Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: rutski on November 11, 2011, 08:06:44 AM
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here is a link to gg and their 5 0 win against iceland. He scores 2 superb goals. Gonna be a great player for sure!
http://www.espn.co.uk/football/sport/video_audio/120732.html (http://www.espn.co.uk/football/sport/video_audio/120732.html)
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If the hype is to be believed & he can do it at the top level, then he won't be here for very long.
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If the hype is to be believed & he can do it at the top level, then he won't be here for very long.
Christ..what a depressing thought that is, but true.
He does look very comfortable on the ball and the free kick last night was top draw.
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Not every player is a mercenary.
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Not every player is a mercenary.
Its not about being a mercenary, its about making progress in your chosen career.
Players leaving moving clubs to increase their wages and/or improve their career prospect is no different to a builder or an accountant changing employers for the same reason
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Not every player is a mercenary.
Its not about being a mercenary, its about making progress in your chosen career.
Players leaving moving clubs to increase their wages and/or improve their career prospect is no different to a builder or an accountant changing employers for the same reason
If he is going to be a top player then he will attract the top clubs who play in the top competitions, which isn't us.
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Here are the goals for anyone not in the UK
http://www.goalsarena.org/video/under-21-u21/10-11-2011-england-5-0-iceland-euro-u21-qualif_en.html (http://www.goalsarena.org/video/under-21-u21/10-11-2011-england-5-0-iceland-euro-u21-qualif_en.html)
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Id like to think we could at least get him a regular in the first team before we even think about him leaving!
Cant understand why he hasn't been given more time on the pitch surely he could come on for Petrov?
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Id like to think we could at least get him a regular in the first team before we even think about him leaving!
Cant understand why he hasn't been given more time on the pitch surely he could come on for Petrov?
Petrov has been better this season. Gardner should be given a chance ahead of Delph, who hasn't impressed me at all.
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Delph isn't in the team though and unlikely to get back in anytime soon now that Jenas is fit and Herd is playing so well.
I could be that the club and AM are handling the Gardner situation exactly right. Mybe the Jenas loan is to allow him to progress naturally with no pressure, so that in 12-months time he's a regular once Jermaine goes back to Spuds?
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Well played Gary, just seen the free kick and if Henderson had scored it the press would be going mad this morning!
Lets play it cool and keep Gary at the club for the best years of his career.
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FFS people - can we just enjoy seeing an obvious talent coming through our ranks, and hopefully this one actually is a Villa fan for real.
Lets just enjoy it before we pack him off to money bags FC eh lads
IT does seem that sometimes our club really cannot do anything without the doom merchants taking hold
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Lets give him a chance he looks very very good.
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I've got a great idea, why don't we never play him then no one will see how good he is and we can keep him for ever-cue evil laugh.
We could keep him locked away at Bodymoor like some demented art criminal thief....
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FFS people - can we just enjoy seeing an obvious talent coming through our ranks, and hopefully this one actually is a Villa fan for real.
Lets just enjoy it before we pack him off to money bags FC eh lads
IT does seem that sometimes our club really cannot do anything without the doom merchants taking hold
Hear hear.
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Would like to see him in the first team at the earliest opportunity to see how he can cope with it.
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Fantastic goals for the lad.
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Wonder if he took on the role that Herd is filling and then Herd took over from Hutton at right back.
Delph could retrain as a left back too and with Clark and Cahill then that's a defence that I would be happier with rather than the current bunch of mistakes waiting to happen
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Warnock has been good all season. Dunne and Collins throw themselves at everything and are experienced enough to handle most situations, concentration is what needs working on - dropping one of them would be okay, but I'd not want to see both dropped. Hutton has been dodgy, but it's early days.
A back four of Delph - Clark - Cahill - Herd would get destroyed to be honest.
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Wonder if he took on the role that Herd is filling and then Herd took over from Hutton at right back.
Delph could retrain as a left back too and with Clark and Cahill then that's a defence that I would be happier with rather than the current bunch of mistakes waiting to happen
Hutton seems to be improving and I don't like midfielders playing at fullback, other than in emergencies. And when the Bolton Defender leaves I think he'll be off to a club in Europe for more money than we'll pay him.
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Shame but it was a nice thought about Cahill
Herd was MOM against Wolves playing as full back and I thought that Delph played there quite promisingly and a great deal more measured in his tackling, which can be a bit scary in midfield.
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Herd at right back did play well yes, but he was electric in midfield. Covered every blade of grass and was involved in defence and attack. I don't think it's worth losing that in midfield just because Hutton has been dodgy. He's getting better and I think he'll prove a good purchase. I wouldn't want Delph at left back, especially over Warnock. I, currently, wouldn't want Delph in the starting line up in any position.
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If the hype is to be believed & he can do it at the top level, then he won't be here for very long.
AM is going to play him at left back, no point playing him in midfield cos we have Ivanhoe
Anyway at what 19 he won't get a chance until he is a least 26.
he looks good so chuck him on for 20 mins in a few games
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I can't see the goals on either link doh, will have to look on you tube later, get him in the team though he deserves a chance over Hefty
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AM is going to play him at left back, no point playing him in midfield cos we have Ivanhoe
Anyway at what 19 he won't get a chance until he is a least 26.
08457 90 90 90
I think they can help you.
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I like the look of Gardner, Herd and Clark as a midfield 3. Football ability, physical presence and energy in abundance there. Not writing off Delph or Bannan either, while using the experience of Petrov and Jenas while they get up to speed. The sad thing is I almost overlooked Ireland who, if he could get his act together, is probably the best player out of the lot of them.
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I think like I have said before that Gary will go on to be a top top player I just hope it is with us I really like the way he plays and that free kick was brilliant it was the type of free kick that Beckham takes I just hope he gets a chance sooner rather than later and I also hope we can keep out of the reach of all the money bag clubs.
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Wonder if he took on the role that Herd is filling and then Herd took over from Hutton at right back.
Delph could retrain as a left back too and with Clark and Cahill then that's a defence that I would be happier with rather than the current bunch of mistakes waiting to happen
Was thinking that myself. Trouble with that is Hutton would be seen as a failure from a Mcleish signing. But that would definetly be a better option ........
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I'm surprised that he would be allowed to take the free kicks when there were bigger names/egos on the pitch.
The other players either think he is a bit special or he is a very confident lad.
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I'm surprised that he would be allowed to take the free kicks when there were bigger names/egos on the pitch.
The other players either think he is a bit special or he is a very confident lad.
He seemed to be telling Henderson he was taking it as Henderson kept on asking if he was sure. I suppose at 3-0 up with minutes left they decided it didn't matter. I do wonder if he would have been allowed if the score or conditions were different.
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Two wonderful goals from Gardner but then he spoiled it with the irritating badge-kissing which seems to be a family trait!
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I've seen Gary play five or six times in the flesh and my take is that he could indeed be a superstar, at his own age group he is the best I've seen, when he steps up to the reserves he looks very promising but Bannan eclipsed him on the three occasions I saw. We don't have to rush this but fuck me, he's good. Its a shame we have such a paucity of players now as if we had him a few years ago we could have introduced him more steadily without the expectation he's now going to be subject to.
On another point that Watford forward looks a player.
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Two wonderful goals from Gardner but then he spoiled it with the irritating badge-kissing which seems to be a family trait!
Not really an issue at international level surely, can't see him swapping for Estonia any time soon
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'Even as a young lad I was Tallin everyone how much football meant to me'
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Wiltshire is 19 and Ramsey is 20. Blend him into the first team slowly. He could easily replace Petrov and with him and Jenas in the middle we would have a lot more energy ......
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I'm looking forward to seeing Gary and Daniel Johnson in the first team, they both look like they could do a job for us at the moment.
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I'd like to see him play in a 3 with Petrov and Herd.
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Not every player is a mercenary.
Its not about being a mercenary, its about making progress in your chosen career.
Players leaving moving clubs to increase their wages and/or improve their career prospect is no different to a builder or an accountant changing employers for the same reason
If he is going to be a top player then he will attract the top clubs who play in the top competitions, which isn't us.
FFS people - can we just enjoy seeing an obvious talent coming through our ranks, and hopefully this one actually is a Villa fan for real.
Lets just enjoy it before we pack him off to money bags FC eh lads
IT does seem that sometimes our club really cannot do anything without the doom merchants taking hold
Exactly what I wanted to say.
Here's to us taking the game by storm over the next few years with Gabby and the rest of our young lads leading the charge.
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Gary Gardner is a quality player and is just going to get even better.
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FFS people - can we just enjoy seeing an obvious talent coming through our ranks, and hopefully this one actually is a Villa fan for real.
Lets just enjoy it before we pack him off to money bags FC eh lads
IT does seem that sometimes our club really cannot do anything without the doom merchants taking hold
Well said sir.
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He may not have played for us first team wise yet but Gardner is as good and the same type of player as Gerrard at that age.
A bold statement I know but referee Gerrard was injury free when he played for England then.
Gardner is THAT good.
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With jenas ineligible for spurs, it seems a choice between bannan and Gardner for a place on the bench, though that could change if herd, petrov or agbonlahor are injured
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Really looking forward to seeing the lad play in the first team proper. Would be lovely to think he'll live up to the expectation.
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Really looking forward to seeing the lad play in the first team proper. Would be lovely to think he'll live up to the expectation.
I agree. Perspective required here methinks - he scored two good goals late on against Iceland under 21s. When he has taken games against Man Utd and Chelsea by the scruff of the neck in the way a young Gerrard or Rooney could, I shall start raving...
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The problem we have with the team is that they are just about winning or drawing. The manager is therefore very reluctant to change things much as he knows what he will be in for if we start losing. If we continue in this vein, we will never develop good young players to a PL level.
Why is it that our young players never seem to get a look in until they are 19 or 20, by which time they will start to lose a bit of the drive that they showed as 16 or 17 year olds and what put them ahead of others in their age group.
Even in the MON years we never looked that convincing that we could carry one or two young players in the team so that they could develop with experience. This, I believe, is why we never seem to get too many youngsters that push on and become 1st team regulars. For every Gabby, we have 5 or 6 that move on to other clubs for nominal fees.
We are never going to finish near the top with the way finances dictate the finishing order at the present, so why do we continue with playing average older players that are on the down slope of their careers. I, for one, would much rather see enthusiasm of youth to rekindle my enthusiasm for the game, than the run-of-the-mill stuff that is served up now. Just look at Herd, a player that was never at the head of the queue but showing, given the chance, the life he has given to a turgid midfield.
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hear hear Old man villa. Get the younger generation in. Gardner good enough to run that midfield. Put Jack Grealish on the bench. Give us some hope for the future.
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There's a fine-line between blooding them and destroying their confidence if they fail to live up to expectations on their first start.
By all accounts McLeish and Grant know only too well of how special Gardner can potentially be.
He will get his chance this season, probably from the bench initially and then it's up to him which seems the logical way to do it.
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The problem we have with the team is that they are just about winning or drawing. The manager is therefore very reluctant to change things much as he knows what he will be in for if we start losing. If we continue in this vein, we will never develop good young players to a PL level.
Why is it that our young players never seem to get a look in until they are 19 or 20, by which time they will start to lose a bit of the drive that they showed as 16 or 17 year olds and what put them ahead of others in their age group.
Even in the MON years we never looked that convincing that we could carry one or two young players in the team so that they could develop with experience. This, I believe, is why we never seem to get too many youngsters that push on and become 1st team regulars. For every Gabby, we have 5 or 6 that move on to other clubs for nominal fees.
We are never going to finish near the top with the way finances dictate the finishing order at the present, so why do we continue with playing average older players that are on the down slope of their careers. I, for one, would much rather see enthusiasm of youth to rekindle my enthusiasm for the game, than the run-of-the-mill stuff that is served up now. Just look at Herd, a player that was never at the head of the queue but showing, given the chance, the life he has given to a turgid midfield.
I agree with that wholeheartedly. I'd rather see a young player who might not make it and who might make mistakes be given a chance than to watch the overpaid, barely average, honest triers our squad seems to be filled with.
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The problem we have with the team is that they are just about winning or drawing. The manager is therefore very reluctant to change things much as he knows what he will be in for if we start losing. If we continue in this vein, we will never develop good young players to a PL level.
Why is it that our young players never seem to get a look in until they are 19 or 20, by which time they will start to lose a bit of the drive that they showed as 16 or 17 year olds and what put them ahead of others in their age group.
Even in the MON years we never looked that convincing that we could carry one or two young players in the team so that they could develop with experience. This, I believe, is why we never seem to get too many youngsters that push on and become 1st team regulars. For every Gabby, we have 5 or 6 that move on to other clubs for nominal fees.
We are never going to finish near the top with the way finances dictate the finishing order at the present, so why do we continue with playing average older players that are on the down slope of their careers. I, for one, would much rather see enthusiasm of youth to rekindle my enthusiasm for the game, than the run-of-the-mill stuff that is served up now. Just look at Herd, a player that was never at the head of the queue but showing, given the chance, the life he has given to a turgid midfield.
I agree with that wholeheartedly. I'd rather see a young player who might not make it and who might make mistakes be given a chance than to watch the overpaid, barely average, honest triers our squad seems to be filled with.
completely disagree. i think the scenario you are looking at is exactly the one that dol had with fa youth cup winners. they need to be drip fed into teams because the prem is so strong! if not you will sink like we did with the likes of ridgewell, cahill, davis the moores etc!
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No doubt one of the Sunday papers will be linking him with a move to Manure etc in the summer!
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Thanks for posting the goals Desi
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He's a very special talent and anyone who's seen him play in his own age group will know how he looks like a man amongst boys! I'd have him on the bench for every game and blood him reasonably gently that way. I think he's good enough now but just needs carefully blending into the rigours of the Prem. He could be great for us and hopefully it will be a very long time before the Mancs/Chelsea start tempting him away!
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Is he a Villan or a Bluenose?
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Does it matter?
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If the hype is to be believed & he can do it at the top level, then he won't be here for very long.
He does look very comfortable on the ball and the free kick last night was top draw.
Top drawer
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Does it matter?
Yes, it could be the difference between him becoming the next Phil jones or the next Gabby.
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By what I've heard he's one of us.
That said being a diehard Everton fan never stopped Rooney going to United.
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He does look very comfortable on the ball
[/quote]We'll soon train that out of him.
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By what I've heard he's one of us.
That said being a diehard Everton fan never stopped Rooney going to United.
Think he's a bluenose
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Everton seem to be able to bring young players through into the 1st team by making the given player one of the substitutes and consistently giving them the last 15 or 20 minutes not just leaving them on the bench game after game.
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By what I've heard he's one of us.
That said being a diehard Everton fan never stopped Rooney going to United.
Think he's a bluenose
He has clearly stated in an interview that Craig and his mom and dad are blue noses and he has always been a Villa fan. Been with Villa since he was 6yrs old. He is going to be a massive player for us. He has a certain presence that all very good players have ......
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Any time I've seen him interviewed on avtv he seems very grounded, mannerly and just a nice fella. In fairness, it's similar to how his brother came across in interviews too. So it was good to see him either taking the free-kick off Henderson as it shows he's not shy on the pitch or that the other players have seen how good he is in training and so let him take it.
He must have been the youngest player in the U21 squad for that game, right?
And was it his debut at that level?
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Was his 3rd game for U21`s but first goals. Not sure about the youngest ........
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Was his 3rd game for U21`s but first goals. Not sure about the youngest ........
3rd Appearence as a sub. I have a feeling he hasn't even achieved 90 mins total on the park with those either. Not the youngest even in the current squad for appearences or goals. Oxlade-Chamberlain has three and he is only 18.
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Haven't seen this mentioned elsewhere, but caught bits of the England U21 game against Belgium tonight. Gardner came on as a sub and looked busy, putting in some dangerous balls from what I saw. Unfortunately his most telling contribution was right at the death when he was caught out making a risky pass back to a team-mate. A Belgian fella nicked the ball and they scored from rebound off the post. Obviously it doesn't make him shit but maybe just a timely reminder not to place all our hopes on the lad.
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It's more like a reminder to him that however brilliant he is he has to keep his focus.
I'm not even remotely concerned if he'll be a Villa first teamer or not.
As far as I'm concerned it's a certainty.
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He should have had a run out with Villa by now, there is no excuse for not giving him 10 minutes here and there.
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I am sure that when we get to a game where we are comfortable and a couple of goals to the good then he will get some game time
I am not sure we are there yet
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I am sure that when we get to a game where we are comfortable and a couple of goals to the good then he will get some game time
I am not sure we are there yet
It would help if he was on the bench, should this eventuality arise.
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I am sure that when we get to a game where we are comfortable and a couple of goals to the good then he will get some game time
I am not sure we are there yet
Lol when was the last time this happened?
As you say were definitely not their yet we could be 5-0 up against wigan with 20 minutes to go and i wouldn't feel comfortable
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Paul Franks on WM is saying Gardner is going out on loan
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Paul Franks on WM is saying Gardner is going out on loan
I'm happy with that on the proviso that we have a recall option. Any idea where?
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Paul Franks on WM is saying Gardner is going out on loan
I'm happy with that on the proviso that we have a recall option. Any idea where?
He didn't say but he seemed pretty certain it was happening
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Gardner hat trick tonight. How can anyone say he is not ready for his first team debut ? Is it possible for anyone to believe he would not of been better on the right of midfield rather than Hutton last night or anywhere in our midfield ?
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Gardner hat trick tonight. How can anyone say he is not ready for his first team debut ? Is it possible for anyone to believe he would not of been better on the right of midfield rather than Hutton last night or anywhere in our midfield ?
It's one thing being good in the u19s; it's a whole different ball game to make it in the Premier League as part of a struggling team. The lad needs time to develop.
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Put him in the bloody team
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He's ready now. For any level. It doesnt mean he wont have to ease himself in and get to grips with Premier League football but he's exceptional and he's ready.
If we had a stellar group of players barring his way I'd understand but we havent. He's already better than most if not all of our midfielders.
Throw him in now and not just him either. There's a few other players that should be called up to get a taste. We're not going anywhere in the league this season so it's a golden opportunity in a way.
If they send him on loan I will be fucking furious and if they dont give him some first team action soon I'll want to know why.
He's a giant in his own age group and there's really nowhere else to go now but the first team. Get it done Villa.
The kids were brilliant again tonight.
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I respect your opinion Maz. I went tonight GG was immense also impressed with Johnson. Who do you think is ready?
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He was indeed good tonight!
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I think Putting him in our horrible first team will soon turn him into a talentless hoofer. We've managed to take the sting out of bent who has been pretty potent through out his career even when at lowly Charlton and Ipswich. We have a habit of turning decent players into shit.
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I respect your opinion Maz. I went tonight GG was immense also impressed with Johnson. Who do you think is ready?
Cheers. Gardner immediately with the likes of Johnson, Burke and maybe Carruthers not far behind. After that, take your pick from the whole squad. Seriously.
But certainly the likes of Grealish (winger), Drennan (striker), Siegrist (Goalie), Robinson (striker), Graham (winger) Cameron (midfielder) and Webb (defender) have impressed me. Along with a few others.
Whilst the first team is going through a transitional phase I'd start blooding some of these kids. I'm a bit of a gambler though. I dont expect the management to agree.
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I think Putting him in our horrible first team will soon turn him into a talentless hoofer. We've managed to take the sting out of bent who has been pretty potent through out his career even when at lowly Charlton and Ipswich. We have a habit of turning decent players into shit.
Is that the Bent who scored twice in the last home game?
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Gardner hat trick tonight. How can anyone say he is not ready for his first team debut ? Is it possible for anyone to believe he would not of been better on the right of midfield rather than Hutton last night or anywhere in our midfield ?
It's one thing being good in the u19s; it's a whole different ball game to make it in the Premier League as part of a struggling team. The lad needs time to develop.
He's out of their league and needs to develop in the First team....and we need him to develop...no pressure then.....but if he's good enough he's old enough
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Unless they are exceptional talents (Rooney / Wiltshire / Fabregas) there are not a lot of 19 year olds that come and make their mark on the premiership - and i do not know if GG is that good yet.
What i do know is years ago i worked with a guy who had won almost every trophy imaginable for amatuer football and was eventually signed by the villa in the mid 60's after a while he had set the reserves alight and was asked to join the first team for training
In his own words them were the days of pre match meals being a fry up and a couple of fags yet the practice games passed him by - that was how big a step up it was.
I would imagine in the heat of the prem you could as easily be ruined as make it so blooding youngsters requires critical timing - look at MA as a prime example of too soon in my opinion
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I'm not sure about that. Albrighton was introduced at the right time because he had a great debut season. He may be scratching around for form right now but I dont think that's related and besides, he isn't being played.
And for my money if you're going to call Wilshere an exceptional talent then Gardner easily fits that bill too.
Yes I accept you have to be careful with a lot of these players and timing is crucial but Gardner, being exceptional, is different. Like Rooney and Fabregas he's way ahead of his peers and so needs to be involved as soon as possible. He is definitely ready for it.
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will Maz forward CV to Randy to be filed in safe for future reference
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I have a letter from Fergie.
It's asking me to lend her a few quid but it's something.
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He looked almost bored at times last night as he's far outgrown his age group, he needs to be stretched by being involved with the first team. He scored a hat-trick yet it seemed to be Johnson's brief to play as the attacking midfielder, he stayed deep most of the time.
A rare talent.
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He looked almost bored at times last night as he's far outgrown his age group, he needs to be stretched by being involved with the first team. He scored a hat-trick yet it seemed to be Johnson's brief to play as the attacking midfielder, he stayed deep most of the time.
A rare talent.
yes but is he as good as Emile or Hutton ?
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To be fair Heskey looked immense at 19.
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Gardner hat trick tonight. How can anyone say he is not ready for his first team debut ? Is it possible for anyone to believe he would not of been better on the right of midfield rather than Hutton last night or anywhere in our midfield ?
It's one thing being good in the u19s; it's a whole different ball game to make it in the Premier League as part of a struggling team. The lad needs time to develop.
He's out of their league and needs to develop in the First team....and we need him to develop...no pressure then.....but if he's good enough he's old enough
He now has had time to develop. He was given plenty of time after his injury to recuperate. Since then he has gone from strength to strength. He has three games for England U21`S and has simply been outstanding in the reserves. They will either put him on loan (which i think would cause a riot) or start on the bench with a few cameo roles which i am sure he would be better than anything we have in midfield. Gardner is ready ........
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It's interesting that other teams do not seem to have such an issue about "is he old enougb yet?" - I can't be arsed to check all the details, but how old were the following when they debuted and then started holding down a regular slot? -
at the Arse: Fabregas, Wilshere, Walcott, Clichy, Gibbs, Ramsey?
at Everton: Rooney, Rodwell, Gosling, Coleman?
at Manure: Gibson, Cleverley, Fabio / Rafael, Smalling
The question is simple: is GG good enough to make an impact at Premiership level? - if yes, then give him some game-time; if not, put him out on loan in the Championship for regular competitive football.
But don't do nothing!
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It's interesting that other teams do not seem to have such an issue about "is he old enougb yet?" - I can't be arsed to check all the details, but how old were the following when they debuted and then started holding down a regular slot? -
at the Arse: Fabregas, Wilshere, Walcott, Clichy, Gibbs, Ramsey?
at Everton: Rooney, Rodwell, Gosling, Coleman?
at Manure: Gibson, Cleverley, Fabio / Rafael, Smalling
The question is simple: is GG good enough to make an impact at Premiership level? - if yes, then give him some game-time; if not, put him out on loan in the Championship for regular competitive football.
But don't do nothing!
For all the kids who make it there are at least twice as many who don't. Just looking at the Villa back catalogue, where are S Moore, L Moore, Hogg, Forrester, etc, etc now?
I don't doubt the kid's good (although I've never seen him play myself) and in other circumstances I'd be all for giving him a taste of the 1st team, but we're struggling at the moment and putting him under pressure to deliver when more seasoned pros around him aren't can have long-term damaging effects.
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The question is simple: is GG good enough to make an impact at Premiership level? - if yes, then give him some game-time; if not, put him out on loan in the Championship for regular competitive football.
But don't do nothing!
For all the kids who make it there are at least twice as many who don't. Just looking at the Villa back catalogue, where are S Moore, L Moore, Hogg, Forrester, etc, etc now?
I don't doubt the kid's good (although I've never seen him play myself) and in other circumstances I'd be all for giving him a taste of the 1st team, but we're struggling at the moment and putting him under pressure to deliver when more seasoned pros around him aren't can have long-term damaging effects.
Or, it could be the making of him.
Having more seasoned pros in the side is fine if they're motivated, committed and giving leadership. Sometimes, however, the young, spunky player who has the right temperament is a better choice.
Since I do not work with any of the players I cannot make the judgement - I can only go from what I've read and heard about players like GG.
The list of recent Villa duds contains players who were all give a chance and found wanting (unlike Vassell, GA, Albi, BB and Herd) - it sounds to me like itn is now time to see whether GG has what it takes.
My key point was that the club should deploy GG in a role that forces him on to more stretch targets - Championship loan or first team opportunity - rather than do nothing.
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I think these damaging effects are a myth personally or at least overstated.
As long as the fans give him time and he's used in the role he is accustomed to I see no problems at all.
If you hold him back too long it could be more damaging to his confidence than to throw him in.
When you have an exceptional talent like Gardner (and he's been touted as such since he was under 10), holding them back is pointless. This isn't a player we're not sure of, it's one of the outstanding young players in the country.
And his attitude says to me he will thrive when he does get his chance. He wants the ball, he wants to be involved, he wants to control the game and when the likes of £20m Liverpool big bollocks Jordan Henderson try and take free kicks he tells them to fuck off and sticks them in himself, because he knows he's better than they are and THAT is exactly what we need.
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However good Gardner is, he isn't going to be our saviour. However, he can't be any worse an option than playing a shit rightback in midfield, so chuck hin into the fray I say. A bit of excitement would be nice.
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I'm confused about Herd. I thought he actually is a midfidler that was forecd into the back four a couple of times. As for Gardner. Surely he'd have done a better job on monday night then Hutton did on the right hand side, even if it's neither of their natural position. Gardner will play a part at some point soon. McLeish will have to start scraping the barrell soon enough, and he'll be forced to use Gardner.
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Younger players have been chucked in at the deep end before and come out of it well. Let's play this kid. If he is going to be a world beater, then lets see it. The very best crop of young players are usually regulars by now.
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We can't be playing Gardner on the wing like we did with his brother as it will be a waste. He is better in the centre and you will be negating his shot power and tackling on the wing. I would expect he could be used instead of or in partnership with Herd.
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There's absolutely no need to use Gardner wide. We have N'Zogbia and Albrighton for that plus other players who can cover there and in a year or two, some very promising options there (Grealish, Graham etc..).
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I think these damaging effects are a myth personally or at least overstated.
As long as the fans give him time and he's used in the role he is accustomed to I see no problems at all.
If you hold him back too long it could be more damaging to his confidence than to throw him in.
When you have an exceptional talent like Gardner (and he's been touted as such since he was under 10), holding them back is pointless. This isn't a player we're not sure of, it's one of the outstanding young players in the country.
And his attitude says to me he will thrive when he does get his chance. He wants the ball, he wants to be involved, he wants to control the game and when the likes of £20m Liverpool big bollocks Jordan Henderson try and take free kicks he tells them to fuck off and sticks them in himself, because he knows he's better than they are and THAT is exactly what we need.
My points exactly.
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It's interesting that other teams do not seem to have such an issue about "is he old enougb yet?" - I can't be arsed to check all the details, but how old were the following when they debuted and then started holding down a regular slot? -
at the Arse: Fabregas, Wilshere, Walcott, Clichy, Gibbs, Ramsey?
at Everton: Rooney, Rodwell, Gosling, Coleman?
at Manure: Gibson, Cleverley, Fabio / Rafael, Smalling
The question is simple: is GG good enough to make an impact at Premiership level? - if yes, then give him some game-time; if not, put him out on loan in the Championship for regular competitive football.
But don't do nothing!
For all the kids who make it there are at least twice as many who don't. Just looking at the Villa back catalogue, where are S Moore, L Moore, Hogg, Forrester, etc, etc now?
I don't doubt the kid's good (although I've never seen him play myself) and in other circumstances I'd be all for giving him a taste of the 1st team, but we're struggling at the moment and putting him under pressure to deliver when more seasoned pros around him aren't can have long-term damaging effects.
Whilst you do have a point, some of the ones listed above and some you didn't list (Osbourne) have had poor attitudes rather then poor ability at the top level. Stefan and Luke are prime examples. Both thought they had made it and both have plenty of skill. You can't tell me Stefan, at 28, is only good enough for the Southern Prem or the United Counties league.
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BTW, I did write some stuff about GG earlier this year - you may want to read it here: http://bit.ly/nb53ZV; I'd be interested to know whether you agree with the synopsis.
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He's Mr September (inset) in the 2012 calendar.
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hope we're not considering loaning him out at the moment. (http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/transfer-news/Aston-Villa-transfer-gossip-Gary-Gardner-wanted-on-loan-by-Leeds-Coventry-and-Ipswich-article834181.html
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He needs to play first team footy, whether its for us or out on loan. If we're going to carry on playing 442, or at least 2 central midfielders, then I think he's behind Petrov, Delph, Herd and Jenas.
I could see him being asked to fill in on the right mind.
But overall, I'd stick him out on loan pretty sharpish, let him get a few games. Not a half season loan like we did last season though.
I also have a nagging doubt that part of Gardner's prowess may be down to simply having developed earlier than his contemporaries. He simply seems bigger, stronger, more athletic than his contemporaries. That's no bad thing, but it won't give him a great advantage forever. Does he have the quick feet and passing range to be a top class midfielder? His brother certainly doesn't!
Let's see if he can do it in the rough and tumble of the championship. Bannan and Fonz couldn't. That's a concern, though it may be the type of player they are. A 6'2" midfielder who gets up and down should suit it down to the ground.
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People expecting Craig Gardner MK2, forget it.
Craig is a decent player but comparing him to Gary is like Apples and Star Destroyers.
Being a big strong lad is a bonus but his game isnt based on it and it's not the reason he is so dominant at his level. It's because of his appreciation of the game and raw ability. He's a natural footballer.
He very much reminds me of a young Gerrard and he could be to us what he was/is to Liverpool. The sort of player you can build a team around. A leader by example. He clearly loves the club too.
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Gone to coventry on a loan until jan 3rd. WHY????????
He must be a better option than Heskey or,Hutton.There is a need to protect players ,but how are we
going to find out if he is good enough now?
Personally i would play Herd at RB and put Gardner in with Jenas,Petrov and NZog.
But then again i am not fan of negative football like our manager seems to be.
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If he had to go out on loan I was hoping for a better club than bloody struggling Coventry
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I didn't realise Coventry had the best academy in the country ::) ::)
http://www.skybluestalk.co.uk/threads/12864-Gardner-In
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I'm glad he's gone to Coventry. He can stay wherever he is currently living and get some championship experience after impressing with the youngsters, the reserves and England. If he has a good spell though he needs to be given a chance as soon as he gets back, while his form and confidence is high.
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I'm glad he's gone to Coventry. He can stay wherever he is currently living and get some championship experience after impressing with the youngsters, the reserves and England. If he has a good spell though he needs to be given a chance as soon as he gets back, while his form and confidence is high.
Agreed. Couldn't have summed it up better myself.
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People expecting Craig Gardner MK2, forget it.
Craig is a decent player but comparing him to Gary is like Apples and Star Destroyers.
Being a big strong lad is a bonus but his game isnt based on it and it's not the reason he is so dominant at his level. It's because of his appreciation of the game and raw ability. He's a natural footballer.
He very much reminds me of a young Gerrard and he could be to us what he was/is to Liverpool. The sort of player you can build a team around. A leader by example. He clearly loves the club too.
Hopefull that's not a Craig Gardner style love for the club either!
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I wonder how much we'll get for Gary Gardner in a couple of years....
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Why? I thought Peter Grant was building GG up to be involved with the first team very soon.
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Sending him to Coventry just when he's really doing well and would probably benefit from being around the first team is a strange one. Still, what do I know. I wouldn't have played Hutton at right midfield so clearly know nowt about football.
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Why? I thought Peter Grant was building GG up to be involved with the first team very soon.
Januarys not far away I suppose.Maybe they don't want to throw him in with this tough run of games coming up
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Why? I thought Peter Grant was building GG up to be involved with the first team very soon.
Januarys not far away I suppose.Maybe they don't want to throw him in with this tough run of games coming up
I suppose, but he is on fire at the moment.
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i mean seriously all the fans would love to see him get 5 mins in a villa shirt before being packed off on loan, and COV OF ALL PLACES!!! i for 1 am very disappointed by this as the only hope that remained was that some kids would step up and raise our spirits, imho another giniger bollox cock up
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I am really struggling to understand what is going on at the club lately. It's just one mindfuck after another.
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I am really struggling to understand what is going on at the club lately. It's just one mindfuck after another.
I hope we have contacted SAF to see if sending Gary was the right decision.
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It is being reported in the Coventry Telegraph and The Express and Star that he is joining Coventry at the foot of the championship. From staring in the England U21s and our Next Gen series he goes to a team struggling to survive. OK it will give him some first team experience but he should be very close to getting on the bench for us. I really hope he doesn't get injured.
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Thought we might see him feature on Sunday with what everyone's been saying, seems a strange one.
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Mods, please merge with the other thread started at same time.
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I am really struggling to understand what is going on at the club lately. It's just one mindfuck after another.
I hope we have contacted SAF to see if sending Gary was the right decision.
I bet Randy can't wait to get the reply so he can mount it and put it up in the boardroom
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Has this been announced officially yet?
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I am really struggling to understand what is going on at the club lately. It's just one mindfuck after another.
I hope we have contacted SAF to see if sending Gary was the right decision.
Well, there's probably a fair bit of space in Lerner's safe these days. A big, Habib Beye wages sized space.
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I totally agree HT, perhaps The Ginge could see we had a glint of hope and was ordered to dash it.
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Sounds sensible to me. If they're preparing him for entry to the first team soon; a few full games in the competitiveness of the championship (how I hate typing that) is far better than 5 minute cameos for Villa. Its only 6 weeks.
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I've merged all the Gardner threads and amended the title. No point in having three seperate threads for the lad.
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Has this been announced officially yet?
http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2525726,00.html
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Has this been announced officially yet?
http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2525726,00.html
Thanks.
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For Gardner's sake, I hope he really is as good as the hypabole on here suggests or he's going to sink under the level of expectation when he does eventually play for us
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There goes my team selection for Sunday. I'd have him in the team now - looked solid enough and ready earlier in the season - and if McLeish thinks Heskey and Hutton are better midfielders than Gardner he's lost what little plot he had.
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Well isn't that annoying?
Even something as simple as seeing a prospect like Gardner getting some game time would have lifted morale.
Oh well, when you have world class midfielders like Heskey and Hutton I suppose you can afford to do this.
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For Gardner's sake, I hope he really is as good as the hypabole on here suggests or he's going to sink under the level of expectation when he does eventually play for us
i dont care if he stinks the place out when he plays for us, i like seeing the youth team make it good or bad give him a game in claret and blue before tossing him aside for a month, but twisted logic may be we are notoriously bad over the festive period and have a tough run of games so maybe hes going to cov in preperation for a chance in jan and feb
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
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I hope this is purely to get him first team football at a reasonable level, to prepare him to come into the first team when he comes back.
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If the squad was a lot bigger / better, I could understand it.
But it isn't, so I can't.
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For Gardner's sake, I hope he really is as good as the hypabole on here suggests or he's going to sink under the level of expectation when he does eventually play for us
i dont care if he stinks the place out when he plays for us, i like seeing the youth team make it good or bad give him a game in claret and blue before tossing him aside for a month, but twisted logic may be we are notoriously bad over the festive period and have a tough run of games so maybe hes going to cov in preperation for a chance in jan and feb
Let's hope were not throwing him into a relegation scrap by then
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
The frequency of reserve games has diminished in the past few seasons so loaning has become the best way of getting promising players the experience and fitness levels they will need in the Premier League.
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Lets face it he is never going to get in our midfield with Heskey playing a blinder every week and with Hutton on the wing.
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Maybe this is for the best although I'd hoped he would get a better gig than a struggling Coventry side, I'd have like to have seen him eased into our first team for the Swansea game but perhaps he isn't looking ready after training with them.
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
Did Manchester United loan out Beckham? Did we loan out Gabby? Given that he's not played a single minute for the first team yet is already being hyped up as a potential world-beater I don't see the problem in letting him have a couple of games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before, especially as our next month or so isn't the type of situation to pitch him into. Hopefully he'll be with us for another decade - six weeks maximum isn't going to make much difference.
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Don't be silly Dave, that's far to sensible.....what on earth were you thinking? ;)
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They'd better look after him.
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
Did Manchester United loan out Beckham? Did we loan out Gabby? Given that he's not played a single minute for the first team yet is already being hyped up as a potential world-beater I don't see the problem in letting him have a couple of games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before, especially as our next month or so isn't the type of situation to pitch him into. Hopefully he'll be with us for another decade - six weeks maximum isn't going to make much difference.
Were Manchester United playing Alan Hutton and Emile Heskey in midfield?
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I'm guessing it has been done in light of the fixtures we have next month. We're unlikely to throw him in in most of these games.
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
Did Manchester United loan out Beckham? Did we loan out Gabby? Given that he's not played a single minute for the first team yet is already being hyped up as a potential world-beater I don't see the problem in letting him have a couple of games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before, especially as our next month or so isn't the type of situation to pitch him into. Hopefully he'll be with us for another decade - six weeks maximum isn't going to make much difference.
Were Manchester United playing Alan Hutton and Emile Heskey in midfield?
EXACTLY!
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I'm guessing it has been done in light of the fixtures we have next month. We're unlikely to throw him in in most of these games.
I've just had a look and there are winnable games against Swansea, Bolton, Liverpool and Stoke with the Arsenal home game also a chance of a draw. Its not as bad as I feared.
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Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO
Pantomime voice on - Oh yes they did
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
Did Manchester United loan out Beckham? Did we loan out Gabby? Given that he's not played a single minute for the first team yet is already being hyped up as a potential world-beater I don't see the problem in letting him have a couple of games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before, especially as our next month or so isn't the type of situation to pitch him into. Hopefully he'll be with us for another decade - six weeks maximum isn't going to make much difference.
Were Manchester United playing Alan Hutton and Emile Heskey in midfield?
EXACTLY!
Exactly what?
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I do not see the point in loaning Gardner out to Coventry. He has been playing excellent for the reserves and in the next gen series so should be worthy of a place on the bench if not a start for the starting 11. Did everton loan out Rooney? Did Liverpool loan out Michael Owen? Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO! They believed in their youth player and gave them a chance to shine and boy did those players pay back the faith their club shown in them.
Yet another pathetic decision by the club!
Did Manchester United loan out Beckham? Did we loan out Gabby? Given that he's not played a single minute for the first team yet is already being hyped up as a potential world-beater I don't see the problem in letting him have a couple of games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before, especially as our next month or so isn't the type of situation to pitch him into. Hopefully he'll be with us for another decade - six weeks maximum isn't going to make much difference.
Were Manchester United playing Alan Hutton and Emile Heskey in midfield?
And what difference does that make? If Gardner isn't ready for the first team yet, he isn't ready regardless of who else we've got.
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And what difference does that make? If Gardner isn't ready for the first team yet, he isn't ready regardless of who else we've got.
How are we going to find out if he isn't? And even if he isn't, it's difficult to imagine him doing any worse than Hutton.
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And what difference does that make? If Gardner isn't ready for the first team yet, he isn't ready regardless of who else we've got.
How are we going to find out if he isn't? And even if he isn't, it's difficult to imagine him doing any worse than Hutton.
As I said earlier, giving him a few games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before might, just might, be a good idea in the context of a career that could last another 15 years.
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As its only a short loan till January this tells me that the management are getting him ready for the first team. If he was off till the end of the season it would be worrying, but for all the GG fans out there this is good news.
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And what difference does that make? If Gardner isn't ready for the first team yet, he isn't ready regardless of who else we've got.
How are we going to find out if he isn't? And even if he isn't, it's difficult to imagine him doing any worse than Hutton.
As I said earlier, giving him a few games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before might, just might, be a good idea in the context of a career that could last another 15 years.
I'd rather see him in the squad getting a few run outs as a sub.
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So would I although I would add the caveat that, at least when I've seen him in the reserves, he's been outshone by Bannan who also doesn't seem to be trusted enough for regular starts.
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And what difference does that make? If Gardner isn't ready for the first team yet, he isn't ready regardless of who else we've got.
How are we going to find out if he isn't? And even if he isn't, it's difficult to imagine him doing any worse than Hutton.
As I said earlier, giving him a few games at a more competitive level than he's ever played at before might, just might, be a good idea in the context of a career that could last another 15 years.
I'd rather see him in the squad getting a few run outs as a sub.
Which I've no doubt in another six weeks he will do. Meanwhile he can learn his trade a bit more.
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That six weeks could, and quite probably will, see us plummeting down the table with the games we've got coming up. Sometimes you need to take a chance on something different.
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That six weeks could, and quite probably will, see us plummeting down the table with the games we've got coming up. Sometimes you need to take a chance on something different.
That being the case he's best out of it instead of the latest target for our ever-patient followers. I'd rather not have a case of sink or swim for someone who might turn out to be an Olympic swimming champion in the future but can barely manage a length of the pool yet.
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That six weeks could, and quite probably will, see us plummeting down the table with the games we've got coming up. Sometimes you need to take a chance on something different.
This. The supporters can relate to youth players coming through to the first team, especially a talent who has been on fire in the last few weeks. Why kill the momentum?
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Going out on loan didn't do the likes of Rio Ferdinand, David Beckham & Michael Carrick (to name a few) any harm when they were younger. They're just a few that gained experience at a lower level and went on to have good careers winning trophies.
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So would I although I would add the caveat that, at least when I've seen him in the reserves, he's been outshone by Bannan who also doesn't seem to be trusted enough for regular starts.
Perhaps they don't fit the remit of 'Get behind the ball lad, and when you get it, hoof it forward.;
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That six weeks could, and quite probably will, see us plummeting down the table with the games we've got coming up. Sometimes you need to take a chance on something different.
This is all dependent on whether AM persists with the ill-fated Hutton experiment. Relying right now on someone who hasn't played a minute of senior football, and whose handful of minutes playing for the under 21s resulted in two spectacular goals, admittedly, but otherwise showed no signs of dominating against the likes of Iceland et al.
This is all starting to sound a tad hysterical. Give the bloke a chance to try the next step up with a bit less pressure.
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Did leeds loan out James Milner? NO
Pantomime voice on - Oh yes they did
Yes they did but im sure he made his inital debut with Leeds first then got farmed out to Swindon. Villa should have used that approach with GG to see if futher development was required.
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Going out on loan didn't do the likes of Rio Ferdinand, David Beckham & Michael Carrick (to name a few) any harm when they were younger. They're just a few that gained experience at a lower level and went on to have good careers winning trophies.
The point is, we have some absolute dross in our squad and first team at the moment. Our midfeld in particular is dreadful, absolute gubbins, and yet we have an extremely hot prospect and aren't prepared to give him a chance. It isn't like he needs to develop physically either, he looks to be an absolute beast.
That being the case he's best out of it instead of the latest target for our ever-patient followers. I'd rather not have a case of sink or swim for someone who might turn out to be an Olympic swimming champion in the future but can barely manage a length of the pool yet.
Coventry are second to bottom, so how do you think our loveable neighbours will take to a Villa player if he doesn't make an impact?
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I really can't see what the fuss is about.He's going to get valuable fist team experience and will be back in a month's time.How he performs for Coventry will give our management a better indication of whether he's ready for our first team than they'll get from watching him in the reserves.I think the fact that he is going on a short term loan is more of an indication that he IS being considered for the first team.
By the way Milner was loaned out by Leeds.If I remember correctly he went to Swindon.
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I really can't see what the fuss is about.He's going to get valuable fist team experience and will be back in a month's time.How he performs for Coventry will give our management a better indication of whether he's ready for our first team than they'll get from watching him in the reserves.I think the fact that he is going on a short term loan is more of an indication that he IS being considered for the first team.
By the way Milner was loaned out by Leeds.If I remember correctly he went to Swindon.
Agree entirely. If I was being picky, I might not have chosen Coventry, but it doesn't matter too much.
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If he's not going to play for us just yet, then his development is better served gettinf game time in the Championship.
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I really can't see what the fuss is about.
It's about a decision the club has taken at a time when they can do nothing right. So surely it must be wrong??
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Coventry are second to bottom, so how do you think our loveable neighbours will take to a Villa player if he doesn't make an impact?
At which point he walks away from them without a second thought.
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I think the fact he hasn't been given a run out in the first team to see if he is capable of playing at this level before being loaned out is an issue with me. With the run of games coming up, he should have been given like 20/30mins here and there to see if he can cope playing in the PL before loaning him out to the championship. Yes, James Milner did get loanded out but i'm sure (although I could be very wrong) that he made his debut as a 16yr for Leeds before they loaned him out to Swindon? This is what Villa should have done with Gardner. The guy is obviously playing very very well, albeit in the reserves and next gen comp but like I have said before, if a player is good enough, at least give them a chance just like Everton did with Rooney and LFC did with Owen.
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This is all starting to sound a tad hysterical. Give the bloke a chance to try the next step up with a bit less pressure.
I disagree. I see it as a urge to see something fresh and exciting. Personally I feel the club have given up hope to be competitive in the league, and we have also given up on our most winnable cup without a fight against Bolton.
What else is there for supporters this season to be excited about? The FA Cup? It will be let down like the LC in my opinion. We keep hearing long term, but we see no action of it.
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Then you've got January to look forward to haven't you? :-)
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So would I although I would add the caveat that, at least when I've seen him in the reserves, he's been outshone by Bannan who also doesn't seem to be trusted enough for regular starts.
Bannan is several years older and more experienced, and although I rate Bannan, has never outshone Gardner that I can recall. Nor do I consider him to have anything like the potential Gardner has.
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Then you've got January to look forward to haven't you? :-)
I do not trust AM to give him a consistent and fair opportunity to prove himself.
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Good idea IMO. He's just starting to hit some good form and some game time in the championship will improve fitness & will be a higher level than the U19s.
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As long as he is not warming the bench there then I so no reason why he shouldn't go there. Feel it's make or break time for him though.
Good luck Gary - see you in the New Year
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I think the fact he hasn't been given a run out in the first team to see if he is capable of playing at this level before being loaned out is an issue with me. With the run of games coming up, he should have been given like 20/30mins here and there to see if he can cope playing in the PL before loaning him out to the championship. Yes, James Milner did get loanded out but i'm sure (although I could be very wrong) that he made his debut as a 16yr for Leeds before they loaned him out to Swindon? This is what Villa should have done with Gardner. The guy is obviously playing very very well, albeit in the reserves and next gen comp but like I have said before, if a player is good enough, at least give them a chance just like Everton did with Rooney and LFC did with Owen.
Totally agree. GG should be on the bench each game and brought on for the final 30 minutes or so to see how he performs at first team level..
He's a fine talent and in our situation we should be utilising our best players, additionally if he's in the squad, he's gelling with the other first team players.
Is it more about saving his wages, even a month's money??
Are we struggling that much?? :-\
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Then you've got January to look forward to haven't you? :-)
I do not trust AM to give him a consistent and fair opportunity to prove himself.
I think I see how the land lies. So if you don't trust AM to play him, why not loan him to a manager who will? Win-win!
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Some spectacular over reactions on here. He's down the road, playing at a better level and will also see how shit his career could end up if he loses focus and ends up at a steaming turd like Cov full time. I think it's good for us to have a look at him at a higher level and I expect him to come back and be involved for us straight away.
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Sounds sensible to me. If they're preparing him for entry to the first team soon; a few full games in the competitiveness of the championship (how I hate typing that) is far better than 5 minute cameos for Villa. Its only 6 weeks.
I agree - at least they've done something, rather than let him get bored in our reserves.
I hope he makes such a great impresion that he'll come back in January ready to help us off the foot of the table as well.
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Just what he needs, the experience will benefit him and give us an idea if he's ready for the first team.
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Then you've got January to look forward to haven't you? :-)
I do not trust AM to give him a consistent and fair opportunity to prove himself.
I think I see how the land lies. So if you don't trust AM to play him, why not loan him to a manager who will? Win-win!
No, I want AM to give him a chance. Admittedly, he will get games at Coventry, but who is indispensable from our current midfield? If he struggles in our first team, they can always take him out of the lime light with a loan move.
I am not trying to moan for the sake of it, I do not understand the logic of the club.
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I dont think its over reaction to be honest. I think many fans would have liked to have seen him given a shot in the first team squad first to see if he really has the potential to step up. I have nothing against Villa loaning him out but without testing him out first considering he is playing very well? Thats where I have a problem. Just say if he was given his chance, for example, against Swansea this weekend (last 20/30mins of the game) and he has a blinder and helps us get 3 points? Yes, this is hypothical speak but we will never know. Yes he will get alot of game time at Cov but have you seen their league position? He is going to be playing along side players who are under severe pressure to get results to get them out of trouble. Surely that negativity will rub off on him if results are still not going their way.
Oh well, nothing we can do about it now. Just want to wish him all the best and I how his has a successful spell there with a view to breaking into the first 11 at avfc
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Is it more about saving his wages, even a month's money??
Are we struggling that much?? :-\
no - if they want to save money they could ship Ireland out somewhere on loan (we'd miss him far less as well).
GG's going to get some great experience and will come back ready to rock for us. In the meantime McMinge should give more exposure to other deserving youngsters like Clark, Herd, Delph, Albrighton and Bannan, all of whom should form the mainstay of our team (along with GG) for some years.
My concern is in the possibility of players like Clark buggering off for first team football as a CB - another Cahill scenario - which would be madness.
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The argument people are wheeling out is, let him get valuable first team experience. Why can't he get that here, we're light in that area anyway.
If he does well great, but if that's coupled with us losing games in December, it's certainly going to be considered another stick to beat Mcleish with.
Monday night, confused and annoyed me in ways that left me with serious concerns and we obviously need to find a balance in midfield. He clearly doesn't seem to trust N'Zogbia or Ireland, Albrighton is MIA so we're light in that department. I would have thought he'd have been a great option for us with the amount of games coming up.
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If Gary good enough for Coventry team , he is good enough for ours
I would rather see Gardner, Delph , Bannan , Herd and Albrighton play than Petrov, Hutton and Heskey in midfield
I dont see the point on loaning out .
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The argument people are wheeling out is, let him get valuable first team experience. Why can't he get that here, we're light in that area anyway.
Because the step up to from the reserves to the Premier League will be a lot easier if he's played a few first team games in the Championship.
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If Gary good enough for Coventry team , he is good enough for ours
We're not that bad.
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We're in danger of getting a bit carried away with Gardner. Very good prospect but he's still got a lot to learn about adult football and the expectation already being heaped on him is ridiculous. Let him develop at a natural pace and play a few Championship games, plenty of others have benefitted from doing the same.
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I'm in two minds about this. Playing well for the reserves should mean you're knocking on the first team door but i think in the long run it'll be good for him.
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I can see both sides of the argument here.
he gets invaluable experience, we learn a bit more about him, he's young and you don't want to put too much pressure on him (which i think is what happened to Albrighton last season)
but ...
we've got a midfield last seen featuring Emile Heskey and Alan Hutton, we have struggled there all season, we need options there, maybe he's good enough now and this is our chance to find out.
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I think this is very good for his development. Yes, we could do with a bit of inspiration in the middle right now, but a few months playing at senior level without the weight of such expectation on his shoulders as he would be with us will benefit him. Gabby didn't set the world alight at Watford, but in the end everything the club has had him do has helped him become the player he is today. As fans we are crying out for a player to hang our hats on and he's been dynamite at youth level. But we need to keep a sense of perspective here. He's not leaving the club for any significant length of time and hopefully when he returns he'll be that much better and understand where he might need to improve to push himself on even further.
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I can see both sides of the argument here.
he gets invaluable experience, we learn a bit more about him, he's young and you don't want to put too much pressure on him (which i think is what happened to Albrighton last season)
but ...
we've got a midfield last seen featuring Emile Heskey and Alan Hutton, we have struggled there all season, we need options there, maybe he's good enough now and this is our chance to find out.
You're forgetting about Jenas. He's got to have first dibs at staking a claim and while he's at it Gary gets a few games for Cov to see how he gets on paying against older and more experienced players.
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Disappointed on the one hand as I was hoping to see him play for us soon. On the other hand, I can see the logic in trying to get him some game time at a higher level than he's used to before he hits our first team.
Probably would have preferred him to go to somewhere like Leeds rather than a club that loses every week.
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Good (though shame it's Cov...!). He's 19 years old, he needs to be playing some senior football. Doubt we'll be playing him in December, given the run of games we've got.
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We should have tied Gardner to a 5 year deal before loaning him out.
We are a feeder club now, so if we don't tie people down we will lose them to early and for not enough money.
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http://www.ccfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10269~2526469,00.html
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If Gardner is as good as all the hype then we better get used to him playing for another team...
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I think I'm right in saying that he signed a five year deal recently.
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I hope that's true
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If Gardner is as good as all the hype then we better get used to him playing for another team...
I heard him say on AVTV that his dream is to be playing in front of 42,000 crowds at Villa for many years to come. Hopefully his future will be one of skippering Villa to plenty of trophies.
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I heard him say on AVTV that his dream is to be playing in front of 42,000 crowds at Villa for many years to come.
The way things are going that'll be split over two games!
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What if does well at Coventry,the pressure to play him would be too much to ignore.
AM has made the right decision for a change.
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If Gardner is as good as all the hype then we better get used to him playing for another team...
I heard him say on AVTV that his dream is to be playing in front of 42,000 crowds at Villa for many years to come. Hopefully his future will be one of skippering Villa to plenty of trophies.
Thats been a dream of mine for last 58 years. Starting to give up hope ;)
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If Gardner is as good as all the hype then we better get used to him playing for another team...
I heard him say on AVTV that his dream is to be playing in front of 42,000 crowds at Villa for many years to come. Hopefully his future will be one of skippering Villa to plenty of trophies.
so that'll be once a season then when he's at City or United... ;)
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Coventry is a strange choice unless they've a player we want first dibs on or the manager has a good relationship with theirs, the few Cov fans I know say they are dire this year. Its proximity will be a factor but are there not any other, better teams close by?
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Oh well, it's done now. I hope it goes swimmingly for him and he comes back in one piece.
We're most certainly going to need him in the new year.
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Cant see the issue really, he goes there and gets 7 games under his belt and returns just before the FA Cup 3rd Rnd tie where I would expect him to go straight into our side...in the meantime Herd, Petrov, Jenas, Delph, Bannan and Ireland get to compete for the 2/3 centre midfield spots.
We arent short of central numbers its just that;
a) the balance or the formation has yet to gel, we have to hope that putting Jenas in there over the next 6 games will help that...heres hoping :-)
b) the ball has been bypassing the midfield too often when hoofed at a striker who is no target man....I'd still occasionally like to see Bannan play deeper and be the one who receives the early pass from the back four and tries to prompt the forward flow
c) none of the wide players (bar Gabby) have fired, N'Zogbia and Albrighton have contributed barely anything and Heskey is being shoe-horned into the team out wide, I'm not convinced that is not for his defensive abilities at set pieces.
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are there not any other, better teams close by?
Birmingham City? Hmmm, maybe not!
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I heard him say on AVTV that his dream is to be playing in front of 42,000 crowds at Villa for many years to come.
The way things are going that'll be split over two games!
Snigger
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Let's see what the kid is made of, as long as it's a short term deal, we will hopefully see him develop on a bit further and get a chance in the first team later on in the season. Not a bad thing in my opinion.
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In 9 years time when Gary Gardner captains England to triumphant glory at Euro 2020, Coventry fans will cling to the fact that they helped to develop him by giving him his first taste of league football ;)
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I was sceptical about this at first but I can see the value in it now. Gary is flying form-wise at the moment and by going there he will hopefully be able to build on that. It will also mean that he won't suffer confidence wise from being at the club through the inevitable difficult period.
The only reservations I'd have is that if Coventry continue to do badly and that damages his confidence.
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The worst thing about this is that I'll have to watch Coventry and hope that he does well. Bastards.
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c) none of the wide players (bar Gabby) have fired, N'Zogbia and Albrighton have contributed barely anything and Heskey is being shoe-horned into the team out wide, I'm not convinced that is not for his defensive abilities at set pieces.
Albrighton hasn't been given a chance this year, that's a bit harsh to say.
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c) none of the wide players (bar Gabby) have fired, N'Zogbia and Albrighton have contributed barely anything and Heskey is being shoe-horned into the team out wide, I'm not convinced that is not for his defensive abilities at set pieces.
Albrighton hasn't been given a chance this year, that's a bit harsh to say.
I'm with Gareth, he started brilliantly with his career but he makes simple mistakes when he plays. Playing the ball out instead of hoofing it, im not all the impressed by his final delivery, his crosses can be excellent but he doesn't always pick the right option imo
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I can't see any harm in this at all.
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When are the knockout games in the next gen series scheduled for ?
If its during his loan period will he be able to come back and play in them ?
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The worst thing about this is that I'll have to watch Coventry and hope that he does well. Bastards.
yes, that thought crossed my mind to
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I cant wait for him to come back and get playing for us. Hope he does well at Cov.
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When are the knockout games in the next gen series scheduled for ?
If its during his loan period will he be able to come back and play in them ?
IIRC when Bannan was on loan at Blackpool he came back to play a reserve or youth game, possibly youth cup, so hopefully Gardner can do the same.
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Good news for the lad.
Gives him so valuable proper matchday experience, hopefully to put him in good stead for 2012 with Aston Villa.
We've hyped the lad up on here recently. What if he had stayed and came on for a few matches and had a stinker. It would have crushed his confidence.
I was hoping Coventry would be playing the Blose in his loan spell. Alas no.
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I was a bit peeved when I heard he was off to Cov to be honest as I thought on his current form he might get a look in with the big boys over the next few games . I suppose if this isn't a part of the AM masterplan then at least he will be getting some experience at a level higher than he is currently playing in.
Good luck Gary . Come back with all guns blazing and make it impossible for AM to leave you out of the first team.
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The only sense I can make of this is if it is being seen as a ramp up to his first team debut when he gets back. I just hope he doesn't pick up an injury while he's there
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I think I see this loan spell, limited as it is, as a declaration of intent from our manager and the coaches. If he does as well as expected, he's up for selection from January 1st.
Go Gary! X
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I do worry about young Gary, it appears he was the one to choose Coventry.
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Can't believe some of the negative comments on here.
The lad has yet to play at Premiership level, he's on the brink of coming through, a few consecutive games at the next level up from where he is currently playing can't do him any harm. He will walk into the Cov team.
Playing in the premiership is a big step, he wouldn't have played in any games for us over the next month. Hopefully he'll come back having shown he's ready to step up. I expect him to make an impact when he returns.
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'I do worry about young Gary, it appears he was the one to choose Coventry.' quote
I have a very nice auntie in Coventry. It's not that bad. Perhaps Gardner minor also has relatives there?
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I do worry about young Gary, it appears he was the one to choose Coventry.
If thats the case i'd imagine its because they're local, less travelling, settled location etc.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
I'm as positive about our NextGen challenge as the next man but assuming Ajax beat Rosenborg then aren't we away at Barcelona in the quarters? Though I understand they've been playing there U17 team so far the smug bastards.
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Makes sense to choose Cov if the other clubs that were interested weren't local. Gives me another game/result to look out for of a weekend I suppose.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
I'm as positive about our NextGen challenge as the next man but assuming Ajax beat Rosenborg then aren't we away at Barcelona in the quarters? Though I understand they've been playing there U17 team so far the smug bastards.
This team with Gardener in, has to fancy their chances against anyone. IIRC the only games we have lost was when he was not playing.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
I'm as positive about our NextGen challenge as the next man but assuming Ajax beat Rosenborg then aren't we away at Barcelona in the quarters? Though I understand they've been playing there U17 team so far the smug bastards.
Well their 'youth' (B) team play in the Spanish second tier, so doubt they can release players from that team as it compromises the promotion to the top league if they play weaker players.
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Looking at the other groups it looks like the last 8 will be:
Ajax, Villa, Barcelona, Marseille, Sporting, Liverpool, Inter and Spurs. We've as much chance as anyone though Gardener is the key to winning it.
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Other than his obvious talent, he has something else that most of our promising young players of recent years didn't, he's physically big and strong enough to hold his own in the premiership.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
I'm as positive about our NextGen challenge as the next man but assuming Ajax beat Rosenborg then aren't we away at Barcelona in the quarters? Though I understand they've been playing there U17 team so far the smug bastards.
Well their 'youth' (B) team play in the Spanish second tier, so doubt they can release players from that team as it compromises the promotion to the top league if they play weaker players.
Pretty sure B teams playing in second tier in spain can't be promoted to top flight
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'I do worry about young Gary, it appears he was the one to choose Coventry.' quote
I have a very nice auntie in Coventry. It's not that bad. Perhaps Gardner minor also has relatives there?
I had a very nice auntie in Burnham but it was still a shithole.
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As the loan is short I am quite happy. He can go and play some Championship competitive games and develop. The only worry is that Cov are a crap team and he could end up doing lot of work.
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As it's not too far from me, I'm thinking I might take in a game at the Ricoh to see how he's doing.
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Probably go with the let him go to cov viewpoint. He could be the new Cowans/Cruyff/Charlton but i'm not a fan of sticking in young untried players into a side that is likely to be on the end of a few kickings in the next month. Certainly not as the great white hope to save our midfield - he'll be slagged off to high heaven if he has a bad game. Let him find his feet there. As long as he plays every weekend mind
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If you do Cov I will pop along Mr Robins.
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He'll be back at Villa Park for the next round of Nextgen matches. He is key to us winning the trophy. This is seen as the number 1 priority for the season.
I'm as positive about our NextGen challenge as the next man but assuming Ajax beat Rosenborg then aren't we away at Barcelona in the quarters? Though I understand they've been playing there U17 team so far the smug bastards.
Well their 'youth' (B) team play in the Spanish second tier, so doubt they can release players from that team as it compromises the promotion to the top league if they play weaker players.
Pretty sure B teams playing in second tier in spain can't be promoted to top flight
I realise that. I didn't mean their own promotion chances, I meant that if they released players to play in a tournament that was to the the majority 'unnecessary' then the Spanish league (LFP) would object based on the affect it would have on the Spanish segunda. It would trivialise the whole league.
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Probably go with the let him go to cov viewpoint. He could be the new Cowans/Cruyff/Charlton but i'm not a fan of sticking in young untried players into a side that is likely to be on the end of a few kickings in the next month. Certainly not as the great white hope to save our midfield - he'll be slagged off to high heaven if he has a bad game. Let him find his feet there. As long as he plays every weekend mind
Hopefully the club has an agreement with Coventry that he'll automatically play. Pointless otherwise.
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The worst thing about this is that I'll have to watch Coventry and hope that he does well. Bastards.
yes, that thought crossed my mind to
Nah, I'll be happy with him scoring hat-tricks and them losing 4-3 every week.
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I hope he does well while on loan there he will gain valuable experience going out on loan it will get him used to playing first team football and hopefully he comes back and we play him because he his a top talent.
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The worst thing about this is that I'll have to watch Coventry and hope that he does well. Bastards.
yes, that thought crossed my mind to
Yes, Gary can do well and Cov can lose 4-3 every week.
*EDIT* As SoccerHQ said above!
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Was sceptical about a loan period at first. But now think that a month at Cov will really help him on pace and a taste of playing on a regular basis. Surely it has been agreed that he goes straight in the first team ? Coventry are really struggling and i am worried he might have his confidence seriously tested, but thats all part of the experience ......
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Probably go with the let him go to cov viewpoint. He could be the new Cowans/Cruyff/Charlton but i'm not a fan of sticking in young untried players into a side that is likely to be on the end of a few kickings in the next month. Certainly not as the great white hope to save our midfield - he'll be slagged off to high heaven if he has a bad game. Let him find his feet there. As long as he plays every weekend mind
Hopefully the club has an agreement with Coventry that he'll automatically play. Pointless otherwise.
Not sure we can dictate to other clubs who they pick in their first team.
Anyway, if he's as good as is made out on here, surely he'll be in their first team because they need him?
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I think he should've had more opportunity by now, especially as our midfield has been so inept at times this season. I think the club's policy at times with promising young players has been poor. I think Clark should be in - he was outstanding last season. Marc Albrighton has hardly had a chance this year, the same goes for the Fonz. instead we have a boring defensive minded manager in AM who choose to play Hutton on the wing when he had specialist wingers in Albrighton and N'Zogbia. I predict a tough December with very few points gained meaning we'll be bottom six come the New Year - then the calls for AM to go will get stronger.
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Probably go with the let him go to cov viewpoint. He could be the new Cowans/Cruyff/Charlton but i'm not a fan of sticking in young untried players into a side that is likely to be on the end of a few kickings in the next month. Certainly not as the great white hope to save our midfield - he'll be slagged off to high heaven if he has a bad game. Let him find his feet there. As long as he plays every weekend mind
Hopefully the club has an agreement with Coventry that he'll automatically play. Pointless otherwise.
Not sure we can dictate to other clubs who they pick in their first team.
Anyway, if he's as good as is made out on here, surely he'll be in their first team because they need him?
Well no we can't force Coventry to play him. However, when the request for the loan came in, the least I'd expect is for someone our end to ask the question "Is he going to play?".
If he ends up playing one game and sitting on the bench for the rest of the loan, then it would have been of absolutely no benefit to him or us.
I can't see him not playing, but you never know.
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Why would Coventry take him if they're not going to play him?
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And Gary Gardner starts for Coventry at the Amex ;)
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And Gary Gardner scores!!!!
Within 10 minutes!!!
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Get in there Gary!
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The lad better be bloody good as he's just made me cheer a Coventry goal!
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Bollocks. I meant to have a few quid on him first scorer.
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Good for the lad. But he should be with us.
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Bollocks. I meant to have a few quid on him first scorer.
You'd have lost it - he scored the equaliser!
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Bollocks. I meant to have a few quid on him first scorer.
You'd have lost it - he scored the equaliser!
Ah!
That's ok then
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Gary G is gonna be massive. His attitude combined with his ability is fantastic. First championship goal in ten minutes :-)
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I wonder what their fans think with a villain scoring for them
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I think, for once, the management are doing the right thing sending him out until the new year. Coventry will have games coming thick and fast from now until January, Gary will get a massive amount of competetive game time. We've got an extremely difficult run coming up and we could risk demoralising the young lad expecting him to come in and turn the clubs fortunes around single handed. He'll come back from Cov more experienced and ready to go into our first team squad, which will be great if the rumours of no cash for the transfer window are true!
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I wonder what their fans think with a villain scoring for them
They're quite chuffed on skybluestalk.co.uk - he is, after all, their 3rd top scorer this season now!!!!
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My Chaventry mate text me, their song: gary gardner is a blue he hates Villa. Pray we get em in the cup
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My Chaventry mate text me, their song: gary gardner is a blue he hates Villa. Pray we get em in the cup
Agreed.
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NM
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Compass, I saw that before you deleted, and have to say it was the most ridiculous "moaning for the sake of it" thing I have ever seen.
Moaning we sent GG there and now they're singing anti Villa songs?
Not realising the strength of the rivalry?
Good god. There are plenty of things to moan about, but jesus, that's really ridiculous.
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That's why I edited it. I realised I went overboard with that one. I'm still annoyed we sent Gardner on loan though. We better not use Heskey in midfield tommorow.
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surely compass wasnt moaning was he??
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What did he say?
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What did he say?
Blah blah blah McLeish blah blah blah is my guess.
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I'm glad he's scored well done Gary let's hope he continues to do well.
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The first of very many
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The first of very many
Did you go today?
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How did he get on? well done on the goal Gary.
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We need to keep this player at all costs.
Truly believe we have a future Top class midfield growing in our youth team at the moment. I've already seen players like Grealish mentioned in Arsenal forums and rated as 'one of the best academy players in the country'. Crowley is just as highly rated and Jordan Graham seems to be progressing brilliantly too.
Im not normally one to get too overly excited, but all of these players are tipped to do big things in the game and they are all coming through our academy at similar times. If we can get our ability to keep players sorted in the next 4 or 5 years its possible our midfield woes could be sorted by our academy (but would need a new DM).
The thought of seeing our youngsters form a midfield in our first team in 5 years time of
-----------------DM
-------Gardner---Crowley
Grealish-------------------Graham
excites me much more than the odd b-s rumour of a takeover from the middle east.
Back on topic.. Gardner seems to be scoring for fun lately, hopefully he can keep it up until January so he can claim a place in our first team.
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I have every confidence in the ability of Bannan and Herd to make it as well.
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Yeah, definitely Bannan for me (presuming he doesnt get a bad attitude) and hopefully Herd. This time last year i thought Herd was poor but he's really impressed me so far this season to the point where hes one of the first names on my hypothetical teamsheet.
Presuming we dont get relegated at any point I think every Villa fan would have to look at Villa in 4-6 years time and if we had a squad consisting of just a few of
Siegriest, Clark, Baker, Herd, Gardner, Bannan, Crowley, Albrighton, Grealish, Graham and possibly still Gabby and Fonz/Weimann
and say that it is a massive success story, regardless of where we are (above 18th) in the league. Purely because it simply does not happen that a club can produce so much of its first team, sure some of the will falter and not all of them will make it but even if five or six do its fantastic. Would allow transfer-fees (and signing on fees) to buy bigger-name players every now and then rather than buying two or three 'meh' players because we need to fill gaps.
Thatd be my ideal Villa future: Produce a healthy amount of the first team and the bench and buy bigger name players where need be, selling on the poorer Academy graduates for a healthy profit and keeping a core of Villa-supporting youngsters as the spine of the squad. Kind of like Sky would have you believe Liverpool do.
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Caught the goal earlier. Late run into the box, anticipating a cross from the right and a fine, brave header meeting the ball on the run just ahead of the defender.
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Spoke to a friend who went to the game and was impressed with gardner although he said his arrival has led to even more vitriolic and abusive anti villa songs from the cov fans-not quite sure what gary makes of that , but he will have to get used to it for a few weeks.
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Yeah, definitely Bannan for me (presuming he doesnt get a bad attitude) and hopefully Herd. This time last year i thought Herd was poor but he's really impressed me so far this season to the point where hes one of the first names on my hypothetical teamsheet.
Presuming we dont get relegated at any point I think every Villa fan would have to look at Villa in 4-6 years time and if we had a squad consisting of just a few of
Siegriest, Clark, Baker, Herd, Gardner, Bannan, Crowley, Albrighton, Grealish, Graham and possibly still Gabby and Fonz/Weimann
and say that it is a massive success story, regardless of where we are (above 18th) in the league. Purely because it simply does not happen that a club can produce so much of its first team, sure some of the will falter and not all of them will make it but even if five or six do its fantastic. Would allow transfer-fees (and signing on fees) to buy bigger-name players every now and then rather than buying two or three 'meh' players because we need to fill gaps.
Thatd be my ideal Villa future: Produce a healthy amount of the first team and the bench and buy bigger name players where need be, selling on the poorer Academy graduates for a healthy profit and keeping a core of Villa-supporting youngsters as the spine of the squad. Kind of like Sky would have you believe Liverpool do.
The problem is how many of those who really make the big time with us in future years will stay at the club , or will they be sold to boost the coffers?
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Exactly, we are a selling club now
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I see the misery arses are out again. Shoody makes some good positive comments abt the one massive positive abt our club at the moment and the doom and gloom merchants piss on his bonfire. More power to your elbow Shoody.
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The advantage we have always had with our youngsters is they have either stayed with us through thick & thin, or left the club on OUR terms.
Selling club my arse, we're the same as everyone else, ex Man City.
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The advantage we have always had with our youngsters is they have either stayed with us through thick & thin, or left the club on OUR terms.
Selling club my arse, we're the same as everyone else, ex Man City.
Bang on. Although even Man City can't keep Tevez 'happy'.
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Hmm. Vassell went for £2M. For an established - at the time - England international although we know he never played again. Meanwhile at the same time Dean Ashton went for £3m; Robbie Savage £3m; Simon Davies £4m; Craig Bellamy £5m; James Beattie £6m; Peter Crouch £7m. On our terms? Seems to me someone is always getting a bargain...
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i am excited about some of our youngsters...
grealish, graham, robinson, gardner, johnson, are all exciting prospects...
the usual disclaimer about youngsters potentially going either way is added...
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The problem is how many of those who really make the big time with us in future years will stay at the club , or will they be sold to boost the coffers?
Sure, some will get sold. It's important for the board to learn to keep a player over the next few years because hopefully we're going to have a bunch of players we need to keep. Yeah one or two may get sold. If they get sold, so be it. It's either because they aren't good enough or they are so good Manchester/London wants them. Yeah we desperately need to keep them but I would rather lose a player for £20-£30m that we have produced ourselves than a player come in for 2 years do okay and sell on for an £8m profit. Atleast this way it shows our academy is producing top quality players.
Grealish' brother has said how much Grealish wants to play for Villa though and I think he's a Villa fan. As is Gardner (so he says). Albrighton, obviously, is. Apparently Graham is a Utd fan though. But 3/4 Villa fans in the lineup is always going to help keep them.
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Caught the goal earlier. Late run into the box, anticipating a cross from the right and a fine, brave header meeting the ball on the run just ahead of the defender.
Yep he was definitely making sure he was going to win that ball when he made the run into the box. Definitely future captain material if the rest of the game matches. Now he just has to get a fucking scary face ready for the pre match video boards.
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Watching him against Ajax and then his performance for CC I hope it is OK to have a little positive vibe running round?
Would love him and Bannan/Herd/Albrighton to do well -
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Can we have him back and offer them Delph on loan?
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Throw Heskey and Hutton in aswell.
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Throw Heskey and Hutton in aswell.
Don't think Coventry are that stupid.
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Throw Heskey and Hutton in aswell.
Are we still talking about Coventry or the Birmingham Canal?!
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Spoke to a friend who went to the game and was impressed with gardner although he said his arrival has led to even more vitriolic and abusive anti villa songs from the cov fans-not quite sure what gary makes of that , but he will have to get used to it for a few weeks.
If they were still singing when he scored, I wonder if GG savoured the irony?
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Spoke to a friend who went to the game and was impressed with gardner although he said his arrival has led to even more vitriolic and abusive anti villa songs from the cov fans-not quite sure what gary makes of that , but he will have to get used to it for a few weeks.
If they were still singing when he scored, I wonder if GG savoured the irony?
It'll make him even more appreciative of us when he returns to VP and starts in the first team. :-)
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
I'll be surprised if Bent is playing for us in the early part of next year, let alone his early thirties.
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Gardner, Jenas, Herd and Bannan with Albrighton and Nzogbia in and out the team seems the likely line ups for the rest of the season. Though Petrov will always get his nose in first .........
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Gardner, Jenas, Herd and Bannan with Albrighton and Nzogbia in and out the team seems the likely line ups for the rest of the season. Though Petrov will always get his nose in first .........
That's four Academy graduates. Add Gabby, Lichaj and maybe Clark and the Grand Plan, such as it is, suddenly looks possible.
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Lichaj, you rate him?
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I rate Guzan at rightback over Hutton. So yeah I rate Lichaj's chances.
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Lichaj's a tidy enough player. He's just not really had much of a chance what with us bringing in Walker last January and his injury this season. I think he's got a good chance of making it.
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Leeds fans liked him when he was there and i thought he was fantastic vs Spurs last year. Had a bad game vs Man City. But I havent seen Hutton be fantastic once yet so even if Lichaj isnt consistent i'd prefer inconsistency to consistently shit.
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Lichaj's a tidy enough player. He's just not really had much of a chance what with us bringing in Walker last January and his injury this season. I think he's got a good chance of making it.
I agree with that
What I've seen of him in the flesh he looks very composed and comfortable on the ball - the exact opposite of hutton
As far as bent goes the only 2 teams I could see signing him would be Arsenal (where he would be behind RVP) or Newcastle (would they want to change their system to fit him in) so I reckon he is going nowhere because Liverpool, man city, Man ure, Chelsea and Spuds won't want him
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I said this at the time, but during the Gold Cup playing for the US at LB, he looked very competent. It's a shame he got injured. Hutton has been hideous so far. I wish the manager saw that.
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Lichaj, you rate him?
I do, always looked tidy when I've seen him.
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Yeah Lichaj is a good RB.
He will be starting as soon as AM sees them long throws ;-)
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Eric Lichaj is another player who was treated shoddily by Mr Houllier.
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Whilst Lichaj will never be a top right back he is the sort of player that hopefully stops us spending Xm on the likes of Hutton and Beye. So in that sense I do rate him and think he should be given a chance.
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Gardner, Jenas, Herd and Bannan with Albrighton and Nzogbia in and out the team seems the likely line ups for the rest of the season. Though Petrov will always get his nose in first .........
That's four Academy graduates. Add Gabby, Lichaj and maybe Clark and the Grand Plan, such as it is, suddenly looks possible.
The problem remains, though, if they're really any good, they'll get bought by richer clubs.
That's the fundamental flaw in the Ajax plan.,
Ajax are the biggest club in their league and play CL football year in, year out, thus making it easier to hold onto players for longer.
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clark and gardner are the 2 jewels in the crown that will be top top players in my opinion ,hopefully with villa!
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Well it'd be nice if Clark got a chance.
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
I'll be surprised if Bent is playing for us in the early part of next year, let alone his early thirties.
So who do you see paying the twenty odd million pounds it would take to persuade us to sell him in January?
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
I'll be surprised if Bent is playing for us in the early part of next year, let alone his early thirties.
So who do you see paying the twenty odd million pounds it would take to persuade us to sell him in January?
Would score goals galore in a team like arsenal!
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
I'll be surprised if Bent is playing for us in the early part of next year, let alone his early thirties.
So who do you see paying the twenty odd million pounds it would take to persuade us to sell him in January?
You never know.
He was linked with a move to Turkey which he apparently wanted before he joined us.
You can never assume nobody will buy one of your players, because that's pretty much never the case, but watching him chase down lost causes this season, he can't be very happy.
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To the team selection for home grown players in 4 years time, I would though Bent is young enough to carry on. as he is only 27 and could be playing for Villa in his early 30s.
I'll be surprised if Bent is playing for us in the early part of next year, let alone his early thirties.
So who do you see paying the twenty odd million pounds it would take to persuade us to sell him in January?
Would score goals galore in a team like arsenal!
I don't think Arsenal shell out that kind of money any more. I don't think they would on Bent anyway.
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You said you'd be surprised if he s still here, meaning it likely rather than possible that he will leave.
Even if you accept that we will be willing sellers, which I don't, then I'd be astonished if, in the run up to the Euros, he fucks off to Turkey. I can't think of a club in this country thatcouldd afford the price who would need him at present.
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Whether other clubs can afford him or not, he's our player at the moment and we're wasting what he does best.
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I see Andy Thorn is already talking up his wish to extend Gardner's loan stay.
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Both will get a chance, they're both young, and they both know they'll get a chance.
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The problem remains, though, if they're really any good, they'll get bought by richer clubs.
For me, that problem is kinda live gravity though. You can't change it so you may as well live with it and plan for it. Make sure the best players are on long contracts, like Modric's 5-year deal signed last season. If they still want to leave then at least the money received is of Milner/Downing proportions rather than Young/Barry levels. But this income MUST be reinvested.
Dortmund won the league last year and are top again this year using the Ajax route so it's not vital to be "the biggest fish in a small pond" to make it work.
The only viable alternative is to buy good players on credit but I think that there is a greater likelihood that we'd become a Leeds rather than discover the revenue streams to make that route viable.
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Do we know how GG did yesterday?
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Do we know how GG did yesterday?
He was subbed after 68 mins and Cov went on to lose 2 - 1 away @ Pompey
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Speaking of loans, with Jenas possibly out for the next 3 years, are we able to re-call Jean II??
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Speaking of loans, with Jenas possibly out for the next 3 years, are we able to re-call Jean II??
He was clearly told that with his football brain and eye for a pass he was not wanted here almost straight away when the ginger twat arrived
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He was clearly told that with his football brain and eye for a pass he was not wanted here almost straight away when the ginger twat arrived
LMAO! I'm still pzzled why we let him go. Admittedly, I didn't see him play last season but from what I have been told by my brother and cousin who went to all home games last season, he looked decent enough, confident on the ball and made forward passes. I'd like to see him called back and start for us but t wont happen.
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I had been looking forward this season to seeing a midfield of Ireland Delph Makoun and N'Zogbia, with Bannan, Albrighton and Gardner pushing for places and Petrov as the experienced back up. Whilst not ideal I thought it would offer a nice balance. What we are ending up with is a mess of Jenas, Herd, Heskey, Hutton, Agbonlahor etc.
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Gary Gardner is also the best FIFA player at Villa :D
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With further protests being planned it will not be dull for young Gary! Over the top Police, stewarts taking away banners (well, trying to), big blokes having flash backs to 1985 and falling down stairs...
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Rivalries and hatreds (existent or non existent) apart, I genuinely feel sorry for the Coventry fans, and hope they get that rabble out.
I saw a piece on the news tonight about how one of the board members has appointed himself Head of Football Operations and taken to sitting on the bench during games.
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With further protests being planned it will not be dull for young Gary! Over the top Police, stewarts taking away banners (well, trying to), big blokes having flash backs to 1985 and falling down stairs...
Some of that lot will be getting an early morning visit in the next couple of weeks. The stewards were totally out of order though.
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With further protests being planned it will not be dull for young Gary! Over the top Police, stewarts taking away banners (well, trying to), big blokes having flash backs to 1985 and falling down stairs...
Seems a bit strong, after all the copper only asked to count his fingers...
Apologies to those who maintain otherwise, but I cannot abide those inbreds one bit. Make no mistake, the vast majority of them feel the same about us as well. It's all about opinions after all!
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The stewards were totally out of order though.
Why? First of all, we don't know what that banner said. It could have been "Sisu is a ******" which might be true but would be an offensive banner and removed. Secondly, they are employees of the club and are paid on the day so would have to carry out orders by their employees.
It wouldn't be the first time a banner has been taken down somewhere. Even Brady invaded the crowd to confiscate one at the Sty. There is enough on here who moan about booing and such affecting players and we should get behind the team when in the stand, so surely removing banners is also a step towards that.
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The stewards were totally out of order though.
Why? First of all, we don't know what that banner said. It could have been "Sisu is a c***" which might be true but would be an offensive banner and removed. Secondly, they are employees of the club and are paid on the day so would have to carry out orders by their employees.
It wouldn't be the first time a banner has been taken down somewhere. Even Brady invaded the crowd to confiscate one at the Sty. There is enough on here who moan about booing and such affecting players and we should get behind the team when in the stand, so surely removing banners is also a step towards that.
SISU are are a group not a person !
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The most disturbing thing about the video footage is the bloke who took his son to the game and clearly wants to get involved in the problem, his son is continually asking him to sit down. Occurs about 3.12 and the bloke is in a grey coloured top.
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In other news, how is GG playing at the moment?
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The banner said SISU OUT.I work with a few Cov fans.
I am not going to moan about our club a the moment when you here what that lot are going through.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
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There is enough on here who moan about booing and such affecting players and we should get behind the team when in the stand, so surely removing banners is also a step towards that.
If the banner was slagging off a player, then yes, but if it was in protest of the board, then no, in my opinion.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Not even the slightest resemblance to him whatsoever.
It is a club in total chaos with the ex chairman now making himself head of football operations and in the dressing room before and at half timre as well as in the dug out-if thorn had any pride he would resign rather than be a puppet.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Not even the slightest resemblance to him whatsoever.
It is a club in total chaos with the ex chairman now making himself head of football operations and in the dressing room before and at half timre as well as in the dug out-if thorn had any pride he would resign rather than be a puppet.
"My arseholes, my inbreds,
A thorn in my pride..."
I think I'd shed more tears for the rags than this lot.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Have we got an expected arrival time as yet for their return?
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Have we got an expected arrival time as yet for their return?
Ask again when hell freezes over!
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That was spectacularly badly handled by the police, what ever the rights and wrongs of it they made it worse with their intervention.
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That was spectacularly badly handled by the police, what ever the rights and wrongs of it they made it worse with their intervention.
It appears it all started because one copper was not wearing his number. The bloke that made all the fuss has rather than being penalised, been given a three year ban from watching that shite.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Have we got an expected arrival time as yet for their return?
We'll see Jesus again before them.
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But probably not Jenas.
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"My arseholes, my inbreds,
A thorn in my pride..."
Black Crowes fan? *Thumbs up*
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Well Gardner has gone to Coventry on loan for some experience and first team football. He is certainly getting an experience !! When he comes back to Villa park, it will feel like a Wacky Wherehouse !! people shouting and smiling for there team, with an occasional hug to celebrate if there team score. Thinking about it if we get some terrible results, come Jan it might not be much different :-)))
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The banner said SISU OUT.I work with a few Cov fans.
I am not going to moan about our club a the moment when you here what that lot are going through.
Were you there? The banner you see taken out is not the same banner that you see in the clip. They have already got a banner in their hands then, the camera sweeps to another banner, then it sweeps back to the banner in the hand again. TBH I don't doubt it said SISU out, just saying we don't know for sure. But surely as employees at the club, the stewards would have to take orders on removing banners or have to quit.
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That video footage is shocking. I personally dont think the police did anything wrong at first. clearly he was asking the fan to leave and he started kicking off big style. What ever was being said resulted in the police being heavy handed with him then the rest of the knob heads join in and then start pushing people down the stairs which could have injured a few people including their own fans. I have no sympathy for them. They are lucky the police are not like the police in europe i.e. Turkey or Greece where they wuld have have a batten around their heads.
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Brave bunch of meatheads. Bet they wont be so lairy when they get the early morning visit.
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I love the way they all give it loads as they are dragging one of the fans out. You see one of them flick the coppers hat off and then hide! what a wet! if youre gonna have the balls to do that then he might as well stand there and let it be known it was him doing it. Brainless thugs.
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
How do you know what he was being asked to leave for?
Maybe he'd done nothing wrong?
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
How do you know what he was being asked to leave for?
Maybe he'd done nothing wrong?
I didn't say I knew what he was being asked to leave for nor does anyone else. Obviously he had done something for the police to come up to him and ask him to leave but then he started gobbing off which led to him being dragged out which resulted in the rest of the fans in that area to kick off too.
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
How do you know what he was being asked to leave for?
Maybe he'd done nothing wrong?
I didn't say I knew what he was being asked to leave for nor does anyone else. Obviously he had done something for the police to come up to him and ask him to leave but then he started gobbing off which led to him being dragged out which resulted in the rest of the fans in that area to kick off too.
Don't the police frequently get involved at the request of the stewards?
So if the stewards decided to eject him for - say - sitting near some people waving a banner, and he refused, and they got the police in, surely he'd be expected to insist he'd done nothing wrong? Wouldn't you?
You're also assume he used profanity, which you don't know.
Like you said, you don't know what he said to them, what the stewards involvement was, or whether he swore at them, so it seems a tricky situation to be saying he deserved to be dragged out.
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Don't the police frequently get involved at the request of the stewards?
So if the stewards decided to eject him for - say - sitting near some people waving a banner, and he refused, and they got the police in, surely he'd be expected to insist he'd done nothing wrong? Wouldn't you?
You're also assume he used profanity, which you don't know.
Like you said, you don't know what he said to them, what the stewards involvement was, or whether he swore at them, so it seems a tricky situation to be saying he deserved to be dragged out.
Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner. there is obviously more to it than what the video clip shows.
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Don't the police frequently get involved at the request of the stewards?
So if the stewards decided to eject him for - say - sitting near some people waving a banner, and he refused, and they got the police in, surely he'd be expected to insist he'd done nothing wrong? Wouldn't you?
You're also assume he used profanity, which you don't know.
Like you said, you don't know what he said to them, what the stewards involvement was, or whether he swore at them, so it seems a tricky situation to be saying he deserved to be dragged out.
Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner. there is obviously more to it than what the video clip shows.
I dunno about that, to be honest.
Those stewards at the Ricoh are apparently an organisation like the ones they use at Old Trafford that got a lot of bad publicity a while back.
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"My arseholes, my inbreds,
A thorn in my pride..."
Black Crowes fan? *Thumbs up*
Right on brother.
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Isn't that big, bold, ugly fella in the sky blue polo shirt the same chap that held up the 'We'll be back' sign at Villa Park the day we sent them down?
Have we got an expected arrival time as yet for their return?
We'll see Jesus again before them.
I actually miss them in the Prem. Most games had an element of drama - good and bad.
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I dont miss them Tony, after leaving Brum at an early age I lived in Coventry for 20 odd years and they absolutely hate us with a passion, I take great pleasure in their demise, horrible spiteful club, my feelings towards them are almost as strong as for Small Heath which is why I dont like helping them out with the Gary Gardner loan.
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
Sorry, I didn't realise you had the background to the incident can you explain what the "mug" had done?
If they had handled it better they wouldn't have had to deal with the later reaction.
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Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner.
Unless things have changed very recently, the West Midlands Police have a football-wide reputation for ejecting people for the most ridiculous of reasons. Always have.
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Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner.
Unless things have changed very recently, the West Midlands Police have a football-wide reputation for ejecting people for the most ridiculous of reasons. Always have.
Is it not the legendary West Mercia mob at Cov? They we're always famed for laissez faire approach crowd management......
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I'm sure it's West Midlands Poilice
I'm happy to be corrected though
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I'm sure it's West Midlands Poilice
I'm happy to be corrected though
You're right, it is West Midlands and they seem to treat as every football fan as though they're a potential hooligan.
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Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner.
Unless things have changed very recently, the West Midlands Police have a football-wide reputation for ejecting people for the most ridiculous of reasons. Always have.
Is it not the legendary West Mercia mob at Cov? They we're always famed for laissez faire approach crowd management......
West Mercia do not cover Coventry. It's West Midlands.
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We always had loads arrested at Highfield Rd and I recall the police were heavy handed.
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I must admit I did like the copper who addressed us as we waited outside the Highfield Road away end before one night game. 'If you've got any knives, hammers, crow-bars or baseball bats, just drop them here now and you can collect them after the game'.
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I got ejected from The Hawthorns when Cheltenham went there in the FA Cup a few years back.
They took a massive following and I was sat on the end by the Olbiyun fans. One fat bastard spent the whole game hurling obscenities at us but it was me who got the boot for using my hands to mimic his man tits.
At least I was back in the pub before it got busy.
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I dont miss them Tony, after leaving Brum at an early age I lived in Coventry for 20 odd years and they absolutely hate us with a passion, I take great pleasure in their demise, horrible spiteful club, my feelings towards them are almost as strong as for Small Heath which is why I dont like helping them out with the Gary Gardner loan.
I get the same stick from Cov fans in Hinckley . Leicester lot are ok , they dont mind Villa, cov hate us with a passion .
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Sorry, I didn't realise you had the background to the incident can you explain what the "mug" had done?
If they had handled it better they wouldn't have had to deal with the later reaction.
Geez! Like a lot of people would, I made an assumption. I could be wrong I could be right. Who knows?? At the end of the day, its my opinion and I strongly believe that "mug" has done something wrong. I have a mate who is a copper and have heard stories of the amount of shite they take especially during footy matches.
Anyway, lets forget about this incident which clearly has nothing to do with AVFC or Gary Gardner's development as a player and move on.
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Don't the police frequently get involved at the request of the stewards?
So if the stewards decided to eject him for - say - sitting near some people waving a banner, and he refused, and they got the police in, surely he'd be expected to insist he'd done nothing wrong? Wouldn't you?
You're also assume he used profanity, which you don't know.
Like you said, you don't know what he said to them, what the stewards involvement was, or whether he swore at them, so it seems a tricky situation to be saying he deserved to be dragged out.
Yes I would but I do not for one minute believe they would have ejected him for something so silly as sitting next to someone or near someone who was waving a banner. there is obviously more to it than what the video clip shows.
I dunno about that, to be honest.
Those stewards at the Ricoh are apparently an organisation like the ones they use at Old Trafford that got a lot of bad publicity a while back.
As I mentioned earlier, the bloke got thrown out for highlighting that the police officer was not wearing his name and number. He choose to make an issue of it, the police didn't like it and eventually threw him out. The fan has apparently received a three year ban from the ground, which I guess makes it all worth while.
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[quote author=The Sound of Villadelphia link=topic=45241.msg1930842#msg1930842
As I mentioned earlier, the bloke got thrown out for highlighting that the police officer was not wearing his name and number. He choose to make an issue of it, the police didn't like it and eventually through him out. The fan has apparently received a three year ban from the ground, which I guess makes it all worth while.
[/quote]
oh dear! What a mug lol! If your gonna get banned for 3 years then at least do it for something worth while.
Anyway, anyone been following GG? hows he getting on?
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Ah, so initially it was the copper who did something wrong. What a surprise.
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The police are there for crowd control, they managed to do the opposite.
By the looks of it, they asked the guy to leave and then he started to become confrontational so they had to use force to get him out. No doubt he probably used profanity as well which police do not stand for especially if it is aimed at them so im sorry, the mug deserved to be dragged out as he was not leaving when asked.
How can a hanful of police control a bunch of mindless thugs charging at them down the stairs?
Sorry, I didn't realise you had the background to the incident can you explain what the "mug" had done?
If they had handled it better they wouldn't have had to deal with the later reaction.
No doubt he probably used profanity ....
No doubt there is a logical contradiction is this formulation.
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No doubt he probably used profanity ....
No doubt there is a logical contradiction is this formulation.
You have too much time on your hands.
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No doubt perhaps there might be, certainly.
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Sweet Jesus my eleventh post , I was living in Coventry in 1987 when they won the F A cup and we were relegated with Billy McShit, that was such a difficult period I took unbelievable stick for 12 months or more, it eased a bit on our return to the top flight, I have never been involved in any scuffles in boozers but there were a few moments with some of their vilest fans when I nearly snapped, as I said they are just a rotten spiteful club, have you guessed im not keen? :)
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I lived in Coventry from 78-83, so all was well as you can imagine,
Mind we did live in Stivichall which is where All the rich posh people like me reside
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i think we can all agree, there's never a "good" time to live in Coventry.
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Good to see football fans standing up for their fellow fans.
Negative banners shouldn't be confiscated by the club.
Remember the 'Had Enough. Houllier Out' banner which got confiscated against Wolves last season?
Are the fans not entitled to voice or display their opinion?
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i think we can all agree, there's never a "good" time to live in Coventry.
It was great as a student. You could rock up to a nightclub in shorts and a polo top and be the best dressed one in there.
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As I mentioned earlier, the bloke got thrown out for highlighting that the police officer was not wearing his name and number. He choose to make an issue of it, the police didn't like it and eventually threw him out. The fan has apparently received a three year ban from the ground, which I guess makes it all worth while.
Where did you get this info? I would question why he was making such a big issue and he does seem to take a confrontational stance with the first copper who at one point just seemed to be asking him to sit down at the start.
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I lived in Coventry from 78-83, so all was well as you can imagine,
Mind we did live in Stivichall which is where All the rich posh people like me reside
That's where my auntie lived as well. Cor - was she posh? Must have been with an address like that!
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Anyway, anyone been following GG? hows he getting on?
Missed a sitter today (6 yards out, unchallenged, and hit the post) as Cov lost 1-0. I hope that being in a team that's clearly devoid of any confidence doesn't bring his own confidence down.
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I bet he can't wait to get out of there.
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As an audition for our first team he isn't exactly banging on the door.
Admittedly there are mitigating factors but compared to JonJo Shelvey's efforts at Blackpool then I have been a bit disappointed.
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He did well to get into the position to take the shot on today, unlucky that it hit the post. The team he's playing in is absolute gash and it's his first real taste of competitive football at a decent level so don't be too hard on the lad. He's not doing bad at all.
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He did well to get into the position to take the shot on today, unlucky that it hit the post. The team he's playing in is absolute gash and it's his first real taste of competitive football at a decent level so don't be too hard on the lad. He's not doing bad at all.
You're right eamonn, my previous post was more negative than I had intended. If anything I was trying to highlight to everyone who said it was a disgrace that he was sent on loan how important getting some real game time is.
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He seems to be doing better than Bannan or Fonz in that he's actually playing games, albeit in a much worse side.
But perhaps it's a vindication that sending him out on loan was a good idea, whereas some were virtually calling for AM's head on the basis he wasn't in the first team.
Shelvey is only 6 months older than Gardner and he does seem to be ripping up trees. I wouldn't read into that that he's better; but equally I wouldn't expect Gardner to waltz into our starting xi upon his return.
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I don't think it works like that.
You'd hope with better players around him and the added incentive of playing for his team in familiar surroundings that he would be more effective for us than Coventry. And I think fans were saying if you're going to play Heskey or Hutton in midfield you may as well throw Gardner in.
He's our brightest young talent so it's obvious in relatively dark times that people are going to look to him and others. He's old enough to be introduced now anyway.
Other clubs, even more successful clubs have done it. I don't see why we should keep our youngsters back overlong especially with such a poor to average level of senior players in their way.
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i think we can all agree, there's never a "good" time to live in Coventry.
Don't you come from that place with the CV postcode?
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Gardner is old enough and good enough to be given his chance in the villa team now.
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According to Matt Kendrick he's coming back:
Hearing from the Coventry end that Gary Gardner has returned to Villa from his loan spell, but not been confirmed yet #avfc #ccfc
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According to Mat Kendrick on Twitter Gardner has returned to Villa - it hasn't been confirmed yet. I hope he is back.
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I though he couldn't come back until the month is up but I'm not sure Coventry have another game before then.
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i think we can all agree, there's never a "good" time to live in Coventry.
Don't you come from that place with the CV postcode?
No, I am from Hall Green, but I admit, I do live in Royal Leamington Spa. That ain't no Cov, no sirree.
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Thought you couldn't recall 28 day loans?
Would imagine he'll be on the bench tommorrow.
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Thought you couldn't recall 28 day loans?
Would imagine he'll be on the bench tommorrow.
I think the 28 days was up today or tomorrow anyway.
Time flies when you're having fun, eh?
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Its been reported on the Coventry Telegraph and quotes from their manager that he has come back to us because of a mounting injury crises.
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It's on the Coventry City FC website now. I guess they'd only say a player that's been in their first team has been recalled, if he has indeed been recalled.
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According to Matt Kendrick he's coming back:
Hearing from the Coventry end that Gary Gardner has returned to Villa from his loan spell, but not been confirmed yet #avfc #ccfc
Spoke to a Cov ST today. He is on his way back.
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I lived in Coventry from 78-83, so all was well as you can imagine,
Mind we did live in Stivichall which is where All the rich posh people like me reside
However it is Cov we are talking about! I thought Cheylesmore was posher than Stivichall but almost like Rubery! Just enjoyed an hour or two in the Open Arms.
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In Rubery it would be the Open Legs.
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GG just been on twitter and said he can't play tonight anyway!
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GG just been on twitter and said he can't play tonight anyway!
He's been naughty and his Mom won't let him out after 6pm
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I lived in Coventry from 78-83, so all was well as you can imagine,
Mind we did live in Stivichall which is where All the rich posh people like me reside
However it is Cov we are talking about! I thought Cheylesmore was posher than Stivichall but almost like Rubery! Just enjoyed an hour or two in the Open Arms.
The Open Arms ain't a bad boozer, played sunday football for them for a number of years. Stivichall & Styvechale are both far better areas than alot of Cheylesmore.
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In Rubery it would be the Open Legs.
Just because you're filth doesn't mean you can abuse the place where I grew up. ;-)
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Chris, I have worked on that patch so have an inside knowledge! (not that sort of inside either).
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My Cov mate ( one that likes me ) said GG has been brilliant and gutted hes gone back , so much better than any tripe they have got there . I said he wont get in midfield while Heskeys playing there .
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yeeeesssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
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yeeeesssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
Wrong thread or are you really, really excited that Gardner is coming back?
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after seeing how gary has come on in the wolves game and then his cameo against newcastle he is obviously a gem that needs to be polished and protected, then rewarded.
how much do we look after gary and his obvious talent because if we dont it wont be long till siralex and the likes will be offering big money.
can we give him the package to make him our steven gerrard, a player for villa for life!
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We have to. Only 2 years left on his (new!) contract at the end of this season. Dont get him tied down this summer and we'll pretty much have to let him go for pennies next summer if his head gets turned. Needs a 6 or 7 year contract imo. Thats how good he could be and even then would only give us 4/5 years until we'd be in danger of losing him again (if we're lucky). And he'd still only be about 22/23 nowhere near his prime.
Give him pretty much whatever to get a Fabregas-esque contract, even if its a clause to make him our highest paid player at 25 or whatever. If he turns out to be no good (i doubt it) then we can cut and run. But i honestly think he could be our best player within 18 months and it'll seem like great business then. Theres always a risk with footballers that they wont make it, or they'll get injured but I was surprised Gary only signed a 3.5yr contract last Jan and I think this is one of those times you have to take a leap of faith by securing him longterm. If it doesn't work out it'll suck but atleast we'd be showing ambition by trying to tie-down our best up and coming players.
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In the short glimpses that I have seen of him he looks real quality. It has been said before, but to me he looks like a young Steve Gerrard - comfortable on the ball, athletic, good eye for a pass and positions himself well for goal opportunities from deep. I really think we need to tie him down long term and build a team around him.
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I think he's the best thing to come through the youth system since Sir Brian, he's a cross between Steve Gerrard and Trevor Brooking in my opinion and we should move mountains to keep him
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He reminds me of Lampard more than anybody. In the few appearances he's made, he's got himself into good positions in the box and nearly bagged himself a couple of goals. I think you'll see him starting against Wigan and Blackburn.
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I can only echo the last few posts. I'm generally cautious when it comes to hyping up the youngsters but Gary really does look like he's the real deal. I can see here people are coming from with some of the comparisons, and it helps to have a yardstick, but I think we'll soon be forgetting all that as he establishes himself on his own merits.
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Sounds great with people posting he is like Lampard , he is like Brooking , he is like Gerrard .. bloody hell , how exciting.
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Sounds great with people posting he is like Lampard , he is like Brooking , he is like Gerrard .. bloody hell , how exciting.
It's also dangerous and unhelpful heaping such expectancy on a young boy's shoulders. Like many before him, he has to fulfil his undoubted potential before he can be compared to such great players. Remember the Moore brothers...
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Sounds great with people posting he is like Lampard , he is like Brooking , he is like Gerrard .. bloody hell , how exciting.
It's also dangerous and unhelpful heaping such expectancy on a young boy's shoulders. Like many before him, he has to fulfil his undoubted potential before he can be compared to such great players. Remember the Moore brothers...
When someone says that I do not read they are as good as "lampard" etc but that is their style of play i.e. it's a description rather than assessment of quality.
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I think he's the best thing to come through the youth system since Sir Brian, he's a cross between Steve Gerrard and Trevor Brooking in my opinion and we should move mountains to keep him
He Who Walks On Water has always been my all-time favourite Villa player but surely Sid Cowans is also up there as a fantastic product of the youth team? - but maybe I'm just being picky!
What I like of GG so far is that he looks so damn comfortable on the ball; he's always looking for the ball and seems to know how he wants to use it before receiving it. Also his games in the youth / reserve set-up show his movement into goalscoring positions.
The future definitely is bright: let's hope that both RL and McL give all these guys the appropriate development pace and exposure to max their potential.
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I can't imagine he won't be starting very soon. I think the thing that stands out more than anything else: personality / character. He wants the ball. He doesn't shirk tackles. He wants to score.
None of these things mean he'll make it. But plenty of kids with great talent don't make it because they lack those characteristics.
He should have had 3 goals by now really. That's encouraging, but he needs to start sticking them away soon!
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That month at Coventry worked out fine then.
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Think he'll be an impact sub vs City and do well for 15 mins to keep his confidence up. Then he needs to be starting for Wigan, Blackburn, Bolton and Fulham. He needs 70 minutes in a game atleast to try and find his feet and actually 'do' something.
Not knocking the lad, but its the same as with Ireland. He was always the 'nearly man', where we'd be thinking 'if only that pass made it' or 'had that shot just found its way in'. But he's done well since he had a run of games. Think the same will happen with Gardner, give him a proper chance and he could take it. 10 minute cameos will only do him good for so long.
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Think he'll be an impact sub vs City and do well for 15 mins to keep his confidence up. Then he needs to be starting for Wigan, Blackburn, Bolton and Fulham. He needs 70 minutes in a game atleast to try and find his feet and actually 'do' something.
Not knocking the lad, but its the same as with Ireland. He was always the 'nearly man', where we'd be thinking 'if only that pass made it' or 'had that shot just found its way in'. But he's done well since he had a run of games. Think the same will happen with Gardner, give him a proper chance and he could take it. 10 minute cameos will only do him good for so long.
Sounds like a good plan to me. Especially as Keane will be departing so Ireland can take his place and Gardner can play with Petrov in CM.
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You would have to think that Gardner, Petrov, Ireland should be solid enough as a three, even without a proper ball winner? Gardner puts himself about a bit as far as I can tell.
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That month at Coventry worked out fine then.
Yep. Coventry certainly made him the player he is today.
And it's great that we didn't waste our time and his playing him in those games that we were going to get bollocked in. Like the draw with Swansea and the 1-0 loss to Man Utd. Would have been completely pointless him playing in those matches as he'd yet to become the next Gerrard/Little/Lampard and would have been utterly outclassed.
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That month at Coventry worked out fine then.
Yep. Coventry certainly made him the player he is today.
And it's great that we didn't waste our time and his playing him in those games that we were going to get bollocked in. Like the draw with Swansea and the 1-0 loss to Man Utd. Would have been completely pointless him playing in those matches as he'd yet to become the next Gerrard/Little/Lampard and would have been utterly outclassed.
Yeah, if i was running the team, I'd insist every young player made their debuts at home against the champions in a fixture we haven't won since they were sleeping in a cot.
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You may have a point. But he's not exactly a delicate little lamb is he? He's not seem overawed against any opposition he's encountered thus far.
But Dave Woodhall's comment seemed to me to be very much an "up yours" to all those that saw the loan to Covrntry when we were struggling for decent players as a bad move. I maintain that he was ready. He banged in his first goal for them in mess than ten mins so it wasn't like he needed to get up to speed.
I think we missed a trick. To suggest that dropped points we're inevitable or, perhaps insinuate that the very brief loan spell made any kind of tangible difference to his game or his mentality is evidence that it was a smart move is little more than an unprovable "I told you so".
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I don't think that loan at Coventry would have done him any harm at all. He'll have experienced life playing for a lower league club and hopefully it will encourage him to give his all for us and not watch his career drift down the leagues like past promising Villa youngsters.
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GG is a tremendous prospect but it worries me that he has only 2 years left (if that's correct) on his contract.
I believe that once he gets a run in the team he will shine and worry that we might soon find ourselves once again watching former Villa stars playing else where ala Milner, Young, Downing even to some extent Barry if Faulkner doesn't tie him up on a long contract.
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For all we know, they're negotiating a deal right now. Let's hope so.
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Contract needs to be done soon. He is going to be a class act .....
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Found it tough against De Jong (who I thought was magnificent, so strong) and to a lesser extent Barry but some good touches and passes.
Lad has potential, can we start him in a winnable home game please (if there's any left).
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He needs to start every game to the end of the season now for me. With Clark out for a few weeks, Petrov, Herd and Gardner.
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Ireland for Herd.
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Need a foot in Soccer, Ireland would be up with Bent and Gabby for me.
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He has to continue in the team. Ireland has to be in the fooking team, you dopey jock. He messed up for the first goal last week, I agree, but has been doing well. How is Heskey a better option?
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Petrov was a complete liability today.GG wa poor but he did have Petrov alongside him.
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I didn't think Petrov was that bad. He just got swamped against a 5 man Man City midfield with Heskey on one side (who wasn't that bad), a poor Albrighton, and a green youngster. he was doing a lot or work for little reward. We weren't set up very well and Petrov was exposed. McLeish should be apologising to him more than we should be calling him a liability.
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Petrov was a complete liability today.GG wa poor but he did have Petrov alongside him.
?????????
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I thought Petrov was poor today. Slowed our attacks down too often by passing sideways, or stopped them completely by giving the ball away. Also gave away far too many free kicks.
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Petrov had a thankless task with Gardner, Keane needed to play on de jong and even things up. The jock messed things up big time
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Petrov does'nt pass the ball quick enough, does'nt pass foward, does'nt move off the ball, does;nt track back.Watch him.He was shot 2 years ago, until he is replaced we will struggle.GG was poor today, but at least he tries to play the ball foward, and has a nice 30/40 yard pass on him.Did'nt make his foward runs today that he is good at, but i put that down to the manager.
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I thought Gardner tried to take a few too many touches on a number of occasions. People seem to be bashing Petrov here but he - probably from experience - usually knows what he wants to do with the ball before he's received it, whereas Gardner seemed to want to have an extra touch, which resulted in him getting a bit swamped by Man City's midfielders.
Hopefully with a few more matches he'll develop the confidence to play the ball more instinctively.
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Sounds great with people posting he is like Lampard , he is like Brooking , he is like Gerrard .. bloody hell , how exciting.
It's also dangerous and unhelpful heaping such expectancy on a young boy's shoulders. Like many before him, he has to fulfil his undoubted potential before he can be compared to such great players. Remember the Moore brothers...
Very true BDE, very true