Steve Bruce - officially confirmed (as Sheffield Wednesday boss)

[Chris Jameson]

3-5-2 is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings.

Conte is being found out this season.

[Chinchilla Bathhouse]

I really don't know why people are so worried about what the media or anyone else will think of us if we sack another manager

we are lying 16th in the championship with no hope of even a play of place, playing the worst football known to man after spending the most money that's ever been spent in this league

and people are worried that sacking another useless manager will make us look like a laughing stock !

But perceptions are important. My worry is that sacking another manager makes us look like a basket case with a trigger-happy chairman, and I can't see that being remotely attractive to any top class manager.

[supertom]

Strange how 3-5-2 has been condemned as some sort of spawn of Satan formation, as though of itself it condemns a manager. Stranger still when you note that Chelsea, 10 points clear at the top of the PL, have been using it for the majority of the season. Now obviously they have much, much better players but that isn't the point when it is the fact of the formation not the players that is being ridiculed.

It hasn't worked for us, Bruce has said as much himself, but that doesn't mean that trying it was a crazy, off the wall, aberrant experiment.

Just about everybody could see that it was doomedd to failure before kick off.  No decent wing backs and therefore no balls into the box for the forward players.  Comparing it to Chelsea is utterly irrelevant.  It was a terrible decision, and got what it deserved, ie nowt.  Your post is like saying "now I know that putting my hand in the oven when it's on is going to hurt, I won't be stupid enough to do it again".  It was a dreadful deciion from a bloke who has sadly lost the plot.

If you've got the right players and a good manager, and it's a system he's comfortable, and his players are comfortable with playing then it works.
With us, under Lamberk, Sherwood, Bruce, and every other manager post O Neill who has gone to it, it's a move of desperation. It's not a plan B, it's that desperate fuck brained scramble in the dark for anything approaching a plan A.
I'm delighted for Chelsea that it works for them (no I'm not). But whenever I see it for Villa it just sends shivers down my spine because it basically means that nothing is going right. It's the telling admission that a manager is signing his death warrant and has bought his one way ticket to palookaville.

I don't want us to sack him now because frankly it will solve nothing. But Bruce has got the run in to save his job. If we finish   reasonably well and look like we have a system that works, then he gets the summer and the start of next season. If we're still abominable, then he gets the bullet. Simple.

I don't want to see us treading water in the bottom half for season upon season here, because we've already seen how that goes, and where that leads. We won't go down this season. We won't go down next season. But fuck knows what happens after that if things haven't improved. We seem incapable of hosing off the stink of failure here though and it's always the wrong manager at the wrong time, or right manager at the wrong time.

[mr underhill]

we say that every six months and yet like actors auditioning for a role, they still keep coming. One day the auditioned and the part will marry up

[ChicagoLion]

Strange how 3-5-2 has been condemned as some sort of spawn of Satan formation, as though of itself it condemns a manager. Stranger still when you note that Chelsea, 10 points clear at the top of the PL, have been using it for the majority of the season. Now obviously they have much, much better players but that isn't the point when it is the fact of the formation not the players that is being ridiculed.

It hasn't worked for us, Bruce has said as much himself, but that doesn't mean that trying it was a crazy, off the wall, aberrant experiment.

Just about everybody could see that it was doomedd to failure before kick off.  No decent wing backs and therefore no balls into the box for the forward players.  Comparing it to Chelsea is utterly irrelevant.  It was a terrible decision, and got what it deserved, ie nowt.  Your post is like saying "now I know that putting my hand in the oven when it's on is going to hurt, I won't be stupid enough to do it again".  It was a dreadful deciion from a bloke who has sadly lost the plot.

Exactly this, if you have the right players to occupy the back 5 positions then you have a chance of making it work, he didn't and then played other players out of position to accommodate.

[LukeJames]

I don't have a problem with 3-5-2, it can work when deployed right, what I have a problem with is he used it without the right players because he hadn't previously planned to use it, now if reports are correct he is going to ditch it again? As I said last week he is throwing shit at a dart board and hoping one sticks.

[supertom]

we say that every six months and yet like actors auditioning for a role, they still keep coming. One day the auditioned and the part will marry up

And they leave their brains at home and their guts, given how gutless we seem to be in recent years.

[UK Redsox]

3-5-2 is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings.

Conte is being found out this season.

Yep, it's a bit different playing three at the back with Luiz and Cahill than it is with Bakerbauer and Mad Tom

[john e]

I really don't know why people are so worried about what the media or anyone else will think of us if we sack another manager

we are lying 16th in the championship with no hope of even a play of place, playing the worst football known to man after spending the most money that's ever been spent in this league

and people are worried that sacking another useless manager will make us look like a laughing stock !

But perceptions are important. My worry is that sacking another manager makes us look like a basket case with a trigger-happy chairman, and I can't see that being remotely attractive to any top class manager.

yeah let's send out the right perceptions and people might not notice the shit football and the team boshing about in the lower reaches of the championship

[supertom]

3-5-2 is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings.

Conte is being found out this season.

Yep, it's a bit different playing three at the back with Luiz and Cahill than it is with Bakerbauer and Mad Tom

Having a CH who can come out with the ball comfortably also helps. Sideshow Luiz is more than comfortable enough to play midfield and loves having a maraud, whilst Cahill is fucking Pele compared to any defender at the club. And this is before you consider the actual art of defending.

When we played it under Little we had Southgate who was decent on the ball. Then under Gregory we had Barry who was also good on the ball. It means one of your CH's can push up into midfield as an extra, deep option when you're on the front foot.
Chester is the closest to being able to do this, but he's okay at best, and defensively he's all over the shop at the moment unfortunately. Again, the problem with the system is that it's a too many cooks scenario when tactically the system isn't clearly understood by manager and/or players. You're better off simplifying matters and playing four at the back.

In addition, we're not terrible defensively anyway. Brentford aside we've not got roasted. Our problem is midfield and attack. We can't keep clean sheets no, but with the attacking quality we have, we should be average 2 goals a game comfortably. We toothless. Concentrate on the midfield and attacking tactics. Do some actual training in the art of passing and moving. Supply the strikers.

[passport1]

Not sure we are on the radar of most people anymore. We are irrelevant other than being a text book case of how not to run a football club.

[TheMalandro]

Supertom for manager. That's how I see it too.

[Chris Smith]

Strange how 3-5-2 has been condemned as some sort of spawn of Satan formation, as though of itself it condemns a manager. Stranger still when you note that Chelsea, 10 points clear at the top of the PL, have been using it for the majority of the season. Now obviously they have much, much better players but that isn't the point when it is the fact of the formation not the players that is being ridiculed.

It hasn't worked for us, Bruce has said as much himself, but that doesn't mean that trying it was a crazy, off the wall, aberrant experiment.

Just about everybody could see that it was doomedd to failure before kick off.  No decent wing backs and therefore no balls into the box for the forward players.  Comparing it to Chelsea is utterly irrelevant.  It was a terrible decision, and got what it deserved, ie nowt.  Your post is like saying "now I know that putting my hand in the oven when it's on is going to hurt, I won't be stupid enough to do it again".  It was a dreadful deciion from a bloke who has sadly lost the plot.

The post was nothing of the sort, it was just a response to people condemning the formation when it was the performance that was the problem. Would Kodjia have learned how to link with others just because there were no wing backs, for instance? We had more possession and many more attempts on goal but didn't make anything of them. That is down to the players themselves.

[Chinchilla Bathhouse]

I really don't know why people are so worried about what the media or anyone else will think of us if we sack another manager

we are lying 16th in the championship with no hope of even a play of place, playing the worst football known to man after spending the most money that's ever been spent in this league

and people are worried that sacking another useless manager will make us look like a laughing stock !

But perceptions are important. My worry is that sacking another manager makes us look like a basket case with a trigger-happy chairman, and I can't see that being remotely attractive to any top class manager.

yeah let's send out the right perceptions and people might not notice the shit football and the team boshing about in the lower reaches of the championship

Whereas we sack another one and people notice the shit football and the team boshing about in the lower reaches of the championship and they say I'm not bloody surprised if they're going to sack their manager every five minutes. And, as I said, that would be the perception of potential candidates too, and that's the worry. Who on earth, of any great quality, is going to leave a decent job and a stable club to come here if it looks like they'll be clearing their desk in weeks if they don't get it right immediately?

[themossman]

Point for me is that 3 at the back is not terrible in and of itself but when combined with Bruce's transfer dealings and player picks he starts to look clueless. If this was his grand plan then he needed, as a bare minimum, to replace elphick and probably buy more CB cover.  If we get the players successfully settled in this formation (unlikely) what happens when Baker has one of his inevitable injured for 2 out of 3 games periods?