Heroes & Villains, the Aston Villa fanzine
Heroes & Villains => Heroes Discussion => Topic started by: markus209 on November 07, 2010, 11:21:11 PM
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I could hardly believe it when I saw this, guessing that the word they were actually looking for was "bloodstained" the thick c***s (plus the boarding that says Celtic in Europe ::)), I'm shocked to see this. Disgraceful. Whatever your opinions on the wars fought, this is respect to men and women who lost their lives.
(http://i842.photobucket.com/albums/zz348/markus209/celticscum.jpg)
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I wonder how many Celtic supporters have died whilst serving in the forces over the years?
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What a bunch of fucking idiots.
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Of course, they will at the same time claim to be anti-fascist.
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Words can't explain how angry that makes me feel.
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I'm not surprised.
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they have a problem they cant move on,
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Unbelievable
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They are getting a lot of grief about it on a lot of forums by the looks of it. Be a sad day if the blue or green bigots ever get invited to our league.
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Maybe they're Guardian readers..
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/05/poppy-appeal-subverted-veterans-complain
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Glasgow Celtic and their supporters would generally be the biggest shower of hypocrites going. I'm Irish but I despise the club. it is a British club so naturally the club want to remember the British war dead and contribute to the Legion etc. I hate seeing the Irish flag being waved prominently at such bigot riven occasion such as the Glasgow derby - the green white and orange meant to symbolise peace between the two communities.
But a lot of Glasgow Celtic fans come from Northern Ireland, leaving aside the hypocricy from the barstool republicans supporting a British club albeit with Irish roots, the British Army committed several attrocities there in the not too distant past. The Bloody Sunday antics by the British Army in Derry for example should shame any civilised nation. A Glasgow Celtic supporter Aiden McAnespie was also murdered passing through an armed crossing - they tend to sing about it a good bit. Where the money goes is also a bone of contention - subsidising drinks for the Lee Clegg's of this world is an argument I've heard many times.
Having lived in the UK for some time, my own view is that I personally wouldnt be buying any poppy. But I wouldnt dream of criticising the British club I support - Aston Villa - for doing so.
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They've got to focus on something, their tinpot league and 4 games against Rangers every season, must drive them to distraction.
Wankers.
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Surely this is religious / rascist bigotry with the intent to cause anger and offense - so lets see if the clyb are fined / charged over it - they at the end of the day have let this be brought into the ground and displayed so they have to take responsibility for it
Bet if it was anti Islam they would have been done with hours
I heard about their refusal to allow poppies to be sold in / outside the ground but it came from a Ranger supporter and i thought it was just a wind up
Totally disgraceful and they should all be ashamed of themselves
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The Celtic players should be made to wear the Poppy and the Rangers players should be made to wear the Easter Lily. For no good reason other than it would annoy the hell out of both of them.
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Our thanks are due to Markus for drawing our attention to this disgusting filth by a bunch of brainless idiots. Fascists indeed.
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I'm happy for them to display their banners as we live in a free country but you do have to say who won them the right to retain their frredom of speech. All thats being asked is to show a bit of respect.
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i think this was from last year about 1.09
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Seems they have a "bit of a record" for being classless twats.
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I'm amazed that the H&V paradox hasn't been invoked, where at least one person sticks up for something indefensible and congratulates the Celtic supporters.
I always imagine that if you had a 'Hitler was a shit' thread in off topic, a few would sing his praises.
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Whether you agree with the Poppy Appeal or not, it's a sensitive issue that can so easily offend, so why not simpy ignore it as opposed to protesting against it, especially as it's not something that actually hurts anyone?
I agree - classless and stupid!
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It will never cease to amaze me why some seem so keen to publish youtube videos so the world can see them and their mates looking utter bell ends.
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I can't belive they all didn't get thrown out for something like that
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Just a bunch of fcking wa***rs.
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I was going to post this today but 'markus' beat me to it!
My Brother-in-law was at the game yesterday as an Aberdeen fan and he told me about this last night. To be honest I was not in the least bit surprised as they had previously shown contemptuous behaviour towards Simon Weston last year. Celtic fans need to be reminded that Scotland is still part of Great Britain.
They are a classless bunch indeed but I think they just crave the free press that this story provides. Every club has their imbeciles but Celtic seem to reign supreme on that front.
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Morons. Over 50,000 Irish Catholics died in the First World War fighting for Britain in the hope of winning self government for Ireland. More Irish died fighting for Britain than ever died fighting against Britain.
It disgusts me to see them wave the tricolour at matches. It's a flag representing Green and Orange and the white stands for peace between them. Most of the idiots have probably never been to Ireland yet embarrass the hell out of us with their sectarianism etc. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't wear a poppy and wouldn't be a huge fan of the British army based on stuff that happened in the past in Ireland yet I recognise that it was on the right side in both world wars. The past is the past and there's no use raking over it again and again. Also I prefer to recognise the similarities between the British and Irish and think the British are a fair people who are home to the club that I've supported all my life!
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Perhaps Celtic fans would have been happier if the British army had drawn a ring around Parkhead and handed it over to the Nazis instead of fighting against them for the benefit of England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales, Europe, the world...etc.
Wankers indeed.
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Sky News have just reported that Celtic FC has apologised for the behaviour of its fans for displaying such appalling behaviour.
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Last year i was in a pub in Dublin watching the Villa with fellow Villa fans and some Celtic supporters starting having a go because we were supporting a "British" club and we should be ashamed, when i pointed out to them in a language they would understand that Celtic is in fact a "British" club and not Irish they didn't seem too impressed.
There is this strange misconception that Celtic is an Irish club, i know Irish lads who support Arsenal, Manure etc that will wear a Celtic jersey on holiday, the same way that people wear England tops abroad.
I know a lot of decent lads who follow Celtic, including family members, but this small minded bigotry really needs to be stamped out, before it grows too much.
As someone said, i would hate to see either of Celtic/Rangers in the PL because of the amount of hassle they would bring with them.
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What a bunch of fucking idiots.
Exactly!.
Thought that we have passed all of this. There are many Irishmen from North and South and also many of their descendants that have served in the Armed Forces. There were lots of Irishman that served in the 2 World Wars fighting against the views such as these.
Yes there is recent history, but there Poppies are becoming more popular in Ireland to remember their War Dead and many Irish people working/living over here that are also wearing them to show a mark of respect.
Want they going to do next, burn an effigy of Louis Walsh?
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<I>Want they going to do next, burn an effigy of Louis Walsh</I>
Wouldn't we all agree with that?
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No chance, he's the REAL start of the Fix Factor
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They should spare a thought for the following ex Celtic players, Patrick Slavin, Leigh Roose, Donnie McLeod, Archie McMillan, Robert Craig, John McLaughlin and Peter Johnstone who gave their lives in the 1st world war.
Also ex celtic player Willie Angus who won the VC
Willie won his VC on June 12th, 1915 in Givenchy. He lost an eye, damaged a foot and was wounded 40 times in the process of successfully rescuing Lt James Martin, a fellow native of Willie's home town of Carluke who was lying injured a couple of feet away from the German front lines. A visit to the Willie Angus website gives the full details of his deed and provides a unique insight into his truly amazing story.
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No chance, he's the REAL start of the Fix Factor
The What factor? I'm afraid I don't watch or want anything to do with talking about the f****** X factor in fact this T shirt sums it up nicely.
http://www.shotdeadinthehead.com/product_view.aspx?pid=1036
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That is absolutely fucking disgusting.
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They should spare a thought for the following ex Celtic players, Patrick Slavin, Leigh Roose, Donnie McLeod, Archie McMillan, Robert Craig, John McLaughlin and Peter Johnstone who gave their lives in the 1st world war.
Also ex celtic player Willie Angus who won the VC
Willie won his VC on June 12th, 1915 in Givenchy. He lost an eye, damaged a foot and was wounded 40 times in the process of successfully rescuing Lt James Martin, a fellow native of Willie's home town of Carluke who was lying injured a couple of feet away from the German front lines. A visit to the Willie Angus website gives the full details of his deed and provides a unique insight into his truly amazing story.
I'm sure that there are 1000's of Celtic Supporters that have no affiliation to Ireland whatsover and are just run of the Mill Scots. How much does this kind of behaviour alienate them?
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The Celtic club apology uses the old ' A small minority' line. I know we are talking a percentage of a 50,000 plus crowd but if you look at the picture, it's hardly just a couple of blokes with a bedsheet is it? Celtic and Rangers certainly have their share of fans with issues don't they?
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I'm amazed that the H&V paradox hasn't been invoked, where at least one person sticks up for something indefensible and congratulates the Celtic supporters.
I always imagine that if you had a 'Hitler was a shit' thread in off topic, a few would sing his praises.
What are you talking about? Hitler was aces, etc.
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The Irish have fought (and continue to fight) in lots of foreign armies. In the Second World War - despite the Irish Government's policy of neutrality - many fought in the US and British armies helping the cause of the Allies.
The Irish are only just coming around to the idea of remembering their war dead in the manner that the US, the UK, the French etc. do because, psychologically as a nation, they were not officially part of these campaigns. The First and Second World Wars have a totally different cultural resonance in Ireland compared to the UK and the rest of Europe and for this reason it has been quite hard for the Irish to work out how best to put it all into a context - but they are working on it.
I would say modern Ireland has no axe to grind with how their neighbours in the UK wish to honour their fallen - they recognise that many Irish were amongst them. The fact that the British Army caused much loss of life in Ireland is balanced out by the acknowledgement that many British soldiers lost their lives at the hands of the Irish, too. It's a complex, confusing relationship, but clearly most of us have tried to move on and see the importance of moving on.
The the sad thing about those Celtic fans is their blatant, small-minded refusal to move on - and the fact that they mistakenly believe they represent Ireland and the Irish. What an embarrassing bunch of dinosaurs.
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Lets be careful not to tar all Celtic fans with the same brush. Some of the comments on here seem to suggest they all hold these sort of views. Not true. Would you like it if Fulham fans were reporting all Villa fans were in the EDL or sung Tracy Andrews songs on saturday?
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Morons. Over 50,000 Irish Catholics died in the First World War fighting for Britain in the hope of winning self government for Ireland. More Irish died fighting for Britain than ever died fighting against Britain.
It disgusts me to see them wave the tricolour at matches. It's a flag representing Green and Orange and the white stands for peace between them. Most of the idiots have probably never been to Ireland yet embarrass the hell out of us with their sectarianism etc. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't wear a poppy and wouldn't be a huge fan of the British army based on stuff that happened in the past in Ireland yet I recognise that it was on the right side in both world wars. The past is the past and there's no use raking over it again and again. Also I prefer to recognise the similarities between the British and Irish and think the British are a fair people who are home to the club that I've supported all my life!
Spot on.
Great strides have been taken in recent years to acknowledge the contribution and sacrifice many Irish soldiers made during the First (and Second) World War. Previously they'd effectively been airbrushed from history in the south, to the point where anyone with ancestors who fought in the wars felt obliged to keep quiet. As if it was some kind of dirty secret.
There are many things the British state and by extension the BA deserve criticism on. I understand also that in an area as divided as Northern Ireland was symbols and emblems take on a whole different meaning. Marking someone out as pro this or anti that. But the Poppy Appeal was set up for the right reasons and should be beyond petty point scoring.
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Bunch of ******. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
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Making a point about poppies is crass and insensitive. However, displaying a banner against the presence of British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq is not. These people should realise that to get their point accross they should not be making enemies with people who want to remember the war-dead. But those wearing poppies should also take moment and remember the 100s of thousands that our government has killed and maimed in recent years.
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110s of thousands in recent years? Surely that's an over exaggeration that undermines your point slightly.
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That banner has made me as angry, and is as justifiable as, the "Justice for Lee Mockble" one that the Knuckledraggers have.
It's bollocks, designed to cause offence and is purely to promote their own narrow-minded self interest.
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110s of thousands in recent years? Surely that's an over exaggeration that undermines your point slightly.
Actually i thought that i was underestimating. Considering that it is estimated that over 1m have died due to the occupation of Iraq
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Scum. Worthless scum.
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I think that it is incredibly sad, that yet again the poppy has been highlighted for political reasons.
I take on board brontebillys comments earlier, but its an oppurtunity to pay respects to all the people who lost their lives serving their country,If you want , remember the ones who died at the Somme etc, and not the ones who died in Ireland, but to be so disrespecful to all those who died in the WWs in partic, is so unbelievably insensitive, and disrespectful, it should make any decent Celtic fan thoroughly ashamed.
I really hope they do what they said they would do, and ban them for life.
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I can't make out what the banner says from my phone, could somebody type it out for me please?
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Verbatim:
YOUR DEEDS WOULD SHAME ALL THE DEVILS IN HELL
IRELAND IRAQ AFGHANISTAN
NO BLODSTAINED (sic) POPPY
ON OUR HOOPS
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I can't make out what the banner says from my phone, could somebody type it out for me please?
Your deeds would shame all the devils in hell Ireland Iraq Afghanistan no blood stained poppy on our hoops.
As they have freedom of speech they are perfectly entitled to have a banner saying that.
I however, have the right to call them a bunch of bigoted, braindead, oxygen thieving ****** who don't have a fucking clue.
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Cheers. What total wankers they are.
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This is one of those moronic prejudices that gets passed on from generation to generation. I doubt if many of those who took part have any sort of ideological commitment to what they were doing.
You can only hope that sooner or later this kind of thing will die out. However, you can never underestimate the stupidity of some people.
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I doubt if many of those who took part have any sort of ideological commitment to what they were doing.
Possibly not, although they certainly went out of their way to do it and there must have been a fair few of them involved. They certainly didn't have commitment to spelling lessons when they were at school.
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Maybe they were trying to replicate the sound of the Glaswegian accent? (Not in any way supporting this, I think it's disgusting)
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Making a point about poppies is crass and insensitive. However, displaying a banner against the presence of British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq is not. These people should realise that to get their point accross they should not be making enemies with people who want to remember the war-dead. But those wearing poppies should also take moment and remember the 100s of thousands that our government has killed and maimed in recent years.
.. what context does that comment have regrading this point?
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I should imagine they are too thick to even understand the meaning of the banners they were holding up.
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Verbatim:
YOUR DEEDS WOULD SHAME ALL THE DEVILS IN HELL
IRELAND IRAQ AFGHANISTAN
NO BLODSTAINED (sic) POPPY
ON OUR HOOPS
I'd like to stick a very large, and very jagged poppy right up their collective hoops.
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I should imagine they are too thick to even understand the meaning of the banners they were holding up.
I would guess they know it full well.
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I don't want to detract from the stupidity of these Celtic fans but I had a similar feeling when I read that the British Legion had launched this year's appeal in the grounds of Europes largest arms dealer BAE Systems who sponsored the event.
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Bunch of c***s. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
Rangers are just as much bigots as Celtic fans. They have UFV / UDA supporters clubs going over to Rangers matches from the ShankilL Road and Sandy Road. They also sing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood. Both sets of fans are embarrassing to football. They always have been and always will be.
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I would love it if the SPL actually did take action against both clubs when they sing their sectarian shite but they never will.
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What can they do though? They already fine both clubs. Deduct points? They'll still take the league.
Do you keep on banning fans? I'd go with that and report them to the local police to deal with. You wouldn't get away with shouting hatred in the streets on a day to day basis so why should a football match be any different?
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Making a point about poppies is crass and insensitive. However, displaying a banner against the presence of British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq is not. These people should realise that to get their point accross they should not be making enemies with people who want to remember the war-dead. But those wearing poppies should also take moment and remember the 100s of thousands that our government has killed and maimed in recent years.
.. what context does that comment have regrading this point?
I would have thought it was obvious. The majority of the banner is against the wars in afghanistan and Iraq, something that I think is entirely justified and correct. However, using the poppy in this way just divides people and is not justifiable. But as someone else points out if the poppy campaign does not want to be political then it shouldn't have sought sponsorship from BAE - a company that produces weapons that have been responsible for the deaths of innocent people. I am all in favour of remembering those who have died in wars (whatever the wrongs and rights of those wars) but I would not want to help support companies like BAE. But it seems this green brigade were just trying to stir things up - it would have been much better if they'd raised a white poppy for example.
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Making a point about poppies is crass and insensitive. However, displaying a banner against the presence of British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq is not. These people should realise that to get their point accross they should not be making enemies with people who want to remember the war-dead. But those wearing poppies should also take moment and remember the 100s of thousands that our government has killed and maimed in recent years.
.. what context does that comment have regrading this point?
I would have thought it was obvious. The majority of the banner is against the wars in afghanistan and Iraq, something that I think is entirely justified and correct. However, using the poppy in this way just divides people and is not justifiable. But as someone else points out if the poppy campaign does not want to be political then it shouldn't have sought sponsorship from BAE - a company that produces weapons that have been responsible for the deaths of innocent people. I am all in favour of remembering those who have died in wars (whatever the wrongs and rights of those wars) but I would not want to help support companies like BAE. But it seems this green brigade were just trying to stir things up - it would have been much better if they'd raised a white poppy for example.
Opium poppies would be more relevant in Glasgow.
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Having spent a lot of time up there in recent years, there are idiots on both 'sides' who like to stir it up and get a reaction. Best thing to do is not give them the publicity.
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Bunch of c***s. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
Rangers are just as much bigots as Celtic fans. They have UFV / UDA supporters clubs going over to Rangers matches from the ShankilL Road and Sandy Road. They also sing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood. Both sets of fans are embarrassing to football. They always have been and always will be.
You are missing my point.
It's all rather pathetic on both sides of the divide but at least Rangers seem to accept their part in this rather than the rank hypocrisy which comes out of Celtic.
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Bunch of c***s. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
Rangers are just as much bigots as Celtic fans. They have UFV / UDA supporters clubs going over to Rangers matches from the ShankilL Road and Sandy Road. They also sing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood. Both sets of fans are embarrassing to football. They always have been and always will be.
You are missing my point.
It's all rather pathetic on both sides of the divide but at least Rangers seem to accept their part in this rather than the rank hypocrisy which comes out of Celtic.
Rangers are banned from singing that song and would have been thrown out from europe if they werent knocked out for their antics in Villarreal.
In my opinion, Celtic fans are much much worse than Rangers, but for some strange reason they don't get punished and are always the victims.
There is youtube footage of Celtic fans in Newcastle singing ' the i the i the ira' that was sent into FIFA and they turned a blind eye. Celtic sung through the minutes silence last year albeit in small numbers and got away with it.
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Making a point about poppies is crass and insensitive. However, displaying a banner against the presence of British troops in Afghanistan and Iraq is not. These people should realise that to get their point accross they should not be making enemies with people who want to remember the war-dead. But those wearing poppies should also take moment and remember the 100s of thousands that our government has killed and maimed in recent years.
.. what context does that comment have regrading this point?
I would have thought it was obvious. The majority of the banner is against the wars in afghanistan and Iraq, something that I think is entirely justified and correct. However, using the poppy in this way just divides people and is not justifiable. But as someone else points out if the poppy campaign does not want to be political then it shouldn't have sought sponsorship from BAE - a company that produces weapons that have been responsible for the deaths of innocent people. I am all in favour of remembering those who have died in wars (whatever the wrongs and rights of those wars) but I would not want to help support companies like BAE. But it seems this green brigade were just trying to stir things up - it would have been much better if they'd raised a white poppy for example.
Well, no it isn't but seeing your Sig, perhaps I can see why you posted it. The Banner has 100% to do with the Irish Question (copyright William Gladstone), and nothing to do with the current conflicts accept the fact that they want to try and legitamise their issues against Poppy wearing.
I totally agree that Protests are justified, but why at a football match and why around Remembrance Week? You know and I know exactly why. I'm sure that there are Muslims at Villa Park on match days that feel the same about Iran and Afghanistan, but have not caused anywhere near the furore that these banners have. They come to watch a football game. I would take a good guess that they have caused huge divide amongst the rank and file of the Celtic Support as well.
As for the Sponsorship, well I can see your point. I don't entirely agree, but I perhaps this is a different area of discussion. I'm sure that the Legion would be able to justify why they are using that particular company. I have no idea why and genuinely not even looked.
I feel sorry for the families of Serviceman are Celtic Fans, as it's a huge smack in the face for them and their loved ones. For all the efforts by the SFA to stop issues such as this, it seems that some people will never let go.
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Bunch of c***s. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
Rangers are just as much bigots as Celtic fans. They have UFV / UDA supporters clubs going over to Rangers matches from the ShankilL Road and Sandy Road. They also sing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood. Both sets of fans are embarrassing to football. They always have been and always will be.
No one is defending Rangers here, and as always when these comparisons are made, it's always seems to give the latest outrage an air of respectability because "the other lot are worse." Each incident should be taken on it's own merits.
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Those banners are the work of morons that use this so called "cause" as a tag to hang their biggotry. A good friend of mine (a marine) died in Afganistan fighting the Taliban two years ago this weekend, he's from the West of Ireland, I'm from the South East, in my opinion these soldiers are all heroes regardless of where your passport anchores you to. I have listened to small minded Celtic wearing fookwits making snide remarks about by buddy and it's not good. I love seeing Celtic jersey and Rangers getting a tanking in Europe, it might remind them eventually of how inward looking they are and what their jerseys mean to a lot of people.
They do not represent the 99% of Irish people or the majority of Scottish people. It's embarrassing in this day and age.
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What can they do though? They already fine both clubs. Deduct points? They'll still take the league.
Do you keep on banning fans? I'd go with that and report them to the local police to deal with. You wouldn't get away with shouting hatred in the streets on a day to day basis so why should a football match be any different?
Even bigger fines and swingeing fines, playing matches behind closed doors, ban them from European competition (which both clubs need for financial reasons)... ?
Bunch of c***s. I don't have much more to add really.
And they still suggest that Rangers are the bigots and they are the poor, put upon club that gets tarred with teh same brush? Dear me.
Rangers are just as much bigots as Celtic fans. They have UFV / UDA supporters clubs going over to Rangers matches from the ShankilL Road and Sandy Road. They also sing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood. Both sets of fans are embarrassing to football. They always have been and always will be.
You are missing my point.
It's all rather pathetic on both sides of the divide but at least Rangers seem to accept their part in this rather than the rank hypocrisy which comes out of Celtic.
Absolutely, most Rangers supporters accept that they have a share of total fuckwits in their support whereas Celtic don't. This is every bit as sickening as Rangers supporters and their anti-catholic chants. Yet, until recently or rather this weekend there has been nothing like the degree of criticism from some in the media.
There have been other cases of things like this (chants rather than something as visible as banner). The year before last it happened at a match a friend of mine was at. The only mention I heard of it was from him and there was nothing in the media. If anything it was underplayed.
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Absolutely, most Rangers supporters accept that they have a share of total fuckwits in their support whereas Celtic don't...
Celtic do.
Talkceltic - Shame Green Brigade (http://www.talkceltic.net/forum/talkceltic-pub/72396-shame-green-brigade.html)
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Absolutely, most Rangers supporters accept that they have a share of total fuckwits in their support whereas Celtic don't...
Celtic do.
Talkceltic - Shame Green Brigade (http://www.talkceltic.net/forum/talkceltic-pub/72396-shame-green-brigade.html)
That thread is a year old. This one shows current feelings more.
Talkceltic - Celtic apologises (http://www.talkceltic.net/forum/talkceltic-pub/92295-celtic-apologises.html)
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Dont want to get into the politics of it but this is so ingrained in families up there from day one of their lives. A few years ago i worked and stayed in a village in Lanarkshire called Larkhall (I was told by many that most from around the Glasgow area will know about it) Anyway it is a Rangers stronghold to a point where Lloyds chemist (whose logo is a green and white cross) now have a blue and white one in place. At some points the traffic lights are
Red
Amber
Blue (most were painted out when i was there)
Facing the building i was at the council installed a kiddies play area in the park and it was corperation green - the next morning the residents painted it (you guessed it blue)
Most of them did not have a lawn as they said "We canna face seeing green"
Was there one saturday when they had the "Marching season" Orange men in aprons and bowlerhatsd strutting their stuff to the church in the next village to band some drums - i have not got a fucking clue what it was all about but they take it very seriously.
At least 2 of the jocks in the factory i was at wore England shirts and even went to England games
Crazy place filled with hate filled crazy people - it will never change
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This is the Green Brigade's statement on it.
Link (http://www.etims.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3038&Itemid=29)
At half-time during today's match against Aberdeen we displayed message banners calling for `No bloodstained poppys on our hoops' in protest at the Club's decision to once again wear the poppy on our shirts during next week's game at St Mirren (a match our group will not attend because of this decision). This is in support of an appeal by Poppyscotland to all SPL clubs. Poppyscotland describes its role as `supporting heroes' and state that `the poppy has become a symbol of remembrance and for the sacrifices made by our Armed Forces'. Our group and many within the Celtic support do not recognise the British Armed Forces as heroes, nor their role in many conflicts as one worthy of our remembrance.
Earlier this year, the Saville Report on Bloody Sunday confirmed that 14 unarmed civilians were murdered in Derry in 1972 by the Paratroop Regiment. They were among hundreds killed by the British Army during the most recent phase of conflict in Ireland. More recently, the British Armed Forces have murdered and maimed many thousands more innocent civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan. The poppy remembers not just our grandfathers who fought the Nazis but also those who sank the Belgrano and brutally occupied the streets of Belfast and Basra. While we recognise the right of individuals to remember their dead and that many within the Celtic support will wear the poppy in memory of family and friends lost in WW2 and other conflicts, we cannot accept the imposition of the poppy onto our shirts.
As far back as April, representatives from the Green Brigade, Celtic Supporters Association and Celtic Trust met with Peter Lawwell to express our united opposition to the Club imposing the poppy on the first team jersey. We also know that the AICSC and many other individual supporters had called on the Club to reverse their position of previous years and take the poppy off the shirt. Following our meeting in April, the Club were contacted on several occasions for further dialogue on the issue but informed us that they were still considering their position and would get back to us.
The first any group knew of the decision was after it had been made, and publicly announced. We share the views of the AICSC whose recent statement on the poppy stated that `to see the jersey being used as a medium for such a divisive symbol and the message it communicates is deplorable', and that it showed a complete lack of respect for the support, further highlighted by repeated declarations on the official website of Celtic's delight to be wearing the poppy and supporting Poppyscotland. It appears rather than leave his politics at the door, chairman John Reid, the former Armed Forces Minister and Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and Defence, has forced his onto the first team jersey.
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It appears rather than leave his politics at the door, chairman John Reid, the former Armed Forces Minister and Secretary of State for Northern Ireland and Defence, has forced his onto the first team jersey.
What a load of bollocks. The bloke is a Roman Catholic, from Glasgow. You can't get much more Celtic than that.
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What a bunch of bigoted wankers they are.If this is an example of the kind of thing they want to bring to the Prem, then i hope that neither they or Rangers are ever allowed to join.
These people live in Britain, generally, yet hate Britain...........can't work it out myself.
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This Green Brigade bunch are clearly just a bunch of pea-brained, attention-seeking twats.
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They're just poisonous vermin, forever paranoid that the world and the media are out to get them.
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As I said, thick.
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This is not a small a dozen of so by the looks of it this is properly organised and supported by the entire crowd in that end. I am shocked at the hatred displayed. May be the few protesters at at passing cortege in Wootten Basset can be excused as mindless idiots this can not.
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Idiots, pathetic. If they hate Britain so much then why do they live in Britain lol? I hope we never see those cretins in the Premier League.
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I've been talking to a mate about how we'd feel and would react if the league/club decided to add a symbol to the Villa shirt that seemed offensive and/or inappropriate to us.
Again, I don't want to underplay the stupidity of these Celtic supporters but there's no denying their historical political affiliation to the Irish repuplican movement, the general antipathy towards the British army within that community and their view that the poppy is as much a political symbol as anything else.
My friend posed the question, "What would you do if the government/league decided that the global appeal of the EPL presented an opportunity to improve the economic situation in the locality of football grounds and imposed a rule that the football shirts should occasionally carry the name of the town that a club came from. How would Villa and Everton fans react to having the word Birmingham orLiverpool on their shirt?"
When I argued that it was unthinkable, he said it is no more unthinkable than the idea of having the poppy emblem on the Celtic shirt would have been to those supporters a few years ago. I had to admit that it wasn't entirely impossible.
How would we react?
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Does anyone else suspect they threw references to Afghanistan and Iraq in there as comparative red herrings whilst what they were really on about was Ulster?
I am strongly against the two recent wars.myself but have nothing but respect and sympathy for the soldiers we are sending out there to die or be maimed.
Everyone knows Celtic's support's position re republicanism, but this is a British club playing in a British league, and what they did was small minded and bigoted. As well as a reminder as to why we should never allow those basket case clubs in our league.
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I've been talking to a mate about how we'd feel and would react if the league/club decided to add a symbol to the Villa shirt that seemed offensive and/or inappropriate to us.
Again, I don't want to underplay the stupidity of these Celtic supporters but there's no denying their historical political affiliation to the Irish repuplican movement, the general antipathy towards the British army within that community and their view that the poppy is as much a political symbol as anything else.
My friend posed the question, "What would you do if the government/league decided that the global appeal of the EPL presented an opportunity to improve the economic situation in the locality of football grounds and imposed a rule that the football shirts should occasionally carry the name of the town that a club came from. How would Villa and Everton fans react to having the word Birmingham orLiverpool on their shirt?"
When I argued that it was unthinkable, he said it is no more unthinkable than the idea of having the poppy emblem on the Celtic shirt would have been to those supporters a few years ago. I had to admit that it wasn't entirely impossible.
How would we react?
I think your friend is simply trying to deflect the blame from Celtic; as the topic of this thread states they are "classless".
If Celtic fans do not like being Scottish or a part of the UK then I think it's about time they moved to South Ireland. The very assumption that they think themselves more important than the thousands who have died serving the UK is an absolute disgrace.
This is a perfect example of why FIFA should never allow those two bigoted teams from Glasgow anywhere near the PL.
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By some accounts 350,000 Irishmen volunteered to fight in World War 1. They fought in some of the bloodiest and most pointless battles in that conflict, and the poppy is a token of remembrance for them too.
As a society we are big and mature enough to tolerate a bit of dissent. But this lot really should have a think about what they're saying.
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For British people what does the poppy represent?
I think the message has been hijacked in recent years but Id be interested to hear what you guys think?
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I've been talking to a mate about how we'd feel and would react if the league/club decided to add a symbol to the Villa shirt that seemed offensive and/or inappropriate to us.
Again, I don't want to underplay the stupidity of these Celtic supporters but there's no denying their historical political affiliation to the Irish repuplican movement, the general antipathy towards the British army within that community and their view that the poppy is as much a political symbol as anything else.
My friend posed the question, "What would you do if the government/league decided that the global appeal of the EPL presented an opportunity to improve the economic situation in the locality of football grounds and imposed a rule that the football shirts should occasionally carry the name of the town that a club came from. How would Villa and Everton fans react to having the word Birmingham orLiverpool on their shirt?"
When I argued that it was unthinkable, he said it is no more unthinkable than the idea of having the poppy emblem on the Celtic shirt would have been to those supporters a few years ago. I had to admit that it wasn't entirely impossible.
How would we react?
I think your friend is simply trying to deflect the blame from Celtic; as the topic of this thread states they are "classless".
If Celtic fans do not like being Scottish or a part of the UK then I think it's about time they moved to South Ireland. The very assumption that they think themselves more important than the thousands who have died serving the UK is an absolute disgrace.
This is a perfect example of why FIFA should never allow those two bigoted teams from Glasgow anywhere near the PL.
No, he wasn't trying to deflect attention from them at all, he was truly appalled by the demonstration.
He has studied and researched the WWI "footballers regiment" and said that from the pre-war Celtic team some fought with the British Army and others joined the Irish insurrection. He also said that at least one Villa player saw active service against the 1916 insurrection in Dublin.
There's no point ignoring the fact that Celtic was formed directly and solely from the Irish community in Glasgow and many of them consider the club to be first and foremost an Irish club and the demonstration is a reflection of the NI conflict.
All that aside, I just thought it was an interesting question regarding what we and Everton would do if the club wanted to put the word Birmingham or Liverpool on the shirt.
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The poppy has long had different connotations in Ireland. As mentioned earlier, in Britain it's simply an acknowledgement of fallen troops and the money raised a valuable resource for them or their families.
In Ireland (particularly the North east corner) it came to be another symbol used by one side to mark them out as being different to the other. We belong to this tribe, you that and never the twain shall meet.
So whilst understandable -to a degree- that some Celtic fans still have an issue with it, when you have an Irish President (born in Belfast, no less) wearing it at Remembrance Day condolences you'd have to say they're out of step on this one.
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Does anyone else suspect they threw references to Afghanistan and Iraq in there as comparative red herrings whilst what they were really on about was Ulster?
Yes mate I did a few posts up
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I've been talking to a mate about how we'd feel and would react if the league/club decided to add a symbol to the Villa shirt that seemed offensive and/or inappropriate to us.
Again, I don't want to underplay the stupidity of these Celtic supporters but there's no denying their historical political affiliation to the Irish repuplican movement, the general antipathy towards the British army within that community and their view that the poppy is as much a political symbol as anything else.
My friend posed the question, "What would you do if the government/league decided that the global appeal of the EPL presented an opportunity to improve the economic situation in the locality of football grounds and imposed a rule that the football shirts should occasionally carry the name of the town that a club came from. How would Villa and Everton fans react to having the word Birmingham orLiverpool on their shirt?"
When I argued that it was unthinkable, he said it is no more unthinkable than the idea of having the poppy emblem on the Celtic shirt would have been to those supporters a few years ago. I had to admit that it wasn't entirely impossible.
How would we react?
It wouldn't bother me. Sorry mate, I don't think that the analogy stacks up in the same context as the issues on this thread.
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I've been talking to a mate about how we'd feel and would react if the league/club decided to add a symbol to the Villa shirt that seemed offensive and/or inappropriate to us.
Again, I don't want to underplay the stupidity of these Celtic supporters but there's no denying their historical political affiliation to the Irish repuplican movement, the general antipathy towards the British army within that community and their view that the poppy is as much a political symbol as anything else.
My friend posed the question, "What would you do if the government/league decided that the global appeal of the EPL presented an opportunity to improve the economic situation in the locality of football grounds and imposed a rule that the football shirts should occasionally carry the name of the town that a club came from. How would Villa and Everton fans react to having the word Birmingham orLiverpool on their shirt?"
When I argued that it was unthinkable, he said it is no more unthinkable than the idea of having the poppy emblem on the Celtic shirt would have been to those supporters a few years ago. I had to admit that it wasn't entirely impossible.
How would we react?
It wouldn't bother me. Sorry mate, I don't think that the analogy stacks up in the same context as the issues on this thread.
I agree, it smacks of mere deflection from the issue at hand.
Celtic may have been formed by Irish people but they are not an Irish club at all. Glasgow, Scotland, U.K. There is no mention of Ireland at all in the location.
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Wouldn't bother me so long as we were sponsored by 'the city is ours'
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Celtic may have been formed by Irish people but they are not an Irish club at all. Glasgow, Scotland, U.K. There is no mention of Ireland at all in the location.
Yup. Might as well say AC Milan is an English cricket team.
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Wouldn't bother me so long as we were sponsored by 'the city is ours'
Nice compromise, I wish I'd thought of that. Maybe we could hook up with a radio station and use the slogan "Are you listening?"
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brontebilly, i find it an opportunity to pay respects to fallen soldiers tbh.
I find watching footage of WW1, in partic, difficult to watch sometimes, with a mixture of respect, anger, humility, sadness.Generally it is perceived as being British soldiers, but as damon said earlier 350'000 Irishmen volunteered for WW1,and from all backgrounds.Maybe you should wear a poppy for them.
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Does anyone else suspect they threw references to Afghanistan and Iraq in there as comparative red herrings whilst what they were really on about was Ulster?
Without a shadow of a doubt.
Hmm. They're a BRITISH club and the symbol is in remembrance of BRITISH soldiers who gave their lives. We may not agree with the cause but these are soldiers doing their job.
Speaking as a catholic of Irish descent I think they're a bunch of hate filled wankers.
Still, looking on the bright side, they can no longer claim any kind of moral higher ground. I used to think that singing about the IRA was reprehensible, but simply in retaliation to the Hun's horrible hate filled chants. However, they've sunk as low as low as they can in my opinion and denigrated the memory of both Irish & British soldiers.
I could rant on but that's enough.
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Well said Mac.
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A lot of the "Irish" soldiers were protestant so wont "count" in the eyes of the Green Bridage.
I can understand why they have a bit of a siege mentality though so of the decisions against them have been ridiculous this season.
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Well said Mac indeed.
I think it's quite sad that somebody has gone to such great lengths to show their dissent or hate filled agenda or whatever. let's face it, it has only been done to antagonise?
A massive own goal in my book from a bunch of morons.
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My great grandfather was an Irish Catholic and a Colonel of engineeers in the British army.
On his behalf, and my own, those twats with the banners can suck my sack.
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These so-called football fans were singing pro-IRA songs last night at Tynecastle.
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These so-called football fans were singing pro-IRA songs last night at Tynecastle.
They do it every week, get away with it every week. They even got away with singing during the rememberance silence last season. Theres definately a bias from the SFA towards Celtic.
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These so-called football fans were singing pro-IRA songs last night at Tynecastle.
Possibly the most ridiculous thing ever written on this forum.
They do it every week, get away with it every week. They even got away with singing during the rememberance silence last season. Theres definately a bias from the SFA towards Celtic.
Possibly the most ridiculous thing ever written on this forum.
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What can they do though? They already fine both clubs. Deduct points? They'll still take the league.
Do you keep on banning fans? I'd go with that and report them to the local police to deal with. You wouldn't get away with shouting hatred in the streets on a day to day basis so why should a football match be any different?
the 'local police' would be mainly of a rangers persuasion if what people say up there is to be believed.
Lost a lot of respect for Celtic supporters over this. Why didn't anyone try to stop it? and if they did, why didn't the club's stewards back them up? My impression of most Celtic supporters I've met is that they are pretty sound and i'm sure the ones you meet day to day, wherever that is, are still and that won't change - but that is a disgrace what was allowed to happen there - and obviously a fair few of them were involved, or turned a blind eye. That will have lost them a lot of friends around the world I reckon, unless the club and fans do something to sort it out.
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A lot of the "Irish" soldiers were protestant so wont "count" in the eyes of the Green Bridage.
I can understand why they have a bit of a siege mentality though so of the decisions against them have been ridiculous this season.
50,000 Southern Catholic Irish Nationalists died fighting for Britain in the hope of being rewarded with self government. The Republic of Ireland has honoured those men in recent years for their sacrifice. Celtic do not represent mainstream Irish opinion on this matter. They just perpetuate one, narrow, view of our history.
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A lot of the "Irish" soldiers were protestant so wont "count" in the eyes of the Green Bridage.
I can understand why they have a bit of a siege mentality though so of the decisions against them have been ridiculous this season.
50,000 Southern Catholic Irish Nationalists died fighting for Britain in the hope of being rewarded with self government. The Republic of Ireland has honoured those men in recent years for their sacrifice. Celtic do not represent mainstream Irish opinion on this matter. They just perpetuate one, narrow, view of our history.
I don't disagree with you.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
I really fail to see any problem with what's happening in that photo at all. They're certainly not hurting or offending anyone as far as I can tell.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
I really fail to see any problem with what's happening in that photo at all. They're certainly not hurting or offending anyone as far as I can tell.
The display is purely a reaction to the Green Brigade banner last week, surely using the poppy to score points is disrespecting those who the flower is there to honour/remind us of?
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Are you suggesting that Rangers wouldn't have had some sort of Remembrance Day tribute at the game otherwise?
They're not really known for holding back on that kind of thing regardless of what silly things Celtic supporters have recently been doing.
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Are you suggesting that Rangers wouldn't have had some sort of Remembrance Day tribute at the game otherwise?
They're not really known for holding back on that kind of thing regardless of what silly things Celtic supporters have recently been doing.
Are you suggesting that Rangers wouldn't have had some sort of Remembrance Day tribute at the game otherwise?
They're not really known for holding back on that kind of thing regardless of what silly things Celtic supporters have recently been doing.
Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
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Considering Rangers long term support of the armed forces it would have been done anyway.
Has anyone mentioned the anti-poppy songs and crowd trouble at Celtic's match against Hearts?
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Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
Don't think you're gonna draw any popular support around here with that one.
Rangers always paint themselves as more British than Royal Tunbridge Wells, Churchill and Last Night at the Proms combined whilst Celtic supporters (or some sections of) define themselves by their anti Britishness.
Both are utterly dislikeable but I'm sure it's easier for some to gravitate towards the club that thinks it's Last Night at the Proms and the 12th of July every Saturday afternoon rather than the one signing rebel songs.
Both seem to be stuck somewhere between 1680 - 1920 so If I had my way I'd pack them off to parts of the world with a similar outlook, Burkina Faso, Kazakhstan and Ulaanbaatar would be my choice. With maybe Rangers facing a few cup games in the Falklands, Gibraltar and the overseas territory of Saint Helena. I'm sure they'd love all the bunting and ostentatious displays of Britishness.
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Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
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Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Who said they were scoring points? I would imagine getting a display like that together would have taken some time, and have to be started well before Celtic's idiocy.
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Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
That's not what they're doing at all. They're showing their support for veterans and current servicemen. If, in doing so, Rangers contrast markedly with a section of Celtic's support then that's really only the fault of those Celtic supporters.
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Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
That's not what they're doing at all. They're showing their support for veterans and current servicemen. If, in doing so, Rangers contrast markedly with a section of Celtic's support then that's really only the fault of those Celtic supporters.
The display was arranged after last Saturday. ;)
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Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Classless=Clueless=you.
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than
Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Classless=Clueless=you.
Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Classless=Clueless=you.
thanks for your input!
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than
Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Classless=Clueless=you.
Im not suggesting at all that Rangers as a club would not have had some sort of tribute, this was however arranged and paid for by fans.
Football supporters honouring Remembrance is "classless." That's a strange thing to say.
Never said that at all, said using the symbol of Remembrance for point scoring purposes is classless.
Classless=Clueless=you.
thanks for your input!
Thank you Troll.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
Don't think you're gonna draw any popular support around here with that one.
Rangers always paint themselves as more British than Royal Tunbridge Wells, Churchill and Last Night at the Proms combined whilst Celtic supporters (or some sections of) define themselves by their anti Britishness.
Both are utterly dislikeable but I'm sure it's easier for some to gravitate towards the club that thinks it's Last Night at the Proms and the 12th of July every Saturday afternoon rather than the one signing rebel songs.
Both seem to be stuck somewhere between 1680 - 1920 so If I had my way I'd pack them off to parts of the world with a similar outlook, Burkina Faso, Kazakhstan and Ulaanbaatar would be my choice. With maybe Rangers facing a few cup games in the Falklands, Gibraltar and the overseas territory of Saint Helena. I'm sure they'd love all the bunting and ostentatious displays of Britishness.
As poetically eloquent a post as you could wish to read.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
Don't think you're gonna draw any popular support around here with that one.
Rangers always paint themselves as more British than Royal Tunbridge Wells, Churchill and Last Night at the Proms combined whilst Celtic supporters (or some sections of) define themselves by their anti Britishness.
Both are utterly dislikeable but I'm sure it's easier for some to gravitate towards the club that thinks it's Last Night at the Proms and the 12th of July every Saturday afternoon rather than the one signing rebel songs.
Both seem to be stuck somewhere between 1680 - 1920 so If I had my way I'd pack them off to parts of the world with a similar outlook, Burkina Faso, Kazakhstan and Ulaanbaatar would be my choice. With maybe Rangers facing a few cup games in the Falklands, Gibraltar and the overseas territory of Saint Helena. I'm sure they'd love all the bunting and ostentatious displays of Britishness.
As poetically eloquent a post as you could wish to read.
I agree.
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If only point scoring via acts of respect was a more common place phenomenon in society.
As hilts said, Celtic only have themselves to blame for their shameful behaviour in exploding the bigoted-o-meter and how they look like a bunch of toss bags in comparison to Rangers on this issue.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
I really fail to see any problem with what's happening in that photo at all. They're certainly not hurting or offending anyone as far as I can tell.
Neither do I. I think it looks quite spectacular.
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It looks superb. Wish we'd have thought of something similar.
And so what if it's in reaction to Celtic's garbage. I see no problem with someone else setting an example of how respect should be paid.
In my opinion it's just further highlighted the Celtic fans who supported the banners for what they are. And that's a good thing.
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Good article here (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/mail-order-intolerance-ignores-celtics-right-to-wear-the-green-2419452.html)
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Good article here (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/mail-order-intolerance-ignores-celtics-right-to-wear-the-green-2419452.html)
Seems poorly written to me.
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Good article here (http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/mail-order-intolerance-ignores-celtics-right-to-wear-the-green-2419452.html)
Seems poorly written to me.
Why ?
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The article is contradictory and also uses the Daily Mail to have a pop at the pro poppy brigade. Clearly the middle ground where most people are is being missed here.
Classless Rangers supporters?
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I couldn't really work out what the author of that article was trying to get at to be honest.
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Ok so the the Celtic fans are classless, what are the Rangers fans who have used the poppy as a tool for point scoring today?
http://willievass.photoshelter.com/gallery-image/131110-Rangers-v-Aberdeen/G0000mz0JD3kq_Fo/I0000FS0kRTCSEFU
I really fail to see any problem with what's happening in that photo at all. They're certainly not hurting or offending anyone as far as I can tell.
The display is purely a reaction to the Green Brigade banner last week, surely using the poppy to score points is disrespecting those who the flower is there to honour/remind us of?
IF it is a "points scoring exercise" then blame the narrow-minded, stuck in the past twats from Celtic that gave them the "open goal" in the first place.
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I cannot pretend to understand the difference in politics between the 2 sets of supporters, I don't.
But do they travel under one banner when they follow Scotland? If so do these political matters ever arise or is it just accepted that following their national side comes without political differences?
Just wondering because we are always told how well behaved their support is on a national level.
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Coming from an Irish catholic background, I have a soft spot for Celtic and I know that the mindless minority of Rangers supporters are just as capable of carrying out acts the rest of us would count as deplorable (see Villa Park 1977), however, MO'Ns X1 (deliberate piss take name to begin with) is attempting to defend the indefensible here. Rangers have been allowed to take the moral highground here and the Celts protest is as wide of the mark as Scottish football is at the moment.
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I cannot pretend to understand the difference in politics between the 2 sets of supporters, I don't.
But do they travel under one banner when they follow Scotland? If so do these political matters ever arise or is it just accepted that following their national side comes without political differences?
Just wondering because we are always told how well behaved their support is on a national level.
Many of the Rangers fans I know don't follow Scotland - I know several born and bred Glaswegians who put on England shirts whenever there's a major tournament. I think it's to do with being ultra-British, and disliking anything to do with anti-Britishness, like Scottish independence, or Scottish nationalism.
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I cannot pretend to understand the difference in politics between the 2 sets of supporters, I don't.
But do they travel under one banner when they follow Scotland? If so do these political matters ever arise or is it just accepted that following their national side comes without political differences?
Just wondering because we are always told how well behaved their support is on a national level.
With Rangers banging on about England and Celtic singing about Ireland, I'm not sure there are enough hours in the day to devote to Scotland.
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Not to mention Aidrie supporting the Krauts!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1329830/Airdrie-United-football-club-puts-Nazi-picture-Remembrance-Day-programme.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
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I cannot pretend to understand the difference in politics between the 2 sets of supporters, I don't.
But do they travel under one banner when they follow Scotland? If so do these political matters ever arise or is it just accepted that following their national side comes without political differences?
Just wondering because we are always told how well behaved their support is on a national level.
There would be moderates in all of this, that often gets overlooked.
Alex Ferguson was a Rangers fans but his brother was a Celtic one. And the purple faced perennial watch checker was apparently as chuffed as most Celtic fans when Jock Stein's team became the first (and so far only) Scottish side to win the EC. Particularly with a side made up entirely of players born within a 30 mile radius of Glasgow.
There probably are other examples of split families like that, though I'd imagine it's more prevalent in other parts of Scotland that it is in Glasgow, which has long been divided along religious lines.
I'd imagine also that some of those who indulge in all things orange on match day or rebel songs leave it at the ground. It's probably pantomime as much as anything else and they probably just take the piss out of each other at work on Monday.
But for those who genuinely live it I don't think supporting Scotland ever really comes into the equation. As the previous poster mentions, you have the curious phenomenon of some tattoo clad Gers fans supporting England and those who see themselves as true Celtic fans supporting Ireland. Even if their blood ties to that country are three/four generations away.
Fergus McCann did a lot of decent work in trying to force home the point that actually, Celtic are a Scottish club first and foremost but he came in for a fair amount of stick in doing so.
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Alex Ferguson was a Rangers fans but his brother was a Celtic one
And Kenny Dog-Leash was a boyhood Rangers fan.
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As was Danny McGrain who I think is still Celtics record appearance maker.
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Danny McGrain
"Tartan Talk, with Danny McGrain" ( And Derek Johnsone every other week)
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I forget the exact breakdown but a fair chunk of that Celtic EC winning side were from the other side of the tracks, so to speak.
On the one hand you could give them praise for being so open in their selection policy. But if they hadn't been they'd have had an incredibly small pool to pick from.
In contrast, even today 2010 Rangers haven't had an Irish catholic or Rep Ireland international play for them. Whether they've tried to sign one and no player has yet felt confident enough to cross the divide I'm not sure. They have signed at least one Scottish catholic though (Johnston) and a fair few from Spain and Italy.
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Carlos Cuellar goes to our church every Sunday. And is a Eucharistic Minister.
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In contrast, even today 2010 Rangers haven't had an Irish catholic or Rep Ireland international play for them. Whether they've tried to sign one and no player has yet felt confident enough to cross the divide I'm not sure. They have signed at least one Scottish catholic though (Johnston) and a fair few from Spain and Italy.
A hundred years too late, Rangers will sign anyone and their supporters don't care. They've had Catholic captains and at least one manager.
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In contrast, even today 2010 Rangers haven't had an Irish catholic or Rep Ireland international play for them. Whether they've tried to sign one and no player has yet felt confident enough to cross the divide I'm not sure. They have signed at least one Scottish catholic though (Johnston) and a fair few from Spain and Italy.
A hundred years too late, Rangers will sign anyone and their supporters don't care. They've had Catholic captains and at least one manager.
The events around the signing of Mo Johnston would suggest otherwise.
There was a definite policy of exclusion in the past, ex players like Ferguson and Craig Brown have publicly said so. Souness was the first one to really try and tackle the problem head on and that wasn't 100 years ago, closer to 20 and a bit. Others have taken the thing on further with signing the likes of Boli, Amaruso and Cuellar.
So it seems that it's a bit more palatable to the Rangers support base to sign a foreign catholic from mainland Europe than it as a catholic from Scotland or Ireland. The distinct lack of the latter even in this day and age provides a fairly decent yardstick in that regard.
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The events around the signing of Mo Johnston would suggest otherwise.
There was a definite policy of exclusion in the past, ex players like Ferguson and Craig Brown have publicly said so. Souness was the first one to really try and tackle the problem head on and that wasn't 100 years ago, closer to 20 and a bit. Others have taken the thing on further with signing the likes of Boli, Amaruso and Cuellar.
So it seems that it's a bit more palatable to the Rangers support base to sign a foreign catholic from mainland Europe than it as a catholic from Scotland or Ireland. The distinct lack of the latter even in this day and age provides a fairly decent yardstick in that regard.
A lot of nonsense was written about the reaction when Johnston signed but the truth is that the ovewhelming majority of Rangers fans were perfectly happy. It was said by the club that a total of one season ticket was returned. How many Scottish/Irish Catholics do they currently have in the team? I don't know. But bearing in mind that Catholics make up something like 15% of the Scottish population, it wouldn't take many to get an accurate reflection of the country as a whole.
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The events around the signing of Mo Johnston would suggest otherwise.
There was a definite policy of exclusion in the past, ex players like Ferguson and Craig Brown have publicly said so. Souness was the first one to really try and tackle the problem head on and that wasn't 100 years ago, closer to 20 and a bit. Others have taken the thing on further with signing the likes of Boli, Amaruso and Cuellar.
So it seems that it's a bit more palatable to the Rangers support base to sign a foreign catholic from mainland Europe than it as a catholic from Scotland or Ireland. The distinct lack of the latter even in this day and age provides a fairly decent yardstick in that regard.
A lot of nonsense was written about the reaction when Johnston signed but the truth is that the ovewhelming majority of Rangers fans were perfectly happy. It was said by the club that a total of one season ticket was returned. How many Scottish/Irish Catholics do they currently have in the team? I don't know. But bearing in mind that Catholics make up something like 15% of the Scottish population, it wouldn't take many to get an accurate reflection of the country as a whole.
I think Rangers have just as much Unionist/UVF bollocks around their club as Celtic do with the Nationalist/IRA bollocks. They're opposite sides of the same coin.
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I think Rangers have just as much Unionist/UVF bollocks around their club as Celtic do with the Nationalist/IRA bollocks. They're opposite sides of the same coin.
Without a doubt they are, and they need each other in the same way the EDL and flagburning idiot Muslim groups need each other.
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Rangers fan as i am, but i have to disagree with you dave.
When Jock Stein , who was a Protestant, was asked if he had 1st choice over Rangers who he would sign, Pele, a catholic, or another player, who was a protestant, i think it was Best.Stein said Best, as Rangers "would never sign a Catholic".
Muc as i hate sticking up for Celtic and their obnoxious supporters, i think they have been a bit more enlightened asa football club.
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On a lighter note looks like Airdrie Utd made a bit of a cock up with their Remembrance weekend programme
http://i55.tinypic.com/30a6cxx.jpg
;D
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I do think that for all the stick Rangers and Celtic fans receive for their bigoted views, Rangers as a football club deserve a degree of blame.
Every club has their knucklehead element, some more than others.
But when a club maintains a policy of exclusion for so long as Rangers did it gives the bigots on the terraces and in the stands credibility.
Dave is quite right in so far as the Catholic population isn't so high (I'd have thought it was higher than 15% but hey ho) in Scotland so as to justify a large percentage of Gers players coming from that background. And you could never advocate quotas or the like.
But I find it odd, particularly post 80's that there hasn't been more players of a Scots/ Irish Catholic background making the grade there. Are they seriously arguing that none were ever good enough?
I could understand Rangers as a club or even said players being wary of such a move on the backdrop of a troubled period as was the late 60's-80's or at various other times prior to that.
But since then, against a backdrop of peace an reconciliation in NI, when player movement has never been so easy and when cash is king it's a rather odd anomaly. A sad relic from a bygone era. Which is pretty much the Old Firm in a nutshell.
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Two points. There aren't that many Scottish players good enough to get into either side. And while Scottish Protestants outside Glasgow tend to support their local side, Catholics support Celtic.
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Or Hibs
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Two points. There aren't that many Scottish players good enough to get into either side. And while Scottish Protestants outside Glasgow tend to support their local side, Catholics support Celtic.
I know one Scot who's too good to get in either side ;)
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Neil McCann is a Catholic I believe.
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John Spencer was as well, he came through their youth team as well I think.
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Two points. There aren't that many Scottish players good enough to get into either side. And while Scottish Protestants outside Glasgow tend to support their local side, Catholics support Celtic.
Don't agree, I knew loads of Catholics from Falkirk and Motherwell that support their local clubs. All have something in common, they hate the Old Firm.
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How can you take anybody seriously that paints over green, "go" traffic lights? Or won't have grass? That's a level of bigotry beyond comprehension.
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Two points. There aren't that many Scottish players good enough to get into either side. And while Scottish Protestants outside Glasgow tend to support their local side, Catholics support Celtic.
Dunno about the second point... I lived in Aberdeen for a bit and there were plenty of Aberdonian Rangers fans... more so than Celtic I'd say.... The Aberdeen fans maintained a healthy disdain for both of the old firm in equal measure.... until Souness turned up at Rangers and Neil Simpson crocked Ian Durant and the hatred towards Rangers seemed to increase a notch or two... A night game between Aberdeen and Rangers in the 90's could make for a very nasty atmosphere.... erm... I think I've strayed from the original point.