Bournemouth - 2 Aston Villa - 2 Post-Match

[Risso]

Id the ref couldn't see it isn't that the point of VAR to correct things missed by the ref? If a player headbutts another but the ref doesn't see it surely we're not saying VAR can't get involved because the ref hasn't seen it?

I'm totally confused by VAR.

They intervene on straight red card incidents, not yellow (including second yellow) fouls. A headbutt would be a straight red. Even though it went against us, I'm happy with this. If they checked yellow card incidents games would last until midnight.

[PaulTheVillan]

Stupid VAR rule. Clear and obvious error shouldn’t be conditioned with additional rules.

It’s either an error or not. Not giving him a 2nd yellow was an error.

[Risso]

Stupid VAR rule. Clear and obvious error shouldn’t be conditioned with additional rules.

It’s either an error or not. Not giving him a 2nd yellow was an error.

There has to be a line drawn somewhere though. Do you honestly want them checking every possible yellow card piece of action? I very much do not.

[Flamingo Lane]

If the referee couldn't see it, how could he have given us a free kick?

[Brend'Watkins]

If the referee couldn't see it, how could he have given us a free kick?

Exactly.  The ref completely bottled it that's all. Dermot Gallagher making himself look stupid there trying to give him an excuse.

[Ian.]

Id the ref couldn't see it isn't that the point of VAR to correct things missed by the ref? If a player headbutts another but the ref doesn't see it surely we're not saying VAR can't get involved because the ref hasn't seen it?

I'm totally confused by VAR.

They intervene on straight red card incidents, not yellow (including second yellow) fouls. A headbutt would be a straight red. Even though it went against us, I'm happy with this. If they checked yellow card incidents games would last until midnight.

I agree, it would just open up another can of worms. This would just add to most of the other things I hate about VAR.

[The Edge]

Id the ref couldn't see it isn't that the point of VAR to correct things missed by the ref? If a player headbutts another but the ref doesn't see it surely we're not saying VAR can't get involved because the ref hasn't seen it?

I'm totally confused by VAR.

They intervene on straight red card incidents, not yellow (including second yellow) fouls. A headbutt would be a straight red. Even though it went against us, I'm happy with this. If they checked yellow card incidents games would last until midnight.

I agree, it would just open up another can of worms. This would just add to most of the other things I hate about VAR.

We just need referee's to referee games properly and apply the rules. A blatant pull on someones shirt is a yellow card. Pure and simple. We can't have ref's interpreting a thing like that just because he'd already booked a player. The absolute state of our referee's nowadays is pathetic. It kind of reminds me of social workers (I work in the NHS). Things have been interpreted and re-interpreted to such an extent they don't know if they are coming or going.

[Somniloquism]

I'm not sure where a deliberate shirt pull is an instant yellow card is coming from? Maybe closer to goal, or to stop a run through which might not be seen as DOGSO directly, it might have been but it isn't a set on stone ruling unlike the new delay in game one for example.

[dave shelley]

Risso's right on VAR getting involved in the yellow card scenario, the game would end up as long as a game of American Football.

One thing we should all look out for when there is a contentious incident during a game is:. How does/did the referee re-start the game? In the instance of our game on Sunday, having given us a free kick which under the circumstances the fouling player already on a yellow should have received a second, that is when I feel VAR should be duty bound to alert the referee citing the fact that you've penalised the player for what is a yellow card offence and correctly awarded the free kick but not administered the second yellow, at the very least the referee should be asked to review it on the monitor. 

Poor officiating by the referee and even if he didn't see the shirt pull, for which I don't believe for one minute, why not then consult his linesman because you can bet your house on the fact that he did!

[usav]

Risso's right on VAR getting involved in the yellow card scenario, the game would end up as long as a game of American Football.

On that subject, one suggestion has been to move to challenge system.  Keep the goal line technology, but move VAR to a challenge system something like 2 per team per game.  You have to abide by whatever the decision from VAR is from the challenge and the rest of the game gets refereed as it was for the previous 150 years - by the officials on the pitch.

[The Edge]

I'm not sure where a deliberate shirt pull is an instant yellow card is coming from? Maybe closer to goal, or to stop a run through which might not be seen as DOGSO directly, it might have been but it isn't a set on stone ruling unlike the new delay in game one for example.

As I understand it a deliberate pull on a players shirt, especially in this instance where Bailey was actually stopped in his tracks, that is a yellow card.

[Somniloquism]

A list of definite yellow card offences are

CAUTIONABLE OFFENCES

A player is cautioned if guilty of:

delaying the restart of play
dissent by word or action
entering, re-entering or deliberately leaving the field of play without the referee’s permission
failing to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a dropped ball, corner kick, free kick or throw-in
persistent offences (no specific number or pattern of offences constitutes “persistent”)
unsporting behaviour
entering the referee review area (RRA)
excessively using the 'review' (TV screen) signal

There are different circumstances when a player must be cautioned for unsporting behaviour including if a player:

attempts to deceive the referee e.g. by feigning injury or pretending to have been fouled (simulation)
changes places with the goalkeeper during play or without the referee’s permission (see Law 3)
commits in a reckless manner a direct free kick offence
handles the ball to interfere with or stop a promising attack
commits any other offence which interferes with or stops a promising attack except where the referee awards a penalty kick for an offence which was an attempt to play the ball or for a challenge for the ball
denies an opponent an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by committing an offence which was an attempt to play the ball or challenge for the ball and the referee awards a penalty kick
handles the ball in an attempt to score a goal (whether or not the attempt is successful) or in an unsuccessful attempt to prevent a goal
makes unauthorised marks on the field of play
plays the ball when leaving the field of play after being given permission to leave
shows a lack of respect for the game
initiates a deliberate trick for the ball to be passed (including from a free kick or goal kick) to the goalkeeper with the head, chest, knee etc. to circumvent the Law, whether or not the goalkeeper touches the ball with the hands; the goalkeeper is cautioned if responsible for initiating the deliberate trick
verbally distracts an opponent during play or at a restart

So as where there are definitive "if this happens yellow card it" there is nothing stating a shirt pull specifically.

I think persistence might be the one it could have come under or if the offence was around the area, it might have been given as well as closer to a an attack situation. (Although the same player also fouled on the edge of the area and still wasn't given one).

[dave shelley]

commits any other offence which interferes with or stops a promising attack

This covers it for me.

[The Edge]

commits any other offence which interferes with or stops a promising attack

This covers it for me.

Me too which is why it's normally given.

[Somniloquism]

Although it was on the halfway line so how promising? I'm only pointing out that the Yellow decision is subjective, and not a definitive Yellow for a shirt pull which most seem to be picking up on, unlike for example kicking the ball away or taking the shirt off after scoring are definitive.

For what it is worth, his challenge later on should have been a yellow as that did stop a promising attack and was right on the edge of the box even if the ref decided the first wasn't.