Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: dave.woodhall on July 02, 2013, 10:49:28 AM
-
www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/ex-aston-villa-star-paul-mcgrath-4804848
-
It is all so inevitable.
-
Very sad to see. Also makes you wonder just how good he could have been without the booze problems. Frighteningly good.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
I had the pleasure of buying him a drink back in 1990 and glad to say he had orange juice , you are though of course quite right dave.
All these years down the line paul has still never quite beaten the drink problem and i wish him well in his fight .
-
I hope it's not too serious and that he gets the help and support he needs. Following on from Supertom in my opinion he was "frighteningly good" (although I think I know what you mean) his continual knee problems were another major factor.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
-
Only once saw him really outplayed in his years with us - at the baseball ground dean Saunders ran rings round him one game but mcgrath was easily the best most consistent player ive seen at villa by a distance - a pleasure to watch .
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
To be honest, I doubt that was a factor to be honest which makes it all the more disappointing.
It's a terrible affliction.
-
Paul McGrath's biggest problem is, that despite publicly speaking about his drinking problems, he never seems to care too much about stopping drinking.
-
I would say it might be best for him to drop out of the public eye completely but sometimes the lack of attention and activity that comes with such a change can create a vacuum which he may fill by drinking more.
-
That's a somewhat sweeping generalisation Mossie, unless of course you have experience in which case I bow to your superior knowledge and genuinely offer you my sympathy.
Alcoholism; as we all know is an illness and, a horrible one at that.
-
Paul McGrath's biggest problem is, that despite publicly speaking about his drinking problems, he never seems to care too much about stopping drinking.
I don't agree with that. He wants to, I just don't think he knows how to.
-
He's going to have slips like this from time to time and it's always sad to hear about. It must be a horrible thing to go through.
-
He's going to have slips like this from time to time and it's always sad to hear about. It must be a horrible thing to go through.
He had been doing well recently too, sad to hear this news.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
Unfortunately he's well-known for being a liability when he's off the wagon.
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
I doubt it. There's more chance of them turning a blind eye to him unless they really had no other choice. Sad to say, you can only help someone so many times unless they want to be helped - and even sadder, the Great Man's squandered more than most.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
I doubt it. There's more chance of them turning a blind eye to him unless they really had no other choice. Sad to say, you can only help someone so many times unless they want to be helped - and even sadder, the Great Man's squandered more than most.
Fair comment in my view.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
I doubt it. There's more chance of them turning a blind eye to him unless they really had no other choice. Sad to say, you can only help someone so many times unless they want to be helped - and even sadder, the Great Man's squandered more than most.
Sad but true, he has the support of all of us but the only person who can conquer this demon is paul .
-
Hope he gets control of problem , he was a greater player and seems a decent man fighting demons
On a side note , I have always hated that song on the piss me lord
-
Hope he gets control of problem , he was a greater player and seems a decent man fighting demons
On a side note , I have always hated that song on the piss me lord
It seems to have died out a little. I don't recall hearing it that much last season.
-
I hear it virtually every game (although, admittedly, I haven't been able to attend since January). Usually followed by the ludicrous "empty seats, my Lord" sang from a far-from-full stand.
-
I hear it virtually every game (although, admittedly, I haven't been able to attend since January). Usually followed by the ludicrous "empty seats, my Lord" sang from a far-from-full stand.
That for me is cringe-worthy.
As to the main song, there must be a better way to show our love for McGrath?
-
Does he have to get as ill as Gazza before he gets the help he needs.I hope not
-
I hear it virtually every game (although, admittedly, I haven't been able to attend since January). Usually followed by the ludicrous "empty seats, my Lord" sang from a far-from-full stand.
That for me is cringe-worthy.
As to the main song, there must be a better way to show our love for McGrath?
Ooh aah paul McGrath was and is a much better way to show appreciation.
-
When you read about some of the stuff surrounding Paul Gascoigne it always amazes me to read that despite his widespread noteriety there are still people out there willing to buy him a drink, or serve him one. Paul Grath is one of the most recognisable people in Ireland yet despite his very well documented troubles people still will provide him access to alcohol, or at worst now know when to stop providing him with it. Reading some of Gascoigne's issues, there's always those people who call themselves "mates" and are always "there" for him, yet these people never seem to step in with any conviction when they see things going south. If he has real friends they need to step in before it gets out of control.
-
The main reason the Paul Mcgrath song is sung is so they can get to the "shit support me lord" verse.
-
The main reason the Paul Mcgrath song is sung is so they can get to the "shit support me lord" verse.
It is such a massively shit song in so many ways. I hate it more every time I hear the Holte sing it. So small time too with the "shit support" bit.
-
Cringeworthy and embarrassing song and needs to be binned.
-
When you read about some of the stuff surrounding Paul Gascoigne it always amazes me to read that despite his widespread noteriety there are still people out there willing to buy him a drink, or serve him one. Paul Grath is one of the most recognisable people in Ireland yet despite his very well documented troubles people still will provide him access to alcohol, or at worst now know when to stop providing him with it. Reading some of Gascoigne's issues, there's always those people who call themselves "mates" and are always "there" for him, yet these people never seem to step in with any conviction when they see things going south. If he has real friends they need to step in before it gets out of control.
There are probably people who would buy them a drink just to get a reaction like that. "I saw Paul McGrath quietly sipping orange juice" isn't as much of a tale as "He was pissed out of his head."
-
I hope it's not too serious and that he gets the help and support he needs. Following on from Supertom in my opinion he was "frighteningly good" (although I think I know what you mean) his continual knee problems were another major factor.
Christ only knows how good with a solid pair of knees too. He wouldn't just be a God, he'd be Zues, a God of Gods. He would have made Maldini look like Titus Bramble.
-
I hope it's not too serious and that he gets the help and support he needs. Following on from Supertom in my opinion he was "frighteningly good" (although I think I know what you mean) his continual knee problems were another major factor.
Christ only knows how good with a solid pair of knees too. He wouldn't just be a God, he'd be Zues, a God of Gods. He would have made Maldini look like Titus Bramble.
you have to wonder though if he didn't have those problems would he have ever ended up with us?
-
I hope it's not too serious and that he gets the help and support he needs. Following on from Supertom in my opinion he was "frighteningly good" (although I think I know what you mean) his continual knee problems were another major factor.
Christ only knows how good with a solid pair of knees too. He wouldn't just be a God, he'd be Zues, a God of Gods. He would have made Maldini look like Titus Bramble.
you have to wonder though if he didn't have those problems would he have ever ended up with us?
Yes that's the other thing. Perhaps not. My guess is that either Bruce or Pallister would not have had quite as illustrious a career.
-
Caring about somebody who has addiction problems, or poor mental health, makes you feel so powerless.
I wish him well, I hope he finds the strength to get better.
-
Caring about somebody who has addiction problems, or poor mental health, makes you feel so powerless.
I wish him well, I hope he finds the strength to get better.
yes,
I have similar issues in my own family concerning gambling,
there is support out there, in the form of GA and AA etc, I've only been to GA and they are excellent but you have to be willing to go and get the 'treatment' for the want of better word,
Paul has I am sure done that in past, but its easy to fall away, and people around do give up in the end, because they see it as a never ending battle, which it is
in fact sometimes its harder for the immediate family than the person with the addictions, because like you say you feel powerless,
in a recent GA meeting with family and friends of compulsive gamblers, everyone in the room said the same thing, it wasn't the gambling that was the biggest problem, it was the lies
the lying destroyed everything, I'm not sure if that's the same for alcoholics, but people do get to the point where they have had enough, give up and go away
-
Caring about somebody who has addiction problems, or poor mental health, makes you feel so powerless.
I wish him well, I hope he finds the strength to get better.
yes,
I have similar issues in my own family concerning gambling,
there is support out there, in the form of GA and AA etc, I've only been to GA and they are excellent but you have to be willing to go and get the 'treatment' for the want of better word,
Paul has I am sure done that in past, but its easy to fall away, and people around do give up in the end, because they see it as a never ending battle, which it is
in fact sometimes its harder for the immediate family than the person with the addictions, because like you say you feel powerless,
in a recent GA meeting with family and friends of compulsive gamblers, everyone in the room said the same thing, it wasn't the gambling that was the biggest problem, it was the lies
the lying destroyed everything, I'm not sure if that's the same for alcoholics, but people do get to the point where they have had enough, give up and go away
May I take this opportunity to wish you all the best in your fight john, I've always enjoyed your posts and you seem a really decent bloke - hope it goes well for you pal.
-
I bet you £2 he gets better
-
Caring about somebody who has addiction problems, or poor mental health, makes you feel so powerless.
I wish him well, I hope he finds the strength to get better.
yes,
I have similar issues in my own family concerning gambling,
there is support out there, in the form of GA and AA etc, I've only been to GA and they are excellent but you have to be willing to go and get the 'treatment' for the want of better word,
Paul has I am sure done that in past, but its easy to fall away, and people around do give up in the end, because they see it as a never ending battle, which it is
in fact sometimes its harder for the immediate family than the person with the addictions, because like you say you feel powerless,
in a recent GA meeting with family and friends of compulsive gamblers, everyone in the room said the same thing, it wasn't the gambling that was the biggest problem, it was the lies
the lying destroyed everything, I'm not sure if that's the same for alcoholics, but people do get to the point where they have had enough, give up and go away
May I take this opportunity to wish you all the best in your fight john, I've always enjoyed your posts and you seem a really decent bloke - hope it goes well for you pal.
thanks,
although I have been a heavy gambler in the past, its my Son who has the problem, I go to support him, although i'm only allowed into the family support meeting
-
I bet you £2 he gets better
make it 2 grand and we might be talking......
-
Best wishes to you both anyway john, you have always struck me as one of the good guys :)
-
Best wishes to you both anyway john, you have always struck me as one of the good guys :)
I am pretty good to be fair
-
Best wishes to you both anyway john, you have always struck me as one of the good guys :)
I am pretty good to be fair
Indeed.
-
it just doesn't sound like him, being loud?
-
it just doesn't sound like him, being loud?
He has had problems in the past becoming a bit loud when drunk i think - not aggressive though.
-
it just doesn't sound like him, being loud?
His inherent shyness is probably what makes him return to the drink.
-
Having read his book more than once, it would seem that solitude and too much time to think and become depressed leads him to drink on occasions. Equally, being out and about with his basic shyness and insecurities leads him to drink. Soon the shyness is overtaken by the drunkenness. I certainly don't think the police targeted him because of who he was. I think it is accepted that many people in Ireland, including the police and the press have actually done the opposite over the years and tried to protect and help him.
-
Always sad to hear him struggling with his demons.
Without knowing any details of how long he has fallen off the wagon it is difficult to know how bad it is this time around. Hopefully it was a one off, in which case an incident with him being arrested could prove a blessing. Rather that than him quietely heading home in denial and sinking back into the bottle long term.
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again. It took my other half a while to reach that point but she hasnt had a drink in about 14 years now and as certain as I can be about anything I know now she never will.
-
I am sure she knows how proud you are.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
To those that say 'he just needs to want it' I'm afraid alcoholism is a much tougher demon than that. Don't take my word for it, read his autobiography. It's an excellent book that may well open your open your eyes to a few things. It's also a good insight into the inner workings of our club back then. It's only £5.99 on Amazon and you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere.
Amazon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Back-Brink-Autobiography-Paul-McGrath/dp/009949955X)
-
That song will only disappear when people who don't really like or support it stop singing it or in fact parts of the our own crowd when it is sung denounce it. It would be weird and likely unrealistic for part of the crowd at Villa Park to boo those singing that song but something needs to be done to get rid of it. I doubt that the club would request something officially but given the trying circumstances of a living legend and hero to so many of us it would be nice.
-
Or for more people to read his book. Then these tools who sing the song will realise what a life he lived before he was famous, and how its a daily struggle for him, as these sad scenes have shown.
-
The song is an irrelevance, not singing it will make no difference to his condition.
It saddens me to read about him going off the rails again but it seems, like with so many addicts, to be somehow inevitable.
-
As his twitter profile says - one day at a time .
Sadly thats going to be the case for him for a long time to come.
-
The song is an irrelevance, not singing it will make no difference to his condition.
I just think that part of the song, considering his condition, is in real poor taste. I know it wont make his condition better, but at least it'll stop me from cringing every time i hear it.
-
The song is an irrelevance, not singing it will make no difference to his condition.
I just think that part of the song, considering his condition, is in real poor taste. I know it wont make his condition better, but at least it'll stop me from cringing every time i hear it.
I think the whole song is cringeworthy not just the McGrath reference.
-
Unless it's my hearing they start with the 'on the piss' verse now, no mention of Paul.
And my sympathies out to his family having to keep dealing with things like this.
-
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again.
I've always wondered about this. Is total abstinence the way to solve the problem? It doesn't seem the most healthy way to deal with it to me, to live a life with a monkey permanently on your back.
There must be a reason why a person has become dependent on alcohol. I can see why a period of abstinence is necessary and the reason for that would be to work on whatever caused the drinking problem in the first place.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
That's a bit over the top.
-
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again.
I've always wondered about this. Is total abstinence the way to solve the problem? It doesn't seem the most healthy way to deal with it to me, to live a life with a monkey permanently on your back.
There must be a reason why a person has become dependent on alcohol. I can see why a period of abstinence is necessary and the reason for that would be to work on whatever caused the drinking problem in the first place.
I'd be interested to hear the views of Russon on this if he would care to share them.
I feel so sorry for McGrath and hope that one day he will overcome his demons. The song is out of order given his circumstances. I was saddened to read, "On the p*ss, M'Lord, on the piss..." by someone on FB who had linked to the rte version of this article.
-
Given his history I would say abstinence is his only option. And after this long the chances of that happening are pretty slim i'd have thought.
From my personal experiences of alcoholics any that have tried moderate drinking have always gone on full time drinking again.
-
Wow - that's a relief. When I saw the thread title, then the title of the link I thought it was going to be much, much worse!
-
I wonder when he starts off drinking, do/should bartenders refuse to serve him when he walks into a bar just because it's common knowledge he's an alcoholic?
I have seen him at close quarters start the night out on diluted orange (do ye Brits call it 'squash'?) but with the prospect of a public speaking engagement to do, and people queueing-up to order "and whatever Paul's having", slowly give into temptation and break down sobbing and apologising when called upon to make the speech. Absolutely heart-breaking to witness. Never meet your heroes...poor fella. Being a loner for a lot of his life has likely affected his behaviour towards drink in a desperate way.
I don't know his domestic situation currently but it must be so much harder for him if he doesn't have a partner to help. He did become a Grandad a couple of years ago, which clearly thrilled him and seemed to be living a peaceful life in rural Wexford. It's a ticking time bomb though isn't it? Let's hope he gets back to the good days soon.
Mind you, on clicking the thread and seeing his name I was thinking something far worse.
-
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again.
I've always wondered about this. Is total abstinence the way to solve the problem? It doesn't seem the most healthy way to deal with it to me, to live a life with a monkey permanently on your back.
There must be a reason why a person has become dependent on alcohol. I can see why a period of abstinence is necessary and the reason for that would be to work on whatever caused the drinking problem in the first place.
Anybody who is an alcoholic should never have even one drink again. It is an illness and there may be all manner of reasons for each individual that is the trigger or cause. We are not talking about people who maybe drink a bit too much than is good for them and should maybe moderate things a bit. An alcoholic is somebody who is either heading for the bottom or have reached it and like my other half looked over the edge and stopped. She has not had a drink for 14 years but she is still an alcoholic, in the sense that if she ever had a drink it could potentially take her down to the bottom again. Luckily for her, even the smell of alcohol now makes her feel ill. For an alcoholic, one drink is one too many but after that first one any other amount is never enough.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
That's a bit over the top.
I really don't think so. It's genuinely how I feel about it although I don't expect or need everyone to see it the same way. Perhaps it's because alcoholism and its effects is something that I've witnessed first hand. I also found his book very moving. It's so honest it's quite harrowing in places.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
100% agree.
-
How much of him getting arrested had to do with being loud and annoying and how much of it had to do with him being Paul McGrath?
Probably seen as a bit of a big shot in Offaly and a big scalp for the local plod to get their 15 mins of fame: I nicked Paul McGrath for being pissed once- they can tell anyone who cares, or maybe doesn't .
I think that's highly unlikely, Paul is universally loved throughout Ireland & I believe a complaint was made to the Police about his behaviour, hence his arrest. I suspect the arrest was only made as the last resort, as even the most likeable of people are often are real pain when drunk.
I hope he conquers his demons but many have to hit rock bottom to achieve that. For others rock bottom is dying from this illness.
-
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again.
I've always wondered about this. Is total abstinence the way to solve the problem? It doesn't seem the most healthy way to deal with it to me, to live a life with a monkey permanently on your back.
There must be a reason why a person has become dependent on alcohol. I can see why a period of abstinence is necessary and the reason for that would be to work on whatever caused the drinking problem in the first place.
Anybody who is an alcoholic should never have even one drink again. It is an illness and there may be all manner of reasons for each individual that is the trigger or cause. We are not talking about people who maybe drink a bit too much than is good for them and should maybe moderate things a bit. An alcoholic is somebody who is either heading for the bottom or have reached it and like my other half looked over the edge and stopped. She has not had a drink for 14 years but she is still an alcoholic, in the sense that if she ever had a drink it could potentially take her down to the bottom again. Luckily for her, even the smell of alcohol now makes her feel ill. For an alcoholic, one drink is one too many but after that first one any other amount is never enough.
Jimmy Greaves the greatest english player I ever saw is an alcoholic. Has been for many years. Says he often wants a drink but knows even one is a non starter if he wants to live.
-
Far from paying homage to possibly our greatest player if anything the song is taking the piss out of him ( no pun intended) .
Anyone singing it really is doing him and our club a disservice in my view - get bak to to the ooh aah paul McGrath chant.
-
Paul's drinking problems are well documented and his book tells us all a lot. He has a problem, but bloody hell he's had a few and got a bit loud and abusive...have you not seen the serious shit happening in our world today????
Give him a break.
-
Paul's drinking problems are well documented and his book tells us all a lot. He has a problem, but bloody hell he's had a few and got a bit loud and abusive...have you not seen the serious shit happening in our world today????
Give him a break.
Giving him a break is what's got him into this mess.
-
The song is an embarrassment and very disrespectful.
I would go so far as to say it's moronic .
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
I had the pleasure of buying him a drink back in 1990 and glad to say he had orange juice , you are though of course quite right dave.
I tried to buy him one in the Dome in the mid-90's, but he insisted on buying me one.
I'm sorry.
-
The song is an irrelevance, not singing it will make no difference to his condition.
I just think that part of the song, considering his condition, is in real poor taste. I know it wont make his condition better, but at least it'll stop me from cringing every time i hear it.
I think the whole song is cringeworthy not just the McGrath reference.
Totally agree Eastie, it's an embarrassment on so many levels.
-
That song seems to be our main anthem at away games which is really depressing. We need to stop it or change the lyrics.
Met Paul in Prague in about 1996/97, it was about 2am and he was being carried out of a club by Townsend and Staunton. Not a pretty site. Love the guy but this is all so sad and tragic.
-
Depending on what study you read, the success rates for recovery from alcoholism vary enormously. Suppose it also depends on what the definition of a successful recovery is.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
And those that profess to love him,at a club he served so well, our main song about probably our biggest world class player, is about him being pissed. Yeah, yeah its just a song but other club's fans sing about their legends with reverence.We don't and some just don't get it.
-
I think he's probably really pissed off at this development and realises he is in trouble legally, but maybe doesn't totally realise he is in trouble, personally. I really hope he gets some kind of intervention that makes this difference clear to him.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
And those that profess to love him,at a club he served so well, our main song about probably our biggest world class player, is about him being pissed. Yeah, yeah its just a song but other club's fans sing about their legends with reverence.We don't and some just don't get it.
A lot of the people who sing it don't make the connection with him anymore. Some of the others will only think of drinking in the great British tradition of getting pissed is just a bit of a laugh.
-
I read once about a reformed alcoholic who hadn't touched a drop for 23 years. Then one day he was helping his wife cook Sunday lunch, she added a splash of red wine whilst preparing a pan of gravy stock. He got one whiff of it and cracked and smuggled the rest of the bottle into the garden and polished it off and it all unravelled from there. I feel sorry for Macca, he must be going through hell.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
And those that profess to love him,at a club he served so well, our main song about probably our biggest world class player, is about him being pissed. Yeah, yeah its just a song but other club's fans sing about their legends with reverence.We don't and some just don't get it.
A lot of the people who sing it don't make the connection with him anymore. Some of the others will only think of drinking in the great British tradition of getting pissed is just a bit of a laugh.
I said earlier, I rarely hear the Paul McGrath verse, it seems to start with 'On the Piss' these days.
-
I think the song has evolved now away from Paul. His name is in the first part of it because that is the origin of the song. I view the 'on the piss' section these days as being a statement of what a chunk of our away support do at away games: have a day out on the lash with their mates. And when I sing it that's what I'm singing/thinking about.
It's not really a big home game anthem, that defines us really is it and is just sang by the folk at the back of the Holte.
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
-
Agree I rarely hear the Paul McGrath verse on away days, it usually gathers volume for the "on the piss" verse. I'd always thought that was referring to Macca being on the piss but I guess it's transcended now to the actual fans being on the piss or perhaps a bit of both ? Even so, that song is always about Macca for me and the connection with being on the lash is a bit close to the bone
-
The m'lord bit will always connect the song to Paul McGrath even if the song no longer mentions him by name.
-
Poor bloke. Hope he gets some help, mainly from himself.
-
For me he'll always be the greatest. And the only God I'll ever believe in.
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
And those that profess to love him,at a club he served so well, our main song about probably our biggest world class player, is about him being pissed. Yeah, yeah its just a song but other club's fans sing about their legends with reverence.We don't and some just don't get it.
A lot of the people who sing it don't make the connection with him anymore. Some of the others will only think of drinking in the great British tradition of getting pissed is just a bit of a laugh.
I said earlier, I rarely hear the Paul McGrath verse, it seems to start with 'On the Piss' these days.
It is definitely still there. It's just that it is a lot quieter than the other verses.
I sing the first bit, that's it.
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
Ah, apologies, misunderstood you.
-
From his twitter account 31 minutes ago (I feel like crying )
Paul McGrath @Paulmcgrath531m
I love aston villa and im pissed soz :-)
-
Is that really god on twitter? It's not a verified account is it?
-
It is definitely him. Now rambling on about bankers.
-
He's just posted a mini rant about bankers.
-
I've just seen them, pretty worrying.
-
(http://i1356.photobucket.com/albums/q736/Mortimers_Bear/Screenshot_2013-07-03-09-44-08_zps51771b14.png)
-
Yep paul is in a bad way on twitter this morning - pissed and posting quite abusive messages - very worrying .
Hope this is a blip that he can overcome but he does seem to be on a rocky road.
-
This subject evokes a lot of hypocrisy in people, there's a guy at work who lambasted Paul Gascoigne last time he fell off the wagon, along the line of 'it's his own fault, if he wants to drink himself to death then let him, he's a burden on society' etc.
When the same happens to one of our own this bloke is full of sympathy and understanding.
-
But Paul McGrath will never completely stop until Paul McGrath himself makes that decision and really understands that he can never ever go near alcohol again.
I've always wondered about this. Is total abstinence the way to solve the problem? It doesn't seem the most healthy way to deal with it to me, to live a life with a monkey permanently on your back.
There must be a reason why a person has become dependent on alcohol. I can see why a period of abstinence is necessary and the reason for that would be to work on whatever caused the drinking problem in the first place.
Anybody who is an alcoholic should never have even one drink again. It is an illness and there may be all manner of reasons for each individual that is the trigger or cause. We are not talking about people who maybe drink a bit too much than is good for them and should maybe moderate things a bit. An alcoholic is somebody who is either heading for the bottom or have reached it and like my other half looked over the edge and stopped. She has not had a drink for 14 years but she is still an alcoholic, in the sense that if she ever had a drink it could potentially take her down to the bottom again. Luckily for her, even the smell of alcohol now makes her feel ill. For an alcoholic, one drink is one too many but after that first one any other amount is never enough.
My Father was an alcoholic, a functioning one at first. After years of heavy drinking it cost him his life at the grand old age of 46. Having to watch him slip into chronic alcoholism was the most upsetting thing i will ever see. Even with the support from family, friends and Medical people he just could not or would not stop drinking.
The denial, the lies and the totally uncharacteristic violent moods were very frightening.
From a man who used to wear smart suits to work, lovely home, all the other trappings of a very successfull buisness man, to scrappy tracksuit bottoms and a scruffy tshirt. Alcoholism took his pride, dignity and then his life. I have had conversations with people about this subject on many occasions. " Why can't they just say no to a drink?" is one i have heard many times. The answer is that nobody knows, unless they are an alcoholic.
It is a horrible disease and it is a disease.
People should have the greatest admiration for any alcoholic who is doing their best to stay Dry. You have to give as much support as you possibly can to them as they are in a life long battle. Should they fall off the Wagon you have to be there for them and help them with their recovery.
Good luck to anybody who suffers from alcoholism. I hope you get the support you will need.
-
Sad to hear that dan , must have been a tough time .
-
This subject evokes a lot of hypocrisy in people, there's a guy at work who lambasted Paul Gascoigne last time he fell off the wagon, along the line of 'it's his own fault, if he wants to drink himself to death then let him, he's a burden on society' etc.
When the same happens to one of our own this bloke is full of sympathy and understanding.
See also McGrath gets sympathy from us, Paul Merson a bit less and Gary Charles hardly any, yet they all have the same underlying problem.
-
Ask anybody who is going through it eastie. I don't just mean the alcoholic but family and friends as well.
It can and does rip families apart. It was tough but to be truthfull, i learned a hell of a lot from it mate.
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
Ah, apologies, misunderstood you.
No problem at all :-) Your feeling towards the chant is understandable and shared by many. Thankfully I think more and more peoples attitude towards alcoholism is slowly changing as more and more people are exposed to it and talk about it (as you can see on here). That is surely one of the only good things to come out of such a sad, desperate and damaging situation like this. If drugs were classified scientifically and on the harm they cause, rather than financially and politically, as is currently the case, alcohol would be top of the pile (Class A) ahead of even heroin and crack.
-
Is that really god on twitter? It's not a verified account is it?
It's him. I was so disappointed when I read those tweets on my way to work. I hope somebody goes to his aid.
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
Ah, apologies, misunderstood you.
No problem at all :-) Your feeling towards the chant is understandable and shared by many. Thankfully I think more and more peoples attitude towards alcoholism is slowly changing as more and more people are exposed to it and talk about it (as you can see on here). That is surely one of the only good things to come out of such a sad, desperate and damaging situation like this. If drugs were classified scientifically and on the harm they cause, rather than financially and politically, as is currently the case, alcohol would be top of the pile (Class A) ahead of even heroin and crack.
Very true and proved by the way.
-
Is that really god on twitter? It's not a verified account is it?
It's him. I was so disappointed when I read those tweets on my way to work. I hope somebody goes to his aid.
I see paul has just tweeted -
@Paulmcgrath5: someone thinks its funny to hack my account. im fine thanks
-
Ask anybody who is going through it eastie. I don't just mean the alcoholic but family and friends as well.
It can and does rip families apart. It was tough but to be truthfull, i learned a hell of a lot from it mate.
Alcoholism is something that needs to be addressed. So many people just do not 'get it'. As I get older I am becoming more and more hostile to alcohol as I have seen the affect it has had on people. Recovering alcoholics should never be put in a position where their brave struggle against the demon drink is compromised. You are no friend of them if you offer them alcohol or put them in a position where they have to fight an urge. I have an alcoholic relative who has been off it since 2000 and always arrange to meet in café. I know other eejits who still try to organise meet ups with him in pubs.
-
Ask anybody who is going through it eastie. I don't just mean the alcoholic but family and friends as well.
It can and does rip families apart. It was tough but to be truthfull, i learned a hell of a lot from it mate.
Alcoholism is something that needs to be addressed. So many people just do not 'get it'. As I get older I am becoming more and more hostile to alcohol as I have seen the affect it has had on people. Recovering alcoholics should never be put in a position where their brave struggle against the demon drink is compromised. You are no friend of them if you offer them alcohol or put them in a position where they have to fight an urge. I have an alcoholic relative who has been off it since 2000 and always arrange to meet in café. I know other eejits who still try to organise meet ups with him in pubs.
A friend of mine who had his struggles with alcohol said to me " The only way i can stay dry is to stay out of wet places." A very true statement. He is still dry now after 5 years but admits that he still gets overwhelming urges to neck some alcohol when he is under any sort of serious stress. So far he is good.
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
Ah, apologies, misunderstood you.
No problem at all :-) Your feeling towards the chant is understandable and shared by many. Thankfully I think more and more peoples attitude towards alcoholism is slowly changing as more and more people are exposed to it and talk about it (as you can see on here). That is surely one of the only good things to come out of such a sad, desperate and damaging situation like this. If drugs were classified scientifically and on the harm they cause, rather than financially and politically, as is currently the case, alcohol would be top of the pile (Class A) ahead of even heroin and crack.
I have heard it said that alcohol would be illegal if it was discovered today, but surely it wouldn't be on a par with heroin/cocaine?
A bottle of beer a day would do a lot less damage than a line of coke would do surely?
-
Equally unfortunately diablo, we're well beyond the point of it being "not too serious", as I sincerely wish the twats who continue to chant "it's your round" would realise.
Sorry when I said "I hope it's not too serious" I didn't make myself clear. I meant from the legal side of things (as he was charged previously with breach of the peace in 2004). I hope he doesn't find himself in more trouble that won't help / aid his hopeful recovery / battle with alcoholism.
Ah, apologies, misunderstood you.
No problem at all :-) Your feeling towards the chant is understandable and shared by many. Thankfully I think more and more peoples attitude towards alcoholism is slowly changing as more and more people are exposed to it and talk about it (as you can see on here). That is surely one of the only good things to come out of such a sad, desperate and damaging situation like this. If drugs were classified scientifically and on the harm they cause, rather than financially and politically, as is currently the case, alcohol would be top of the pile (Class A) ahead of even heroin and crack.
I have heard it said that alcohol would be illegal if it was discovered today, but surely it wouldn't be on a par with heroin/cocaine?
A bottle of beer a day would do a lot less damage than a line of coke would do surely?
A bottle of beer a day Is fine , its the not stopping at that and 7 or 8 bottles a day that cause the problems.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
To those that say 'he just needs to want it' I'm afraid alcoholism is a much tougher demon than that. Don't take my word for it, read his autobiography. It's an excellent book that may well open your open your eyes to a few things. It's also a good insight into the inner workings of our club back then. It's only £5.99 on Amazon and you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere.
Amazon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Back-Brink-Autobiography-Paul-McGrath/dp/009949955X)
And what do you think Pauls thoughts are on this song?
I have spoken to him both privately and at an open forum on the subject of this song.
He has no objections at all to it being sung......... just saying.
-
a lot of addictions are more to do with having a compulsive nature than just falling into a trap door
i bet if you looked at some of the high profile business people like Murdock, Sugar, Maxwell etc they would be compulsive by nature, but they were able to channel it into other things ie making money by taking a few risks
footballers like Gaza and Best i reckon were probably compulsive people, even Beckham, its where you channel it, and if you go down the path of alcohol, you can easily become a compulsive drinker, where it takes over your life completely
i know a guy who was a compulsive gambler, he lost the lot, house, wife, kids, when he managed to control his affliction, he turned to fishing, which sounds a bit daft, but he became a compulsive fisherman, obsessed with catching the biggest/most etc
if you are born with this compulsive nature it will always manifest itself in something
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
To those that say 'he just needs to want it' I'm afraid alcoholism is a much tougher demon than that. Don't take my word for it, read his autobiography. It's an excellent book that may well open your open your eyes to a few things. It's also a good insight into the inner workings of our club back then. It's only £5.99 on Amazon and you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere.
Amazon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Back-Brink-Autobiography-Paul-McGrath/dp/009949955X)
And what do you think Pauls thoughts are on this song?
I have spoken to him both privately and at an open forum on the subject of this song.
He has no objections at all to it being sung......... just saying.
It's not just reference to on the piss, its the shit support , empty seats etc - the song is a heap of shit.
-
God reckons his twitter account was hacked earlier.
-
God reckons his twitter account was hacked earlier.
I posted his tweet on previous page , do keep up to date clamps please .
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
To those that say 'he just needs to want it' I'm afraid alcoholism is a much tougher demon than that. Don't take my word for it, read his autobiography. It's an excellent book that may well open your open your eyes to a few things. It's also a good insight into the inner workings of our club back then. It's only £5.99 on Amazon and you may be able to find it cheaper elsewhere.
Amazon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Back-Brink-Autobiography-Paul-McGrath/dp/009949955X)
And what do you think Pauls thoughts are on this song?
I have spoken to him both privately and at an open forum on the subject of this song.
He has no objections at all to it being sung......... just saying.
It's not just reference to on the piss, its the shit support , empty seats etc - the song is a heap of shit.
Agree - I'm sure there must be some creative fan within the Villa fold who can come up with a more appropriate song in support of, IMO, the greatest Villa player in recent decades.
-
God reckons his twitter account was hacked earlier.
I posted his tweet on previous page , do keep up to date clamps please .
I'm sorry Easts, some of us have other things to do.
-
God reckons his twitter account was hacked earlier.
I posted his tweet on previous page , do keep up to date clamps please .
I'm sorry Easts, some of us have other things to do.
Indeed.
-
Is that really god on twitter? It's not a verified account is it?
It's him. I was so disappointed when I read those tweets on my way to work. I hope somebody goes to his aid.
I see paul has just tweeted -
@Paulmcgrath5: someone thinks its funny to hack my account. im fine thanks
I hope this is true but I guess there's no way of knowing unless you saw how he was when these suposed hacked tweets were being posted.
-
I hate to say it but claims of Twitter hacking is rarely true and if his account had been hacked the culprit could have done a lot worse than one rant about bankers and an apology for being pissed.
-
I hate to say it but claims of Twitter hacking is rarely true and if his account had been hacked the culprit could have done a lot worse than one rant about bankers and an apology for being pissed.
Thought exactly the same dave, maybe trying to make amends after a few hours sleep .
-
Alcoholism is something that needs to be addressed. So many people just do not 'get it'. As I get older I am becoming more and more hostile to alcohol as I have seen the affect it has had on people.
I never used to 'get it', I think when you're younger you think you're indestructible. When I was younger like many others I would go out regularly and drink far too much and indulge in certain things that I wouldn't dream of doing these days. Some people have addictive personalities and I've heard in the past couple of years of 3 of my old friends from Newcastle who I spent many an evening with have died, two as a result of alcoholism, one of them sadly killed himself and another from a drug overdose. They were all in their early 40's and people I am proud and happy to have had as friends.
A few years ago a friend of mine introduced me once to a woman who because of her addictive personality is a recovering alcoholic/ drug addict/ sex addict and is now obsessed with Nick Cave which is a far healthier obsession/addiction!
-
I hate to say it but claims of Twitter hacking is rarely true and if his account had been hacked the culprit could have done a lot worse than one rant about bankers and an apology for being pissed.
I'm very doubtful it was hacked. More likely scenario for me is he was pissed, had a rant and someone managed to talk some sense to him so he tried the "hacked" excuse. I hope i'm wrong and that's just me being cynical.
-
I hate to say it but claims of Twitter hacking is rarely true and if his account had been hacked the culprit could have done a lot worse than one rant about bankers and an apology for being pissed.
I'm very doubtful it was hacked. More likely scenario for me is he was pissed, had a rant and someone managed to talk some sense to him so he tried the "hacked" excuse. I hope i'm wrong and that's just me being cynical.
I don't think he was either. I've been hacked and and it was a lot more than two messages. Let's hope he sorts himself out.
-
I hate to say it but claims of Twitter hacking is rarely true and if his account had been hacked the culprit could have done a lot worse than one rant about bankers and an apology for being pissed.
I'm very doubtful it was hacked. More likely scenario for me is he was pissed, had a rant and someone managed to talk some sense to him so he tried the "hacked" excuse. I hope i'm wrong and that's just me being cynical.
I don't think he was either. I've been hacked and and it was a lot more than two messages. Let's hope he sorts himself out.
Who hacked you clampy ? I thought it just happened to the rich and famous ;)
Was it a bluenose ?
-
Usually when people are hacked their followers receive tweets about weight loss and 'LOL what are you doing in this video?' direct messages.
-
Usually when people are hacked their followers receive tweets about weight loss and 'LOL what are you doing in this video?' direct messages.
My acccount was filled with foreign tweets. There's some strange folk out there.
-
Usually when people are hacked their followers receive tweets about weight loss and 'LOL what are you doing in this video?' direct messages.
My acccount was filled with foreign tweets. There's some strange folk out there.
They may have been from yang wing Wong - your Thai admirer.
-
Usually when people are hacked their followers receive tweets about weight loss and 'LOL what are you doing in this video?' direct messages.
That happened to me where a direct message was sent to all my whopping 26 followers. Of them all, only Shaun Teale told me I was hacked. Bizzare.
-
Macca is now saying his twitter account was hacked ??
-
One of the biggest problems Paul has is, the never ending queue, of people willing to buy him drinks despite his problems. It's nothing malicious just misguided gratitude. Combine this with Paul's genial and inoffensive (when not drinking) character and it's an accident waiting to happen. Just my opinion.
Unfortunately, sometimes it is malicious as he is an easy target for a "laugh"!!!
Got chatting with Whiteside at OT this year. He was saying that earlier this year, some fellas took God for a few drinks before plonking him on the ferry to Anglesey. Presumably he continued drinking on the ferry and became abusive causing the captain to radio ahead to be met on docking by the police. Fair play to the police, when they got hold of him, instead of locking him up, they contacted Whiteside and got him to agree to fund a taxi ride for God to Whitesides place in Manc.
It's only going to end one way unfortunately....
-
I'd guess that the 'hacked' tweet is the guilt setting in. Fall off the wagon, behave like an arse, sober up, become consumed with guilt. Alcoholism has its cycles.
-
Every time I hear 'on the piss my lord' I want to hand everyone singing it a copy of his book. In my view it's not just an embarrassing song, it's morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It doesn't make me cringe it makes me f***ing angry.
A tad OTT (though I'm no great fan of the song).
I seem to recall it started in 1994, soon after he went AWOL and abandoned the club on the eve of an important cup match. It wasn't the first time he'd done that either.
For many players, that would signal the beginning of the end of the relationship with the club and it's fans. For Paul, he could do no wrong and was welcomed back into the fold with barely a murmur. If the sum total of his punishment was a fine and a new song, he got off lightly.
There were no calls to ditch him, though that probably has as much to do with with how good a player he was, more than any deep empathy for his condition. That said, he seemed to have a bond with the clubs fans from day one, so the song was perhaps a misguided and clumsy attempt at affection, as much as anything else.
It seemed to come back around 2007, particularly at away days. And the 'on the piss' declaration seemed to be as much about the condition of those singing it as it was about McGrath himself.
It isn't morally repugnant and utterly indefensible. It's just shit.
To the tune of Kumbaya, with a witty, imaginative new verse tacked on sometimes depending on the opposition. Empty seats/ going down. Yawn. Hopefully it's come to the end of it's cycle and that Brigada mob in the Lower Holte can introduce some long overdue new material. They do seem to be the only lot trying most games, in fairness.
-
I think that we all can find ourselves on the brink one way or another. I'm no where near an alcoholic but when I go for a drink, I struggle to limit myself to 2 or 3. I can easily go for a session if I don't stop myself. Usually that is returning to work or going home to the kids. It doesn't appear that Paul has either to stop him. Quite the opposite. There is no shortage of people trying to get him even more drunk and have a good time with him.
-
It was Exeter in the Cup where he went AWOL.
It was Paul McGrath my Lord as usual, followed by in the bar my Lord, in the Bar.
Deano penalty in a 1-0 win if I recall. A wet day too.
-
what was gods greatest game in a villa shirt?
-
All of them.
-
All of them.
Exactly , can count his poor games on one hand and that is indeed something - the guy was immense and consistently outstanding.
-
what was gods greatest game in a villa shirt?
1994 League Cup Final v ManUre ?
-
what was gods greatest game in a villa shirt?
1994 League Cup Final v ManUre ?
Not for me , there were numerous league games in both runners up years ahead of that .
-
Probably Eastie yes. Reality is he had so many great games it would be very hard to single one out.
-
He'll be alright now. His dad's looking after him. www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/former-aston-villa-boss-doug-4865283
-
He'll be alright now. His dad's looking after him. www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/former-aston-villa-boss-doug-4865283
is Doug wearing a claret and blue dickie there ?
-
what was gods greatest game in a villa shirt?
1994 League Cup Final v ManUre ?
Not sure - he was awesome that day.
Anyone who can make Derek Mountfield, Shaun Teale, Southgate, Ugo, Kevin Moran, Phil Babb look much much better than they actually were - international class in fact - has something very special.
The Green Beret of Villa's troops past and present.
-
I thought he was a great former footballer, not a licensed killer.
-
Common sense prevails.
www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/local-news/ex-aston-villa-star-paul-mcgrath-5119508
-
I think that article sums up just how difficult it is for him to lead anything like a normal life in Ireland. He's in court after, frankly, making a tool of himself and yet there are still those using it as an opportunity to get an autograph. For someone so shy. To protect his health I really think he needs to move somewhere to avoid the constant attention.
-
The Judge wants locking up. Only one of the greatest Irish footballers?
-
The Judge wants locking up. Only one of the greatest Irish footballers?
And a Leeds fan.
-
I want to know why do the pubs give him beer and people keep buying him beers. It is simple - DON'T BUY BEER for people like George Best, Paul Merson, Tony Adams, Paul Gascoigne, and Paul McGrath. They can't handle it.
-
I want to know why do the pubs give him beer and people keep buying him beers. It is simple - DON'T BUY BEER for people like George Best, Paul Merson, Tony Adams, Paul Gascoigne, and Paul McGrath. They can't handle it.
Sad to say there are still people who believe "One beer won't hurt you". Even sadder to say there are people who would happily buy Macca or Paul Gascoigne drinks all day in the hope that they'll get drunk and provide the buyer with a story.
-
Plus, their money is as good as anyone else's. A bar man is paid to serve his customers, not to warn them of what their habits may lead to.
Maybe he should move to the Isle of Man where he's unknown due to tv not being invented yet. Risso can keep an eye on him now that he seems to have a fair bit of time on his hands.
-
Alcoholics will find ways and means of finding drink, with or without the help of barmen or idiotic punters. And it's beyond simplistic to just say 'don't buy drinks for the likes of x, y or z', what about the many more alcoholics not in the public eye?
-
I noticed the mention of the word Agent in the article, need we say more, that's the last thing he needs
-
Funny, I saw the word and felt a bit relieved that he's at least not completely on his own with all this.
-
Agents get a bad press but sometimes they look after more than their clients' income.
-
Solicitor Donal Farrelly said McGrath sometimes turned to drink to cope with a debilitating disorder whereby he suffers acute anxiety during social occasions.
He is basically a shy guy. Making decisions with a football as 80,000 people watch was easy for him, I guess because it was something he was very very good at and he was in control of the situation. But expressing yourself standing around with a small group of people engaged in small talk can petrify him. Does the shyness/anxiety come from a fear you are going to say something daft or feeling you have nothing worthwhile to contribute to the conversation ?
When I have seen interviews with him he has always just come across a nice quiet unassuming modest guy. Maybe he feels he is expected to put on a great show in front of people just as he used to put on a great show every week on the pitch.
-
"Agents get a bad press but sometimes they look after more than their clients' income. "
It may be quite trite to agree and say that yes, they have their own income to look after. but, I agree with the point. Its a bit like Saul in Breaking Bad.
-
I suppose there is a hint of self-interest in our wish to see Paul find a cure for his obsession with drink.
We wish to have as many reasons to carry on admiring him in his retirement at we did during his career, and so we can't help wishing there was a quick fix to his problems and he could find a way to maintain his dignity as well as his reputation.
Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.
So I don't think the self-medication route is particularly helpful because if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.
My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.
He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.
There are plenty of people who would pay to hear him speak and as Warren Buffet found out, public speaking can be taught.
And if an autistic person like Temple Grandin can learn to do it, then so can Paul McGrath.
Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.
In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.
I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.
And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.
-
if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.
I don't imagine many people on here would have experienced anything like the trauma of being a chronically shy black kid in an Irish orphanage in the 1970s.
-
he is ont he public speaking circuit. however, his problem is a lot to do with his crippling shyness. In certain situations he has stated that he gets panic attacks which leads to the drinking starting again.
-
if you send anyone on a hunt for trauma in their childhood etc, they will always find something.
I don't imagine many people on here would have experienced anything like the trauma of being a chronically shy black kid in an Irish orphanage in the 1970s.
Good point Chico.
-
Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.
My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.
He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.
Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.
In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.
I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.
And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.
This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".
Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.
-
If he showed the same sort of determination and focus he did on the pitch, to kick this thing in the ass he'd come out a winner. That's one of the saddest parts of it. I hope he sorts himself out. I think the trouble too for some people who suffer from alcoholism is not cutting it out altogether. It gets to a point that you just need to cut it out of your life completely because one pint here and there might seem harmless enough but it can set the ball rolling on another binge.
It's not impossible though. Others have overcome this, so hopefully God will too. If he doesn't he'll not have many years left unfortunately. Now is the time to do it though.
-
Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.
My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.
He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.
Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.
In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.
I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.
And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.
This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".
Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.
This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".
Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?
-
Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.
My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.
He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.
Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.
In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.
I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.
And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.
This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".
Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.
This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".
Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?
I see you've chosen to use the word boozers, what does that mean because it'll help me understand where you're coming from? Alcoholics like to refer to 'boozing' and 'social drinking' to pretend they are just like everyone else that 'likes a drink' when in fact they're in denial of the fact that they have become powerless over alcohol. Sporting Chance was set up for ex-sports people yes but access to places like that isn't exclusive in that it's simply a rehab place for footballers etc. There are many hostels/rehabs for the general public too they just aren't as well known.
-
Trying to suggest a cure verges on the impossible because even from our own experience, we all know that boozers are not rare in most walks of life, and it would be absurd to suggest that every single one of the boozers we have known (count them up, there will be many), are boozers because they are dealing with some kind of psychological trauma, they do it because they find it incredibly pleasurable.
My view would be that he is just bored and hasn't enough to fill up his time and just succumbs to his favourite sort of hedonism.
He should get himself on the public speaking circuit.
Whether Paul McGrath can be arsed is another matter.
In the end we might just have to accept that he loves the drink far too much to give it up and that that is his choice and our own disappointment.
I personally am not big on the sympathy thing for boozers because they can be particularly selfish, dishonest and manipulative.
And it has to be accepted that not many people are in a better position to access support and help, than Paul McGrath.
This is a staggering misunderstanding of alcoholism (apart from the selfish, dishonest, manipulative bit which is bang on the money). Similar to Collymore's depression being dismissed by people simply because he's minted and has "nothing to be depressed about".
Alcoholism is no respecter of a person's status and his wealth won't help him deal with it, neither will his access to different agencies due to his fame. To claim that alcoholics drink because it's incredibly pleasurable is a million miles off the mark and I say that not to pick a fight but just to prompt you and anyone else who believes that to research the condition if that's your genuine opinion.
This might be a valid criticism if I'd actually used the word "alcoholic".
Wasn't Sporting Chance set up to specifically help the likes of Paul McGrath?
I see you've chosen to use the word boozers, what does that mean because it'll help me understand where you're coming from? Alcoholics like to refer to 'boozing' and 'social drinking' to pretend they are just like everyone else that 'likes a drink' when in fact they're in denial of the fact that they have become powerless over alcohol. Sporting Chance was set up for ex-sports people yes but access to places like that isn't exclusive in that it's simply a rehab place for footballers etc. There are many hostels/rehabs for the general public too they just aren't as well known.
Boozers?
I would define it as all those drinkers who don't quite manage to screw their lives up entirely by failing to keep a job or wrecking their relationships but generally live lives which are dominated by drink and create misery for everyone about them by being selfish SOBs.
The fact that they do not lose their jobs or get kicked out by their family is largely down to the tolerance of their colleagues and family which amounts to co-dependence in many cases.
This is where the manipulation comes in, as in between their bouts of boozing, boozers will do the full mea culpa, with tears and their best 'helpless victim' act, claiming they need someone to rescue them.
Having negotiated forgiveness they will go through a short period of sobriety before starting the process all over again.
I would reserve the term "alcoholic" for those few people who can be shown to have reached the stage of total chemical dependency where withdrawal produces seizures and DTs.
-
I can understand that differentiation Villadroid and thank you for it. Right enough, the physical symptoms of alcoholics (DTs and seizures) is ample evidence but I know many functioning alcoholics who are no less gripped by the condition. I think there is no difference between the people you've described as boozers and those you call alcoholics. If people class themselves in your 'boozers' category they'll never truly grasp the need for a life changing decision about their drinking, denial is commonplace in that they think they can return to social drinking after a period of sobriety when all that leads to is a new rock bottom.
-
I can understand that differentiation Villadroid and thank you for it. Right enough, the physical symptoms of alcoholics (DTs and seizures) is ample evidence but I know many functioning alcoholics who are no less gripped by the condition. I think there is no difference between the people you've described as boozers and those you call alcoholics. If people class themselves in your 'boozers' category they'll never truly grasp the need for a life changing decision about their drinking, denial is commonplace in that they think they can return to social drinking after a period of sobriety when all that leads to is a new rock bottom.
There is absolutely no denying the destructive grip alcohol has on some people's lives but whether it is caused by addiction or selfishness is open to debate.
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
-
There is absolutely no denying the destructive grip alcohol has on some people's lives but whether it is caused by addiction or selfishness is open to debate.
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
Why do I get the feeling you don't really believe in mental illness? And why am I not really surprised?
EDIT: I wonder how long will it take you to use your patented "my post was misunderstood" tactic?
-
There is absolutely no denying the destructive grip alcohol has on some people's lives but whether it is caused by addiction or selfishness is open to debate.
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
A quite staggeringly *actually i'd better stop myself from saying what I really want to*
-
Villadroid, what you're saying is the equivalent of telling an asthmatic that they should just stop failing to breathe.
-
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
You can have as little doubt as you like, but in a vast majority of cases of any kind of addiction, you are wrong.
-
Villadroid when you have any idea what you're talking about when it comes to addiction, specifically alcoholism (which is one of the worst addictions to do anything about because of the social aspects of it) then please continue to post but what you've written up there is disgraceful. I've had a family member die from conditions resulting from alcoholism and worked for a number of years with an alcoholic and the idea that you can suggest it's self-indulgent is utterly repugnant.
-
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
I don't believe people are avoiding personal responsibility, but then my judgement is clouded by knowing one alcoholic who despite numerous medical interventions, drank himself to death. How anyone would choose to do that is beyond me, ergo I believe personal choice didn't enter the equation.
-
Villadroid when you have any idea what you're talking about when it comes to addiction, specifically alcoholism (which is one of the worst addictions to do anything about because of the social aspects of it) then please continue to post but what you've written up there is disgraceful. I've had a family member die from conditions resulting from alcoholism and worked for a number of years with an alcoholic and the idea that you can suggest it's self-indulgent is utterly repugnant.
I think it would be hard to find a family which hasn't had a member die from the result of alcohol abuse.
I apologise if you are offended but my cynical view of alcohol abusers but it is not entirely a novel invention on my part and anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis would not find it strange at all.
-
TA is a pseudo-psychological theory unsupported by any credible evidence to its accuracy or effectiveness. Don't try and get out of a contemptibly outdated statement by name-dropping a hopelessly outdated theory which you hoped nobody else would have heard of.
-
anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis
Oh yeah, a football fans' forum is bursting with contributors who are familiar with this. When I'm on long journeys home after an away defeat, I talk of little else.
Maybe shift this load of rubbish to off topic?
-
I apologise if you are offended but my cynical view of alcohol abusers but it is not entirely a novel invention on my part and anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis would not find it strange at all.
Here comes the wriggle!
-
Villadroid when you have any idea what you're talking about when it comes to addiction, specifically alcoholism (which is one of the worst addictions to do anything about because of the social aspects of it) then please continue to post but what you've written up there is disgraceful. I've had a family member die from conditions resulting from alcoholism and worked for a number of years with an alcoholic and the idea that you can suggest it's self-indulgent is utterly repugnant.
I think it would be hard to find a family which hasn't had a member die from the result of alcohol abuse.
I apologise if you are offended but my cynical view of alcohol abusers but it is not entirely a novel invention on my part and anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis would not find it strange at all.
Whereas anyone with the merest trace of human decency would find it offensive shite.
-
anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis
Oh yeah, a football fans' forum is bursting with contributors who are familiar with this. When I'm on long journeys home after an away defeat, I talk of little else.
We have met before then, Christ almighty that was a long train journey when I got stuck with you waffling on about transactional analysis for what seemed like days when all I asked was 'why didn't Barry take the penalty?'.
Nice to meet you though.
-
I apologise if you are offended but my cynical view of alcohol abusers but it is not entirely a novel invention on my part and anyone familiar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis would not find it strange at all.
Sorry I am completely unfamiliar with the psychological theory of Transactional Analysis. Would it have been useful to know at the time for the absolute hell on earth which my other half was existing in and the whirlwind of complete and utter shite that those of us close to her were party to during her years of heavy drinking ?
In the fourteen or so years since that she has completely stopped drinking and the scars have gradually healed, we are both of the view that her alcoholism was/is an illness. Maybe I should review my viewpoint as this could be more lies and deceit from her like the ones she used to display when she was a drinker.
Yes I do find some of your views of alcohol abuse offensive, but will accept your apology.
-
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
When they give it up for a good while and then choose to go back to the booze, I have little doubt that they are just being self-indulgent and not responding to a physical need.
I don't believe people are avoiding personal responsibility, but then my judgement is clouded by knowing one alcoholic who despite numerous medical interventions, drank himself to death. How anyone would choose to do that is beyond me, ergo I believe personal choice didn't enter the equation.
It takes years of regular high-levels of alcoholic intake to show signs of physical damage or become an addict.
It would be these years of dedicated drinking for the buzz which I would call the indulgence.
William S. Burroughs made the same claim about heroin, that it takes time to make a junky.
I think it is in this phase where personal choice is possible.
Although it is counter-intuitive to claim people are deliberately self-destructive observing how people behave does suggest it might be the case.
Freud was trying to unravel this when he came up with his theory of the "death drive".
-
Again, the name-dropping, of Burroughs and Sigmund Fraud. Burroughs may say that, but most pharmacological research says something very very different about heroin. Why believe Burroughs over the scientists? For perspective, he also believed that everything that happens is because of the number 23. As for Freud, the death drive is one of the cases - as with a great deal of his output - of his literary instincts getting the better of his attempts at science. All a bit unfalsifiable, like.
-
It takes years of regular high-levels of alcoholic intake to show signs of physical damage or become an addict.
I can't work out whether you're on the wind up or being serious, can you confirm? I'll know if I should be getting annoyed or not then
-
I believe it was the Beatles who said "I am the eggman, they are the eggmen
I am the walrus, goo goo goo joob", which I'm sure you'll agree is as relevant today as it was all those years ago.
-
Villadroid, I'm coming very close to saying something to you which would probably get me a ban.
Please, please stop spouting pseudo-intellectual bollocks about a subject you obviously know fuck-all about. You are now furiously back-tracking and trying to baffle us with bullshit becuae once again you are trying to come over as a worldy-wise intellectual who knows everything about everything.
For once in your sad little life please knowwhen to shut up because you have crossed the line between being annoying to being downright insulting.
And yes this is personal.
-
It takes years of regular high-levels of alcoholic intake to show signs of physical damage or become an addict.
I can't work out whether you're on the wind up or being serious, can you confirm? I'll know if I should be getting annoyed or not then
If his opinions were worth anything then I'd say you should be annoyed. Luckily his posting history proves that this is not the case.
-
I'm reminded of Sir Clement Freud's 1970s assertion that "Henry likes his Minced Morsels"
-
It takes years of regular high-levels of alcoholic intake to show signs of physical damage or become an addict.
I can't work out whether you're on the wind up or being serious, can you confirm? I'll know if I should be getting annoyed or not then
I made my original argument which you disagreed with and the discussion followed from there.
I explained that I was not on about addicts but about annoying coping-boozers.
You thought my use of the word boozer instead of alcoholic was not useful because it reduced the seriousness of the problem.
I thought you had a point.
I thought the discussion was heading towards a reasonable resolution.
Sorry to have got you involved.
Apologies to those who took offence.
-
Edited due to getting into the realms of abuse. I'm just going to ignore him from now on.
-
I suppose I tend to think that when people claim that they are victims of an addiction they are avoiding personal responsibility, a conclusion which is usually supported by their their lies, craftiness and manipulation.
Wow.
That's about as high-handed as it gets. It even has your trademark ridiculous 2+2=5 conclusion thrown in, too.
-
Very bold statement by Villadroid that. Very bold.
I have posted about my Fathers alcoholism earlier on this thread. I do not find Villadroids statement offensive, just very ill informed.
If i was you Villadroid, and this is just a suggestion, find out where the nearest AA meeting is to where you live and go along one night, afternoon.
I think you may just change your views on this subject, once you really understand it, or a little bit about it.
Once you see the lost lives, the upset, the broken families and also the people who have become recovering alcoholics and have turned their lives around then i think i would listen to your comments. At the moment you obviously have no idea about this subject. Sorry, but you don't.
-
Absolutely Dan.
I also wonder why he sought to bring this into a discussion about a club legend whose alcoholism is linked to some very real demons. Does Paul McGrath rank as a 'genuine addict' or an 'annoying coping boozer' on the Villadroid scale? If the first, he should have saved the point for a more relevant thread and shouldn't have been surprised it got people's backs up. If the second, I might lack Coops' and Ger Regan's restraint in my response. I'd recommend he read Paul's autobiography to get an idea of his issues. He might not think it is high brow enough for him, but if he reads it it might just give him a new layer of understanding on the situation.
-
Absolutely Dan.
I also wonder why he sought to bring this into a discussion about a club legend whose alcoholism is linked to some very real demons. Does Paul McGrath rank as a 'genuine addict' or an 'annoying coping boozer' on the Villadroid scale? If the first, he should have saved the point for a more relevant thread and shouldn't have been surprised it got people's backs up. If the second, I might lack Coops' and Ger Regan's restraint in my response. I'd recommend he read Paul's autobiography to get an idea of his issues. He might not think it is high brow enough for him, but if he reads it it might just give him a new layer of understanding on the situation.
Agree 100% mate. I don't want to have a go at Villadroid, i find most of his posts very interesting, if a bit confusing at times, difference in intellect.
This is a subject that, unless you have been through it yourself, or with a close friend or relative you should not make silly comments about. Just my view, but i will stick by it for the rest of my life.
-
Very bold statement by Villadroid that. Very bold.
I have posted about my Fathers alcoholism earlier on this thread. I do not find Villadroids statement offensive, just very ill informed.
If i was you Villadroid, and this is just a suggestion, find out where the nearest AA meeting is to where you live and go along one night, afternoon.
I think you may just change your views on this subject, once you really understand it, or a little bit about it.
Once you see the lost lives, the upset, the broken families and also the people who have become recovering alcoholics and have turned their lives around then i think i would listen to your comments. At the moment you obviously have no idea about this subject. Sorry, but you don't.
I accept my admonishment.
It is almost certain that I am prejudiced.
Years ago my neighbour had a boyfriend with a drink problem and he was always stealing her money for drink and all the rest of the stuff.
She would kick him out and he'd go stay with his mother for a few weeks and then he'd use their young daughter to manipulate my neighbour and she would let him come back.
He even went to AA a few times but didn't keep it up.
He would be okay for a couple of months and then it would start over again.
I thought he was selfish and manipulative and found it impossible to give him any sympathy.
Anyway that's me done on the subject.
Thanks for your comment.
-
Very bold statement by Villadroid that. Very bold.
I have posted about my Fathers alcoholism earlier on this thread. I do not find Villadroids statement offensive, just very ill informed.
If i was you Villadroid, and this is just a suggestion, find out where the nearest AA meeting is to where you live and go along one night, afternoon.
I think you may just change your views on this subject, once you really understand it, or a little bit about it.
Once you see the lost lives, the upset, the broken families and also the people who have become recovering alcoholics and have turned their lives around then i think i would listen to your comments. At the moment you obviously have no idea about this subject. Sorry, but you don't.
I accept my admonishment.
It is almost certain that I am prejudiced.
Years ago my neighbour had a boyfriend with a drink problem and he was always stealing her money for drink and all the rest of the stuff.
She would kick him out and he'd go stay with his mother for a few weeks and then he'd use their young daughter to manipulate my neighbour and she would let him come back.
He even went to AA a few times but didn't keep it up.
He would be okay for a couple of months and then it would start over again.
I thought he was selfish and manipulative and found it impossible to give him any sympathy.
Anyway that's me done on the subject.
Thanks for your comment.
No probs mate. It is a difficult subject to talk about and i do not disagree with all of your prior comment at all. But to understand any addiction, you have to have been through it or very close to it.
-
http://www.aa.org.au/members/twelve-steps.php
-
I heard Paul on Talksport this morning and he sounded dreadful..I hope I am wrong
-
I heard it as well. Surely someone from the station would have spoken to him before he went on air and figured out he didn't sound too good. It didn't make for easy listening.
-
I heard it as well. Surely someone from the station would have spoken to him before he went on air and figured out he didn't sound too good. It didn't make for easy listening.
I don't listen to Talksport so I'm probably biased here but I suspect they'd be rubbing their hands thinking that this* could get them some free publicity. They're a commercial station after all.
* I didn't hear the interview so I'm not sure in what way McGrath sounded bad.
-
I heard it as well. Surely someone from the station would have spoken to him before he went on air and figured out he didn't sound too good. It didn't make for easy listening.
I don't listen to Talksport so I'm probably biased here but I suspect they'd be rubbing their hands thinking that this* could get them some free publicity. They're a commercial station after all.
* I didn't hear the interview so I'm not sure in what way McGrath sounded bad.
He sounded like he'd had a few too many. In all fairness to Alan Brazil he did cut the interview short.
-
I've said it before, but Paul desperately needs to find a source of income out of the public eye. His condition cannot be helped by appearing at events such as last saturday / sunday, or regular interviews and other public appearances. Easier said than done though, of course.
-
I heard the interview this morning and have heard him on Talksport before. There was a clear difference he couldnt get his words out and he definetly sounded like he had a few. So very sad. The interview definately got cut.
He is a true legend but I doubt he realises it himself, and instead fights the demons.
He must keep fighting it and all of us Villa fans must be there whenever and however we can be
-
I heard it too and it wasn't good. Just pray he doesn't follow the same path as Gazza.
-
My cousin met him last Thursday in Dublin and said he seemed fine.
My cousin's wife works in Dunnes Stores (sort of M&S) and took a uniform round to a colleague after work. She wasn't in so she knocked on the next door neighbour's and McGrath answered the door - apparently his mom lives there and he was visiting her. Cousin and wife said he was charming and sober (and this was after 10pm) so maybe there is hope for him. I hope so.
-
To be fair to Brazil he sussed it quite quickly and waffled on for ages as he does and they didn't go back to Paul but it was uncomfortable listening.
-
To be fair to Brazil he sussed it quite quickly and waffled on for ages as he does and they didn't go back to Paul but it was uncomfortable listening.
Alan Brazil is not the right person to be around if you have a drink problem.
-
To be fair to Brazil he sussed it quite quickly and waffled on for ages as he does and they didn't go back to Paul but it was uncomfortable listening.
Alan Brazil is not the right person to be around if you have a drink problem.
He was on the phone to him, Paul was in Wexford where he lives. They talk to him quite regularly about Villa and Man United. The last time he was on he was in great form, it was just after Benteke had signed his contract and I noticed he says "we" when talking about Villa but not when talking about them.
-
Yes it was uncomfortable this morning however I thought Brazil did well to protect him and not prolonging the agony.
-
maybe the Holte can finally retire the Paul McGrath my Lord song. It wasn't clever to start with, has been an insult to him for years and is now at a paradoxical point where you'd expect opposing fans to be singing it to us
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
-
Crass and irresponsible.
-
Crass and irresponsible.
Yes,agreed.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Is that a real quote or have you just made it up?
-
Was talking to my folks about this - very sad. My Mum always says hes "such a nice lad" after she sent him home for his dry cleaning ticket once (hence my nickname).
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
ill drink to that , cheers
-
Was talking to my folks about this - very sad. My Mum always says hes "such a nice lad" after she sent him home for his dry cleaning ticket once (hence my nickname).
Hang on, lets get this right. Your mother ran some sort of dry cleaning business and Paul McGrath was a customer and had forgot his ticket when he came in to collect ? She had the temerity to make him go all the way home to get it and come all the way back ?
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
-
Was talking to my folks about this - very sad. My Mum always says hes "such a nice lad" after she sent him home for his dry cleaning ticket once (hence my nickname).
Hang on, lets get this right. Your mother ran some sort of dry cleaning business and Paul McGrath was a customer and had forgot his ticket when he came in to collect ? She had the temerity to make him go all the way home to get it and come all the way back ?
Ha ha yes. She worked in Johnsons in Lichfield and he was a customer. I will quote my mother directly: "I know you're Paul McGrath but you can't have your dry cleaning without your ticket". Apparently everyone in the shop fell about - including the man himself.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Is that a real quote or have you just made it up?
I didn't make it up. I think it's a genuine quote.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Is that a real quote or have you just made it up?
I didn't make it up. I think it's a genuine quote.
Apologies, I genuinely didn't think anyone could be so crass.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
Christ that's painful to listen to. Some friends of mine saw him in Dublin after the match last week and said he was pissed. I really hope Villa fans weren't lining up the drinks for him.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Is that a real quote or have you just made it up?
I didn't make it up. I think it's a genuine quote.
Apologies, I genuinely didn't think anyone could be so crass.
He has form, he once enquired about the health of Bob Monkhouse during an interview despite the fact that Monkhouse was dead.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Is that a real quote or have you just made it up?
I didn't make it up. I think it's a genuine quote.
Apologies, I genuinely didn't think anyone could be so crass.
He has form, he once enquired about the health of Bob Monkhouse during an interview despite the fact that Monkhouse was dead.
Alan Brazil: "I was sad to hear yesterday about the death of Inspector Morse, TV's John Shaw."
Mike Parry: "John Thaw, Alan."
Alan Brazil: "Do you know, I've been doing that all morning. John, if you're listening, sorry mate."
-
On the plus side, if he's being an ignorant and insensetive idiot like that at least he's not banging on about how Ipswich should have won the league in 81.
-
His stupidity stems from his bitterness over 81. It explains why all Albion fans are thick.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
You have to question the ethics of such journalism.
They certainly must have known he was going to embarrass himself.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
You have to question the ethics of such journalism.
They certainly must have known he was going to embarrass himself.
He's on the phone in another country. How do they know what state he's in?
-
How on Earth would they? He's been interviewed before and been fine.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
You have to question the ethics of such journalism.
They certainly must have known he was going to embarrass himself.
He's on the phone in another country. How do they know what state he's in?
I just assumed that they phoned him up and had him waiting on the line, so they could go to him straight away.
I thought they would use call-screening and would have spoken to him beforehand and known.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
You have to question the ethics of such journalism.
They certainly must have known he was going to embarrass himself.
He's on the phone in another country. How do they know what state he's in?
I just assumed that they phoned him up and had him waiting on the line, so they could go to him straight away.
I thought they would use call-screening and would have spoken to him beforehand and known.
Some researcher would have rung him and said "You're on in five minutes" or however long. You can't judge someone's sobriety in two words.
-
"Our talking point this morning is George Best, his liver transplant and the booze culture in football. Don't forget, the best caller wins a crate of John Smith's bitter." - Alan Brazil, TalkSport radio host.
Well, I for one can't think of anything better than a crate of John Smith's bitter to help you quit drinking alcohol.
;D
[ Invalid YouTube link ]
Is this what people were on about? Didn't hear the interview as I don't listen to Talkshite.
You have to question the ethics of such journalism.
They certainly must have known he was going to embarrass himself.
He's on the phone in another country. How do they know what state he's in?
I just assumed that they phoned him up and had him waiting on the line, so they could go to him straight away.
I thought they would use call-screening and would have spoken to him beforehand and known.
Some researcher would have rung him and said "You're on in five minutes" or however long. You can't judge someone's sobriety in two words.
Perhaps I am a bit too protective of the big fellah.
-
It's not about being protective. He has a problem, but it seems that he can't accept it.
-
It's not about being protective. He has a problem, but it seems that he can't accept it.
Isn't that what "interventions" are about, where your friends all turn up and tell you straight that you have a problem?
-
It's not about being protective. He has a problem, but it seems that he can't accept it.
Isn't that what "interventions" are about, where your friends all turn up and tell you straight that you have a problem?
We've said all through this thread though that you can't help someone who won't help themself.
-
It's not about being protective. He has a problem, but it seems that he can't accept it.
Isn't that what "interventions" are about, where your friends all turn up and tell you straight that you have a problem?
We've said all through this thread though that you can't help someone who won't help themself.
Oh how I wish that that wasn't true.
-
On Twitter now, seems like he's had a few.
-
On Twitter now, seems like he's had a few.
It doesn't look good.
-
My brother-in-law took early retirement a couple of years ago from Dublin County Council and now spends his time as a taxi driver. A couple of weeks ago he collected Paul McGrath from a gig at Setanta and took him to his Dublin residence a journey of about 25-30 minutes. Now, my brother-in-law is not too much into football but is a gregarious character and engaged Paul in conversation mainly about addiction and alcoholism. He told me that Paul recognises his problems but is sometimes (as we all know) powerless to do anything about it. One of the main problems being the willingness of people to buy him drinks.
Anyhow, the real reason for posting this is just for balance and that, he said that Paul looked well and seemed in full control of himself. I mentioned this to Dave Woodhall as I was leaving the H&V soiree last Friday and Dave said to me " this is something that never gets reported and people never hear about." So Dave, there you go, your are dead right so I thought I'd let the folks know. May his recovery continue.