Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Dave P on February 25, 2025, 09:32:43 PM
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Minging team selection. Minging performance.
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There's no hiding place!
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We probably need to can any thoughts of playing a back 3/5 again. It's monumentally shit every time we try it. I'm not sure why we went down that route.
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I’ll be happy when this league season is over.
I might amend that in the next few weeks depending on outcome of Friday and CL - but really - it’s been turgid flecked with moments of goodness.
But tonight was the equivalent of finding a dog crimping one out on your lawn when you’d just treated it.
Wank.
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Disappointing.
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Fucking appalling after such a good start. The introduction of a player who's been way of it all season was baffling when you have so much on the bench but the collapse in the last half an hour is on everyone.
Dreadful.
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Not the best.
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Dog shit. Emery got it wrong. Players pathetic. Dreading Friday now. Thanks Villa.
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Typical performance at the drummers dump. Konsa and Bailey can go this summer. We need a new defence. I think we'll see a rebuild this summer, really needed defensively but also some of the others are going to want to leave for European football.
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Really poor and disappointing performance for so many reasons. Every time we think we have turned a corner, we somehow seems to implode. The stats aren't great this season. Really strange set up, subs and selection tonight played into Palace's hands and they have schooled us. Terrible defensively.
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Dog shit. Emery got it wrong. Players pathetic. Dreading Friday now. Thanks Villa.
This
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How many home games have Palace won all season? No worries, the Villa are in town.
Poor selection coupled with piss-poor application. That was embarrassing.
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We need CD on the coaching staff to make sure Emery doesn't go 3 at the back again. I reckon he'd be willing to do time to stop it happening.
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Embarrassing performance
In my eyes a totally unacceptable defensive display
The way we collapse at times is utterly pathetic 3 fucking 1 against palace?
We dont deserve chanpions league based on league form. Just not good enough
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It wasn’t great in the first half once Palace realised how brittle we are and started to attack. But they second half was as bad as anything Gerrard served up, they completely gave up and it could easily have been 6 or 7.
It’s utterly bizarre after two goals and two assists between them Unai didn’t think it might be worth starting with at least one of Rashford or Asensio. Unai wants us to play this controlled style but we cannot do it, we implode and concede stupid goals every game. The only time we look good is when we play on the front foot, it is bewildering that he keeps trying what evidently doesn’t work.
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Underwhelming
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Now I have another unlucky pub!
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Ok, to many matches in passed few weeks has caught up with us with the injuries has obviously affected the quality of the starting 11.
But, Emery fucked that up tonight, 3 at the back and poor team selection and subs. He fucks up, he really fucks up.
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Oh Jesus just seen we’re playing on Friday. Make it stop.
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You know it, I know it, even Mrs Baldy knows it, our defence is the problem.
So why do we persist in playing out from the back every fucking game and heaping even more pressure on our defence.
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Utterly fucking dreadful
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Forget a set piece coach. We need a defensive coach and bring back cutler to be the goalkeeper coach.
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When the manager gets it wrong, he really gets it wrong. Terrible team selection and if you are trying 3 at he back, forget about all the tippy tappy shit. Kamara can't come back soon enough, having Torres and Barkley back will be good too. Anyway, Friday very important now.
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Too many times we collapse and get battered.
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Embarrassing performance
In my eyes a totally unacceptable defensive display
The way we collapse at times is utterly pathetic 3 fucking 1 against palace?
We dont deserve chanpions league based on league form. Just not good enough
4-1
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Frankly disgraceful. Terrible set up, terrible subs, not change to formation. Poor midfield. One of those that Emery really needs to look at. Of course we are so much better than we used to be but this looked like an older version of Villa not the new one. Not sure where we go from here. CL from league position is gone as others around us doing much better. UTV
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Unai is usually good when we're in London, but I think he experimented today to try and find a new wrinkle for our defense, and it went poorly.
No protection in front of our backs with Kamara and Onana out, and tired heavy legs in McGinn and Tielemans in their place. It's a shame that we're wearing down like this, but we've still got two big competitions to finish out. The league is now priority number three.
Ezri Konsa might be our next outgoing transfer is he doesn't up his game and attitude - really disappointed in him. I don't like putting individual players in the crosshairs, but I can't hold it in anymore. Totally unacceptable season on his behalf - don't care about the pain barrier stuff.
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Ghastly to behold.
You hate to see it.
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I’ve been watching and waiting all season for us to let loose and start playing in the league, but time to finally accept it’s just not happening and concentrate on the cups.
We look like a mid table team, we play like a mid table team and we’ll finish in mid table.
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A horrible one, had no luck and had our arse handed to us on a plate big style. Our defense has been a liability for ages, and here we are 3/4 through the season with a worse goal difference Everton. That's 9 for Olsen in 2 appearances at that place..
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I’m dreading the visit of Southampton.
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Compare defences.
Palace had a set of players who relished defending. Attacking every ball.
Trying to be first to everything. Being aggressive and dominant.
Our lot are so timid in comparison. I know we have injuries but they approach each game the same regardless of who is playing.
Jockeying rather than attacking, jogging rather than running and overplaying to the max.
Palaces first goal was a prime example. The ball goes out wide. Palace players race to be first to it, our defenders jog out behind them, allowing Palace to collect the free ball, with us making no attempt to be first to the the ball.
The one thing they are all incredibly good at though, with Konsa being king, is fucking pointing.
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Minging team selection. Minging performance.
Team selection could have worked better in a formation most of the players knew. But to try them in a once in a blue-moon formation which inevitably lets in goals the few times it has been tried was an awful decision. To then compound that with the subs into the same formation at half time was just asking for disaster. What was wrong with Bogarde in CDM with Konsa left centre and Disasi right, or even the same forward line that ended the last game?
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From the manager to our subs, not a single wage earned today. Emery needs a week between games, otherwise it all seems panicked.
3 at the back. Rogers being flogged to death. Bailey coming on as a wingback. All had a touch of desperation to it.
Another pathetic showing away from home. Another terrible defensive performance. Not too good going forward either.
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Embarrassing performance
In my eyes a totally unacceptable defensive display
The way we collapse at times is utterly pathetic 3 fucking 1 against palace?
We dont deserve chanpions league based on league form. Just not good enough
4-1
I wanted to make myself feel better 😔
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I'll be surprised if Konsa is in Tuchel's first squad. he's been out of sorts for a while now.
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Konsa and Bailey are massive weak links in the side. Application and performance.
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We got well and truly squeezed out of that.
Its a bit like:
The Indians send signals from the rocks above the pass
The cowboys take position in the bushes and the grass
The squaw is with the corporal, she is tied against the tree
She doesn't mind the language, it's the beating she don't need
She lets loose all the horses when the corporal is asleep
And he wakes to find the fire's dead and arrows in his hats
And Davy Crockett rides around and says it's cool for cats
It's cool for cats (cool for cats)
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I'd love an insight into Unai's logic tonight.
He had a very adequate back 4 at his disposal, Garcia, Konsa, Desasi, Digne, and could have then used Bogarde as a defensive midfielder and still had McGinn and Tielemans in midfield.
Odd not to start at least one of the loanees up front after Saturday too.
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Usually fairly level headed after a loss but that one hurt. I genuinely cannot see us qualifying for any form of European football next season and with that, many of our starting xi will be off.
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Yes but ... OK we were poor but looked good at the beginning. Watkins' 'equaliser' was not offside (can't understand how they worked that one out), For the VAR check on their goal they didn't even seem to check the pass to Wharton before the cross. Clutching at straws maybe but a big difference if those decisions had gone for us.
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3 at the back worked great until a Palace attack.
You are at an immediate disadvantage if you change your system to match the opposition who are used to playing that system. It just compounds the problem of continually having to change the defence.
At least we know that CL qualification is over and can concentrate on the cups.
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Bailey as RWB. Sometimes these managers try to be too clever.
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From the manager to our subs, not a single wage earned today. Emery needs a week between games, otherwise it all seems panicked.
3 at the back. Rogers being flogged to death. Bailey coming on as a wingback. All had a touch of desperation to it.
Another pathetic showing away from home. Another terrible defensive performance. Not too good going forward either.
That’s the thing our away form is crushingly repetitive, albeit this was the nadir (I hope!). It’s the same stuff all the time.
Also the goal we got was from being more direct - any sense we should adapt and go more direct in this game as a result? Not stick to the plan, ignore the warnings of McGinn nearly losing it in front of goal, persist, then he does give it away which leads to the second and it collapses.
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I'm not one to criticise Watkins either but the difference in the finish of Matteta's chance and Oli's was a bit embarrassing.
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You know it, I know it, even Mrs Baldy knows it, our defence is the problem.
So why do we persist in playing out from the back every fucking game and heaping even more pressure on our defence.
Glasner has Emery’s number for sure. Let us have the ball and wait for us to make a mistake. We sap energy from the game messing about at the back and then get caught time and time again.
The defenders are just not good enough to play it consistently especially away from home.
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I'm not one to criticise Watkins either but the difference in the finish of Matteta's chance and Oli's was a bit embarrassing.
They’re quite different to be fair, but Ollie should have done better.
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Not really - half a sniff of goal and Oli tamely screws it wide, Matteta almost rips the net.
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The one thing they are all incredibly good at though, with Konsa being king, is fucking pointing.
The ghost of 2015
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I'll be surprised if Konsa is in Tuchel's first squad. he's been out of sorts for a while now.
Tuchel must be even more pissed off than the Villa fans. What a waste of a night, all his English lads were shit.
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Our GD is tells the story.
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Well the Villa ones.
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Awful, awful beyond belief. Players will take a lot of criticism but Emery had a nightmare tonight. I presumed seeing the line up that Bogarde was going into midfield. A horrid five at the back that sold out McGinn and Tielemans. Bailey then brought on but at wing back! Asensio and Rashford on for two of our best players on the night! Rogers up top and Malen left on bench. We were a complete rabble and that's solely on Emery.
Martinez 5 - one great save but poor for first, Olsen 5 never looks like saving anything
Garcia 4 - lost in a stupid role, Bailey 4 was decent going forward but lost in no man's land defensively
Disasi 4 - rotten, bullied by Mateta throughout and absolutely is not a RB/RWB
Konsa 1 - d*ckhead, soft as shit as per usual in any contest, rotten attitude needed addressing early on this season. Too late out
Bogarde 2 - horrible night, let down by his manager
Digne 4 - not a LWB, Maatsen came on too late
Tielemans 5 - we got overran in midfield, nice touches
McGinn 4 - tried very hard but didn't have a chance
Rogers 5 - brilliant goal but again lost in position he was picked in
Ramsey 7 - very good and a crazy decision to take him off, that pen shout is given as a foul everywhere else on pitch
Watkins 7 - ridiculous decision to take him off, did great for our goal and the offside one.
Asensio and Rashford hardly had a kick of note between them.
Emery 0
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Really poor - thought we were the better side first half and unlucky not to be level. 3 at the back didnt work - and we never look as comfortable with Olsen in goal.
All on Unai for me. The formation was wrong - the wing backs made no impact - and after there first goal the back 3 lost and sense of control. Every sub made us worse.
Only mitgations i would say is some marginal decisions just didnt go our way, and mcginn and youri having to be our midfield constiently - with Barkley, Onana and Kamara all out.
Lack leadership in games like that without Mings and Emi. Could really do with a few more in the squad with those skills.
Every good result is followed up with an awful one - if we're not careful we could end up with a mid table finish and nothing else to show. This squad is better than that.
Im sure well go again next season, and as long as Unai is here well get our act together, but think we're likely to lose Emi and maybe Ollie as a result of mid-table finish combined with our shite FFP position. Worried this could be another sliding doors moment where we just didnt kick on when we should have. In the top 5 this season, there will be at least two poor teams / teams that have been poor this season. We needed to make sure we were one of them.
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Bailey as RWB. Sometimes these managers try to be too clever.
I said that to my partner when I saw the set up 10 minutes in. When your defence is already up shit creek, you don't then reintroduce a failed set up.
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Our GD is -45!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table)
Look again - it doesn't say that at all!!
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Compare defences.
Palace had a set of players who relished defending. Attacking every ball.
Trying to be first to everything. Being aggressive and dominant.
Our lot are so timid in comparison. I know we have injuries but they approach each game the same regardless of who is playing.
Jockeying rather than attacking, jogging rather than running and overplaying to the max.
Palaces first goal was a prime example. The ball goes out wide. Palace players race to be first to it, our defenders jog out behind them, allowing Palace to collect the free ball, with us making no attempt to be first to the the ball.
The one thing they are all incredibly good at though, with Konsa being king, is fucking pointing.
Spot on. We need more players that enjoy defending. I fear Emery will think the answer is Pau Torres but that will just compound the problem in my opinion.
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I'll be surprised if Konsa is in Tuchel's first squad. he's been out of sorts for a while now.
Tuchel must be even more pissed off than the Villa fans. What a waste of a night, all his English lads were shit.
Couldn't give a monkies what Tuchel thinks tbh.
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Our GD is -45!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/table)
Look again - it doesn't say that at all!!
I've edited the post.
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That was like watching steven gerrards villa tonight
Fucking awful
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Awful, awful beyond belief. Players will take a lot of criticism but Emery had a nightmare tonight. I presumed seeing the line up that Bogarde was going into midfield. A horrid five at the back that sold out McGinn and Tielemans. Bailey then brought on but at wing back! Asensio and Rashford on for two of our best players on the night! Rogers up top and Malen left on bench. We were a complete rabble and that's solely on Emery.
Martinez 5 - one great save but poor for first, Olsen 5 never looks like saving anything
Garcia 4 - lost in a stupid role, Bailey 4 was decent going forward but lost in no man's land defensively
Disasi 4 - rotten, bullied by Mateta throughout and absolutely is not a RB/RWB
Konsa 1 - d*ckhead, soft as shit as per usual in any contest, rotten attitude needed addressing early on this season. Too late out
Bogarde 2 - horrible night, let down by his manager
Digne 4 - not a LWB, Maatsen came on too late
Tielemans 5 - we got overran in midfield, nice touches
McGinn 4 - tried very hard but didn't have a chance
Rogers 5 - brilliant goal but again lost in position he was picked in
Ramsey 7 - very good and a crazy decision to take him off, that pen shout is given as a foul everywhere else on pitch
Watkins 7 - ridiculous decision to take him off, did great for our goal and the offside one.
Asensio and Rashford hardly had a kick of note between them.
Emery 0
Think you’re being overly positive here
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Emery got the team wrong. We should of gone to selhurts with the loan lads starting and set out our stall to attack from the off. We need goals to pump up the GD. wrong midset done us.
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Some v sensible comments but I think Monchi takes his share of blame.
It was obvious last summer that at the v least we needed a decent centre half, replacement for Douglas Luiz who was integral to our play and a decent back up keeper. Instead we ended up with Maatsen, Onana and all sorts of make weights.
We were set up to fail.
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It may possibly have been a different outcome had the goal stood but we wasn't really good enough in all honesty. One to bounce back from and we will.
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Ramsey is so overrated . Konsa has been shit for ages and McGinn is on a downward trend. Watkins needs 6 sitters to score one goal. So much talent left on the bench.I could go on but I’ll leave it at that.
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I'll be surprised if Konsa is in Tuchel's first squad. he's been out of sorts for a while now.
Tuchel must be even more pissed off than the Villa fans. What a waste of a night, all his English lads were shit.
Couldn't give a monkies what Tuchel thinks tbh.
That makes me feel better. I think.
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You know it, I know it, even Mrs Baldy knows it, our defence is the problem.
So why do we persist in playing out from the back every fucking game and heaping even more pressure on our defence.
Glasner has Emery’s number for sure. Let us have the ball and wait for us to make a mistake. We sap energy from the game messing about at the back and then get caught time and time again.
The defenders are just not good enough to play it consistently especially away from home.
Even Pep admitted that it doesn't work any more, teams have learned to play against it and counter it. Real played a couple of long balls against City and scored, and did them easily on the transition. We need to up our tempo and get the ball into midfield sooner. How many times have we faffed around at the back and conceded stupid goals.
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Embarrassing performance
In my eyes a totally unacceptable defensive display
The way we collapse at times is utterly pathetic 3 fucking 1 against palace?
We dont deserve chanpions league based on league form. Just not good enough
4-1
I was hoping nobody would tell him.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
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Odd to think we could match their formation and be better at it, given we were playing away and literally had no free time to practice it.
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Ramsey is so overrated . Konsa has been shit for ages and McGinn is on a downward trend. Watkins needs 6 sitters to score one goal. So much talent left on the bench.I could go on but I’ll leave it at that.
I was quite annoyed he played himself offside for the goal. He should not have been offside there.
I like ramsey but man he is frustrating at times
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Have we ever won or even put in a good performance with 3 at the back?
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It may possibly have been a different outcome had the goal stood but we wasn't really good enough in all honesty. One to bounce back from and we will.
Possibly yeah, but on the basis that we did equalise and then proceeded to put in a performance that was Man Utd bad I suspect it wouldn’t have been. It was all wrong tonight, exceptionally so, but our continued concession of so many poor goals even when we play better is what is absolutely killing us.
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A horrible one, had no luck and had our arse handed to us on a plate big style. Our defense has been a liability for ages, and here we are 3/4 through the season with a worse goal difference Everton. That's 9 for Olsen in 2 appearances at that place..
8 in 2. Which is his average, 4.
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1 win in 6
4 points against Liverpool + Chelsea
1 point against Palace and Ipswich
Did ok on the hard part, fucked the easy part. Needed 9 points from that run and should have got it
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I'm not even sure where to start with the assessment of this one .
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I'm not even sure where to start with the assessment of this one .
Try the toilet, that's where we all are.
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A horrible one, had no luck and had our arse handed to us on a plate big style. Our defense has been a liability for ages, and here we are 3/4 through the season with a worse goal difference Everton. That's 9 for Olsen in 2 appearances at that place..
8 in 2. Which is his average, 4.
My bad..lol
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Played Palace 3 times this season and failed to beat them, proper bogey side.
Emery clearly been on the Rioja, abysmal starting XI, awful tactics and mind bogglingly bad substitutions. Hopefully he sobers up in time for Friday, just win the fucking FA Cup Villa and nights like these will be long forgotten.
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Palace looked bigger, quicker and more aggressive than us in all the 1-1 duels, when they pressed they did it in a very organised way and we constantly gave the ball up.
We seem to be playing a completely different way to last year, no offside trap, no control of the game.
For all the attacking talent at our disposal, did their keeper make a save before that one at the end from Youri at 4-1?
All were well below par but Rashford's lack of effort for the 3rd and Baileys for the 4th, u10 style -getting the wrong side of the ball and then getting shoved off it - were the lowlights.
Pitiful at Palace. Again.
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One word for that.
Disgusting.
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Emery looked like he was in a huff before the game even started. He’s so often great but tonight he fecked it up, big style.
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Rashford must be starting to think, 'why am I not starting games'.
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Todays game shows how desperately we miss kamara. Im almost certain if we had him in there we would not have lost in this fashion
Its just a absolute shambles when we do not have kamara in the team. He is the one im worried about leaving the most if we dont get CL a scan see biv offers coming in for him in the summer
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The annoying thing which makes a lot of this season really unenjoyable is that you know we are going to concede multiple goals every game with a good chance of one of them being unenforced. League performances this season have by and large been poor. If we don't win a cup the season is a total failure finishing midtable with the wages we are paying the playing staff.
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This was the absolute pits, but in characteristics it’s not dissimilar to Chelsea away, Spurs away, Newcastle away.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Is Martinez overrated? Our goals against column is starting to suggest he might be.
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No that shot from Youri was our second and final shot on target
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I wrote this on the match thread and it's still my sentiment now.
The last time, according to the commentator, we played three at the back was the 4-0 gubbing to Tottenham. Definitely worth a revisit tonight then, Unai. Who changes their shape for Crystal fucking Palace?!
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Palace looked bigger, quicker and more aggressive than us in all the 1-1 duels, when they pressed they did it in a very organised way and we constantly gave the ball up.
We seem to be playing a completely different way to last year, no offside trap, no control of the game.
For all the attacking talent at our disposal, did their keeper make a save before that one at the end from Youri at 4-1?
All were well below par but Rashford's lack of effort for the 3rd and Baileys for the 4th, u10 style -getting the wrong side of the ball and then getting shoved off it - were the lowlights.
Pitiful. Again.
Konsa certainly couldn’t handle Mateta’s physicality. I didn’t understand why we didn’t have Desasi in the middle but you’re right, we looked lightweight and got bullied defensively, not for the first time.
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We've conceded 4, 2, 2, 0, 3, 2, 3, 2 ,4 and 1 in our last 10 away games. 22 goals conceded in 10 games.
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We've conceded 4, 2, 2, 0, 3, 2, 3, 2 ,4 and 1 in our last 10 away games. 22 goals conceded in 10 games.
Thats undefendable in my opinion
Embarrassing defensive record
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Is Martinez overrated? Our goals against column is starting to suggest he might be.
Overrated? difficult one, still up there but, he's 32 now, for him, its possible he's slowing down and not the keeper he has been and we will see more of this kind of thing, we should have a plan in place.
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Sounds daft after losing 1-4, but although not creating much, we were the better side until they scored and I thought we probably deserved to get level, but thereafter it was dreadful. Our direct contributions to their goals along with the poor defending was abject.
If we can't expect Tielemans and McGinn to protect the defence, we need to be lining up with a better formation and also be playing to our strengths - in the opponent's half, not getting easily pressed into errors at the back.
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We've conceded 4, 2, 2, 0, 3, 2, 3, 2 ,4 and 1 in our last 10 away games. 22 goals conceded in 10 games.
23 but I get your point. Our away form is unacceptable and yet we hardly concede in the CL. Bizarre.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Is Martinez overrated? Our goals against column is starting to suggest he might be.
He isn't having a good season anyway. Such a soft parry for the first. But we were brutal for the two crosses into our box that preceeded it.
The mind boggles with the decision to start Bogarde in there against such strong forwards.
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You know it, I know it, even Mrs Baldy knows it, our defence is the problem.
So why do we persist in playing out from the back every fucking game and heaping even more pressure on our defence.
Glasner has Emery’s number for sure. Let us have the ball and wait for us to make a mistake. We sap energy from the game messing about at the back and then get caught time and time again.
The defenders are just not good enough to play it consistently especially away from home.
Even Pep admitted that it doesn't work any more, teams have learned to play against it and counter it. Real played a couple of long balls against City and scored, and did them easily on the transition. We need to up our tempo and get the ball into midfield sooner. How many times have we faffed around at the back and conceded stupid goals.
Case in point: Emi received a back pass, and trapped the ball, waiting for a player to close him down. They just held their ground, and the home fans starting booing as though he was delaying a goal kick.
Rigid systems come unstuck when enough teams work them out.
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Very poor performance. They closed us down and we went slowly backwards. Exactly what Palace wanted. When we shifted the ball quickly we got ourselves into decent positions. But then we reverted back to the slow going nowhere nonsense which at no time proved to be successful. Totally baffling.
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We've conceded 4, 2, 2, 0, 3, 2, 3, 2 ,4 and 1 in our last 10 away games. 22 goals conceded in 10 games.
23 but I get your point. Our away form is unacceptable and yet we hardly concede in the CL. Bizarre.
Im that enraged that I can't count. Now it's 23 conceded in 10 i'm even angrier.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Is Martinez overrated? Our goals against column is starting to suggest he might be.
Overrated? difficult one, still up there but, he's 32 now, for him, its possible he's slowing down and not the keeper he has been and we will see more of this kind of thing, we should have a plan in place.
“Having a plan” sounds about right. It’s unlikely we’ll get Europe so I can see him seeking a move. Just need to make sure we fleece the buyer, probably Chelsea, for a massive sum.
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We don't create enough chances and give up far too many. That's about the long and short really. And I'm really not sure what's changed and why, we've abandoned the offside trap, is that because we think other teams have worked it out and can get deeper runners behind it? Or just a change of philosophy?
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We don't create enough chances and give up far too many. That's about the long and short really. And I'm really not sure what's changed and why, we've abandoned the offside trap, is that because we think other teams have worked it out and can get deeper runners behind it? Or just a change of philosophy?
He doesn't trust the players to keep it up? The trouble is some still try it very poorly so step up instead of tracking back / not stepping up because it isn't a main tactic so playing everyone onside and I believe it is a reason now we are also letting in more goals.
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We're absolutely running on fumes in the engine room and they hunted every tired stretch, every slight mis control from Mcginn and Tielemans down. Neither was able to get any momentum, got picked off and we really needed a fresh pair of legs in there, noting Barkley, Onana and Kamara have got the missing for 27 days plus t-shirts again, which is dreadfully unlucky but the injuries are a price of the success over the past 28 months or so
The season has been so stop start that I fear we're bumping along before the gas stops...I couldn't understand the 352, as the evidence, Spurs away, showed a miserable, tactically butchered performance last time...but i could understand the general reticence going there, and the mindset to keep the powder dry.
All retrospect, but I felt prior to kickoff, we should have bunged the midfield up with some fresh legs...possibly gone Bogarde, Tielemans and Ramsey centrally, and stuck the 3 who finished at Chelsea up top, Malen, Rashford and Bailey..The bench would have been swinging and we'd have had a more energetic Mcginn, Ollie and Rogers to switch plus Asensio.
The other thing I think is we're turning up on a personal level and struggling with the environment, and the game scenario...great away at Leipzig, home to Man City..all bright and compact...lethargic and half witted for the run of the mill games. Dreadful versus the South Cockneys now on three occasions, Tatters away, Ipswich twice, Brugge and a host of midplace teams getting points at villa park.Mentality, luck, injuries or we've been sussed...Not sure...
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If he could drill it into the players last year, why not a different set this year?
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Please don't let us get them in the quarters. Assuming...
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Ghastly to behold.
You hate to see it.
I know, but that's the post-match thread for you after a disappointing defeat.
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Olsen was fucking awful. He needs to anticipate the shots for the goals better.
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Olsen was fucking awful. He needs to anticipate the shots for the goals better.
Olsen is shit.
Why hasn't that been addressed?
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I think we’ve had about 12/13 different central defensive partnerships this season. It’s not the whole reason we can’t defend but it’s got to be one of them.
The constant injuries to Onana has weakened the midfield plans and now we’ve got McGinn and Tielemans having to play every few days without a rest.
We looked so tired tonight and no club with the depth and injuries we have can sustain a challenge on 3 fronts. The league has suffered as the bright lights of the CL have taken over and that’s understandable. We just had nothing left to give tonight.
What I do find strange is not playing Malen, very odd unless he starts on Friday. We don’t have too many options in central midfield or defence to change it for the next few weeks so we’ll just have to hope luck is on our side.
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We are supposed to have good attacking options now yet we hardly created anything.
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The defence and midfield is made up of whoever is fit. Some have played far too many games in a short period of time. Some aren't good enough for what they are being asked to do.
We are passive when defending, marking space whilst leaving attackers unmarked. Palace scored with their first attack, when we equalised, they scored with their next attack. We are wholly predictable, lose possession, the defenders turned & left standing in a line whilst the opposition take a shot.
You could question Emery's selection but defenders doing the basics of marking a player & putting them under pressure is nonexistent. Yet we keep playing the same way.
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Olsen was fucking awful. He needs to anticipate the shots for the goals better.
Olsen is shit.
Why hasn't that been addressed?
Olsen is and always has been a hologram. His positioning and footwork is some of the worst I've seen from a keeper, he's always caught flat footed or his weight going away. Another defensive mishap in planning by having him still haunting the bench as our back up. The ghost of 4-0's past. A Monchi signing, stupid enough to sign him twice.
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Olsen was fucking awful. He needs to anticipate the shots for the goals better.
I think you might look high and low to find a fan of Olsen but I didn't think he could do owt about any of the goals he conceded, the blame lay elsewhere.
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You could question Emery's selection but defenders doing the basics of marking a player & putting them under pressure is nonexistent. Yet we keep playing the same way.
So whose job is it to fix that?
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When we’re relying on Bailey to be our last line of defence, then you know something has gone severely awry.
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I've sat on it for an hour and I still don't really know what to say about that .
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My gut feeling is Emery is all in on us winning a trophy this season. I think we'd all settle for winning the FA cup. Champions league has clearly taken its toll which is inevitable. I think Cardiff will have watched that and and collectively winced because the backlash will be fierce. And somehow we're still only 2 points off top 5. Bizarre season.
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Still scratching my head about Malen getting no minutes , and Rashford not starting , he should have been on HT with MAlen and not Leon, and for (Garcia , odd ) and asensio earlier . People said we did ok first half should have been 3 0 to them before the dubious VAR .
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I thought we were moving away from this but typical Villa.
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Northing wrong with Emi hes the best keeper in the world and for my money the best keeper we have had - we're asking him to save shots from point blank range. And he does a lot just not everyone.
Same with Olsen.
Similar with Watkins
We cant blame players for being human. The reality is the faults in the execution in the game plan leave them exposed and thats much more nuanced.
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I do think it’s more tactical than individuals, fully acknowledging there are some shocking individual performances in there.
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Used to love it going for the juglar from the first minute Im getting tired of this tippy tappy shite at the back .
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Hello paul, welcome to H&V. Have you tried Grammarly?
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Bailey playing RB must be an Emery low point . Sheer madness .
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Hello paul, welcome to H&V. Have you tried Grammarly?
Ha ha ha, see, AI isn't all bad.
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Well If we need to sell anyone in summer for PSR . Konsa is the one , keep away from Kamara and JJ .
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I echo the olsen comments
Why is this fucking guy our number 2? How much more evidence does unai need for this guy mever to be played again?
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When we’re relying on Bailey to be our last line of defence, then you know something has gone severely awry.
Yup, he's no last ditch defender, I don't think he thinks he is. And he worked very hard to prove it to UE.
That last goal was pitiful, absolutely unforgiveable, I know he isn't a defender but he's played with enough defenders to know how shit his attempts at defending were for that goal.
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Martinez wasn't injured (didn't look it ) , what's gone off in the dressing room at HT
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Bullshit for us away fans too. All trains out of Marylebone cancelled. Just had to make a mad dash across to Euston to catch a train to Cov. Made it with literally seconds to spare.
Then I need to taxi back to leamington to pick up my car from work.
What a fucking shite away day. Fuming.
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Just back after walking home from Selhurst Park. Was sat in the directors box just a few feet behind Unai.
We looked so tired. Beaten to every 50:50. No rhythm, no energy. You can excuse that as fatigue. But, my god, we are fucking shit at defending. I thought they’d score every time they got the ball.
If we don’t prioritise a top centre half this summer then Monchi needs his head seeing to.
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It wasn’t great in the first half once Palace realised how brittle we are and started to attack. But they second half was as bad as anything Gerrard served up, they completely gave up and it could easily have been 6 or 7.
It’s utterly bizarre after two goals and two assists between them Unai didn’t think it might be worth starting with at least one of Rashford or Asensio. Unai wants us to play this controlled style but we cannot do it, we implode and concede stupid goals every game. The only time we look good is when we play on the front foot, it is bewildering that he keeps trying what evidently doesn’t work.
This is it for me. Well said!! I love Unai, but he is regularly putting lineups together that make no sense given the circumstances. I think of last year’s Spurs game at home. He needs to have a serious rethink.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Hello paul*, welcome to H&V. Have you tried Grammarly?
*Paul
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When we’re relying on Bailey to be our last line of defence, then you know something has gone severely awry.
Unfortunately Leon is now just pointless. How he gets any game time ahead of others is a mystery.
The Bailey routine:
Get the ball.
Shape-up to do something with it.
Run straight into the defender, fall over and lose the ball.
Remain on the ground for several seconds appealing for a foul.
Rinse & repeat.
I'm struggling to recall his last significant contribution.
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Having played out from the back with little effect we play the dreaded long ball and score, not emerys style but effective!
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Bailey did very well last time out against a better team than Palace, when he wasn't playing right back. Might be linked?
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A couple of goals and assists would be welcome.
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He said during last weeks press conference they are working every day on the defence. Good to see it’s finally coming to fruition.
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Used to love it going for the juglar from the first minute Im getting tired of this tippy tappy shite at the back .
Me too.
It invariably, more often than not ends up with the ball being turned over. I am not saying stop doing it, just mix it up a little and stop being so predictable.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Hello paul*, welcome to H&V. Have you tried Grammarly?
*Paul
Quite, but I deliberately went with the format he had chosen for his user name.
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Just finished watching that pile of shit. The blame rests entirety on Unai for a shocking starting formation, then no response during the game to tweak it. Bailey as wing back is comedy gold, as is Ollie's finishing. Still, we won't get relegated this season, so there is that to be grateful for.
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Not sure the selection or even the formation were the main problem - the tactic of passing out from the back and NEVER just clearing the ball when don’t have it under control has caused sooo many goals against. If I had one question for Unai that he had to answer honestly it would be whether the players are forbidden to do anything but pass it out.
VAR…desperate to disallow the ‘equaliser’
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Another poor defensive showing. The Rogers disallowed goal was hardly clear and obvious! Another virtual toenail decision. Emery didn't mention Martinez when interviewed and why he was replaced? The only bright spot was a terrific goal by Rogers.
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Another poor defensive showing. The Rogers disallowed goal was hardly clear and obvious!
Offsides don't need to be, just offside, which he was. A soon as the photo came up it was clear he was marginally offside. No complaints from me
I did think their first was offside when the ball first came in from Eze, they didnt seem to dwell on that in the replays
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Martinez wasn't injured (didn't look it ) , what's gone off in the dressing room at HT
You can stand down.
Unai Emery on Emi Martinez: "He was feeling yesterday a little bit of some pain. He trained and today he did the warm up and he was feeling good. He was feeling some pain and we had to take him off."
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Another poor defensive showing. The Rogers disallowed goal was hardly clear and obvious! Another virtual toenail decision. Emery didn't mention Martinez when interviewed and why he was replaced? The only bright spot was a terrific goal by Rogers.
Outstanding goal, some leap by Ollie on the first ball but brilliant strength and footwork from Rogers afterwards. His potential is limitless really. Great combo between them for the offside one too.
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Great the mighty Crystal Palace got their free villa gift as we dole out home wins or goals to out of form strikers. We ain’t getting back into the CL next year unless we win the fucker. Let’s hope next year will see us develop a fucking backbone
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Villa 3 Palace 13 the last four matches. This guy really knows how to school Unai.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
Hello paul*, welcome to H&V. Have you tried Grammarly?
*Paul
Quite, but I deliberately went with the format he had chosen for his user name.
I never win these!
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Another poor defensive showing. The Rogers disallowed goal was hardly clear and obvious!
Offsides don't need to be, just offside, which he was. A soon as the photo came up it was clear he was marginally offside. No complaints from me
I did think their first was offside when the ball first came in from Eze, they didnt seem to dwell on that in the replays
Yeah, clear and obvious doesn't mean anything with offsides.
One of our players is keeping him quite easily on for the first, just outside the box at the top of the screen.
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Oh and a nice seven goal swing for Chelsea tonight.
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Compare defences.
Palace had a set of players who relished defending. Attacking every ball.
Trying to be first to everything. Being aggressive and dominant.
I wasn’t able to watch the game, and I’m not arguing with your general point, but another difference is that Mitchell, Guehi, Munoz and Lacroix have all started 23+ league games out of a possible 27 this season. Richards has only started 13, presumably mostly since Chalobah was recalled by Chelsea.
For us Konsa and Digne have started 23 games out of a possible 28. Beyond that it’s Torres on 18, Cash on 16, Carlos on 8, Mings on 7, Maatsen and Bogarde on 4, and Garcia on 3. Kamara has obviously played in defence too.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
Cack is another.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
Win on Friday and it'll be honorificabilitudinitatibus.
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Some v sensible comments but I think Monchi takes his share of blame.
It was obvious last summer that at the v least we needed a decent centre half, replacement for Douglas Luiz who was integral to our play and a decent back up keeper. Instead we ended up with Maatsen, Onana and all sorts of make weights.
We were set up to fail.
According to accepted Villa wisdom, Emery tells him what profile of player he wants and he brings him a list.
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how come no one ever moans about martinez? he pushed ball into players path again when it was in both hands,then when he knows he's fucked up pretends he's injured or ill! 3rd worst save percentage in league! he needs to go with konsa
I hope he’s pretending. What did he go off with? I thought it might be a nervous breakdown playing behind that lot.
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Rashford must be starting to think, 'why am I not starting games'.
Or ‘am I back at Man Utd’?
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We've conceded 4, 2, 2, 0, 3, 2, 3, 2 ,4 and 1 in our last 10 away games. 22 goals conceded in 10 games.
23 but I get your point. Our away form is unacceptable and yet we hardly concede in the CL. Bizarre.
Interesting…
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I was fortunately out tonight at a gig so haven’t seen 1 minute of it. I may brave the highlights in the morning but after reading this I think I may give it a miss.
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Olsen was fucking awful. He needs to anticipate the shots for the goals better.
Olsen is shit.
Why hasn't that been addressed?
Olsen is and always has been a hologram. His positioning and footwork is some of the worst I've seen from a keeper, he's always caught flat footed or his weight going away. Another defensive mishap in planning by having him still haunting the bench as our back up. The ghost of 4-0's past. A Monchi signing, stupid enough to sign him twice.
Really? I know he’s supposed to have signed him for Roma but he didn’t sign him for us.
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Horrible team selection.
Horrible performance
Horrible result
Horrible venue.
Rinse and repeat each year at Selhurst.
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Even living in London that is a shit place to get to, and going there is synonymous with a pathetic performance.
Nobody played well tonight though Watkins, Ramsey and Rogers showed occasional glimpses, but far too little to give us any dominance.
A shit formation and set up, but we actually created a foothold in the game. Until their first shot….I haven’t watched any highlights since I got home but defensively we were awful and our midfield looked sluggish. They seemed to have a plan for McGinn with a rotation of 6-7 fouls on him, meaning he created little.
None of the subs made the remotest impact and Rogers at centre forward was weird.
A shit night for the manager, players and fans.
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Oh and at half time Palace tried to do a penalty competition with some young fans and their fluffy eagle mascot. Olsen was having none of it as he was warming up in the goal in front of us so their announcer got into a huff and dragged everybody off to the other end to do it.
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https://x.com/AVFCStatto/status/1894483601816728057 (https://x.com/AVFCStatto/status/1894483601816728057)
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The only shot on goal came from direct football, oppositions have worked us out now with this Martinez standing on the ball, passing it sideways, passing it back,passing it sideways again, JJ loses possession goal. It is so annoying, even in attack we go very Arsenal, never getting it into the box. That is why Rashford in his first outings was so refreshing, actually attacking the defence at pace. Emery had far better options than to bring on a player wh's worst attribute is tackling and then use him as a wing back. This result is down to Emery, we had far superior players at our disposal but he got it completely wrong.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
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"Villa have conceded from their opponent's first shot on target in 17 fixtures this season, as well as from the rebound in three games when the first attempt was saved."@AVFCStatto
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We must be top of the xG conceded table.
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I’m not quite sure what the problem is this season, but some thoughts…
Our attempts to bait the press with Martinez stopping on the ball rarely work anymore. Our goal and one of our best opportunities in the first half came from long balls from both our keepers straight up to Watkins.
I don’t want us to turn into a long ball team but I wonder if we might cause teams more problems if we mixed things up a bit more often.
The modern game seems to be made up of both teams wanting to play on the transition which maybe explains why we seem to give a better account of ourselves against the better teams who we get to break on than the lesser teams who break on us.
Our inability to play a settled defence who know one another and rest midfielders is obviously not helping matters. We put a lot of our transfer eggs into Onanas injury stricken basket and into Maatesen. Our lack of depth in key areas is a bit frustrating when so much was spent on players who wouldn’t make our best eleven and could have spread cover round a bit.
We’re really not going to win the Champions League I’m afraid. We have a lot riding on the FA Cup now I feel as I’m getting that worried feeling about losing some of our players that I haven’t had for a while.
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This was the absolute pits, but in characteristics it’s not dissimilar to Chelsea away, Spurs away, Newcastle away.
Add Wolves, Bruges, Monaco and Forest
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
well I thought it was a pathetic performance myself , cant believe he picked that team for a start and most who played , they was embarrassing . Glasner has Emery's number .
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
well I thought it was a pathetic performance myself , cant believe he picked that team for a start and most who played , they was embarrassing . Glasner has Emery's number .
So, within reason, a 'poor' or 'very poor' performance.
Not 'embarrassing'. Why shouldn't Crystal Palace beat us? It's a game and the opposition can win.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
well I thought it was a pathetic performance myself , cant believe he picked that team for a start and most who played , they was embarrassing . Glasner has Emery's number .
So, within reason, a 'poor' or 'very poor' performance.
Not 'embarrassing'. Why shouldn't Crystal Palace beat us? It's a game and the opposition can win.
Of course they can beat us but they battered us , we won 8 tackles compared to their 36 , could easily have been 8 2 to be fair to them . The starting line up and formation obviously didnt help and scrathing my head why malen got no minutes.
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I might be the odd one out out here but I think Unai got the starting line up right. He was clearly worried they would batter us so went like for like and we were relatively untroubled until they scored, and even then a dodgy VAR stopped us from seeing the plan through. As soon as he panicked and changed it to a four his fears were realised
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The bait/press needs Torres and Kamara to work properly. Without them there is often a lot of panic.
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I rushed back to watch the second half on TV, much to my other halfs disgust as it meant leaving a nice restaurant promptly. She reckons it was karma, I reckon it was poor team selection, with a makeshift defence with tired legs in front of it and a not brilliant goalkeeper behind it.
The first 15 minutes of the half a game I saw we looked pretty good going forwards, unlucky with the chalked off goal and a well crafted goal. Once their second went in we looked ragged and the subs did not make much of an impact.
Disappointing. Five hour drive to Belgium this morning to look at strawberry farms, going to be in a grumpy, coffee deficient mood for most of it.
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I rushed back to watch the second half on TV, much to my other halfs disgust as it meant leaving a nice restaurant promptly. She reckons it was karma, I reckon it was poor team selection, with a makeshift defence with tired legs in front of it and a not brilliant goalkeeper behind it.
The first 15 minutes of the half a game I saw we looked pretty good going forwards, unlucky with the chalked off goal and a well crafted goal. Once their second went in we looked ragged and the subs did not make much of an impact.
Disappointing. Five hour drive to Belgium this morning to look at strawberry farms, going to be in a grumpy, coffee deficient mood for most of it.
Never mind all that, how was the korma?
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Our away form in the league since beating Fulham in October..
W 1 D 1 L 7 Scored 6 Conceded 22.
That’s more than a blip. As well as being dreadful at the back, we’re not much of a threat going forward. And even taking into account Europe in that time, we have lost 9 of our last 12, conceding the first in most.
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Our away form in the league since beating Fulham in October..
W 1 D 1 L 7 Scored 6 Conceded 22.
That’s more than a blip. As well as being dreadful at the back, we’re not much of a threat going forward. And even taking into account Europe in that time, we have lost 9 of our last 12, conceding the first in most.
Yep it’s woeful and yet we continue to take the same approach to each game. Maybe change it? The time we went more direct we scored. It would be nice to mix it up.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
I disagree with you here mate
I thought it was a embarrassing performance. The way we defended for most of the game was amateur stuff. There is losing and losing like that. Lets not forget palace have been struggling to win at home. To lose 4-1 is embarrassing in my view
Our away form as a whole is a complete embarrassment this season
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Losing isn’t embarrassing - the second half performance was. We gave up and could easily have conceded 6 in that half.
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Losing isn’t embarrassing - the second half performance was. We gave up and could easily have conceded 6 in that half.
Losing in that fashion is though. No excuse for collapsing like that. We had enough quality to at least get a point not lose 4-1. Lets not forget we were piss poor vs wolves in our last away performance too
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Our primary tactic is to ‘out football’ the opposition, we are rarely more physical or clinical. This unbalanced set-up/tactics are magnified away from home.
We need at least two more players on the pitch that love a battle, typically one at CB and one in the double pivot position.
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Our primary tactic is to ‘out football’ the opposition, we are rarely more physical or clinical. This unbalanced set-up/tactics are magnified away from home.
We need at least two more players on the pitch that love a battle, typically one at CB and one in the double pivot position.
Quite right. Kamara is the only one we have and when he’s out we look crap against physical teams. If he’s not back for the Newcastle and Forest games we will struggle a lot.
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
Do you think that performance was in any way acceptable?
Embarrassing is just one of the numerous words I can think of to describe that absolute turd of an evening.
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OK. A cup double will just have to do then
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"Villa have conceded from their opponent's first shot on target in 17 fixtures this season, as well as from the rebound in three games when the first attempt was saved."@AVFCStatto
I think its become a tactic.
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"Villa have conceded from their opponent's first shot on target in 17 fixtures this season, as well as from the rebound in three games when the first attempt was saved."@AVFCStatto
That stat alone is embarrassing
Wow unbelievable
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Our primary tactic is to ‘out football’ the opposition, we are rarely more physical or clinical. This unbalanced set-up/tactics are magnified away from home.
We need at least two more players on the pitch that love a battle, typically one at CB and one in the double pivot position.
I agree with this. When we bought in three attacking players in January I said we were going for the Kevin Keegan approach and I was half joking but now it's not funny. Do we even have a defensive coach? Our -5 goal difference stat is defining our season in the league. It's bottom six.
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That result feels like a bit of a body blow - when we really needed to build on a good result at the weekend.
I think it just killed any momentum. We have had two periods this season in the league where we just can’t string results together.
The midfield and defence distruption is part of the problem - along with us not creating enough - it’s a bad reciepe but I think it’s more about the way we’re playing.
You can see how much it’s hurting unai - but we just don’t seem to be able to play well for more than 15 mins at a time
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"Villa have conceded from their opponent's first shot on target in 17 fixtures this season, @AVFCStatto
That stat alone is embarrassing
Wow unbelievable
That is both a shocking and damning stat.
It reflects a lack of preparation and organisation.
The stat that we have gained more points from losing positions is because we have had to.
It is probably too late for this season to change the approach but our ability to concede so easily will denie us any success in any competition.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
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Is it not a bit unlucky to concede from the opposition's first shot on target so many times?
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Yeah, the subs were a bit weird last night. I kind of got the starting line up. He wanted bodies and runners in the midfield against a team like that and we did catch them twice with the disallowed goals but the subs didn't help as much as they can do.
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Is it not a bit unlucky to concede from the opposition's first shot on target so many times?
Twice is unlucky. About 15 times is criminal.
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bet Malen is wondering what he has done wrong? He has looked good when he has played , where Baileys whole season has been meh.
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Well I’ve just watched the “highlights”. I assume the media team showed all of our chances which seemed to consist of two offside goals, the goal, hitting the bar and having one saved on the line whilst Palace scored 4.
On any other night that’s a 5-4 win so I really don’t see what you’re all moaning about.
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We were bad last night really awful.
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The available squad is imbalanced. Injuries to key players have messed us up. We don’t have an experienced CM available to play.
Ollie misses too much as the main striker for an aspiring top 5 team and it’s costing us.
Konsa is in very poor form, too soft and not a leader at the back. I think we looked better with Disassi and Mings.
I’m not defending the selection but I think Unai was trying to find solutions to the problems.
Friday’s performance as well as next week’s CL may tell us if he’s banking on winning a cup - otherwise it could be a sorry season.
I’m not bitter to losing to Palace. They are a good side, well coached, and brilliant on their day. We’re not entitled to an automatic win there
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Yeah, I wasn't keen on the subs last night. Didn't make much sense to me.
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We were bad last night really awful.
I've never seen you this angry, it must have been really bad.
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The disallowed Rogers goal in the first half was a really bad call in my opinion. Once again the clowns at Stockley Park decided to draw their stupid lines on the screen when it's impossible to tell which frame is the right one to use because every freeze frame just shows a blurry image of foot and ball so who knows for sure which one is correct? The frames are about 100th of a second. Go forward a frame and he's off, go back a frame and he's on. It's a joke. Why can't they just go with the attacker if it's too tight to call? Simple. They did exactly that for their third goal when the player who crossed the ball looked very close to offside but they took a millisecond to decide to give the goal without even trying to draw those stupid lines. Going in level at half time may or may not have made a difference but it all just seems so arbitrary. There's just no consistency with these VAR numptys.
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Last night was a horrible watch post half time but having slept on it, and considering the way this season has gone it wasn't totally unpredictable.
And hallmark of Emery's reign is that when we're bad, we're awful. Not helped by the bizarre Bailey introduction.
It was also at Selhurst, VAR continues to infuriate, our injuries continue, as does the ridiculous calendar of matches.
It all helps to make a bit of a mad season where it's magic one minute and terrible the next.
I'm philosophical but still wish I didn't have to sit through that.
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bet Malen is wondering what he has done wrong? He has looked good when he has played , where Baileys whole season has been meh.
Put Malen at RWB and he would have struggled too. That was just a ridiculous change from Emery.
We ended up with Bailey at RWB, Rogers up front, not really sure where Asensio was meant to be and Rashford and Maatsen on top of each other on left. It was a complete shambles of Emery's making.
Half time sub should have been Bailey for Bogarde. 4 at back, Rogers in middle next to Watkins. There was no need to take off Ramsey or Watkins last night.
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At the 38 minute mark they put up a picture of a man and his son. The man must have recently died. The whole stadium applauded for a minute. I’m assuming the chap was 38 years old. His son looked about the same age as my eldest, maybe 7 or 8. It brought a tear to my eye and certainly provides a sense of perspective.
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bet Malen is wondering what he has done wrong? He has looked good when he has played , where Baileys whole season has been meh.
Guessing he might have been carrying or knock or not feeling great as it was otherwise pretty inexplicable why he didn't come on last night.
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That was our fourth game in ten days, I think, so it's little wonder Unai decided to rotate and rest players. As others have said, it was a perfect storm of things working against us: scheduling, marginal VAR calls, injuries etc. It happens - dust ourselves down and move on quickly. UTV.
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Last night was a horrible watch post half time but having slept on it, and considering the way this season has gone it wasn't totally unpredictable.
It always ooked a tough fixture given the run of games it was sandwiched in between. Similar to the Wolves game, it was just not the kind of fixture I'd fancy our lot to be up for.
Oh well, roll on Friday night and next Tuesday!
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We tried something different to counter their fast paced, strong front line and it didn't work out unfortunately. Their first shot on target was after a third of the game, that shows that it was working until that point.
Our first offside was annoying because the timing of the run v pass was out. The second one was so marginal it was about stride pattern. We could easily have been 3-1 up after an hour, instead found ourselves 2-1 down and then we lost all control and went to shit, whilst they stuck to their plan.
Kamara, Barkley and Onana would have made a difference last night, and a settled back 4 would too. But it wasn't to be.
Given the two games previously, and the run of games we're having, making such a big change in shape with a lack of preparation time on the pitch felt like a huge gamble to me.
Wghen I saw the lineup, I expected our formation to be more like
Martinez
Garcia Konsa Disasi Digne
Bogarde McGinn
Rogers Tielemans Ramsey
Watkins
And I think it would have done better.
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I was in the Palace end and it was very odd. I had two whole rows of seats to myself, plus loads more empty around me. It was though nobody wanted to buy season tickets in that area. Maybe a 7:30 kick off put some people off getting back from work.
Interesting number of local Polish fans.
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Funny game, football. The first 20 minutes I thought we were solid, inventive and the idea was obviously to contain them and then bring on our new fresh legs (Malen, Rashford, Asensio) in the second half. Tactically that looked OK to me. Added to that, Tielemans misdirected header, Ramsey's marginally mstimed run for his goal, the ridiculous Watkins offside decision, things could have been very different (although admittedly Palace missed some chances too. Second half subs, especially Martinez, were crucial and unfortunately unworkable - Malen left on the bench, Rashford and Asensio late on, Bailey at wing back; and then of course Saar and Mateta in majestic form. I was seething last night, but for the Beeb to say Villa were 'swept aside' by Palace is an overstatement.
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We played with control in the first half and were probably unlucky to be behind. Losing Emi knocked us off our stride due to the reluctance to play the slow cat and mouse game we have when he’s there and just looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
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When I saw the lineup, I expected our formation to be more like
Martinez
Garcia Konsa Disasi Digne
Bogarde McGinn
Rogers Tielemans Ramsey
Watkins
And I think it would have done better.
I thought he was doing this -
Martinez
Garcia Konsa Disasi Digne
Bogarde Tielemans
McGinn Ramsey
Rogers
Watkins
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Traffic for miles around was shocking last night, we were late and walking/ running to the pub at about 6.15 when the team bus went past us. That seems a bit late for a 7.30 KO? Not ideal preparation.
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Our problem this year is just that we don’t score loads but do concede loads. I think the very slow playing out from the back is less effective at both ends than it used to be. This has been compounded by injuries and certain players starting to believe the hype. And last night’s formation and team selection.
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Playing 3 centre halves reduced how many players we could pass into, the main tactic was give it to McGinn and hope his big ass would get a free kick or get him out of traffic, Palace only had to nick it once or twice to make it a big problem for us.
We scored when Olsen played it into Watkins and he flicked on for Rogers, but I don't remember us trying it again.
It was odd that Garcia looked all at sea playing wing back, when he looked so good pushing Jones back last Wednesday as a regular right back.
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Given the two games previously, and the run of games we're having, making such a big change in shape with a lack of preparation time on the pitch felt like a huge gamble to me.
This is exactly what I thought. I expected Emery to be smarter than that
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We played with control in the first half and were probably unlucky to be behind. Losing Emi knocked us off our stride due to the reluctance to play the slow cat and mouse game we have when he’s there and just looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
I thought we did control it but created nothing and by the time we scored the VAR taken off goal , we should have been 3 down, I thought we was lucky to get to 1 1 at that time.
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We were playing one of the teams, who when they on song, going forward they are few teams in the league better, having said that it was still another woeful away display, in contrast to VP in the league, still unbeaten since the first match of the season.
If we win on Friday, hopefully the draw doesn't have us going to Selhurst Park again.
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Playing 3 centre halves reduced how many players we could pass into, the main tactic was give it to McGinn and hope his big ass would get a free kick or get him out of traffic, Palace only had to nick it once or twice to make it a big problem for us.
I thought the same , very predicitible , no width neither.
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Given the two games previously, and the run of games we're having, making such a big change in shape with a lack of preparation time on the pitch felt like a huge gamble to me.
This is exactly what I thought. I expected Emery to be smarter than that
Element of surprise I guess. Which is why we started more brightly and were the better side for the first half an hour at least. If we'd kept some discipline instead of conceding the first, and held the runs by a nanosecond for the offsides we'd all be celebrating a tactical masterclass and solid win.
Such are the margins.
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Out fought and out thought!
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I heard on the UTV podcast that tackles / challenges were recorded as 8 for us and 32 for Palace
Certainly out fought
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The only word I can come up with is embarrassing.
We lost to another team in our division, away from home. What's embarrassing?
There is valid criticism, but some of you lot are beginning to sound like the kind of wanker Sky 6 fans that we always complain about.
I think having sat through it it was pretty miserable viewing. Sometimes you win sometimes not but getting thumped 4-1 to Crystal Palace it’s not really that surprising that the post match thread is focused on how poor the performance is and some of the responses are emotional.
I wouldn’t have called it embarrassing, but I would call it demoralising. But wouldn’t have a problem with anybody saying they found it embarrassing.
If people can’t wallow a bit in a post match thread straight after a thumping on an internet forum, then where can they?
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We were playing one of the teams, who when they on song, going forward they are few teams in the league better, having said that it was still another woeful away display, in contrast to VP in the league, still unbeaten since the first match of the season.
If we win on Friday, hopefully the draw doesn't have us going to Selhurst Park again.
On the contrary, Palace at Selhurst is exactly what we want. The law of averages means we can’t continually be shit at that place.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Indeed. From what I've seen Malen is better as a centre forward than on the right. What I love about him is he makes things happen up front. That said I don't understand how Unai gave a CL place to Bailey rather than Malen. I can only put it down to the lack of games he's seen Malen play when he had to make the call.
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first team in the top 8 Palace have beaten this season.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Indeed. From what I've seen Malen is better as a centre forward than on the right. What I love about him is he makes things happen up front. That said I don't understand how Unai gave a CL place to Bailey rather than Malen. I can only put it down to the lack of games he's seen Malen play when he had to make the call.
Im not sure you allowed to swap Malen for Bailey in the rules but I agree in what you say. Why he didnt play Malen yesterday no idea m If he aint well , dont put it on bench ,
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What was wrong with Martinez, that caused him to be replaced at HT?
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What was wrong with Martinez, that caused him to be replaced at HT?
Wasn't 100% before the game, was fine in the warm-up, but felt pain in the first half. No specific details given by Unai.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Indeed. From what I've seen Malen is better as a centre forward than on the right. What I love about him is he makes things happen up front. That said I don't understand how Unai gave a CL place to Bailey rather than Malen. I can only put it down to the lack of games he's seen Malen play when he had to make the call.
Because he could only add 3 new players. And he picked Asensio, Rashford and Disasi. Which was the right call.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Indeed. From what I've seen Malen is better as a centre forward than on the right. What I love about him is he makes things happen up front. That said I don't understand how Unai gave a CL place to Bailey rather than Malen. I can only put it down to the lack of games he's seen Malen play when he had to make the call.
Because he could only add 3 new players. And he picked Asensio, Rashford and Disasi. Which was the right call.
That makes sense. I assume that if for example Bailey had been sent out on loan we could have added another?
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No.
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That’s a joke, right? RIGHT?
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We were playing one of the teams, who when they on song, going forward they are few teams in the league better, having said that it was still another woeful away display, in contrast to VP in the league, still unbeaten since the first match of the season.
If we win on Friday, hopefully the draw doesn't have us going to Selhurst Park again.
On the contrary, Palace at Selhurst is exactly what we want. The law of averages means we can’t continually be shit at that place.
Few teams better than Palace going forwards? They're the 14th highest scorers. We're just shit defensively and approach games wrong.
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The substitutions we baffling too. Bailey for Garcia at RWB? Playing Rogers as a centre forward when Malen was on the Bench? Rashbord and Asensio getting just 20 mins? All very bizarre.
Indeed. From what I've seen Malen is better as a centre forward than on the right. What I love about him is he makes things happen up front. That said I don't understand how Unai gave a CL place to Bailey rather than Malen. I can only put it down to the lack of games he's seen Malen play when he had to make the call.
Because he could only add 3 new players. And he picked Asensio, Rashford and Disasi. Which was the right call.
That makes sense. I assume that if for example Bailey had been sent out on loan we could have added another?
No, because Malen would still have been classed as a new player.
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Certainly hoping we never see Bailey at RB again. What was that all about...
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I'd move Bailey on in the summer. Get something for him before his value tanks.
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We were playing one of the teams, who when they on song, going forward they are few teams in the league better, having said that it was still another woeful away display, in contrast to VP in the league, still unbeaten since the first match of the season.
If we win on Friday, hopefully the draw doesn't have us going to Selhurst Park again.
On the contrary, Palace at Selhurst is exactly what we want. The law of averages means we can’t continually be shit at that place.
Aston Villa FC spit in the face of the law of averages, unfortunately.
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I'd move Bailey on in the summer. Get something for him before his value tanks.
100%
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Playing 3 centre halves reduced how many players we could pass into, the main tactic was give it to McGinn and hope his big ass would get a free kick or get him out of traffic, Palace only had to nick it once or twice to make it a big problem for us.
We scored when Olsen played it into Watkins and he flicked on for Rogers, but I don't remember us trying it again.
It was odd that Garcia looked all at sea playing wing back, when he looked so good pushing Jones back last Wednesday as a regular right back.
First paragraph absolutely bob-on.
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I'd move Bailey on in the summer. Get something for him before his value tanks.
100%
Sell him to Everton, they always pay top dollar for cast offs of better sides.
They'll probably spend the summer buying the worst 2 or 3 of the dross currently stinking out Man United.
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Playing 3 centre halves reduced how many players we could pass into, the main tactic was give it to McGinn and hope his big ass would get a free kick or get him out of traffic, Palace only had to nick it once or twice to make it a big problem for us.
We scored when Olsen played it into Watkins and he flicked on for Rogers, but I don't remember us trying it again.
It was odd that Garcia looked all at sea playing wing back, when he looked so good pushing Jones back last Wednesday as a regular right back.
First paragraph absolutely bob-on.
McGinn is initially at fault for the first goal , but there are then a catalogue of other errors before the ball ends up in the net. As a collective they were all very poor.
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It's not ass, it's arse. Ginny grew-up in Clydebank, not Cleveland.
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I'd move Bailey on in the summer. Get something for him before his value tanks.
100%
Sell him to Everton, they always pay top dollar for cast offs of better sides.
They'll probably spend the summer buying the worst 2 or 3 of the dross currently stinking out Man United.
They might finish above us if the current form remains as is. Moyes has rejuvenated them
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I thought Palace got away with 'tactical' fouling all game - especially Munoz who I think could have been sent off. At times it was difficult for us to get the ball moving forward because of this.
Still no excuse for the overall performance.
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I thought Palace got away with 'tactical' fouling all game - especially Munoz who I think could have been sent off. At times it was difficult for us to get the ball moving forward because of this.
Still no excuse for the overall performance.
We struggle against physical teams like Palace, Forest & Newcastle.
We play so slowly just inviting teams to come onto us, which works sometimes if we play through them, but when it doesn’t work we end up with 2nd half’s like last night
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I thought Palace got away with 'tactical' fouling all game - especially Munoz who I think could have been sent off. At times it was difficult for us to get the ball moving forward because of this.
Still no excuse for the overall performance.
Agree , dark arts palace , similar to forest and jawdie PIF
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Not sure about all the embarrassing comments, being embarrassed usually entails worrying about what others think, when it comes to Villa, who gives a shit what others think.
Wasn’t great last night, like it hasnt been great away for most of the season, as opposed to at home, where we pretty much have a fortress.
Anyway, 4 games in 10 days probably didn’t help us last night.
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We played with control in the first half and were probably unlucky to be behind. Losing Emi knocked us off our stride due to the reluctance to play the slow cat and mouse game we have when he’s there and just looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
We should have been 3 down by half time. Emerys tactics emptied our already fatigued midfield. It was batshit crazy stuff.
Granted Olsen never looks like saving a shot but in terms of reasons we lost it's a long way down the list.
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Not sure about all the embarrassing comments, being embarrassed usually entails worrying about what others think, when it comes to Villa, who gives a shit what others think.
Wasn’t great last night, like it hasnt been great away for most of the season, as opposed to at home, where we pretty much have a fortress.
Anyway, 4 games in 10 days probably didn’t help us last night.
Yes. Playing 4 games in the space of a week and a half is one thing some fans should also take into account, especially when we've had to pick the same midfield.
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Not sure about all the embarrassing comments, being embarrassed usually entails worrying about what others think, when it comes to Villa, who gives a shit what others think.
Wasn’t great last night, like it hasnt been great away for most of the season, as opposed to at home, where we pretty much have a fortress.
Anyway, 4 games in 10 days probably didn’t help us last night.
Yes. Playing 4 games in the space of a week and a half is one thing some fans should also take into account, especially when we've had to pick the same midfield.
Not having Onana Barkley Kamara available is taking its Toll.
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We played with control in the first half and were probably unlucky to be behind. Losing Emi knocked us off our stride due to the reluctance to play the slow cat and mouse game we have when he’s there and just looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
We should have been 3 down by half time. Emerys tactics emptied our already fatigued midfield. It was batshit crazy stuff.
Granted Olsen never looks like saving a shot but in terms of reasons we lost it's a long way down the list.
Yet more evidence you watch a different game to the rest of us!
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Not sure about all the embarrassing comments, being embarrassed usually entails worrying about what others think, when it comes to Villa, who gives a shit what others think.
Wasn’t great last night, like it hasnt been great away for most of the season, as opposed to at home, where we pretty much have a fortress.
Anyway, 4 games in 10 days probably didn’t help us last night.
Yes. Playing 4 games in the space of a week and a half is one thing some fans should also take into account, especially when we've had to pick the same midfield.
Not having Onana Barkley Kamara available is taking its Toll.
And a constantly changing central defence.
Margins are finer than ever this season.
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Not sure about all the embarrassing comments, being embarrassed usually entails worrying about what others think, when it comes to Villa, who gives a shit what others think.
Wasn’t great last night, like it hasnt been great away for most of the season, as opposed to at home, where we pretty much have a fortress.
Anyway, 4 games in 10 days probably didn’t help us last night.
Yes. Playing 4 games in the space of a week and a half is one thing some fans should also take into account, especially when we've had to pick the same midfield.
Not having Onana Barkley Kamara available is taking its Toll.
And a constantly changing central defence.
Margins are finer than ever this season.
And few of them going our way, but Emery did shoot us in the foot with the 3 at the back formation.
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You can blame injuries if you like, but this side beat Chelsea and drew with liverpool so im not buying that.
.the formation yet again 3 at the back a complete and utter failure.
Thats on unai. He messed up on this one. I think the last time he tried this was spurs at home last season where we again got a tonking.
It just does not work with this group of players. I never want to see that formation again
Losing 4-1 to palace is a embarrassing scoreline. We got embarrassed there last season 5-0 as well. Glasner has emerys number thats for sure
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We played with control in the first half and were probably unlucky to be behind. Losing Emi knocked us off our stride due to the reluctance to play the slow cat and mouse game we have when he’s there and just looked vulnerable every time they attacked.
We should have been 3 down by half time. Emerys tactics emptied our already fatigued midfield. It was batshit crazy stuff.
Granted Olsen never looks like saving a shot but in terms of reasons we lost it's a long way down the list.
Yet more evidence you watch a different game to the rest of us!
Palace didn't have three gilt edged chances to score in the first half?We were utterly shit in both halves.
With the exception of Konsa Id be reluctant to pile in on the players as it was all down to Emery.
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Seems an odd choice to make, that when you are struggling at the back in terms of both numbers and form, you then decide to change the shape of the defence.
I know Unai knows best, but...