FFP

[Steve67]

I normally stop reading when the quote Micah Richards, but he’s actually spot on this time. 

[Steve67]

I also hadn’t realised until I read this bbc article that, under Unai, we’ve made a £10m sales profit.  I appreciate it’s also about salary but this is tough to take.

[Dave]

I also hadn’t realised until I read this bbc article that, under Unai, we’ve made a £10m sales profit.  I appreciate it’s also about salary but this is tough to take.

It is also about what the club did prior to the current management.

[SaddVillan]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cy982zd1e7jo

PSR or mismanagement? Villa face harsh financial reality

This is another, alternative take on PSR/SCR

But the Observer and BBC pieces both miss the point entirely.

Chelsea and City were able to rack up huge owner funded losses whilst they built themselves up to become the cash generative businesses that we see today.

Villa and Toon are being denied that opportunity.

Had PSR/SCR existed before Abramovich and Sheikh Mansour got involved then City and Chelsea would never have been as successful as they have been.

Under Abramovich, Chelsea lost an average of £900k A WEEK for 19 years.

£889.2m INTOTAL

He bought Chelsea in 2003.
PSR was introduced in 2013-4.

Sheikh Mansour took over City in 2008. They made losses of £479.4m in the first 3 seasons (compare that to the current £105m PSR limit) and have benefitted from "bogus" sponsorships to balance the books. But more recently selling Academy products has helped their numbers.

And Spurs are trying to get around it due to relatively unique circumstances - building a new stadium which doesn't count for PSR/SCR - and leveraging the stadium in London to generate revenue in the off season.

We are trying to do the same but are hamstrung by poor infrastructure (which bedevils every city outside London).

And the difficulty in getting sufficient numbers of punters/tourists to pay top dollar for middling quality food and wine in hospitality.

All we're asking for is the same opportunity/level playing field that existed pre-Abramovich/Mansour.

PSR has stopped losses, but stifled ambition and cemented the cartel's dominance.

If football fair, with performances and results being rewarded, , then Spurs and United would have been handicapped in the transfer market. Instead Villa and Toon are screwed because of how the rules have been written.

[Beard82]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/articles/cy982zd1e7jo

PSR or mismanagement? Villa face harsh financial reality

This is another, alternative take on PSR/SCR

But the Observer and BBC pieces both miss the point entirely.

Chelsea and City were able to rack up huge owner funded losses whilst they built themselves up to become the cash generative businesses that we see today.

Villa and Toon are being denied that opportunity.

Had PSR/SCR existed before Abramovich and Sheikh Mansour got involved then City and Chelsea would never have been as successful as they have been.

Under Abramovich, Chelsea lost an average of £900k A WEEK for 19 years.

£889.2m INTOTAL

He bought Chelsea in 2003.
PSR was introduced in 2013-4.

Sheikh Mansour took over City in 2008. They made losses of £479.4m in the first 3 seasons (compare that to the current £105m PSR limit) and have benefitted from "bogus" sponsorships to balance the books. But more recently selling Academy products has helped their numbers.

And Spurs are trying to get around it due to relatively unique circumstances - building a new stadium which doesn't count for PSR/SCR - and leveraging the stadium in London to generate revenue in the off season.

We are trying to do the same but are hamstrung by poor infrastructure (which bedevils every city outside London).

And the difficulty in getting sufficient numbers of punters/tourists to pay top dollar for middling quality food and wine in hospitality.

All we're asking for is the same opportunity/level playing field that existed pre-Abramovich/Mansour.

PSR has stopped losses, but stifled ambition and cemented the cartel's dominance.

If football fair, with performances and results being rewarded, , then Spurs and United would have been handicapped in the transfer market. Instead Villa and Toon are screwed because of how the rules have been written.

I dont even think were asking that - I think were just asking for a more balanced tool that gives us half a chance.  Or even for Man City's charges to be resolved so it at least feels like it applies to everyone. 

[andyh]

It now feels like the club are operating under an embargo.

[tomd2103]

The more I think about, the more that disastrous afternoon at Old Trafford in May feels like it might be a sliding doors moment.  If we'd made the Champions League then things may still have been tight financially, but there would have been a better feel about us.

As it is, it just feels like our blood is now in the water and the usual sharks are circling.  Everything around us seems to be negative at the moment and we just have a feeling of being a bit vulnerable.

[ChicagoLion]

The more I think about, the more that disastrous afternoon at Old Trafford in May feels like it might be a sliding doors moment.  If we'd made the Champions League then things may still have been tight financially, but there would have been a better feel about us.

As it is, it just feels like our blood is now in the water and the usual sharks are circling.  Everything around us seems to be negative at the moment and we just have a feeling a being a bit vulnerable.

OT was a huge disappointment and we could be paying for that insipid performance for a very long time.

[aj2k77]

Or we could knuckle down, stop all the accountancy talk, have clear instructions for everyone what is going on and realise the season has started and we are in a fight every game. Brentford and Newcastle looked like games we were just getting out of the way whilst the real business was taking place off the pitch and later on.

[kippaxvilla2]

The counter arguments are:

No one forced us to pay 96 percent of turnover on wages.

The stadium expansion should have happened 20 years ago if not more.  We might be looking at 60k plus now.  But as usual the happy to be here attitude took precedence.

The rule makers don’t force us to fork out reasonable money on players who can make a difference and then are not played.

We try and raise revenue through ticket prices the old supply and demand due to limited stadium capacity and people are up in arms.  Catch 22.

The leagues are not responsible for the lack of a continuous production line from the academy such that we don’t need to worry about PSR.  Our hit rate out of it is still average at best.

I don’t like the rules.  At the very least they should reflect inflation if they’re to continue which we don’t yet know for sure. But we have a number of areas we need or needed to improve quicker in order to avoid this constant three year cycle.

I don’t like some of the things on the pitch at the moment and the manager has to take responsibility for that.  But he has done reamarkably with the players he inherited.  The usual villa curse applies is that when we get something nice something will get in the way to prevent it.

[Mellin]

Yep. I was raging about that Rogers goal for weeks and still not seeing any reason to reengage. It's not an even playing field, our squad has been stripped bare due to shit rules, and I'm not sure I can be arsed with an enforced descent into mediocrity.

You can see we're done. If we would've kept the squad together from the back end of last year, replacing Rashford with someone else decent, we were in league winning form. Instead we've been fucked over. Shit rules. Shit league. Sling your hook.

[aj2k77]

Malen, Onana, Maatsen, Ozcan, Cisse, Illing Jr, Garcia, Barkley, Nedkeljovic. £140M there and very very little to show on the pitch. Guessand needs to start playing, we don't play in some extremely complex way that needs months to adapt to, we play slow sideways back and forth. If this summer is a total bust on transfers in and no one makes an impact then it's time for Monchi to go. He can fuck off and save non league Spanish clubs.

[Gareth]

I’d never really thought about the PSR regulations before in terms of how they should be…but if they measure wages vs revenue shouldn’t there be an element in there to reflect debt?  Obv will never happen because the cartel, particularly the one playing at the moment won’t benefit from that being included

[Percy McCarthy]

I haven’t kept up with verdicts and all that, but Man City are trying to win a case that interest-free shareholder loans should be accounted for at commercial interest rates. Suits us if they win that one.

[Mister E]

I’d never really thought about the PSR regulations before in terms of how they should be…but if they measure wages vs revenue shouldn’t there be an element in there to reflect debt?  Obv will never happen because the cartel, particularly the one playing at the moment won’t benefit from that being included

PSR is about allowable losses over a 3 year period. The UEFA SCR rules are about the ratio of salaries to revenue.
Your point about debt is a good one: since both the Premier League and UEFA are purportedly about sustainability, some measure of debt and owner-affordability should really be in place. I think the biggest problem for us has been that UEFA and the EPL have different measures: really, there should be one set of measures across Europe. In reality, UEFA is not about sustainability and more about preventing rich clubs buying success through wages