Winter 24/26 transfer window - the verdict

[paul_e]

This recent window is a really tough one to judge. Effectively we swapped Luiz, Tammy and Bailey for Malen and Guessand which is an upgrade to the squad but with the context of Kamara, Tielemans and McGinn all getting injured it doesn't feel like we're stronger, which is frustrating. Just those 3 coming back means it's a decent window and we really shouldn't be down about it.

However add on Alysson as someone I suspect we'll see introduced slowly over the next few months and Madjo who is even further off and it feels like one where the real verdict here might not be something we can determine for 18months yet because those 2 are the signings that will determine if this is a decent window or a very good one for us.

[geolex]

^^ He gave the summer window 1/10. I merely pointed that we had done well since, which to me, is the true measure of a transfer window. If we’d have sold our best players and been mid-table or worse, I’d have considered it a fair mark. We didn’t, so I don’t.

i don't disagree with you at all regarding how well we've done, and yes keeping our best players was good news but i (maybe wrongly) tend to judge transfer windows on what we bring in.

[geolex]

I said the summer transfer window was a 1/10.

Maybe he should have said 1/10 for incomings and given a mark for outgoings as well, which sometimes happen in transfer windows.
[/quote
 i suppose you could argue that if they didn't leave then there's no actual transfer so shouldn't be included in a transfer window discussion

[paul_e]

^^ He gave the summer window 1/10. I merely pointed that we had done well since, which to me, is the true measure of a transfer window. If we’d have sold our best players and been mid-table or worse, I’d have considered it a fair mark. We didn’t, so I don’t.

i don't disagree with you at all regarding how well we've done, and yes keeping our best players was good news but i (maybe wrongly) tend to judge transfer windows on what we bring in.

Even reducing the criteria to that, we massively improved our backup goalkeeper and added a 4th CB that has proven to be a very capable addition to the squad. Just for those 2 it's a 5/10 window as a mimimum.

Aside from that a huge part of why the window was seen so negatively is that we 'replaced' Asensio and Rashford with Guessand and Sancho, which is a downgrade but is also undeniably the risk of using loan players and isn't really a fair thing to judge the window on.

[geolex]

^^ He gave the summer window 1/10. I merely pointed that we had done well since, which to me, is the true measure of a transfer window. If we’d have sold our best players and been mid-table or worse, I’d have considered it a fair mark. We didn’t, so I don’t.

i don't disagree with you at all regarding how well we've done, and yes keeping our best players was good news but i (maybe wrongly) tend to judge transfer windows on what we bring in.

Even reducing the criteria to that, we massively improved our backup goalkeeper and added a 4th CB that has proven to be a very capable addition to the squad. Just for those 2 it's a 5/10 window as a mimimum.

Aside from that a huge part of why the window was seen so negatively is that we 'replaced' Asensio and Rashford with Guessand and Sancho, which is a downgrade but is also undeniably the risk of using loan players and isn't really a fair thing to judge the window on.
[/quotte

its not unfair you cant take Guessand and Sancho out of the equation they were part of the window i don't think 2 freebies negate  the thick end of £30m for Guessand   and the reported  £150k+ a week for Sancho + loan fee and you seem to have forgotten Elliott  ..

[olaftab]

In the prevailing circumstances I give the club 8 out of 10. The 2 point loss is Malen leaving, other than that I do not think we could have done much better.

[paul_e]

^^ He gave the summer window 1/10. I merely pointed that we had done well since, which to me, is the true measure of a transfer window. If we’d have sold our best players and been mid-table or worse, I’d have considered it a fair mark. We didn’t, so I don’t.

i don't disagree with you at all regarding how well we've done, and yes keeping our best players was good news but i (maybe wrongly) tend to judge transfer windows on what we bring in.

Even reducing the criteria to that, we massively improved our backup goalkeeper and added a 4th CB that has proven to be a very capable addition to the squad. Just for those 2 it's a 5/10 window as a mimimum.

Aside from that a huge part of why the window was seen so negatively is that we 'replaced' Asensio and Rashford with Guessand and Sancho, which is a downgrade but is also undeniably the risk of using loan players and isn't really a fair thing to judge the window on.

its not unfair you cant take Guessand and Sancho out of the equation they were part of the window i don't think 2 freebies negate  the thick end of £30m for Guessand   and the reported  £150k+ a week for Sancho + loan fee and you seem to have forgotten Elliott  ..

You've got that completely backwards, I'm not saying including Guessand and Sancho is unfair, I'm saying including the loss of Rashford and Asensio is. I also didn't forget Elliott, it just wasn't relevant to the point that we finished the season with 2 very good loan players and the loanee and signing we made to replace them weren't of the same standard. My point being that we weren't really replacing them, we were filling the same gaps again.

In real terms the summer window was:

Olsen > Bizot - 10/10 - Massive improvement
Gap at CB > Lindelof - 10/10 - Added depth and has been very good when needed
Gap on the wing > Sancho - 5/10 - he's been disappointing in general and certainly not worth the cost so far
Gap as a utility attacker > Guessand - 5/10 - hasn't settled at all and looks like Emery might have decided to move him on
Ramsey > Elliott - 6/10 - Ramsey was pretty poor last season but Elliott has, through no fault of his own, not really offered much either so this one is pretty neutral
Bailey > no one - 1/10 - this weakened us but has been rectified since
Overall - 6/10 - not breath-taking but big defensive upgrades have proven very valuable, attacking players haven't worked as hoped

Without hindsight the winter window was a little better:

Guessand > Bailey - 7/10 - If Bailey can find form then this is a massive upgrade
Malen > Tammy - 7/10 - sacrificed flexibility for depth, seems sensible but it depends on how well Tammy can replicate the work Ollie does
Alysson - 7/10 - unknown quantity but might add something as the season progresses
Madjo - 6/10 - unlikely to have an impact this season
Luiz - 8/10 - the most important signing after all the injuries, should have a big part to play
Overall - 7/10 - without all the injuries we'd be looking at a very strong squad now. The 2 youngsters are what will determine how this window gets viewed in the future

I'm being a little conservative because I'm not entirely sold on Tammy and Bailey but we'll see.

[Bent Neilsens Screamer]

Very generous ratings for Guessand and particularly Elliott there Paul.

[brontebilly]

Guessand was a 0/10, might have been the worst player to play for us since we came back to the PL (Drinky aside). Any scout that identified him really shouldn't be working at the club any longer. Elliot has had zero impact and Sancho about a 2. Losing Ramsey to pickup those three was a net negative.

Think we have made the best of a difficult situation in January, resolving the Elliot situation aside. Bailey/Luiz/Tammy are a better fit for us than Guessand/Barkley/Malen from a squad depth perspective. It was only the first game but Luiz was surprisingly sharp v Brentford compared to his Forest form.

[eamonn]

Ramsey > Elliott - 6/10 - Ramsey was pretty poor last season but Elliott has, through no fault of his own, not really offered much either so this one is pretty neutral

Come on, you can't say an hour of Elliott in the first team is the same as Ramsey's contribution last season!

[Dante Lavelli]

Guessand was a 0/10, might have been the worst player to play for us since we came back to the PL (Drinky aside). Any scout that identified him really shouldn't be working at the club any longer. 

Wasn't it reported that Guessand was an Emery pick?

[paul_e]

Very generous ratings for Guessand and particularly Elliott there Paul.

Mostly because the hyperbolic bullshit that some people are coming out with needs to be countered...

Guessand was a 0/10, might have been the worst player to play for us since we came back to the PL (Drinky aside). Any scout that identified him really shouldn't be working at the club any longer. Elliot has had zero impact and Sancho about a 2. Losing Ramsey to pickup those three was a net negative.

Think we have made the best of a difficult situation in January, resolving the Elliot situation aside. Bailey/Luiz/Tammy are a better fit for us than Guessand/Barkley/Malen from a squad depth perspective. It was only the first game but Luiz was surprisingly sharp v Brentford compared to his Forest form.

.. right on time from the person who clearly has no idea how a rating out of 10 is supposed to work.

[paul_e]

Ramsey > Elliott - 6/10 - Ramsey was pretty poor last season but Elliott has, through no fault of his own, not really offered much either so this one is pretty neutral

Come on, you can't say an hour of Elliott in the first team is the same as Ramsey's contribution last season!

Nope, I can't which is why I didn't. I said Ramsey was poor last season so wasn't much of a loss in real terms and Elliott hasn't offered much this season so hasn't really added anything. From a squad perspective it's a pretty neutral change.

[john e]

Very generous ratings for Guessand and particularly Elliott there Paul.

Mostly because the hyperbolic bullshit that some people are coming out with needs to be countered...

Guessand was a 0/10, might have been the worst player to play for us since we came back to the PL (Drinky aside). Any scout that identified him really shouldn't be working at the club any longer. Elliot has had zero impact and Sancho about a 2. Losing Ramsey to pickup those three was a net negative.

Think we have made the best of a difficult situation in January, resolving the Elliot situation aside. Bailey/Luiz/Tammy are a better fit for us than Guessand/Barkley/Malen from a squad depth perspective. It was only the first game but Luiz was surprisingly sharp v Brentford compared to his Forest form.

.. right on time from the person who clearly has no idea how a rating out of 10 is supposed to work.

I still think he’s closer with his 0 out of 10 than you are with your 7 mind

[paul_e]

Very generous ratings for Guessand and particularly Elliott there Paul.

Mostly because the hyperbolic bullshit that some people are coming out with needs to be countered...

Guessand was a 0/10, might have been the worst player to play for us since we came back to the PL (Drinky aside). Any scout that identified him really shouldn't be working at the club any longer. Elliot has had zero impact and Sancho about a 2. Losing Ramsey to pickup those three was a net negative.

Think we have made the best of a difficult situation in January, resolving the Elliot situation aside. Bailey/Luiz/Tammy are a better fit for us than Guessand/Barkley/Malen from a squad depth perspective. It was only the first game but Luiz was surprisingly sharp v Brentford compared to his Forest form.

.. right on time from the person who clearly has no idea how a rating out of 10 is supposed to work.

I still think he’s closer with his 0 out of 10 than you are with your 7 mind

I gave him 5, which I think is fair for a guy who got a couple of goals and did some decent defensive work for us despite clearly struggling with the pace of the league and the tactical requirements of Emery. I then gave the choice to replace him with Bailey for the 2nd half of the season a 7 because I think it's a clear improvement but with concerns that last seasons Bailey was still a way short of what we'd want.