Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Match Threads & Player Ratings => Topic started by: Legion on April 29, 2011, 06:45:29 PM
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Available Saturday evening.
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i'm sorry to say this but we're still not safe, 3 tough games coming up. 6 points above the drop zone. with wigan, arsenal and liverpool to play. this stress wil go to the very end of the season i'm afraid. and then half the squad need to fuck off!
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That sums up our season.
Shit decisions from management costing us points.
With an opposition down to ten men and tiring, it's time to hit them with some pace and some guile.
But we hit them with the crab twins.
Petrov, sideways to Pires, square ball back to Petrov, back to Pires who looks around and sees Petrov available who then gives it away....
Well done Gary Mac. Clueless cock.
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Another 90 minutes of garbage football lucky us.
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So it is not Houllier that is the problem, but Gary Mac - get rid NOW
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another stain on a shitty, horrible season.
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Not good today at all.
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All fart and no shit.
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Just saw Mike Jeffries complain on TV :)
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This is the season we've lost to Blues, Wolves and now Baggies. It's too much.
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We can't defend for our lives, and can't break down a West Bromwich Albion side hen we have more players for 25 minutes. Fucking awful.
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Pure unadulterated shit from a clueless set of spineless wankers lead by a clueless clown of a manager.
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Absolutely inspired substitution, lets take out the engine of the team and pair up the guy whose legs go after 60 minutes with the guy whose legs went half a decade ago!
Fuck off Gary McCallister you are a cancer in our great football club!!
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Someone please explain how any one could believe that bringing Pires on was a good idea?
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Pure unadulterated shit from a clueless set of spineless wankers lead by a clueless clown of a manager.
Spot on.
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The entire 11 barring Downing, L Young, Bent and just maybe Petrov (for back up) needs to go. Overhaul time. These players just aren't good enough.
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How important was that last minute winner at West Ham?
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Well this team will always be known as the record breakers but for all the wrong reasons. Not good.
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Looking at BBC Sport and it seem Albion is celebrating as if they won the FA Cup.
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They were down to ten men and we still couldn't get a point, where the hell is the fight in this team to try and get points, they just don't have the desire to get in where it hurts and battle.
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This season can't finish soon enough. It's embarrassing.
New Manager, new coaching staff for next season please Randy.
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Embarrassing yet entirely predictable garbage. New management team required.
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Utterly predictable. Like every away game this season we seem to play absolutely cracking stuff, dominate, have loads of chances to win it before rolling over.
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The entire 11 barring Downing, L Young, Bent and just maybe Petrov (for back up) needs to go. Overhaul time. These players just aren't good enough.
They are the same players that finished 6th last year and got to Wembley twice.
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Someone please explain how any one could believe that bringing Pires on was a good idea?
He shouldnt even be in the squad ahead of Gardner or Makoun
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Someone please explain how any one could believe that bringing Pires on was a good idea?
Why not? He's experienced. And no way should we be 'experimenting' with youth. They'll just fuck it all up.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly, but then something like this just reminds me of all the problems that have been allowed to persist all season.
A wretched season in which the management team and players have done very little to make us think they're worthy of being associated with Aston Villa.
It's also not over yet, worryingly. Three games left, Wigan, Arsenal and Liverpool, none of which will be easy.
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that was embarrassing !!!! this manager is worse than odreary. we are fucked !!!
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If Randy thinks thats good enough he is off is head.New manager and half a new squad is needed.We will struggle like hell next season.Time for the board to grow a pair and sort this shit out.
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Stupid fucking subs, we finished the game with 1 st, 2 cb, 2 rb and 5 fucking wingers.
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Awful. Truly dire. Our goal is a flukey OG, we have an extra man for the last half hour and have no idea how to create chances. I remember when we lost at home to Sunderland, Houllier said after we had a man sent off the game changed and there was little chance of us winning. We must be the most defeatist, spineless team in the division.
This has almost been as bad as O'Dreary's last season. West Brom haven't beaten us since Johnny fecking Giles was their manager. Fuck them all off in the summer, management and players. Rip it up and start again.
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Another defeat from a position that 12 months ago we would have held on to. From start to finish this season has been shit.
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Looking at BBC Sport and it seem Albion is celebrating as if they won the FA Cup.
What did you expect? For all the cobblers about Wolves, they like us as much as I enjoy eating shit sandwiches. Very silly to throw away a lead from there against a team that aren't very good. We got too gung ho for our own good at the end and should have kept Reo Coker on.
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I wish Houllier the best of health but i'll be glad if we don't see him at VP again. What a terrible appointment he was.
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How many years since we lost to Albion - 20-odd? Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic. Why take NRC off and bring Pires on? If anyone needed to replace NRC it should have been Delph. But we still had over half an hour against 10 men and still didn't look like scoring. The real worry is that we're still not mathematically safe
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Someone please explain how any one could believe that bringing Pires on was a good idea?
Why not? He's experienced. And no way should we be 'experimenting' with youth. They'll just fuck it all up.
True. I said the same thing on another thread and was thinking the exact same thing when Pires came on.
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I fucking hate the team, most of the squad, the management. Never seen a team with less collective balls in villa colours. In retrospect it was clear that players would do fuck all for McAllister, and then he further hamstrings us with a retarded substitution. I hope they slash and burn this summer, players and management, and start again, and not in fucking August. If Randy is not decisive this summer in cutting out the shite I will have finally gone from pro to anti. We are where we are because GH/GM was a mistake, which was not rectified, and far, far shitter teams with better managers are making mugs of us all over the place. What a massive pile of fucking shit of a season.
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Houllier may have had a heart-attack but Gary Mac's clearly had a psychotic episode.
Pires? Sorry, but I just can't get over that.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly, but then something like this just reminds me of all the problems that have been allowed to persist all season.
A wretched season in which the management team and players have done very little to make us think they're worthy of being associated with Aston Villa.
It's also not over yet, worryingly. Three games left, Wigan, Arsenal and Liverpool, none of which will be easy.
If Houllier stays. we will go down next season. We would have been down this season had Saint Randy not pulled Bent out of his back pocket. Time to admit he's past it now, and let's move on.
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I'm more angry after that result, than after any result this season tbh.
Angry that LYoung is playing LB, gives a stupid ball away that leads to a free kick for their 1st goal.Not strong enough for their 2nd.
Angry that Petrov is even in the squad.Too slow, can't pick a pass, did'nt track his man back for their 2nd.A lazy lazy player.
Pires.....why, good player, but 3 years too laqte for a club of our stature.
AYoung.....another fruitless performance.Can't think of one telling contribution.
Gabby.....time is up son.Never looked a danger in the whole of the game.
If Ashley goes in the summer, then good luck to him, the others i have mentioned, time to get rid.
Collins can join them as well.
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We needed a point to be safe and should have got at least that today. If we don't get it against Wigan it's going to be squeaky bum time again. At one all and a man up there should have been only one winner. A bit unlucky with both goals but then ours was jammy as well and the defending was still worse than woeful. I'm afraid Gabby contributes little if he isn't scoring and would play Heskey ahead of him every time.
As for A Young and his free kicks there were all sorts of excuse made for him on a thread a while back such as the new ball making them difficult but I've seen plenty of players get them on target regularly. The long and short of it is Ash is just shit at free kicks and everyone except Ash and the management have known it for months. I won;t be sorry to see him go for that reason alone.
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Ashley Young's value is dropping every game. We'll be lucky to get £7M for him now.
He'll end up at Fulham or somewhere similar if he keeps stinking the place up week after week.
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the game changed at the sending off, when it forced us to be the dominant team. We are not built for that at all, and you can see how uncomfortable the team is when they are being asked to push forward. We are much better soaking up pressure and exposing the open spaces on the break. This is a result of five years under MON where we became very good at block and break tactics.
I don't blame McAllister entirely for this. He brought on Pires to try and open things up knowing full well Albion would close ranks. It didn't work, and the rest of our players simply didn't have the knowledge or ability to get it done. Inevtiably with a less than secure defence Albion did to us, what we have done to others for the past few years.
We need personnel changes at the club if we are to play in the manner Houllier wants us to. That much is abundantly clear.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
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FFS - I don't think we will get another point this season, I just hope 41 points is enough to stay up.
We need a complete overall this summer.
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As I said on the match thread I would not be suprised to see Pires given a contract for next season........If he isnt going to get a contract then why is he even in the squad. I think Gerard and McAllister think he is "our game changing" sub/playmaker
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Well hopefully Wolves and West Ham lose tom'w / monday and we can get a point at home to wigan next week and then we can close this bloody season. What a sad state of affairs to come down to this...
If nothing else happens this summer, please get two centre backs and a midfielder with a bit of guile...
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I wish Houllier the best of health but i'll be glad if we don't see him at VP again. What a terrible appointment he was.
Yep we owe a debt of thanks to O'Neill, or was it Km, for spending so much on Bent, without his goals we would be in dire, not just some trouble.
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I don't get all this ''Luke Young is better at left-back''. He has no confidence in his left peg, constantly cuts-in thus narrowing the pitch and when against a winger he's uncomfortable with his tackling leg.
And so much for making sure we play the most experienced side possible in order to climb the table and win more lucre. Putting Delph, Bannan and Albrighton in from the start would at least have given us some zest and movement.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
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Awful season. Decision to bring Pires on totally fucked the momentum - as it does everytime Pires comes on. He is too slow for the top flight, a point that I think everyone knew before he even came to the club. Bad management decisions and a lack of fight. Defensively we are fucking awful.
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Fuck me it's the managers fault again, what a suprise. We have half a team that shouldn't wear the shirt,and that includes Ash who was at his very worst today. He should be banned from takig free kicks, when was the last time he scored from one.
This team needs a major overhaul and like everyone else i can't wait for the season to end, we have a midfield that couldn't open a can of beans and centrebacks that are passed their use by date. Well played Walker, Luke Young and Downing all the rest of them were shit.
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The entire 11 barring Downing, L Young, Bent and just maybe Petrov (for back up) needs to go. Overhaul time. These players just aren't good enough.
They are the same players that finished 6th last year and got to Wembley twice.
Yes and the obvious difference is the manager, the buck stops there!
The baggies bring in a new manager and look at what he has done!
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Off the top of my head: Fulham, Blackpool, Bolton, Sunderland, Stoke, West Brom.
Away games where we dominated the possesion, were the better side and created the majority of the chances without ever looking too troubled, before rolling over late on and losing points.
Absolutely ridiculous.
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game changed moment pires set foot on pitch total garbage.
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The entire 11 barring Downing, L Young, Bent and just maybe Petrov (for back up) needs to go. Overhaul time. These players just aren't good enough.
Randy Lerner is the owner, not the Prince of Persia, you realise.
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Dear Randy,
If we are fortunate enough to avoid needing points in our last two games to stay up, please sort out the management issue as soon as the season ends. We need stability and I fear we will never have that with the current 'management' team. Gerry Mac clearly isn't up to it. Also, be prepared to invest in the squad, early on in the summer. Not enough fight or ambition in this group of players.
If we screw things up this summer, we will be relegated next year.
Yours etc,
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Why not?
We've shown exactly the same pathetic frailties which have gone unchecked all season and got us into this position, while I am firmly in the camp of those who say MON's departure was a massive, massive handicap, the fact we've been so feeble all season is not his fault, it is the fault of the current management team.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
I think its more to do with the season.He has had his chance but clearly isn't up to it.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Totally. I blame Ads.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
And there was me thinking he was our manager. He may be tucked up in bed right now (and I hope he is recovering well) but this is his team and his style of play. It's been terrible all season, with precious few signs of improvement. Ultimately the buck stops with him.
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This season can't finish soon enough. It's embarrassing.
New Manager, new coaching staff for next season please Randy.
This x10
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Well he is the easy target isnt he ?? But you cant absolve him of all the blame as its his team,tactics and it wouldnt suprise me if he texted McAllister and told him to swop Reo for Pires
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Please end now, Season 2010-11.
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Well played Walker, Luke Young and Downing all the rest of them were shit.
I concur
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
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I just watched it in oldbury, pub was mostly full of Albion cocks!! I heard shit like..
3-0 to the Albion, Were the Man U of the midlands, Viiilaaa in that squeaky fucking voice. I fucked off when their man was down at the end.
really piss poor, 1st half we had it in the bag, 2nd half what the fuck happened? petrov was shit it was him that should have gone off not NRC, Where was the service to the forwards? Young was shit, the free kick at the end summed him up!
Pires? Why?
Shambles total fucking shambles
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There is an inherent spinelessness about this side.
Bringing Pires on for Reo Coker was farcical. The sooner that inept piece of shit by the name of McAllister is out of our club, the better.
We're continually told how brilliant the likes of Downing and Young are, but to be top class, you have to perform consistently.
They're basically a bunch of gutless bottlers and it will only be the utter shiteness of other teams that will keep us in this division.
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It's more the management team people have a problem with. Houllier has earned his stripes. McAllister?
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No other team on this planet would've threw that result away from the position we were in, fucking unreal!
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
Dead right, nearly as mental as those who reckon O'Neill is blameless.
No doubt the real weirdos will be out soon calling for Sid to take over.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
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Albrighton should of been substituted instead of Pires!!! WTF? Villa needed to "open up the field" not play it conservative. We need a massive house cleaning.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly
I disagree Paulie, it just hasn't worked.
The other minus point is that when you get Houllier, you get McAllister as part of the package.
A fresh approach needed for next season.
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
Cos he's shit !
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Well, what a binbag full of old wank this season has been. Losing against Blues and Wolves was bad enough but this takes the piss. They might as well put the 2010-11 DVD in the bargain bins now.
If we lose against the pie munchers we might still be looking over our shoulders nervously for a week or so.
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It's more the management team people have a problem with. Houllier has earned his stripes. McAllister?
So who should take over, Sid, KM perhaps, maybe General K. The guys a useless twunt, he's relegated enough teams to prove it, but he's all we have, sadly
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
Fuck me TV give it a rest.Your backing of the board this season no matter what is mental.
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
Cos he's shit !
Cmon, if our defender hadn't kicked the ball onto their striker, he'd have saved it. The main mistake was minutes before anyway, the major mistake was taking off Coker for Pires.
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Certainly worrying stuff as we have yet to play Liverpool and go away to the Emirates.
We'll be looking over our shoulder for a bit now.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
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No doubt the real weirdos will be out soon calling for Sid to take over.
Anyone YOU call a weirdo is likely to be a perfectly sane, normal person.
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and here's the other thing. Why does Sid get none of the blame. I'm guessing he and McAllister speak about tactics and what to do in certain situations. If people are going to throw mud at McAllister then throw it at Sid as well.
Personally, I don't think we have the weapons "right now" to play the way that Houllier wants us to, and put in a situation of having to press on and win a game we just can't do it very well.
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I hate to say it, but we really miss Milner. Houllier needs to go - his lame personality has rubbed off on the team.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly
I disagree Paulie, it just hasn't worked.
The other minus point is that when you get Houllier, you get McAllister as part of the package.
A fresh approach needed for next season.
The main reason I'd be inclined to do it is because otherwise, it means ripping up any good work he's done behind the scenes, and starting again.
admittedly, it's not the most fulsome of backings, but that's the way I'm leaning now.
Although, to be honest, I suspect it is all academic as he'll bow out on medical grounds. If that happens, it absolutely MUST happen at the start of the summer - absolutely no fucking about waiting months by Mr Lerner.
This season has been a fuck up from start to finish on lots of levels at the club, including the brass, I am afraid. That's bad enough, but walking into the same situation again this summer would be unforgiveable.
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No doubt the real weirdos will be out soon calling for Sid to take over.
Anyone YOU call a weirdo is likely to be a perfectly sane, normal person.
Oh my troll is back xxxx
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly
I disagree Paulie, it just hasn't worked.
The other minus point is that when you get Houllier, you get McAllister as part of the package.
A fresh approach needed for next season.
Yep, there are enough managers around who'd want the job, we proved in January there's money there and there'll be plenty of highly-paid deadwood departing over the summer.
If Houllier's got any sense he'll step down, I wouldn't fancy another 12 stressful months managing this shower of utter shit if I had a dodgy ticker.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly, but then something like this just reminds me of all the problems that have been allowed to persist all season.
A wretched season in which the management team and players have done very little to make us think they're worthy of being associated with Aston Villa.
It's also not over yet, worryingly. Three games left, Wigan, Arsenal and Liverpool, none of which will be easy.
Today was the day reality finally came home to roost.
Albion were poor and there for the taking but we have a shit defence, as we've had all season. The problem has never been addressed, instead we have our best centre half sitting on the bloody bench.
In central midfield we have a tidy but defensive NRC playing along side Petrov, who despite his natural technique contributes nothing positive unless you count square and backward passes as positive. When we had our injury crisis, Clark, Bannan and Delph all contributed more creatively up and down the pitch.
We have supposedly 'creative' players in Ashley and Downing but they're both all fart - no shit. Remind me what service they've given Bent in the last two games? I think the answer is sweet fuck all. We really solely on Walker and Luke Young to deliver the ball into the box. Remind me again who is Marc Albrighton?
As Chris Smith used to say during the final seasons of DOL and MON, "at least we're still creating chances". Well where are the chances this season? We've got a £24m striker that scores for fun if you give him the chance, we have Gabby, a natural goalscorer that's been played out of position all season. What a bloody waste of talent.
For me, the season is over, I really can't be bothered to waste my Saturdays watching this shit. I just hope Randy is making plans for the summer. For the money he's poured into the Villa he deserves a lot better than this crap.
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and here's the other thing. Why does Sid get none of the blame. I'm guessing he and McAllister speak about tactics and what to do in certain situations. If people are going to throw mud at McAllister then throw it at Sid as well.
Personally, I don't think we have the weapons "right now" to play the way that Houllier wants us to, and put in a situation of having to press on and win a game we just can't do it very well.
We cant when you dont pick any strikers on the bench to come on and change things
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
Cos he's shit !
Friedel
Walker
Collins
Dunne
Young
Downing
Petrov (c)
NRC
Young
Heskey
Bent
There's your team, set up to win a gritty derby
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What manner of idiot tries to play 4-4-2 with Pires as one of the central midfielders?
I thought Coker played quite well today, and Petrov didn't. If bringing Pires on was not bad enough, choosing Coker as the one to make way made it downright surreal.
McAllister really does seem to have the Platt touch when it comes to management.
I would have liked to have seen Houllier given a season with his own players. If the price of retaining him in some capacity is having McAllister running the shop then both have to go.
On a positive note, in addition to Coker, Ciaran Clark looked a class above the Swiss Roll he replaced and Luke Young had a good game.
I want to go to sleep until after the Liverpool game.
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How did LYoung play well when he was partly responsible for both their goals, offered no support for AYoung.
Compare and contrast our left side to our right.Everything comes down our right.
Gabby and Petrov, where we the runs of Bent.How many times do Walker/Downing get free, and fail to pick a pass out?Is that their fault, or the lack of runs.
A midfield of Petrov and NRC is too pedestrian......Makoun every time for me, where ws he.
Albion were shit, and even with 10 men we lost......embarassing
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and here's the other thing. Why does Sid get none of the blame. I'm guessing he and McAllister speak about tactics and what to do in certain situations. If people are going to throw mud at McAllister then throw it at Sid as well.
Personally, I don't think we have the weapons "right now" to play the way that Houllier wants us to, and put in a situation of having to press on and win a game we just can't do it very well.
We cant when you dont pick any strikers on the bench to come on and change things
We had enough attacking talent on the pitch to win the game. The only other forward would have been having Heskey available. Would it have made that much of a difference? We couldn't get the ball into the box for ages. Apparently that's a key piece to scoring goals.
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We are safe already, so no need for panic.
We should have been 2 or 3 up by the time they equalised, but We kept getting caught offside.
I must admit Mark Hughes results have caught my eye recently, but hopefully Houllier returns.
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I wish Houllier the best of health but i'll be glad if we don't see him at VP again. What a terrible appointment he was.
This.
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I'm of the opinion that Houllier should get next season at least to try to sort us out properly
I disagree Paulie, it just hasn't worked.
The other minus point is that when you get Houllier, you get McAllister as part of the package.
A fresh approach needed for next season.
Yep, there are enough managers around who'd want the job, we proved in January there's money there and there'll be plenty of highly-paid deadwood departing over the summer.
If Houllier's got any sense he'll step down, I wouldn't fancy another 12 stressful months managing this shower of utter shit if I had a dodgy ticker.
I don't think Houllier will be here due to his health. I expect that will also mean the end of McAllister because whoever comes in will bring his own staff.
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What a nightmare we've had since we lost away to Chelsea 7-1 last season. We then lost the FA cup semi, stupid loss on the last day of the season to Blackburn, the Milner saga, the problems from August.
There clearly are underlying problems at villa that need to be addressed this summer. Radical surgery needed and that includes staff unless we can get Thompson in to assist GH.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Today's result is symptomatic of what's happened far too many times this season. That is because the culture that Houllier has engendered at Villa Park is completely wrong.
I reckon that at least half the clubs in the division were their manager to be in hospital there would be a spirit of "Let's do it for the boss" and we'd have six points from the last two games. That we have one point tells you everything about a lack of fight and esprit de corps. That's Houllier's fault.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
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Urgh, our defence is pathetic once again being. mentally frail. It was 11 v 10 wtf?!
We can never truly push forward and progress, just when things are looking good and we have the opportunity to go top 10 we go two steps back yet again.
We have to beat Wigan next week but we probably won't with mcallister in charge.
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Ashley Young has morphed into a prima donna.
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and here's the other thing. Why does Sid get none of the blame. I'm guessing he and McAllister speak about tactics and what to do in certain situations. If people are going to throw mud at McAllister then throw it at Sid as well.
Personally, I don't think we have the weapons "right now" to play the way that Houllier wants us to, and put in a situation of having to press on and win a game we just can't do it very well.
We cant when you dont pick any strikers on the bench to come on and change things
We had enough attacking talent on the pitch to win the game. The only other forward would have been having Heskey available. Would it have made that much of a difference? We couldn't get the ball into the box for ages. Apparently that's a key piece to scoring goals.
Nail on head.Who sets up the side to play like that.It's not the players.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
Decisions he made today which may have affected the outcome of the match are down to GM, but there's no getting away from the fact that the weaknesses and shitness of today were the same ones which have been allowed to fester all season.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
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On the plus side we are now only three games away from the end of a truly abysmal season.
We can only hope for wholesale changes on and off the pitch now and hopefully make amends next season.
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After the way O'Neill walked, the uncertainty and injuries during KM's episode in control, the aggro when Houllier took over, his subsequent heart problems, I'd suggest next season we need to have a new manager in early, very early to take over, to ensure next season whichever league we are in is one of some stability and follows and agreed plan of action.
We most certainly don't need to keep a bloke who even if he does well may be subject to further heart problems, or to develop a situation where after a full close season we are looking in the bargain basement again for another manager when they have all been signed up.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
Wrong im afraid its Gerards team, his tactics and the team was set up as he wanted it as he had been in contact with
McAllister all week and it wouldnt suprise me if Gerard told him to make the substitution as well
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You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
True. But it's still a drink. I reckon Gary Mac would try to make a cup of coffee with a house-brick.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
If you fundamentally do not believe in kick and rush football, you're not going to just go along with it now are you? Lots of people have been crying out for a better brand of football at Villa Park for a while now. He's trying to do that, and it's not going to happen overnight. He needs the summer.
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After the way O'Neill walked, the uncertainty and injuries during KM's episode in control, the aggro when Houllier took over, his subsequent heart problems, I'd suggest next season we need to have a new manager in early, very early to take over, to ensure next season whichever league we are in is one of some stability and follows and agreed plan of action.
We most certainly don't need to keep a bloke who even if he does well may be subject to further heart problems, or to develop a situation where after a full close season we are looking in the bargain basement again for another manager when they have all been signed up.
Thank you, Captain Obvious.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
Decisions he made today which may have affected the outcome of the match are down to GM, but there's no getting away from the fact that the weaknesses and shitness of today were the same ones which have been allowed to fester all season.
Luckily those decisions got us 4 games unbeaten too until today and most likely avoided the drop, if we scrounge 2 points from somewhere.
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
No one today came out with any credit, all a bag of shit, massive clear out is required. I used to think we needed to give houllier full pre-season etc, but houllier has to go I think now, we need to get a new manager in sharpish, early june at the latest, to give full pre-season and chance of making the signings he wants.
We HAVE to get something out of the wigan game next weekend, cos we will get fuck all out of Arsenal or Liverpool.
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After the way O'Neill walked, the uncertainty and injuries during KM's episode in control, the aggro when Houllier took over, his subsequent heart problems, I'd suggest next season we need to have a new manager in early, very early to take over, to ensure next season whichever league we are in is one of some stability and follows and agreed plan of action.
We most certainly don't need to keep a bloke who even if he does well may be subject to further heart problems, or to develop a situation where after a full close season we are looking in the bargain basement again for another manager when they have all been signed up.
Thank you, Captain Obvious.
Amazed you realised it xx
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Ashley Young has morphed into a prima donna.
You've only just noticed? Have you not seen much of the Villa over the last two seasons?
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
ps. why aren't you blaming Sid also? Houllier promoted him to his current position too.
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
That why he was leading goalscorer under the Mighty Mon ?
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Just had a txt off my boggie mate
Worth the wait he said.
Wanker
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I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
I don't really understand what you're getting at here.
McAllister wasn't his first choice, but he still chose him. Just like Houllier wasn't our first choice, but he still got the job.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
ps. why aren't you blaming Sid also? Houllier promoted him to his current position too.
What a load of crap.It's not like it was a rush job to get him in was it?
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
No one today came out with any credit, all a bag of shit, massive clear out is required. I used to think we needed to give houllier full pre-season etc, but houllier has to go I think now, we need to get a new manager in sharpish, early june at the latest, to give full pre-season and chance of making the signings he wants.
We HAVE to get something out of the wigan game next weekend, cos we will get fuck all out of Arsenal or Liverpool.
Luckily for us I think we are safe...I can see 39/40 points being safe the way the games are going.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
ps. why aren't you blaming Sid also? Houllier promoted him to his current position too.
No need to get sarcastic TV. You are 100% wrong. Houllier appointed him and if he didn't rate him he shouldn't have brought him in. If he did rate him (which he obviously did) then his judgement is poor. Which part of that do you not understand?
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
You've obviously not seen his goal record up until this season. As I said earlier, give him (and Bent) decent service and the goals will come.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
If you fundamentally do not believe in kick and rush football, you're not going to just go along with it now are you? Lots of people have been crying out for a better brand of football at Villa Park for a while now. He's trying to do that, and it's not going to happen overnight. He needs the summer.
You do the best you can with the players at your disposal. You do not risk everything just because you don't believe in 'kick and rush', because if you get relegated then the summer gets spent selling most of your players to Premier League clubs (ones that played to their strengths and stayed up) and building a side for the Championship. I find it astonishing that a Villa fan would think it's perfectly okey-dokey to risk our top-flight status like this.
Make us solid first, then start changing the style of play to suit your ideals of how the game should be played.
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That sums up our season.
Shit decisions from management costing us points.
With an opposition down to ten men and tiring, it's time to hit them with some pace and some guile.
But we hit them with the crab twins.
Petrov, sideways to Pires, square ball back to Petrov, back to Pires who looks around and sees Petrov available who then gives it away....
Well done Gary Mac. Clueless cock.
Took the words out of my mouth. Pires and petrov I bet they shit themselves
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
If you fundamentally do not believe in kick and rush football, you're not going to just go along with it now are you? Lots of people have been crying out for a better brand of football at Villa Park for a while now. He's trying to do that, and it's not going to happen overnight. He needs the summer.
You do the best you can with the players at your disposal. You do not risk everything just because you don't believe in 'kick and rush', because if you get relegated then the summer gets spent selling most of your players to Premier League clubs (ones that played to their strengths and stayed up) and building a side for the Championship. I find it astonishing that a Villa fan would think it's perfectly okey-dokey to risk our top-flight status like this.
Make us solid first, then start changing the style of play to suit your ideals of how the game should be played.
I'm firmly in favour of getting us to play more football, and at a lot of points this season we have shown signs of doing just that, but we've gone from having one of the more solid defences in the league to having an utter fucking shambles at the back.
How long does it take to instill in the minds of defenders, who did a good job last season, the basics of defending?
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The entire 11 barring Downing, L Young, Bent and just maybe Petrov (for back up) needs to go. Overhaul time. These players just aren't good enough.
They are the same players that finished 6th last year and got to Wembley twice.
Yes and the obvious difference is the manager, the buck stops there!
The baggies bring in a new manager and look at what he has done!
Maybe James Milner is another obvious difference.
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Gary Mac, one of a select bunch who can make Gerard look good!!! Thank Goodness Randy will sort it out in the summer.
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Pires on was todays fault. He was shocking. Troy put it best, saying we played the Crab-twins, and giving possesion away. That was Macs fault. And Mac has been here all season, so maybe he is the cancer in the side.
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
You've obviously not seen his goal record up until this season. As I said earlier, give him (and Bent) decent service and the goals will come.
Is the correct answer, The service to Agbonlahor & Bent was shocking
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
You've obviously not seen his goal record up until this season. As I said earlier, give him (and Bent) decent service and the goals will come.
Quite...nowt wrong with the forward options. It's just we are too one dimensional. Teams set out to nullify Young and Downing...and if they do that we have no other option through the middle. We've been crying out for a centre mid playmaker and a goal scorer for years. We have Bent now, now for the other if we seriously want to push on. (err and two centre backs).
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Dire, awful stuff from the Villa, and a performance which strangely and probably irrationally has had a bit of a 'last straw' effect on me. I've managed to remain broadly positive through the season, in the face of a lot of balls-ups, but for some reason today has just left me with a real 'ah, fuck it' frame of mind.
I won't be sorry to see Houllier leave (wishing him the best of health, of course) along with McAllister, Ashley Young, Dunne, Collins, Petrov, Pires...... it just isn't working.
Rip this up, start again.
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Any Aston Villa manager whos team loses games to blose albion and wolves in the same season should be sacked along with his staff its as simple as that Randy!!
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Maybe we should take the positives, we lost, but only by one goal, which could mean something at the end of the season. Sunderland lost by 3, so I see we are neck and neck with them now. Actually, what happens if it comes down to goal difference and even that is the same?!
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I still maintain that the substitution lost us that game. If NRC wasn't injured why take him off rather than the tiring Petrov? Even if we assume NRC was injured why replace him with the slow Pires rather than someone with energy like Delph? Also given that our defence has been so shit all season - 57 goals conceded and counting - what does Cuellar have to do to get a game? Even today Clark got the nod ahead of him when Fatboy came off.
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Maybe we should take the positives, we lost, but only by one goal, which could mean something at the end of the season. Sunderland lost by 3, so I see we are neck and neck with them now. Actually, what happens if it comes down to goal difference and even that is the same?!
Then they judge you buy your neighbours.
Newcastle and Blues....an equal set of complete ******.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
ps. why aren't you blaming Sid also? Houllier promoted him to his current position too.
No need to get sarcastic TV. You are 100% wrong. Houllier appointed him and if he didn't rate him he shouldn't have brought him in. If he did rate him (which he obviously did) then his judgement is poor. Which part of that do you not understand?
Would he have appointed him if the people he wanted were available? It's a simple question. He appointed him because the people he wanted weren't available and he trusted him from their time at Liverpool. When you come to a new place it is very common for a manager to surround himself with people he knows and trusts.
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The service to Gabby and Bent was not shite, thet just take the same positions.
How many times did Downing/Walker and Petrov get in good positions, but fail to pick a pass out?
A more intellegent striker needed alongside Bent please.
I was a big fan of Gabby, now if anyone offered over £10m i w3ould seriously consider.
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I still maintain that the substitution lost us that game.
No one in the entire galaxy is arguing with you...except the one solitary dickhead who matters.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
If it was one game in isolation, and we'd had even an average season, I could maybe buy into that.
Frustrating yes, but in the grand scheme of things largely academic.
However, today illustrated most of the weaknesses that have dogged us throughout this campaign -particularly under this management team- and failure to win next week will see us facing the very real prospect of starting the final game of the season still not absolutely, mathematically safe.
I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
If you fundamentally do not believe in kick and rush football, you're not going to just go along with it now are you? Lots of people have been crying out for a better brand of football at Villa Park for a while now. He's trying to do that, and it's not going to happen overnight. He needs the summer.
You do the best you can with the players at your disposal. You do not risk everything just because you don't believe in 'kick and rush', because if you get relegated then the summer gets spent selling most of your players to Premier League clubs (ones that played to their strengths and stayed up) and building a side for the Championship. I find it astonishing that a Villa fan would think it's perfectly okey-dokey to risk our top-flight status like this.
Make us solid first, then start changing the style of play to suit your ideals of how the game should be played.
Exactly right Jimbo.
To hear the way some go on you'd think we were like Wimbledon under Basset or Gould, Bolton under Allerdyce during MON's tenure. We weren't always easy on the eye, but we were capable of generating excitement at times and getting results. Under Houllier/ Gmac, we can do neither.
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gabby a natural goalscorer ? really ? shit more like, all about pace and no end product.
You've obviously not seen his goal record up until this season. As I said earlier, give him (and Bent) decent service and the goals will come.
Quite...nowt wrong with the forward options. It's just we are too one dimensional. Teams set out to nullify Young and Downing...and if they do that we have no other option through the middle. We've been crying out for a centre mid playmaker and a goal scorer for years. We have Bent now, now for the other if we seriously want to push on. (err and two centre backs).
I think Young and Downing do enough to nullify themselves without the opposition having to worry too much. They get themselves in great positions to deliver but almost always try and complicate the opportunity. They really are all fart, no shit. Somebody for far too long has needed to stand up to them and tell them to get the ball in the bloody box. At least Downing brings the ball forward and uses Walker to cross the ball.
Don't get me started on corners and free kicks.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I think you might find that I am not incorrect because I didn't say anything about him being his first choice did I? Read peoples posts properly before you make such statements. Oh, and by the way, Houllier appointed G Mac whether he was 1st choice, 2nd choice or 26th choice. It's Houllier's fault that McAllister is at our club.
Houllier appointed McAllister as his assistant manager. So in answer to your comment about bringing in his "own number 2" he didn't which is what I pointed out. He wanted Thompson with Duverne. It is quite conceivable that McAllister would not even be at the club had he appointed Thompson. I did read your post and in doing so pointed out your error.
What error? Did Houllier bring in G Mac or not?
I'll type slower. He brought in McAllister because the people he really wanted didn't want to come at the time. It is conceivable that McAllister would not be at the club getting the blame for today's defeat had Houllier been able to get the people he actually wanted.
ps. why aren't you blaming Sid also? Houllier promoted him to his current position too.
No need to get sarcastic TV. You are 100% wrong. Houllier appointed him and if he didn't rate him he shouldn't have brought him in. If he did rate him (which he obviously did) then his judgement is poor. Which part of that do you not understand?
Would he have appointed him if the people he wanted were available? It's a simple question. He appointed him because the people he wanted weren't available and he trusted him from their time at Liverpool. When you come to a new place it is very common for a manager to surround himself with people he knows and trusts.
Whichever way you slice it Gary McAllister was brought in by Houllier and therefore Gerard is culpable for that clueless waste of space being at our club. G Mac was the worst appointment we've had at the Villa since..................well, since Houllier.
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This game was G Macs fault! Not Houlliers.
If it was one game in isolation, and we'd had even an average season, I could maybe buy into that.
Frustrating yes, but in the grand scheme of things largely academic.
However, today illustrated most of the weaknesses that have dogged us throughout this campaign -particularly under this management team- and failure to win next week will see us facing the very real prospect of starting the final game of the season still not absolutely, mathematically safe.
I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Agreed.
Yeah poor Gerard. Having that clueless twat Gary Mac forced on him like that. If only Gerard could have brought in his own number 2, then we wouldn't have had that useless prat in charge of us today. Oh wait........
so McAllister was his initial choice as assistant? I think you might find that you incorrect on that and he wanted Thompson instead.
I was unaware there were only two men available to be considered for this role. Unlucky, Gerard.
so you seem to have knowledge of who was out of work and available, or who might have just pakced up on their current employer a month into the season and walked to Villa Park. Who should he have got instead?
I'm not a top-flight football manager, so I'm afraid I cannot tell you. I can, however, tell you that there were probably more than two men in the entire world of football that might have been considered for this job, and who might have been better at it.
I can also tell you that a manager should play to his side's strengths rather than impose a new system upon it, which his players are ill-equipped to play. You admit that we haven't got the personnel to play Houllier's attractive, intelligent passing game. So why can't you admit that trying to play this way with the wrong players has been a failure of management? You don't try to make a cup of coffee with a tea bag.
If you fundamentally do not believe in kick and rush football, you're not going to just go along with it now are you? Lots of people have been crying out for a better brand of football at Villa Park for a while now. He's trying to do that, and it's not going to happen overnight. He needs the summer.
You do the best you can with the players at your disposal. You do not risk everything just because you don't believe in 'kick and rush', because if you get relegated then the summer gets spent selling most of your players to Premier League clubs (ones that played to their strengths and stayed up) and building a side for the Championship. I find it astonishing that a Villa fan would think it's perfectly okey-dokey to risk our top-flight status like this.
Make us solid first, then start changing the style of play to suit your ideals of how the game should be played.
Exactly right Jimbo.
To hear the way some go on you'd think we were like Wimbledon under Basset or Gould, Bolton under Allerdyce during MON's tenure. We weren't always easy on the eye, but we were capable of generating excitement at times and getting results. Under Houllier/ Gmac, we can do neither.
That is why i said "this game". I might also say that GMac is part of the problem all season. Can't say who is fault at what - can't care, replace management. But today we could have had 3 easy games (mentally) if that idiot didnt put Pires on!
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Just got home, I still can't get my head around that, Albion were absolutely woeful and we handed it to them on a plate, i lost count of the amount of times we got into a position along the goal line only to cut the ball back to nobody, must have been about 6 or 7 times, worst thing that happened was them going down to 10 because they stuck everybody behind the ball and not one of our lads had a clue what to do, our movement off the ball is non existance, losing to Wolves and Albion in the space of a few weeks is sickening.
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And another thing - i am trying to remember if we have scored from a Corner this season? If we have, i would guess Clark has scored one, but I really can't remember.
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
Cos he's shit !
But he's experienced. And you were telling us all week how important that was. Indeed you did the same today after the game.
Pires is experienced too.
As is that disgrace to the shirt Dunne.
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Just one question - are we safe? Because as soon as we are, I couldn't give less of a shit. We're not going to be in Europe, nor will we be relegated. So as soon as it's confirmed, the better.
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One of a few games I've not watched this season. From what you lot have said, I'm glad. SOunds like a re-run of other, equally inept performances, such as Sunderland, Wolves, Blues at home and Stoke City to name but a few. This season has been a true shocker.
We won't go down, but to be still having to bother to check the bottom half of the tables results with only a few games to go is a disgrace.
Bollocks.
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Mathematically, no, we're not safe. In all likelihood we'll stay up in spite of our determination to self-destruct.
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No were not safe
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Beat Wigan we are, lose against them, lose against Arsenal & Liverpool and our fate is not in our own hands
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
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I am fully aware of his record thanks, and my point still stands, gabby is NOT a natural goal scorer for me, his footballing brain is poor, on chances there for the taking more often than not he will fuck it up, compared to someone like bent who i would class as a natural goalscorer. If we had not of bought bent, we would be well and truly fucked now if we were relying on gabby to score the goals.
Someone makes us an offer in the summer for 8-10m, personally I would take it.
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This is the season we've lost to Blues, Wolves and now Baggies. It's too much.
Yes this actually sums up how shit we have been this season. Normally 18 points from this lot this season we get 8 and first Wolves win for 28 years first Albion win for 25 years. Nothing else to be said.
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The only positive I can take from todays game is that it re-emphasised what a complete and utter twat GMac is.
If he is harbouring any ambitions of taking over from Houllier then today should have been the final nail in that particular coffin.
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I am fully aware of his record thanks, and my point still stands, gabby is NOT a natural goal scorer for me, his footballing brain is poor, on chances there for the taking more often than not he will fuck it up, compared to someone like bent who i would class as a natural goalscorer. If we had not of bought bent, we would be well and truly fucked now if we were relying on gabby to score the goals.
Someone makes us an offer in the summer for 8-10m, personally I would take it.
We'll have problems keeping most of our players even if we survive, and here you are advocating selling our leading striker under Mon. Personally I can think of plenty of dire shite in the side I'd prefer sold first, but then I don't have a Gabby thing.
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Watched that on the telly,absolutley no quality for all the possesion,Ashley Young truely awful today,downing good first half goes missing 2nd half ,could go on but to much to drink so would say to much,any positives ?nahh.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
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Pires is being played by GMAC so it's not his fault that he is on the pitch. He should not be on the pitch. However Dunne and Ash Young are a complete disgrace. Get them out ASAP.
After this no one should be under ant illusion that we have not turned into a crap team. unmotivated players managed by third class coaching staff.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
Great post Percy.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
The perfect analogy..
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
It's hard to argue against that.
Look at where we are now, in isolation to everything that has gone on previously this season, and the very fact that we are still not mathematically safe from relegation with three - THREE - matches remaining is nothing short of a disgrace.
Not just "bad", "poor" or "shit", it is an inexcusable mess that we are in - even thinking about relegation, FFS.
It'd be nice to find an option where the answer is that it is nobody's fault, but there is no such thing, unfortunately.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
He appointed Gary McAllister.
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McAllister is the senior coach isn't he?
He has to carry the can till Houllier returns.
He doesn't inspire any confidence whatsoever.
He has the look of a man suffering with incurable piles.
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There is something seriously wrong with the way the team is set up, motivation and the tactics. Today was Mcalisters fault, but it was indicative of the GH GM regime. The whole thing is a mess and considering GH health issues there are no easy soloutions. RL does need to come up with a plan for the summer and the right people to take the club forward.
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I wouldn't let him carry my shopping.
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I fucking hate the team, most of the squad, the management. Never seen a team with less collective balls in villa colours. In retrospect it was clear that players would do fuck all for McAllister, and then he further hamstrings us with a retarded substitution. I hope they slash and burn this summer, players and management, and start again, and not in fucking August. If Randy is not decisive this summer in cutting out the shite I will have finally gone from pro to anti. We are where we are because GH/GM was a mistake, which was not rectified, and far, far shitter teams with better managers are making mugs of us all over the place. What a massive pile of fucking shit of a season.
Agree totally. I feel absolutely no attachment to the current set up at all - neither the management team or most of the players. It is quite a while since I have felt so detached and lacking in passion about my beloved club...
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I am fully aware of his record thanks, and my point still stands, gabby is NOT a natural goal scorer for me, his footballing brain is poor, on chances there for the taking more often than not he will fuck it up, compared to someone like bent who i would class as a natural goalscorer. If we had not of bought bent, we would be well and truly fucked now if we were relying on gabby to score the goals.
Someone makes us an offer in the summer for 8-10m, personally I would take it.
We'll have problems keeping most of our players even if we survive, and here you are advocating selling our leading striker under Mon. Personally I can think of plenty of dire shite in the side I'd prefer sold first, but then I don't have a Gabby thing.
Where have i said I wanted gabby sold first ? No disagreement on there is more shit to be moved on ahead of him from me.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
It's hard to argue against that.
Look at where we are now, in isolation to everything that has gone on previously this season, and the very fact that we are still not mathematically safe from relegation with three - THREE - matches remaining is nothing short of a disgrace.
Not just "bad", "poor" or "shit", it is an inexcusable mess that we are in - even thinking about relegation, FFS.
It'd be nice to find an option where the answer is that it is nobody's fault, but there is no such thing, unfortunately.
Yep that is a good summary and when you look at the fact that only Cit-eh and Bolton have improved on last season and NO club has fallen so far and so fast.
Fact is that any half decent management team would have had this side finishing seventh or eighth especially after spending 0million in the transfer window
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
That sums it up perfectly, excellent post!
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game changed moment pires set foot on pitch total garbage.
and the moment NRC left the pitch
Clueless management
as for Clarks challenge leading to the equaliser, I'm speechless, no need, stay on your feet FFS
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And why did Friedel go down so quick for their 2nd goal.He did'nt need to.
Cos he's shit !
But he's experienced. And you were telling us all week how important that was. Indeed you did the same today after the game.
Pires is experienced too.
As is that disgrace to the shirt Dunne.
for weeks ive said friedel should be gone and marshall in
ia lso said bannan should have been off th bench for petrov
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I fucking hate the team, most of the squad, the management. Never seen a team with less collective balls in villa colours. In retrospect it was clear that players would do fuck all for McAllister, and then he further hamstrings us with a retarded substitution. I hope they slash and burn this summer, players and management, and start again, and not in fucking August. If Randy is not decisive this summer in cutting out the shite I will have finally gone from pro to anti. We are where we are because GH/GM was a mistake, which was not rectified, and far, far shitter teams with better managers are making mugs of us all over the place. What a massive pile of fucking shit of a season.
Agree totally. I feel absolutely no attachment to the current set up at all - neither the management team or most of the players. It is quite a while since I have felt so detached and lacking in passion about my beloved club...
Can't disagree with any of this. An overhaul starting with Falconer, Houllier, McAllister otherwise we will start throwing good money after bad - likely as not to start with Michael Owen in exchange for Ashley + some. And there is no way we will hold onto ones we actually want to keep (other than the youngsters).
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
can anyone please explain to me why he even has a squad number ?
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for weeks ive said friedel should be gone and marshall in
ia lso said bannan should have been off th bench for petrov
Stop talking shit.
Friedel
Walker
Collins
Dunne
Young
Downing
Petrov (c)
NRC
Young
Heskey
Bent
There's your team, set up to win a gritty derby
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Prior to that i'd called for Friedels head on many occasssions, feel free to dig tose posts out too
I picked Friedel for today as it was clear he will never be dropped
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I said...STOP. TALKING. SHIT.
It was suggested a change of goalkeeper in the "should we experiment" thread and you had a big fucking cry over changing the spine of the team.
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I said...STOP. TALKING. SHIT.
It was suggested a change of goalkeeper in the "should we experiment" thread and you had a big fucking cry over changing the spine of the team.
Cut out the bull crap, dig my quote out, i mentioned CB, CM areas not the keeper albeit to play the 3rd choice ahead of Marshall would have been ridiculous
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical. Bringing on a creative player for someone not renowned for his attacking flair isn't that bonkers especially if the opposition are down to ten men.
It's not what I would have done but lets be realistic on another day it could have worked.
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If anything sums up our season, it was the introduction of Pires and the subsequent result.
And if you want some more of that, theres plenty coming if there's no change in the management structure.
One of the least endearing traits of anyone is arrogance, but I did predict this. Sorry.
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical. Bringing on a creative player for someone not renowned for his attacking flair isn't that bonkers especially if the opposition are down to ten men.
It's not what I would have done but lets be realistic on another day it could have worked.
point being NRC was RUNNING the game
maybe hard to see over a tv ??
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Where was Makoun today?
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical.
Of course our possession went up. Pires and Petrov passed the ball sideways for a sum total of 427 miles. And all that for a gain of about 5 yards before losing the ball.
Possession wasn't the issue...getting the ball into an area where we could hurt West Brom was.
Pires wasn't the man to do that. Not today, not any other day.
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The problems.
Trying to play with 2 wide men, and no plan B.
No left back.
Allowing AY to take every free kick. And a lack of alternative.
Centre of defence a shambles.
Goalkeeper past it.
Lack of motivation.
Shocking PR from the Manager.
Dreadfull substitutions.
Off field problems.
Too many players the wrong side of 30.
Not all of these issues are the fault of GH and GM but when you consider the playing resources they have there is no way that we should be in the situation we are in.
the saving grace is that we have an owner that has shown his financial comitment to our club.
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical. Bringing on a creative player for someone not renowned for his attacking flair isn't that bonkers especially if the opposition are down to ten men.
It's not what I would have done but lets be realistic on another day it could have worked.
point being NRC was RUNNING the game
maybe hard to see over a tv ??
Regardless of the impact of NRC, the presence of Pires at the club has added nothing, unless you count his bank balance.
He did ok against Blackburn but in the main he has the gait of one who doesn't give a fuckin' shit. Sorry boys, not for me, and you get what you put in. Swallow the result, we deserve nothing more.
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Maybe. I didn't come across that way but I acknowledge that TV doesn't show the movements players make in order to prevent attacks and equally get into attacking spaces.
At the time I would have liked to have seen Delph come on for NRC as he has a bit more flair than Coker but still has the energy (which is needed along side Petrov). Alas we don't have a crystal ball to see whether that would have been better.
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why bring Bannan back ?
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I said...STOP. TALKING. SHIT.
It was suggested a change of goalkeeper in the "should we experiment" thread and you had a big fucking cry over changing the spine of the team.
Cut out the bull crap, dig my quote out...
Did your own fucking quotes out, dipshit.
I'm quoting you saying Friedel is shit even though you picked him in your team pre-match.
But you then claim you only picked him because "he's undroppable". Which means you kind of miss the whole point of putting up a team you'd like to see.
But then, missing the point is really what you do best. Aside from being a complete cock.
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical.
Of course our possession went up. Pires and Petrov passed the ball sideways for a sum total of 427 miles. And all that for a gain of about 5 yards before losing the ball.
Possession wasn't the issue...getting the ball into an area where we could hurt West Brom was.
Pires wasn't the man to do that. Not today, not any other day.
i thought we had them on the rack until we bought Pires on, the momentum changed immmediately. It was a fkin ridiculous decision, just plain stupid.
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I said...STOP. TALKING. SHIT.
It was suggested a change of goalkeeper in the "should we experiment" thread and you had a big fucking cry over changing the spine of the team.
Cut out the bull crap, dig my quote out...
Did your own fucking quotes out, dipshit.
I'm quoting you saying Friedel is shit even though you picked him in your team pre-match.
But you then claim you only picked him because "he's undroppable". Which means you kind of miss the whole point of putting up a team you'd like to see.
But then, missing the point is really what you do best. Aside from being a complete cock.
That's enough of that.
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We're so close to being a quality side its frustrating. We lack a bit of steel, defensive stability and we're still not clinical enough.
If we can add a quality leader at the back and in midfield, and replace Ashley with someone who can get 7-8 from open play, we'll be a top six side again.
Not disrespect to Clark, but had Dunne stayed on we'd have atleast a point, I reckon.
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The problems:
...
...
Allowing AY to take every free kick. And a lack of alternative.
...
Oh, I dunno. Blindfolding Friedel, spinning him around a dozen times and then getting him to try a back-heel with his left foot seems a better alternative to me.
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Agree totally. I feel absolutely no attachment to the current set up at all - neither the management team or most of the players. It is quite a while since I have felt so detached and lacking in passion about my beloved club...
Know what you mean about feeling detached from the management just now. I felt pretty apathetic about the game today - a strange sentiment.
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It seemed to get worse when Pirès came on.
hmmm the possession went from 57% (on my ESPN stream) to 67% (on the BBC) in the period from the substitution to their goal. I hate to not be hysterical like a lot of you guys but the substitution wasn't *that* illogical.
Of course our possession went up. Pires and Petrov passed the ball sideways for a sum total of 427 miles. And all that for a gain of about 5 yards before losing the ball.
Possession wasn't the issue...getting the ball into an area where we could hurt West Brom was.
Pires wasn't the man to do that. Not today, not any other day.
i thought we had them on the rack until we bought Pires on, the momentum changed immmediately. It was a fkin ridiculous decision, just plain stupid.
I agreed. They were on the rack, hence bringing on a more attacking player who is more likely to be able to pick a killer pass that NRC. Again its not what I would have done but it wasn't as stupid/negligent as some are making out.
He gambled. He lost. Simple as that.
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I agreed. They were on the rack, hence bringing on a more attacking player who is more likely to be able to pick a killer pass that NRC. Again its not what I would have done but it wasn't as stupid/negligent as some are making out.
He gambled. He lost. Simple as that.
In theory I do too. I'd have no complaints if he brought on Delph or Bannan (if he'd made the bench). But he brought on Pires.
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I agreed. They were on the rack, hence bringing on a more attacking player who is more likely to be able to pick a killer pass that NRC. Again its not what I would have done but it wasn't as stupid/negligent as some are making out.
He gambled. He lost. Simple as that.
In theory I do too. I'd have no complaints if he brought on Delph or Bannan (if he'd made the bench). But he brought on Pires.
Exactly Bentman. The mistake was arguably not having Bannan on the bench or not trusting Delph enough, the logic behind the change was pretty sound.
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We're so close to being a quality side its frustrating. We lack a bit of steel, defensive stability and we're still not clinical enough.
Hit the nail right on the head. That's the massively frustrating thing with our team this season. We know we're better than this. But we're just not
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We got lots of good ball time in and around their box but there was never a killer ball.
Very frustrating
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Petrov and Pires are quite similar. Had it been him for Pires I could see it. But to change the only midfielder with balls we have, for Pires, against their midfield cloggers, makes no sense to me at all. If NRC was coming off, it had to be for Delph.
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I agreed. They were on the rack, hence bringing on a more attacking player who is more likely to be able to pick a killer pass that NRC. Again its not what I would have done but it wasn't as stupid/negligent as some are making out.
He gambled. He lost. Simple as that.
In theory I do too. I'd have no complaints if he brought on Delph or Bannan (if he'd made the bench). But he brought on Pires.
Exactly Bentman. The mistake was arguably not having Bannan on the bench or not trusting Delph enough, the logic behind the change was pretty sound.
I still don't agree. NRC had what was for him, a decent passing game. He had forward momentum. Petrov doesn't. We needed to keep the game deep in West Brom's half. Having the crab brothers was only ever going to allow the Stripey's to put pressure on our midfield. NRC should have stayed. ANYONE but Pires should have come on. Even the reserve keeper. At least he could have punted the ball up field.
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He's as mad as a bottle of cake (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2350323,00.html)
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We stuck in a lot of offensive players with skill, pace and guile but we couldn't break down West Brom and then we got done with a sucker punch, which was a series of mistakes.
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Maybe that's why he went with Pires...to give some balance to our over-weight in "skill, pace and guile".
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We're so close to being a quality side its frustrating. We lack a bit of steel, defensive stability and we're still not clinical enough.
If we can add a quality leader at the back and in midfield, and replace Ashley with someone who can get 7-8 from open play, we'll be a top six side again.
Not disrespect to Clark, but had Dunne stayed on we'd have atleast a point, I reckon.
This is why we need a new manager. Despite being in the job eight months, we are further away from being a good side under Houllier than we would be under a new boss. Virtually every manager in the league could make a solid defence out of Dunne, Collins, Cuellar, Luke Young, Warnock, Beye and Clarke. Same goes for making a good attack out of Ash, Bent, Gabby, Downing, Albrighton and Heskey. If a new bloke can sort out centre-mid, hopefully while making the most of Makoun, Gardner and Delph, we'll be sorted. It is remarkably similar to the situation inherited by DOL - good players who didn't perform for the previous boss. He only needed two players (bought from a relegated club) to return us to the top six side we were under Gregory. Could even be that we need similar players now as we did then - a keeper and a midfield battler.
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Pure unadulterated shit from a clueless set of spineless wankers lead by a clueless clown of a manager.
Absolutely bang on the money
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
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He's as mad as a bottle of cake (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2350323,00.html)
GM reckons Ashley Young has 'been outstanding' this season.That alone is an act of gross misconduct.He's as mad as a bottle of cake (http://www.avfc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10265~2350323,00.html)
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler was written in 1943 Germany.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.
I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.
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Tbh i think a lot of players are going through the motions, knowing/hopeing to be elsewhere next season, and they play like it.
The worst thing that could have happened to us today was us scoring early.Then too many6 players thought it was over.The 1st half was all us, and if we was 2/3-0 up at h/t it would'nt have flattered us.2nd half we was probably as dominant, but 2 poor goals yet again, and not creating enough chances with the amount of posession yet again.
JJ, you are right, we are not far away, and to be fair to GH, Bent and Walker have beenexcellant, as i think will be Makoun.
MM might be right on VT, that some of the players who will be shipped out are destabilising the team.Mind you it is our 1st defeat in 5 games.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.
I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.
Not having trouble understanding it at all Percy. I'm just not ready to jump into the lifeboat with you. I'm not happy about today, but I don't think today displays close to the end product. Where was this outpouring of anger yesterday? We had the same manager, assistant, coaches and players. Where was the panic then? One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.
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Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?
This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.
The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.
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I didn't see much wrong in McAllister's post-match interview on the beeb or in the Pravda article (apart from giving Young and Downing too much credit). The interviewer on the BBC was sucking-up to him if anything - ''a game I thought you dominated'', ''they scored against the run of play'' but in fairness to McAllister he said he thought our passing was too pedestrian and defending was slack for the goals...Houllier isn't usually critical of our play when talking to the media.
If anything though, the fact that he knows what our faults are but isn't able to rectify them suggest he isn't cut-out for an assistant managerial/caretaker position.
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Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?
This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.
The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.
And the problems will be there until he can rid the club of the players that cannot do the job. It's all good and well throwing bombs at the manager. But some of the players have simply not done the job.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Now this is the thing, it's not just after losing a game is it? It's after losing many games. It's after losing derby games against our three closest rivals in one season. It's after the Anfield fiasco. It's after the Man City/FA Cup capitulation. It's after playing Young and Gabby out of position again and again. It's after a solid defence has been transformed into one of the worst in the Premier League. It's after Robert Pires. It's after Gary McAllister. It's after performances that are consistently as hapless as they are toothless. It's after watching us try to play a system with players that cannot play that system. It's after watching our players pass the ball back and forth just in front of their own box without going anywhere. It's after being mathematically unsafe with just three games to go before the end of the season. It's after seeing us go from 6th place and two Wembley appearances, to flirting with relegation in less than a year. It's after all this that some of us are saying "wake the fuck up, this isn't working."
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One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.
You're right. That's why some of us have banged on about it for the best part of six months.
Wrong manager, wrong assistant and - looking at how the same mistakes have been replicated over and over again - the wrong coaches. And I don't care if that includes a playing legend.
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Or indeed his man mangement skills
Criticising players in public is certainly route one to losing player respect, not that it matters now as this seems to have happened months ago
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.
I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.
Not having trouble understanding it at all Percy. I'm just not ready to jump into the lifeboat with you. I'm not happy about today, but I d
on't think today displays close to the end product. Where was this outpouring of anger yesterday? We had the same manager, assistant, coaches and players. Where was the panic then? One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.
What today has re-affirmed is what we have all known for months.
The team is lost, floundering, and under performing.
It needs strong leadership, and we do not have it.
I agree that we have taken some steps forward. BUT, for every step forward, we seem to take 3 steps back.
We have no consistency.
If we agree that underneath everything there is a decent team in there, then you have to question why someone can't bring it out.
After all, The Baggies were in dire straits until they brought the right manager, for them.
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It's the accumulation of the season, VT. Today was just the last straw for me. Albion were crap and all 3 points were there for the taking and we just bottled it. You can carry on with your annual defence of the undefendable but the writing is clearly on the wall in big flashing neon letters. It's not a demand to go back to the shite of MON but just because we pass the ball about at the back, it doesn't mean we're moving in the right direction.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful business and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the business continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Now this is the thing, it's not just after losing a game is it? It's after losing many games. It's after losing derby games against our three closest rivals in one season. It's after the Anfield fiasco. It's after the Man City/FA Cup capitulation. It's after playing Young and Gabby out of position again and again. It's after a solid defence has been transformed into one of the worst in the Premier League. It's after Robert Pires. It's after Gary McAllister. It's after performances that are consistently as hapless as they are toothless. It's after watching us try to play a system with players that cannot play that system. It's after watching our players pass the ball back and forth just in front of their own box without going anywhere. It's after being mathematically unsafe with just three games to go before the end of the season. It's after seeing us go from 6th place and two Wembley appearances, to flirting with relegation in less than a year. It's after all this that some of us are saying "wake the fuck up, this isn't working."
spot on Jimbo
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GED spent what £6m on Makoun and he cant even get into our floundering side
Enough is enough surely
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Jimbo - spot on. It's a season's pile of crap, one thing after another!
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Woeful again.
We have had 12 months of shit.
Time to get ruthless - unless we want the same next year and beyond.
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Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?
This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.
The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.
And the problems will be there until he can rid the club of the players that cannot do the job. It's all good and well throwing bombs at the manager. But some of the players have simply not done the job.
Everyone can see some of the players have not done the job, but why are you absolving the manager of blame?
Dunne, Collins, Cuellar, Luke Young, Ashley, Downing, Petrov, Friedel, Warnock, I could go on - these were players which were all here last season too. What happened to them to become so utterly rubbish
He has had the whole season to do something about the defence, but opted not to change it because it'll be easier in the summer (his words), meanwhile we've leaked goals all season. The same players under a different manager last season were one of the best defences in the league.
And if you're wondering why so many people want to see the back of him, and the pathetic points return we've managed this season, take a pick from any one of about a dozen gigantic fuck ups and gaffes directly attributable to him.
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I really can't get my head around people blaming Houllier for today's result.
Neither can I but you know they've been lying dormant for the past couple of weeks itching to give it another go. He wasn't at the game but somehow he caused our defeat. I find that kind of thinking borderline mental.
So a manager takes over a moderately successful football team and turns it into a shambles. He goes on the sick, leaving the assistant he appointed in charge, and surprise surprise, the football team continues to be a shambles. Who do you blame then?
so what business would you compare football to? When did managing football players or changing tactics in sport, versus people in an or factory become similar occupations?
I'm not here to tell you the garden is rosy. Far from it. I consider this a difficult period in the plan. But I'm certainly not about to claim the sky is falling in either which was absolutely guaranteed to be the position for some as soon as we lost a game.
Fixed.
yes, nothing like re-writing history to suit your argument. I think you can also find books on what cuddly bloke Hitler written in 1943 Germany.
I haven't re-written my argument at all, I just simplified it for you as you seemed to be having trouble understanding the analogy.
Not having trouble understanding it at all Percy. I'm just not ready to jump into the lifeboat with you. I'm not happy about today, but I don't think today displays close to the end product. Where was this outpouring of anger yesterday? We had the same manager, assistant, coaches and players. Where was the panic then? One game shouldn't change the way people feel about the entire situation.
One game TV you are in total denial.
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Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?
This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.
The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.
And the problems will be there until he can rid the club of the players that cannot do the job. It's all good and well throwing bombs at the manager. But some of the players have simply not done the job.
Everyone can see some of the players have not done the job, but why are you absolving the manager of blame?
Dunne, Collins, Cuellar, Luke Young, Ashley, Downing, Petrov, Friedel, Warnock, I could go on - these were players which were all here last season too. What happened to them to become so utterly rubbish
He has had the whole season to do something about the defence, but opted not to change it because it'll be easier in the summer (his words), meanwhile we've leaked goals all season. The same players under a different manager last season were one of the best defences in the league.
And if you're wondering why so many people want to see the back of him, and the pathetic points return we've managed this season, take a pick from any one of about a dozen gigantic fuck ups and gaffes directly attributable to him.
I've genuinely lost count of Gerard's gaffes - anyone care to list them to remind us of where we're at?
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In defence of TV, it is sometimes hard to pick up on our tactical deficiencies, lack of battle and general lethargy from web streams/ tv etc.
I can understand the argument that GH / GM may need another year or two, but personally i think it will end in tears
We've got away with it this year it seems, next year we may not get the breaks
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Toronto - "a difficult period in the plan" - isn't that putting it somewhat lightly?
This is year five and in playing terms, we're more or less where we were in 2006, except with a really expensive striker, and having spent a gigantic amount of money.
The anger has been there all season, so it's a little unfair to ask where it was yesterday or the day before. Pick a match thread at random from this season and you'll see the same old problems over and over. The problems have been there the whole time. Today was a reminder that they're *still* there, and it's really not good enough.
And the problems will be there until he can rid the club of the players that cannot do the job. It's all good and well throwing bombs at the manager. But some of the players have simply not done the job.
Everyone can see some of the players have not done the job, but why are you absolving the manager of blame?
Dunne, Collins, Cuellar, Luke Young, Ashley, Downing, Petrov, Friedel, Warnock, I could go on - these were players which were all here last season too. What happened to them to become so utterly rubbish
He has had the whole season to do something about the defence, but opted not to change it because it'll be easier in the summer (his words), meanwhile we've leaked goals all season. The same players under a different manager last season were one of the best defences in the league.
And if you're wondering why so many people want to see the back of him, and the pathetic points return we've managed this season, take a pick from any one of about a dozen gigantic fuck ups and gaffes directly attributable to him.
I've genuinely lost count of Gerard's gaffes - anyone care to list them to remind us of where we're at?
Just starting it now,if I work day and night I should be able to get it to you on Monday.
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Wiki, you are prepared to give the current management team another year or two? You obviously didn't see that surrender today. Bloody disgrace. £42 for what?
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Wiki, you are prepared to give the current management team another year or two? You obviously didn't see that surrender today. Bloody disgrace. £42 for what?
No mate, i said cut losses now, I did close to £150 on tickets / petrol / parking etc today
Complete waste of time and money
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Where did you go?
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Sadly, Smethwick
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We had a great day in Stourbridge and Lye - some cracking ales! Should have stayed in the pub!
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Next time I will, Arsenal away, no thanks
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
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They all have, but as Yorkie said recently, the players must take most responsibility.
is it GH/GM fault that LYoung cant defend properly
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There has been a distinct lack of professionalism within this club from players and management alike. The following need to leave in the summer for the benefit of the club.
Beye, Warnock, Dunne, Collins, Reo-Coker, Heskey, A.Young, Carew, Friedal, Pires, McCallister and Houllier.
They're not fit to be wearing an Aston Villa badge on their clothing. The signing of Bent by Randy has kept us up, we're lucky her done that. He needs to deal with the management of the club the day after the season ends and not fuck about waiting for solutions to sort themselve.
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There has been a distinct lack of professionalism within this club from players and management alike. The following need to leave in the summer for the benefit of the club.
Beye, Warnock, Dunne, Collins, Reo-Coker, Heskey, A.Young, Carew, Friedal, Pires, McCallister and Houllier.
They're not fit to be wearing an Aston Villa badge on their clothing. The signing of Bent by Randy has kept us up, we're lucky her done that. He needs to deal with the management of the club the day after the season ends and not fuck about waiting for solutions to sort themselve.
I can't see what Reo-Coker has done wrong, to be honest. He's no world beater, but he's always stepped up and given a decent account of himself when called upon.
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Ashley Young's free kick at the end summed it all up for me, we are gifted a goal and have the lion's share of the ball but do nothing with it, I can't remember us having many clear cut chances.
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back hoping the bottom half doz have a terrible finish to season otherwise we are back in the deep doo doo.. we needed all wins and look at us. One poss win and rwo heavy duty games left.
Disgusted again,,should have done better today and we'd be relaxed about ensuing games. Really disgusted.
Other put it more eloquently...
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So you get shot of half the squad, and who do you trust to get replacements in?
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What a woeful season, thank McGrath it's nearly over.
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
Habit? Time of the year? (winky)
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Putting on Pires for NRC was something i don't think even GH would have done. My mate next to me said 'that's the game gone' and how bloody right he was. There was no need to make a change at all, it was just Gmac trying to be tactical and he fell flat on his face.
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Just read a few comments from Baggies fans. They could not believe the decision to replace NRC with Pires. 'It won them the game.'
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Fingers crossed that the day the season ends, this clown of a caretaker is hauled in and sacked!
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There has been a distinct lack of professionalism within this club from players and management alike. The following need to leave in the summer for the benefit of the club.
Beye, Warnock, Dunne, Collins, Reo-Coker, Heskey, A.Young, Carew, Friedal, Pires, McCallister and Houllier.
They're not fit to be wearing an Aston Villa badge on their clothing. The signing of Bent by Randy has kept us up, we're lucky her done that. He needs to deal with the management of the club the day after the season ends and not fuck about waiting for solutions to sort themselve.
I can't see what Reo-Coker has done wrong, to be honest. He's no world beater, but he's always stepped up and given a decent account of himself when called upon.
I'm not doubting that, I think he always gives his best. I just don't think his best is good enough
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I genuinely don't recall a sub more baffling than that today.
There was a time when we were chasing a game under O'Neill where MON moved Cuellar to left back, but that's about all I can recall in terms of running it close.
Petrov, maybe I can see the logic. But taking our only legs in the middle of the park infront of our dodgy back four was asking for trouble.
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I genuinely don't recall a sub more baffling than that today.
There was a time when we were chasing a game under O'Neill where MON moved Cuellar to left back, but that's about all I can recall in terms of running it close.
Petrov, maybe I can see the logic. But taking our only legs in the middle of the park infront of our dodgy back four was asking for trouble.
I honestly think it was a planned sub and that it was something that Gerard and McAllister had discussed before the game
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Just read a few comments from Baggies fans. They could not believe the decision to replace NRC with Pires. 'It won them the game.'
"Nice of Villa to even up the numbers after Scharner's sending off."
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Fingers crossed that the day the season ends, this clown of a caretaker is hauled in and sacked!
And why do we need to wait til the season ends?
McAllister will not get us another point this season so either we hope we have enough already or we kick his sorry ass and that of Houllier's out now and hope that KMac can get us the victory against Wigan that settles things. That way we can start looking for a proper replacement straight away.
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I wish GH all the best and a swift return to full health.
But please RL get rid of him and GM at the end of the season on the dot..
Time to plan for the future. Our club has has its up and downs. But it's time we look to for a new management team.
Hope the guardians of OUR club take note. It is very easy to slip down the leagues.
UTV
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Fingers crossed that the day the season ends, this clown of a caretaker is hauled in and sacked!
And why do we need to wait til the season ends?
McAllister will not get us another point this season so either we hope we have enough already or we kick his sorry ass and that of Houllier's out now and hope that KMac can get us the victory against Wigan that settles things. That way we can start looking for a proper replacement straight away.
Won't happen.
If there's one thing we've learned it's that they don't do snap decisions, for good or for ill.
*optimistic hat on* We were the better side today. We're above Sunderland and B-lose (even if they win tomorrow) and only two points off the Olbiyun with three games to make it up. It wouldn't be entirely out of the question for us to beat Wigan and Liverpool at home.
FWIW, I think we'll draw with Wigan next week and lose to the Gooners and Redscouse though. 42 points should see us safe -say in 15h-16th place. Whisper it quietly, but that might even be best for us in the long run too. A positive end to the campaign might paper over a few of the cracks and tempt the powers that be (plus some Villa fans) to continue with the present set up, the knock on effect being that we die a slow death under an uninspired and uninspiring management team.
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Todays performancs and result should be the final nail that I'm hoping helps some on here get their heads out of the sand.
The Houllier experience has proved to be a shocking Management appointment. I said after the Spam game, if we end the season well and play some good football, pick up a few wins he can then potentially build a platform for next season with players and supporters.
Well already it's gone the other way hasnt it. So get well soon Gerrard but please, please, please Randy, it must be Au Revoir.
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We were doing fine just recently until G-Crap was responsible for things.
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the only positive about today is it should really make Lerner & Faulkner wake up and shit themselves
Albion were abysmal, and they beat us
With 10 men
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People are slating Pires, NRC and some others on here for the result, but surely the majority of the blame must rest with Collins? Who missed the free kick allowing the Baggy to head it back into our box? A half decent centre back would have got something on that ball to knock it away from the attacker and thus kill off the danger. To miss it completely having seen the distance it travelled is inexusable.
And who got done out on the sideline in the build up for their second goal? If he had made the tackle that would have nullified the situation.
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Todays performancs and result should be the final nail that I'm hoping helps some on here get their heads out of the sand.
The Houllier experience has proved to be a shocking Management appointment. I said after the Spam game, if we end the season well and play some good football, pick up a few wins he can then potentially build a platform for next season with players and supporters.
Well already it's gone the other way hasnt it. So get well soon Gerrard but please, please, please Randy, it must be Au Revoir.
Agreed 3.5 years away from any day to day management and the hiring of an ineffective crony who seems to turned to dust everything he has touched. That is why Falconer needs to be binned too - he is hired to run the club and recommend the best candidate for the most important position. An absolute disaster. The reason I have so much ire is that this season was a wasted opportunity and the way Spurs have folded 5th place should not have been out of the question. I met an Everton fan at the 1st Ashes Test in Brisbane who was bemoaning Moyes - I said I would love him at the Villa - also said they would finish above us with ease this year and he was unconvinced. I can see his point this is there worse season for 5 years but it has been better than ours.
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People are slating Pires, NRC and some others on here for the result, but surely the majority of the blame must rest with Collins? Who missed the free kick allowing the Baggy to head it back into our box? A half decent centre back would have got something on that ball to knock it away from the attacker and thus kill off the danger. To miss it completely having seen the distance it travelled is inexusable.
And who got done out on the sideline in the build up for their second goal? If he had made the tackle that would have nullified the situation.
Exactly, headless chicken comes to mind...even at the end of the game when he was playing up front
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Half the team appear to have a foot on the beach - looking at the reamaining matches
we might finish with 42pts that will keep us up for now but a massive question mark over
our fortunes for next season -
I fear Mssrs Houllier & McAllister might still be around but significant changes in the squad-
The club will be expecting us to renew our season tickets in the next few weeks, I don't reckon
on being alone in having to think long and hard about that one based on what I seen home and
away this past 11 months-
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I'll renew. I love our club and everything about it. No matter what.
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I'll renew. I love our club and everything about it. No matter what.
80% of us will, but we can demand change also
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If Houllier/McAllister had run Nasa's Apollo missions, man would never have landed on the Moon, he would have just stayed in orbit, slowly made his way around the orb and meekly made his way back again with barely a splash down. We try to play possession football but tinker around the edges, crab-like, refusing to use what pace exists in the team; there is barely a forward gear, we hardly create a chance, and when we do get behind the defence (Shorey was struggling for them today) the delivery was poor; on top of that today our set-pieces were shocking - in a season when they have been mostly just abysmal; we barely gave our record striker a sniff. And the management took off our two most effective players. And yes, Petrov had lots of energy and was trying to knit things together, before ludicrously being paired with Pires after NRC's nonsensical substitution. There's little bottle in the team, not enough adventure in how we're set out and a complete rabbit-in-headlamps vision from the bench.
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So you get shot of half the squad, and who do you trust to get replacements in?
sod that where does the money come from.
Ok we were beaten today but the problem is holding onto players not selling them.
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We've got away with it this year it seems, next year we may not get the breaks
the breaks??
Like the manager walking out on a poorly prepered unfit squad as the season started.
The length of time it took to get a new man in the dugout, for him to get the players fit, to stop the insider dissent.
Or perhaps you consider seventy percent of the season with a full injury list and untried kids as your mainstay a break.
Get a life.
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We've got away with it this year it seems, next year we may not get the breaks
the breaks??
Like the manager walking out on a poorly prepered unfit squad as the season started.
The length of time it took to get a new man in the dugout, for him to get the players fit, to stop the insider dissent.
Or perhaps you consider seventy percent of the season with a full injury list and untried kids as your mainstay a break.
Get a life.
You also missed the bit about having a Manager that undermines players, plays them consitantly out of position, ignores supporters so he can have a love in with his former, former employers, throws FA Cup ties and generally brings in a level of incompetence not seen since the halcyon days of Billy McDonught.
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We've got away with it this year it seems, next year we may not get the breaks
the breaks??
Like the manager walking out on a poorly prepered unfit squad as the season started.
The length of time it took to get a new man in the dugout, for him to get the players fit, to stop the insider dissent.
Or perhaps you consider seventy percent of the season with a full injury list and untried kids as your mainstay a break.
Get a life.
You also missed the bit about having a Manager that undermines players, plays them consitantly out of position, ignores supporters so he can have a love in with his former, former employers, throws FA Cup ties and generally brings in a level of incompetence not seen since the halcyon days of Billy McDonaught.
And the bit about the manager turning players who previously had the confidence that they could beat any team in the league into a bunch of blokes who look like they've never met before and expect to lose from the first minute.
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Bottom line is I'm gutted we lost today to a SHIT albion side
Just like we lost to a SHIT SHA side
& a SHIT WOLVES Side
Points to one thing, a very crap season and the fact that under the current regime WE ARE SHIT
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Hate to agree with you WikiVilla but I do.
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We've got away with it this year it seems, next year we may not get the breaks
the breaks??
Like the manager walking out on a poorly prepered unfit squad as the season started.
The length of time it took to get a new man in the dugout, for him to get the players fit, to stop the insider dissent.
Or perhaps you consider seventy percent of the season with a full injury list and untried kids as your mainstay a break.
Get a life.
You also missed the bit about having a Manager that undermines players, plays them consitantly out of position, ignores supporters so he can have a love in with his former, former employers, throws FA Cup ties and generally brings in a level of incompetence not seen since the halcyon days of Billy McDonaught.
Think you sum it perfect! Mr Oz
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Ashley Youngs free kick at the end summed up our season, I predicted it was going high over the bar as so many of his frees have this season and so it did. He is a major part of our problem, he is not the player of two years ago but still demands the ball every time.
I do not understand why Delph isn't playing, we are playing the same midfield that were useless last season, not a constructive pass between them and it just shows how far we've dropped when NRC is looked upon as the better option. Most of our problems stem from midfield and until we replace NRC and Petrov with quality it won't change.
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part of that problem is Ash has left the club a "nuggett" of hope of keeping him so they are fearful of upsetting him
Still taking free kicks on the edge of your own 18 yard box is taking the piss
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I've just heard Gmac say on TV ' We need to win against Wigan and get our first double of the season'
plonker , get that twat out of the club now. He hasnt got a clue.
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Bottom line is I'm gutted we lost today to a SHIT albion side
Just like we lost to a SHIT SHA side
& a SHIT WOLVES Side
Points to one thing, a very crap season and the fact that under the current regime WE ARE SHIT
But this is nothing new. We've known that we've been shit all season. We all know which of those players have been consistently shit. And they are the senior pro's. The very ones that you insisted pre-match that we stick with no matter what.
You're all over the road like a mad woman's dinner.
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Wba 2 - 1 Villa - Loss
Villa 1 - 1 Wigan - Draw
Arsenal 4 - 1 Villa - Loss
Villa 0 - 0 Liverpool - Draw
Wba 2 - 1 Villa - Loss
Villa 1 - 1 Wigan - Draw
Arsenal 4 - 1 Villa - Loss
Villa 0 - 0 Liverpool - Draw
This season results wise i've been bang on the money! It's been pretty easy though crap tactics/management/players/attitude/small squad = shit results.
Unfortunately for us it's all very predictable and stale, we can't win a game or get a point without going a goal down first!
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Try as I might I cannot establish any reason to put on Pires. NRC was solid. We have 60% odd of posession and them down to ten men. The obvious thing is to quicken and spread the play. Petrov was tiring as normal so get him off and bring on some creativety to release the forward players.
We need new legs and he brings on the Gallic Douglas Bader.
I can only think he wanted some mature stability in midfield and hence GMaC was actually playing for a draw!!
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
I'm not at all. I just don't see how he can be blamed for the defeat today. There is no way any of us know how today could have ended up if he was on the sideline. Up until his illness we had gone 4 unbeaten. Not earth shattering I grant you, but unbeaten nonetheless. At 1-0 at HT I didn't read any Houllier out posts. Just because we threw it away in the 2nd half is down to players and staff at the game today. It's as much McAllister's fault for not making the right tactical changes as it is for the players' inability to finish off their chances, and the defences for not keeping them from scoring. We simply didn't know how to break down the opposition when asked to be the dominant team in the game. Is Houllier responsible for some of that because he's been the manager this season? Off course. But then these same players under MON couldn't do it either, so I'm not going to say it's all Houllier's fault.
I'm just not going to get carried away when we lose, neither am I going to dance in the streets when we win right now. I'm willing to give him the opportunity to properly put his stamp on the club, both in terms of coaches and players. This is a manager that has won a lot in his career, so my guess he has to have some idea of what it takes to build a successful club side. Each to their own of their view of that. If it's like this next season, he'll have very few people that will come to his defence.
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I've just heard Gmac say on TV ' We need to win against Wigan and get our first double of the season'
plonker , get that twat out of the club now. He hasnt got a clue.
We've done the double over Wrist Ham.
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I went for a walk in Cannock Chase. Infinitely better than watching the game, it seems. Bring on the end of the season.
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Does anyone else think we missed Heskey yesterday? Gabby and Bent did'nt quite work really did it?
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Does anyone else think we missed Heskey yesterday? Gabby and Bent did'nt quite work really did it?
No, because Gabby spent most of the game out on the left again while Ashley Young wandered everywhere else doing bugger all.
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Does anyone else think we missed Heskey yesterday? Gabby and Bent did'nt quite work really did it?
thats the thing , If we did miss Heskey , its bloody worrying.
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I've just heard Gmac say on TV ' We need to win against Wigan and get our first double of the season'
plonker , get that twat out of the club now. He hasnt got a clue.
We've done the double over Wrist Ham.
Exactly , he's managing our club and fook knows what hes been up to. He aint got a clue. I dont mind Houlier getting another season but not with that man next to him. If he is going to be , then houlier can fook off too..
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What is worrying is that nothing positive was done to change a clearly flawed set up. Irrespective of Heskey.
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Again i was disappointed i thought 1-0 up we would go on and win it but we feck it up again every time when will we ever learn it now becomes our cup final next week when we play Wigan beat them and we are safe.
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
I'm not at all. I just don't see how he can be blamed for the defeat today. There is no way any of us know how today could have ended up if he was on the sideline. Up until his illness we had gone 4 unbeaten. Not earth shattering I grant you, but unbeaten nonetheless. At 1-0 at HT I didn't read any Houllier out posts. Just because we threw it away in the 2nd half is down to players and staff at the game today. It's as much McAllister's fault for not making the right tactical changes as it is for the players' inability to finish off their chances, and the defences for not keeping them from scoring. We simply didn't know how to break down the opposition when asked to be the dominant team in the game. Is Houllier responsible for some of that because he's been the manager this season? Off course. But then these same players under MON couldn't do it either, so I'm not going to say it's all Houllier's fault.
I'm just not going to get carried away when we lose, neither am I going to dance in the streets when we win right now. I'm willing to give him the opportunity to properly put his stamp on the club, both in terms of coaches and players. This is a manager that has won a lot in his career, so my guess he has to have some idea of what it takes to build a successful club side. Each to their own of their view of that. If it's like this next season, he'll have very few people that will come to his defence.
If GH slept with your misses you would forgive him.
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We were SHIT , only Downing can hold his head up high ( again ) ... what chance does Benty have liviing on scraps, so you cant blame him either.
Ash was dreadful , maybe he does need a change of scenery ?
N'Zogbia for me.
Oh and Dunne , Ffs, drive him to Harry Ramsdens and leave him there I say .
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Ashley Young's petulant swing of the ball in the last minute summed up the whole sorry mess. There was no effort in that free kick and he was basically saying fuck off as he took it. The Pires for Reo-Coker substitution was the most baffling decision in a season of baffling decisions. Abysmal.
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When was the last time we beat Wigan at home?
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Only plus point was being back in a pub in Brum by 5.30 pm (And meeting Frank and the German Villans there).
I really can't remember a Villa side that was so poor at making key decisions at the back and going forward. Well no in truth I can, it was our last relegation team - but this team has so much more natural talent than that one, so why? :-\
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
It's the later, but also for me that this team has thrown away so many winning positions this season which is inevitably really, really, bloody frustrating.
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
If you don't get the negativity you may as well give up now.
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
If you don't get the negativity you may as well give up now.
Well explain. I have seen a team that, when it has all its players fit produce some really entertaining attacking football since January. We lost our first game in 5, after our manager nearly was taken seriously ill and we were still very unfortunate. It hurts losing a derby and for what its worth i think Gmac should be replaced in the summer but some of the criticism of GED is outrageous. Our two centre backs that started yesterday are a fucking disgrace, neither will be 1st choice after the summer IMO and despite that we have been on a decent run. Watch the highlights from yesterday and tell me we didnt deserve 3 points. Both there goals were fortunate, and while i appreciate ours was as well, we created far more than they did. We were unfortunate to lose away to a team in good form, move on.
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
If you don't get the negativity you may as well give up now.
Well explain. I have seen a team that, when it has all its players fit produce some really entertaining attacking football since January. We lost our first game in 5, after our manager nearly was taken seriously ill and we were still very unfortunate. It hurts losing a derby and for what its worth i think Gmac should be replaced in the summer but some of the criticism of GED is outrageous. Our two centre backs that started yesterday are a fucking disgrace, neither will be 1st choice after the summer IMO and despite that we have been on a decent run. Watch the highlights from yesterday and tell me we didnt deserve 3 points. Both there goals were fortunate, and while i appreciate ours was as well, we created far more than they did. We were unfortunate to lose away to a team in good form, move on.
We lost,we did not deserve 3 points.We got what we deserved nothing.
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The problem is, it's been larely the same all season, lots of possesion and attacks that lead to nothing and getting sucker punched down the other end. Especially away from home. It's frustrating enough losing as much as we have this season anyway, but to lose in that manner as often as we have is infuriating.
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I never saw the match live, but why are everyone having a go at Dunne for this match. He wasn't even on the pitch for either goal and Clark and Collins actually both made mistakes for both goals.
My brother texted me to say "Told you so. Another late goal" at 1750 yesterday. I texted back that the main reason we are in this mess is now in charge of the team and he had evened up the teams with bringing Pires on for NRC.
Although Houllier has dropped clangers himself, most of the rumours about the behind the scenes issues seem to have GMac at the centre of them. He has proved three times that he is not a manager at lower levels then we play so why should he be good now. I doubt very much that we would be in any of this mess if Pinochio had took the job.
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Please please tell me why Mcallister put Pires on ?? we needed fresh legs to humiliate there ten man team ? So he puts on Charlie fucking Chaplin .......
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Please please tell me why Mcallister put Pires on ?? we needed fresh legs to humiliate there ten man team ? So he puts on Charlie fucking Chaplin .......
I may have missed something but I haven't seen or heard from anyone that can make sense of that substitution. Bizarre.
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I was at the Hawthorns in April 85 and we should've won that game with the chances we had too...
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
I'm not at all. I just don't see how he can be blamed for the defeat today. There is no way any of us know how today could have ended up if he was on the sideline. Up until his illness we had gone 4 unbeaten. Not earth shattering I grant you, but unbeaten nonetheless. At 1-0 at HT I didn't read any Houllier out posts. Just because we threw it away in the 2nd half is down to players and staff at the game today. It's as much McAllister's fault for not making the right tactical changes as it is for the players' inability to finish off their chances, and the defences for not keeping them from scoring. We simply didn't know how to break down the opposition when asked to be the dominant team in the game. Is Houllier responsible for some of that because he's been the manager this season? Off course. But then these same players under MON couldn't do it either, so I'm not going to say it's all Houllier's fault.
I'm just not going to get carried away when we lose, neither am I going to dance in the streets when we win right now. I'm willing to give him the opportunity to properly put his stamp on the club, both in terms of coaches and players. This is a manager that has won a lot in his career, so my guess he has to have some idea of what it takes to build a successful club side. Each to their own of their view of that. If it's like this next season, he'll have very few people that will come to his defence.
If GH slept with your misses you would forgive him.
That's ok. I've been pounding your wife because she wanted a less emotional man in her life.
I've said since the start Houllier has done nothing wrong and the world is great, haven't I? FFS. You know, once you calm down and are able to put down the snotty tissues you'll find it isn't the end of the world.
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Why was Dunne taken off? Was he injured or was it a tactical move?
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There have been many ocaisions this season when we have had teams on the rack, created lots of opportunities in the Penalty Box, failed to score and then the key stone cops in defence have come to the rescue of the opposition. It isnt down to luck that this keeps happening. There is something fundementaly wrong. It seems that there is a real lack of intent. A decent managerial set up should have that squad in the top 10.
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Of all the years i've been on this site (and it's been a few) i can't remember there being a season where's been a quite so much support for a manager who has lost as many games as we have, as well as three local derbies.
GT Mark 2 seemed to get more stick than GH has or is it just me?
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Have we ever won in those claret shorts ?
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Of all the years i've been on this site (and it's been a few) i can't remember there being a season where's been a quite so much support for a manager who has lost as many games as we have, as well as three local derbies.
GT Mark 2 seemed to get more stick than GH has or is it just me?
i think a 4 games defeated and a heart condition has something to do with it.
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
I'm not at all. I just don't see how he can be blamed for the defeat today. There is no way any of us know how today could have ended up if he was on the sideline. Up until his illness we had gone 4 unbeaten. Not earth shattering I grant you, but unbeaten nonetheless. At 1-0 at HT I didn't read any Houllier out posts. Just because we threw it away in the 2nd half is down to players and staff at the game today. It's as much McAllister's fault for not making the right tactical changes as it is for the players' inability to finish off their chances, and the defences for not keeping them from scoring. We simply didn't know how to break down the opposition when asked to be the dominant team in the game. Is Houllier responsible for some of that because he's been the manager this season? Off course. But then these same players under MON couldn't do it either, so I'm not going to say it's all Houllier's fault.
I'm just not going to get carried away when we lose, neither am I going to dance in the streets when we win right now. I'm willing to give him the opportunity to properly put his stamp on the club, both in terms of coaches and players. This is a manager that has won a lot in his career, so my guess he has to have some idea of what it takes to build a successful club side. Each to their own of their view of that. If it's like this next season, he'll have very few people that will come to his defence.
If GH slept with your misses you would forgive him.
That's ok. I've been pounding your wife because she wanted a less emotional man in her life.
I've said since the start Houllier has done nothing wrong and the world is great, haven't I? FFS. You know, once you calm down and are able to put down the snotty tissues you'll find it isn't the end of the world.
The only person who is getting emotional is you.Anybody who has a go, you come on here crying your eyes up,telling everybody how wrong they are.By the way I got both fists up your wifes arse and there was still room for more
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Please please tell me why Mcallister put Pires on ?? we needed fresh legs to humiliate there ten man team ? So he puts on Charlie fucking Chaplin .......
You're not the first on this thread to ask this. Did nobody hear Mcallister's post match comments, or was I dreaming??
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I never saw the match live, but why are everyone having a go at Dunne for this match. He wasn't even on the pitch for either goal and Clark and Collins actually both made mistakes for both goals.
We reserve the right to blame Houllier and Dunne for every defeat even if they were in Africa at the time.
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I still blame Ads.
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I really don't get the negativity. We lost after battering them and they scored two very fortunate goals. It is our first defeat in 5, is this just 5 weeks of anti GED built up? Or is it just because it was a derby?
No it's because once again we lost a game when ahead and have now lost 26 points when drawing or winning, another late goal and yes the fact that we have lost to both Albion and Wolves either side of those 5 games.
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To be fair paulie, regardless of who the manager was, i think the complete lack of professionalism by about 5/6 senior players cannot not have had an effect.
Of course it has, as i said, I'm just curious as to why Toronto is absolving the manager of blame.
I'm not at all. I just don't see how he can be blamed for the defeat today. There is no way any of us know how today could have ended up if he was on the sideline. Up until his illness we had gone 4 unbeaten. Not earth shattering I grant you, but unbeaten nonetheless. At 1-0 at HT I didn't read any Houllier out posts. Just because we threw it away in the 2nd half is down to players and staff at the game today. It's as much McAllister's fault for not making the right tactical changes as it is for the players' inability to finish off their chances, and the defences for not keeping them from scoring. We simply didn't know how to break down the opposition when asked to be the dominant team in the game. Is Houllier responsible for some of that because he's been the manager this season? Off course. But then these same players under MON couldn't do it either, so I'm not going to say it's all Houllier's fault.
I'm just not going to get carried away when we lose, neither am I going to dance in the streets when we win right now. I'm willing to give him the opportunity to properly put his stamp on the club, both in terms of coaches and players. This is a manager that has won a lot in his career, so my guess he has to have some idea of what it takes to build a successful club side. Each to their own of their view of that. If it's like this next season, he'll have very few people that will come to his defence.
If GH slept with your misses you would forgive him.
That's ok. I've been pounding your wife because she wanted a less emotional man in her life.
I've said since the start Houllier has done nothing wrong and the world is great, haven't I? FFS. You know, once you calm down and are able to put down the snotty tissues you'll find it isn't the end of the world.
The only person who is getting emotional is you.Anybody who has a go, you come on here crying your eyes up,telling everybody how wrong they are.By the way I got both fists up your wifes arse and there was still room for more
very good. Your anger grows. How are you going to feel when you find I'm hanging out the back of your mum?
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Please give it a rest.
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Final warning for both of you.
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no problem.
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Thank you.
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no problem.
Same here.
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Thank you, too.
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Please give it a rest.
Careful Legion you don't want to introduce Snooker Cue's into this penetrating debate!
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It's almost as fun as the great Comic Relief fight!
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When was the last time we beat Wigan at home?
When was the last time we lost to West Brom?
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OK as you asked. It was on 30 April 2011. ;)
But know what you mean however I can not remember us beating Wigan at VP in the PL.
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Good thing Roeder did a number on the baggies before we took to the field ;)
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disgraceful...
cant wait for the season to end...
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Why was Dunne taken off? Was he injured or was it a tactical move?
He told Gmac , he was starving..
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Why was Dunne taken off? Was he injured or was it a tactical move?
He told Gmac , he was starving..
He fell on his arse