Lamare Bogarde

[Monty]

I just think the moment and the intensity of the game overwhelmed him.

[Meanwood Villa]

I thought he was ok after the first pass. Couldn't Dougie be the replacement for Onana?

[brontebilly]

In Emery's mind, it's Onana, Bogarde or Kamara in that slightly deeper position, and I think that's about right. Dougie's a pretty ineffective tackler.

Bogarde's distribution was conspicuously poor on two occasions last night, including one just after he came on. Other than that, he was fine in his role sitting at the base and niggling the opposition when we didn't have possession. He's just not as good (yet) at it as Onana, who is, as a reminder, a £50m player heading to the WC as first pick midfielder with a top ten ranked nation.

I think Emery's judgement is misplaced on this one, Bogarde is a better athlete than Luiz but that's it. He has no feel for the ball at all. What's worse is it looked like some players were bypassing him when he was available for the pass. It's like an average centre back playing in midfield.

Agree,he has been awful last 2 games but I think it’s partly down to being thrown in cold.

Was the same when given chances in midfield v Everton, Brentford, that cup game v Spurs. He's honest but very limited.

[AV82EC]

In Emery's mind, it's Onana, Bogarde or Kamara in that slightly deeper position, and I think that's about right. Dougie's a pretty ineffective tackler.

Bogarde's distribution was conspicuously poor on two occasions last night, including one just after he came on. Other than that, he was fine in his role sitting at the base and niggling the opposition when we didn't have possession. He's just not as good (yet) at it as Onana, who is, as a reminder, a £50m player heading to the WC as first pick midfielder with a top ten ranked nation.

I think Emery's judgement is misplaced on this one, Bogarde is a better athlete than Luiz but that's it. He has no feel for the ball at all. What's worse is it looked like some players were bypassing him when he was available for the pass. It's like an average centre back playing in midfield.

Agree,he has been awful last 2 games but I think it’s partly down to being thrown in cold.

Was the same when given chances in midfield v Everton, Brentford, that cup game v Spurs. He's honest but very limited.

Fully agree with this. You can see he doesn’t have the wherewithal to help build the play and the other players see him as someone to exchange passes with not as a creator or finder of a critical pass. Also I disagree with the putting him in cold viewpoint. This is high level sport, if you’re in the squad you need to be ready.

[eye digress]

In Emery's mind, it's Onana, Bogarde or Kamara in that slightly deeper position, and I think that's about right. Dougie's a pretty ineffective tackler.

Bogarde's distribution was conspicuously poor on two occasions last night, including one just after he came on. Other than that, he was fine in his role sitting at the base and niggling the opposition when we didn't have possession. He's just not as good (yet) at it as Onana, who is, as a reminder, a £50m player heading to the WC as first pick midfielder with a top ten ranked nation.

I think Emery's judgement is misplaced on this one, Bogarde is a better athlete than Luiz but that's it. He has no feel for the ball at all. What's worse is it looked like some players were bypassing him when he was available for the pass. It's like an average centre back playing in midfield.

Agree,he has been awful last 2 games but I think it’s partly down to being thrown in cold.

Was the same when given chances in midfield v Everton, Brentford, that cup game v Spurs. He's honest but very limited.

Think I've buried the Everton and Brentford matches somewhere that my brain can't reach them.

Harsh for the Spurs game though, he played very well alongside (mostly) Tielemans, even though he did get turned over as he tired second half.

[LeeS]

I can’t see how anyone defends him. He’s not even that young. Move him on fast.

[LeeB]

I thought he was ok after the first pass. Couldn't Dougie be the replacement for Onana?

I thought the same.

[eye digress]

I can’t see how anyone defends him. He’s not even that young. Move him on fast.

Think everyone has acknowledged that he was fairly poor in parts last night and that he's a step down from Onana, or even several steps.

So I think it's less of a case of defending him than calling for perspective and not throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

Lastly, we didn't lose last night because of Bogarde.

[Smithy]

I can’t see how anyone defends him. He’s not even that young. Move him on fast.

Indeed, he's a year older than Kobbie Mainoo, who was playing international football two years ago.  I had hoped he might develop into a Mainoo-style footballer, but his limitations with the ball mean it's more likely he'll be our Phil Neville.  Never claiming a position of his own, but able to cover two or three, when absolutely needed. 

However, if our financial limitations are to remain for another couple of years, then I don't think he's the sort of player to move on, simply because the cost of replacing the cover he provides would vastly outweigh any fee, plus his wages will be on the low end.

I also think we have to rein in our expectations a little, and accept that, for now, our 3rd choice defensive central midfielder, 5th choice centre-back and 3rd choice right-back is probably not going to be at the same level as all of the players ahead of him in the pecking order.  So when he plays, we should perhaps expect a little bit of a drop-off.

It would be nice if the player 3rd, 5th and 3rd in those positions was of International quality, but we're probably a few years away from having a squad with that sort of strength!

[ChicagoLion]

My expectations are that he should be good enough to play at this level, not world beating not prime Messi, just competent will do.

[SamTheMouse]

I can’t see how anyone defends him. He’s not even that young. Move him on fast.

I also think we have to rein in our expectations a little, and accept that, for now, our 3rd choice defensive central midfielder, 5th choice centre-back and 3rd choice right-back is probably not going to be at the same level as all of the players ahead of him in the pecking order.  So when he plays, we should perhaps expect a little bit of a drop-off.

Agree with this. The underlying problem is that we're having to play the third choice way too often.

[OzVilla]

Has regressed as the season has gone on when he’s appeared. Shame as I thought we were really on to something early on.

[eamonn]

I thought he was ok after the first pass. Couldn't Dougie be the replacement for Onana?

I thought the same.

In the presser pre-match, Unai was quick to mention Bogarde only when Onana's mooted unavailability was brought-up.

He clearly doesn't see Luiz in that role or, annoyingly, Barkley either as I thought he should have started against Fulham. Bogarde ball-watched and let his man free for the shot that led to Fulham's winner.

[eye digress]

His form has mirrored that of the team as a whole - i.e., poor since end-January, as a quick review of this thread demonstrates.

[john e]

He’s done OK in some matches, but just doing OK isn’t good enough
I don’t think there is a single game where I thought he looks a proper player there because he just plays it safe most of the time when he doesn’t he gives the ball away to many times

I was never on board with the hype when he first broke through I just didn’t see what others were seeing I thought he was fairly limited. I’ve not changed my mind. I don’t think he’s anywhere near good enough to be playing at the top level of where we are now to be honest

That might sound a bit harsh, but that’s where we’ve got to be now, we can’t afford passengers, liabilities, or average quality players,
I’m not saying he’s a bad player particularly but he’s just not good enough for us as a starter or as a backup