and an idea in what we're doing, and the lack of balance to win games, and the lack of identifying our match winner and attempting to supply him as much as possible. instead we played to teh same system week in week out. It only works so far.

My point about taking away Tottenham and Man City, is that they were not a consideration in 08-09 but were last season so added more of a challenge than the season previous to last. But, it still should not have provided us with teh challenge it did.

We do not look like scoring goals yet keep hearing about this fast, counter-attacking team with loads of bright young English talent, who are very dangerous from set-pieces. We are becoming moribund and something needs to be done to shake it up. I hope its the manager going because I think that's what it will take.