FFP

[N'ZMAV]

Yep, they did break the rules, but I also has some small element of sympathy for them.  I remember reading that the Spurs offer before 30th June wouldn't have got them inside the FFP limit, so even if they'd sold then, they'd be sitting here having still broken the rules.  So I guess then you're faced with the choice, accept you're definitely going to be the wrong side the FFP limit, or gamble and know that if you get a bit more from Spurs you'll be the wrong side of FFP for a couple of months, and hope you can mitigate to a lesser punishment with the Premier League by demonstrating the sale brought you back within FFP limits.

It's their own fault, and was based on their strategy for the entire year previous, but faced with the decision they had at the end of June, I'd probably have done the same.  They were screwed either way.

Or maybe they could have not bought a couple of the players in their supermarket sweep in the first place? Breaching FFP doesn't just happen overnight, it's a cumulative effect and one that is very easily calculated as you go along. Eg buy player X at £40m on a four year contract, that's going to give us £10m a year amortisation and whatever his wages are. Don't buy him, and we won't have those costs. It's really very simple, and they're not exactly dealing with millions of transactions.

exactly, it’s all of their own making.

they didn't really need those 40 odd players they signed within a year. They couldn't even register them all, so what was the point?

[PaulWinch again]

Yep agreed it’s poor management that has left Forest needing to rely on one asset to keep them the right side of the line, and it’s too late. Leicester didn’t sign hardly anyone the January they went down I think due to FFP, so you can’t have sides deciding when the rules apply.

[Dogtanian]

I don't see how forest can blame anyone apart from themselves.

They bought 24 players... yet somehow still left themselves needing to loan 5 more across the season?

Two players were bought for over £5m combined, and immediately loaned out to the owner's other club, Olympiacos...

Two other players made no appearances at all, and only ten of the 24 made half a season's worth or more.

It's a disgusting example of complete mismanagement, not a technicality, simple mistake, or a matter of bad timing.

[eamonn]

Cooper is well off out of that mess.

[brontebilly]

I don't see how forest can blame anyone apart from themselves.

They bought 24 players... yet somehow still left themselves needing to loan 5 more across the season?

Two players were bought for over £5m combined, and immediately loaned out to the owner's other club, Olympiacos...

Two other players made no appearances at all, and only ten of the 24 made half a season's worth or more.

It's a disgusting example of complete mismanagement, not a technicality, simple mistake, or a matter of bad timing.

Lots of their business made no sense and I'm surprised Cooper didn't leave last summer, to selfishly protect his own reputation if nothing else. It doesnt look as if he was having much of a say with most of those transfers and a big squad is impossible to manage. But their promotion was a bit of a miracle really, heavily reliant on loan players like Keinan Davis, Spence, Garner. They were always going to have to try a last minute shopping dash that summer to replace those loan players alone and add then numbers to their squad. I'm sure their fans will say the end justified the means.
Similar to our own first season back really, Drinky was our Shelvey! We signed a lot of very average players too.

Their FFP 'books' balanced at the end of the transfer window with the big sale of Johnson so for me they should be get cut a lot of slack. As for the point they should have cashed in Johnson earlier to stay compliant, fine take 12m or less cash and then play elevated prices to replace him or alternatively struggle to get anyone in and likely get relegated. Either all the transfer window is in scope or none of it.

[itbrvilla]

Yep, they did break the rules, but I also has some small element of sympathy for them.  I remember reading that the Spurs offer before 30th June wouldn't have got them inside the FFP limit, so even if they'd sold then, they'd be sitting here having still broken the rules.  So I guess then you're faced with the choice, accept you're definitely going to be the wrong side the FFP limit, or gamble and know that if you get a bit more from Spurs you'll be the wrong side of FFP for a couple of months, and hope you can mitigate to a lesser punishment with the Premier League by demonstrating the sale brought you back within FFP limits.

It's their own fault, and was based on their strategy for the entire year previous, but faced with the decision they had at the end of June, I'd probably have done the same.  They were screwed either way.

Or maybe they could have not bought a couple of the players in their supermarket sweep in the first place? Breaching FFP doesn't just happen overnight, it's a cumulative effect and one that is very easily calculated as you go along. Eg buy player X at £40m on a four year contract, that's going to give us £10m a year amortisation and whatever his wages are. Don't buy him, and we won't have those costs. It's really very simple, and they're not exactly dealing with millions of transactions.

exactly, it’s all of their own making.

they didn't really need those 40 odd players they signed within a year. They couldn't even register them all, so what was the point?

It doesn't make sense. I wonder who the agents 8nvolved were as it feels like some kind of fraud or laundering to me somehow.

[pablo_picasso]

I don't see how forest can blame anyone apart from themselves.

They bought 24 players... yet somehow still left themselves needing to loan 5 more across the season?

Two players were bought for over £5m combined, and immediately loaned out to the owner's other club, Olympiacos...

Two other players made no appearances at all, and only ten of the 24 made half a season's worth or more.

It's a disgusting example of complete mismanagement, not a technicality, simple mistake, or a matter of bad timing.

Lots of their business made no sense and I'm surprised Cooper didn't leave last summer, to selfishly protect his own reputation if nothing else. It doesnt look as if he was having much of a say with most of those transfers and a big squad is impossible to manage. But their promotion was a bit of a miracle really, heavily reliant on loan players like Keinan Davis, Spence, Garner. They were always going to have to try a last minute shopping dash that summer to replace those loan players alone and add then numbers to their squad. I'm sure their fans will say the end justified the means.
Similar to our own first season back really, Drinky was our Shelvey! We signed a lot of very average players too.

Their FFP 'books' balanced at the end of the transfer window with the big sale of Johnson so for me they should be get cut a lot of slack. As for the point they should have cashed in Johnson earlier to stay compliant, fine take 12m or less cash and then play elevated prices to replace him or alternatively struggle to get anyone in and likely get relegated. Either all the transfer window is in scope or none of it.

But not by the FFP / P&S date.

They didn't have to buy 24 players & spend an amount of money to the point of selling Johnson became the tipping point.

I have no problem with Forest being punished for breaking the FFP / P&S rules. Nor Everton.

Nor us for that matter, if we fuck up over it.

The biggest issue with this whole FFP / P&S farce is that Chelsea & ManC haven't been dealt with in the same manner as Everton & Forest yet.

If they had been, I don't think the numbers of sympathy that has come Everton & Forests way would be there.

They tried to cheat the system that has forced Villa to sell useful academy players & have to navigate the circling of those that cheated their way towards higher profits, & therefore higher amounts to spend on players, looking curiously at our top players with rubbing hands & a smug smirking c**tish smile.

So I have absolutely zero sympathy for either Everton or Forest, anymore than I do for those cheating c**nts who are bathing in the rewards of their cheating.

[PeterWithesShin]

They shouldn't be cut any slack at all.

They chose to buy and loan in a stupid amount of players. They chose to be non compliant. They chose not to sell Johnson in a window that would have made them compliant, which was by the end of Jan last year, and instead not sell him until 7 months later. They want 7 transfer windows and three and a half years to be compliant while us and other clubs are going by the rules which is 6 windows and three years.

And they benefited from having Johnson play 20 odd gamas after Jan last year. How are they doing anything but benefitting from it and trying to give themselves an advantage over the other clubs down the bottom of the league?

[Gareth]

I don't see how forest can blame anyone apart from themselves.

They bought 24 players... yet somehow still left themselves needing to loan 5 more across the season?

Two players were bought for over £5m combined, and immediately loaned out to the owner's other club, Olympiacos...

Two other players made no appearances at all, and only ten of the 24 made half a season's worth or more.

It's a disgusting example of complete mismanagement, not a technicality, simple mistake, or a matter of bad timing.

Lots of their business made no sense and I'm surprised Cooper didn't leave last summer, to selfishly protect his own reputation if nothing else. It doesnt look as if he was having much of a say with most of those transfers and a big squad is impossible to manage. But their promotion was a bit of a miracle really, heavily reliant on loan players like Keinan Davis, Spence, Garner. They were always going to have to try a last minute shopping dash that summer to replace those loan players alone and add then numbers to their squad. I'm sure their fans will say the end justified the means.
Similar to our own first season back really, Drinky was our Shelvey! We signed a lot of very average players too.

Their FFP 'books' balanced at the end of the transfer window with the big sale of Johnson so for me they should be get cut a lot of slack. As for the point they should have cashed in Johnson earlier to stay compliant, fine take 12m or less cash and then play elevated prices to replace him or alternatively struggle to get anyone in and likely get relegated. Either all the transfer window is in scope or none of it.

They tried to cheat a rule that they knew about from day one, they failed.

If they are still in PL next season they will have cheated and succeeded & will feel the end justified the means. 

Rolled the dice & gambled, hopefully if proven it results in relegation for both them and Everton…that’s the deterrent that should apply to all

[Hookeysmith]

Joking aside, if Man City are found guilty then can the owners be considered unsuitable?  By trying to cheat the system then its not a hard argument to make and presumably the directive has come from the very top.

So how would they punish them if deemed unfit to own - make them sell the club?

By the time this comes to an actual sentence the game would have moved on. Guadliola would be retired, none of the current players will be around and more than likely they would not be playing under Premiership rules as they would of achieved the Euro super league all the other corrupt money loving fuckers wanted

[jwarry]

Joking aside, if Man City are found guilty then can the owners be considered unsuitable?  By trying to cheat the system then its not a hard argument to make and presumably the directive has come from the very top.

So how would they punish them if deemed unfit to own - make them sell the club?

By the time this comes to an actual sentence the game would have moved on. Guadliola would be retired, none of the current players will be around and more than likely they would not be playing under Premiership rules as they would of achieved the Euro super league all the other corrupt money loving fuckers wanted

Bit like Chelsea where we all hoped they would drop like a stone after the Russian was deemed unfit - but no, because their value had increased by so much when they were cheating, some other stupid billionaires step in and save them, and then have the gall to say to the PL it wasn’t us guv it was the other guys so make sure you are lenient as we’ve been so honest. 

[sid1964]

Heard a City podcast recently and they are confident that all charges will be found not guilty

Imagine the anger if they get away with all charges!!!

[GordonCowansisthegreatest]

Wishful thinking!

[ASHTONVILLA]

Joking aside, if Man City are found guilty then can the owners be considered unsuitable?  By trying to cheat the system then its not a hard argument to make and presumably the directive has come from the very top.

They are not exactly flourishing right now.

So how would they punish them if deemed unfit to own - make them sell the club?

By the time this comes to an actual sentence the game would have moved on. Guadliola would be retired, none of the current players will be around and more than likely they would not be playing under Premiership rules as they would of achieved the Euro super league all the other corrupt money loving fuckers wanted

Bit like Chelsea where we all hoped they would drop like a stone after the Russian was deemed unfit - but no, because their value had increased by so much when they were cheating, some other stupid billionaires step in and save them, and then have the gall to say to the PL it wasn’t us guv it was the other guys so make sure you are lenient as we’ve been so honest. 

[sid1964]

Just watched UTV podcast with Keiran Maguire - when you look at what other top 6 clubs earn in match day / commercial revenue, we are light years behind them.

He made some interesting points on the North Stand / Lower Grounds and our deal with Adidas and also explained FFP (seems as though won't be massively splashing the cash this summer)