Fans Worried Over Villa Future

[Simon Page]

So Doug's plan has been the same as Man Utd's and Arsenal's.  Apart from the bit about the brilliant marketing.  And the bit about appointing the right manager and sticking with them through thick and thin.  And the bit about having a decent board of directors all pulling together to take the club forwards. Ah yes, exactly the same

Woohoo. Risso responds.  See a chink eh?

Exactly apart from the "brilliant" marketing. Well done for reading that.

Appointing the right manager? Possibly. I think Atkinson was (though possibly went at the right time). Little was. O'Leary may well be.

Sticking through thick and thin? When was Arsenal's thin bit under Wenger?

Board of directors pulling in the same direction? That's precisely what we've had. Oh, what about Ansell? Left because of the appointment of Langham as opposed to promotion for Mark from what I heard, but maybe someone knows different. And Langham? Could be Doug being a tit, could be Langham being one. Do you know the answer?

As you will be aware (unless you aren't as smart as I give you credit for) my point was made in response to Ian stating we don't have a plan. Subsequently, he admitted we do. And as you'll equally be aware, it was exactly my point that it was the application of said plan which put us behind the likes of Man U and the Arse. Of course, if you look at Tottenham, Everton, Boro and Ian's pool of little clubs, we've done quite well. Like you though, I'd rather be Salford's finest than Spurs.

Now, about those other points you may have missed....

[DaveK]

And Langham? Could be Doug being a tit, could be Langham being one. Do you know the answer?

I'd love to know the answer to that one. All this 'professionalism' is a bit boring isn't it? Whatever happened to the slagging each other off in the press after quitting / being fired? It was much better IMHO, definitely more interesting.

[Laughing Gravity]

11.

Come one keep it going.

[pete bland]

...
We do have a plan under Doug. It's the same as always. In basic terms, give all available cash to the manager to spend, but don't bank on a top four finish. It's a good plan which falls down (from the fans' point of view) on a perceived inability to self-generate enough cash....

At the risk of being picky, that's not a plan, and not the same as Arsenal's or Man U's

You might as well say our plan is "to do as well as we can"

It's not a plan, "a detailed proposal for doing or achieving something"

It rather lacks detail for a start. Or indeed a "something" which is to be the target.

And this is where it's hugely different, I suspect from Man U or Arsenal.

I suspect, again, that our "plan" (in your terms) has been based around a lot of "don'ts" and not many "do's"

Don't go into debt
Don't take any risks
Don't allow that ruddy manager to take control
Don't put up with any dissent
Don't look at attracting any investment (which would dilute the HDE position)

and so on

I just feel the whole outlook has mostly been over cautious and has concentrated on current account bank balance, making sure Herbert stays in control, making sure he has the deciding say on every facet of the way the club functions (perhaps with the exception of the playing side, where he went as far as he could without immediately causing the managers to leave)

I wonder if perhaps other clubs - especially the two examples you chose, don't perhaps delegate and divide responsibility more widely. Don't leave the relevant areas to have have freedom to be positive, to set their own targets and how they want to go about reaching them etc etc.

I felt that after a while Langham was starting to get some of this approach embedded in the club. Then he was gone. Resigned over a difference of opinion about the "direction the club should take"

To say Villa's plan is the same as Man U and Arsenal's is, apart from superficially, er, somewhat mistaken, I feel.

[Laughing Gravity]

(perhaps with the exception of the playing side, where he went as far as he could without immediately causing the managers to leave)

I think there have been times when the managers had to get his approval for selections.

[canadamatt]

(perhaps with the exception of the playing side, where he went as far as he could without immediately causing the managers to leave)

I think there have been times when the managers had to get his approval for selections.

I think this needs further explanation...can you back this up?

[Warren Aspinall]

I'm pretty sure that Graham Turner (I know),complained of to much interference about team selection from Doug.Also wasn't this the initial reason why Big fat ron & doug fell out.I may be wrong here but it's something that's always been at the back of my mind.

[canadamatt]

I'm pretty sure that Graham Turner (I know),complained of to much interference about team selection from Doug.Also wasn't this the initial reason why Big fat ron & doug fell out.I may be wrong here but it's something that's always been at the back of my mind.

My worry is that this was a rumour started by a section of supporters, which has now turned into gospel...similar to the 'Doug purchased Ginola' nonsense that JG has since put straight.

[Warren Aspinall]

It may well be as I'm not sure how or where I heard it,isn't something reletive to this mentioned in HDE's lieography & by a few managers in Dave Woodalls book.

[Tony]

Tony how is saying a 81 yo is not fit for the job agist, he isn't, no 81 would be.

F'ing ell, that statement, by it's globally sweeping presumption, IS ageist.

how can it be ageist Mac, retirement age is 65, every company I have worked for enforces the rule and why ?

because you need to renew your staff at that age people get less involved, less interested and more boring.

I asked for examples and was brought one name I had not heard off but just like you wouldn't want a 20 year old running Villa you also wouldn't want a 81 year old (for obviously different reasnons before anyone becomes smart arse !!)

Don't Asda or someone employ lots of people past retirement age and haven't we got a bit of a pensions crisis going on? How old are some of those people in the house of Lords, which is quite an important role. The age thing is just a personal issue.

[dave.woodhall]

It may well be as I'm not sure how or where I heard it,isn't something reletive to this mentioned in HDE's lieography & by a few managers in Dave Woodalls book.

I wish somebody had interfered in Graham Turner's team selections.

That aside, the general concensus of the managers I spoke to was that Doug's supposed interference was over-exaggerated. BFR, in particular, said they worked well together.

[Risso]

Board of directors pulling in the same direction? That's precisely what we've had.

Well technically I suppose two full time executive directors constitutes a board, seeing as they're directors, and errr, they meet in the boardroom.  By any reasonable sized company's criteria though, it's a good four members short.

Doug deciding what to do and Stride agreeing with him does not constitute a board pulling in the same direction.

[Chris_Jephcott]

Would this post make the 12th page?

[JD]

Well I think we should sign Bakke and Milner.


Oh, sorry is this the wrong thread?  :-   :-#

[Laughing Gravity]

Yes Graham Turner at least had his selections "approved". But I suspect most of the managers over the years had "discussions" with Doug over team selection. I'm sure I read that somewhere, it may have been Doug himself. Can't remember now.