This is the season...

[curiousorange]

I don't buy this rift thing. It wasn't like we sold our best players because we wanted Gana, Ayew et al. We bought them because we had to replace our two best players whose release clauses had been met. It's hard to imagine Grealish's puggy face over Sherwood splitting a dressing room over geographic lines.

[myf]

Long term, Remi Garde may work (if he's given the time and he's good enough) and his record at Lyon is really impressive but it's the wrong man at the wrong time for me.

So who (available) would you have gone for?

What does 'available' even mean?  A club of our stature shouldn't just be fishing around for the unemployed and/or unemployable.  I'd have put a significant amount of effort in to getting Moyes - the club may have done so but we'll never know.

Failing that I'd have spoken to Rodgers.  Given the mess that our club appears to be behind the scenes I'd have even considered the likes of Alan Pardew or Mark Hughes.

As it is we've gone with yet another massive gamble.  If you keep gambling eventually you're going to lose.

Why would Rodgers,  pardew or hughes consider us? We're too much of a risk for them. We're cut adrift at the bottom of the league if you havent noticed

Behave.  Pardew joined Palace when they were in the relegation zone, Hughes is at Stoke, and Rodgers is out of a job.  I'd say all three would quite happily have taken the £2m a year salary (assuming we still pay the same as TSM got).

Id say bollocks. Pardew was only too happy to get out of toon to go back to his old club. Stoke are a well run club and Rodgers still has some credibility but wouldn't risk it here.

We may be a big club but we're no longer attractive to decent managers or players.

[Toronto Villa]

Long term, Remi Garde may work (if he's given the time and he's good enough) and his record at Lyon is really impressive but it's the wrong man at the wrong time for me.

So who (available) would you have gone for?

What does 'available' even mean?  A club of our stature shouldn't just be fishing around for the unemployed and/or unemployable.  I'd have put a significant amount of effort in to getting Moyes - the club may have done so but we'll never know.

Failing that I'd have spoken to Rodgers.  Given the mess that our club appears to be behind the scenes I'd have even considered the likes of Alan Pardew or Mark Hughes.

As it is we've gone with yet another massive gamble.  If you keep gambling eventually you're going to lose.

Why would Rodgers,  pardew or hughes consider us? We're too much of a risk for them. We're cut adrift at the bottom of the league if you havent noticed

Behave.  Pardew joined Palace when they were in the relegation zone, Hughes is at Stoke, and Rodgers is out of a job.  I'd say all three would quite happily have taken the £2m a year salary (assuming we still pay the same as TSM got).

Id say bollocks. Pardew was only too happy to get out of toon to go back to his old club. Stoke are a well run club and Rodgers still has some credibility but wouldn't risk it here.

We may be a big club but we're no longer attractive to decent managers or players.

Sorry that's nonsense. The game is littered with players/managers going to clubs outside the established elite in every era. Much of it is opportunity and some down to who will pay the most. Just because we are not doing as well we could be today doesn't mean that we are no longer a PL club who is willing to pay good/very good transfer fees/salaries. We made McLeish a very rich man and we have paid some good sized transfer fees and paid some astonishing salaries even in the austerity period. The question has always been has it been a good return on investment and certainly over the past 4/5 years in many cases it clearly hasn't.

[ChicagoLion]

Richardson, Gabby, Guzan Bacuna Westwood Clark Hutton sanchez Lescott Gestede are Championship level at best.
Then you have Ayew Gana Vertout Grealish that have potential but still lack the ability to play at this level consistantly.
i think that leaves Richards Gil and Okore from the first team that are good enough, that is the size of the problem.

[Ads]

How are you able to qualify those comments? That those players cannot play consistently at this level, when they're not even gone the opportunity to play at this level. Ayew has picked up the pace of the league and looks dangerous. He played well against Swansea, yet was dropped.

Veretout hasn't started a game since August as he was the subject of dim Tim's anger.

Amavi can put a cross onto a sixpence and has electric pace, yet he doesn't feature at full back because he might drop the odd mistake. And Richardson, who drops as many if not more, plays and offers nothing going forwards.

Gana is our best midfielder. He looks better than Delph, as he can actually control the ball while running with it, yet because dim Tim had him isolated in a two against Swansea and an error ensued, he doesn't feature.

Keep picking the shit that we are and we will drop, no mistake.

[Dave]

Richardson, Gabby, Guzan Bacuna Westwood Clark Hutton sanchez Lescott Gestede are Championship level at best.
Then you have Ayew Gana Vertout Grealish that have potential but still lack the ability to play at this level consistantly.
i think that leaves Richards Gil and Okore from the first team that are good enough, that is the size of the problem.

So why on another thread are you saying that team selection has nothing to do with the problem it when five of the seven people that you think might be good enough were left out yesterday for seemingly no reason, and nine of the ten that you think aren't good enough all started?

[ChicagoLion]

How are you able to qualify those comments? That those players cannot play consistently at this level, when they're not even gone the opportunity to play at this level. Ayew has picked up the pace of the league and looks dangerous. He played well against Swansea, yet was dropped.

Veretout hasn't started a game since August as he was the subject of dim Tim's anger.

Amavi can put a cross onto a sixpence and has electric pace, yet he doesn't feature at full back because he might drop the odd mistake. And Richardson, who drops as many if not more, plays and offers nothing going forwards.

Gana is our best midfielder. He looks better than Delph, as he can actually control the ball while running with it, yet because dim Tim had him isolated in a two against Swansea and an error ensued, he doesn't feature.

Keep picking the shit that we are and we will drop, no mistake.

Amavi cant defend, Gana goes walkabout Ayew keeps getting caught in posession.
We can keep  believing these players are better than they are, our league position and induividual performances tell you the truth.

[NeilH]

I have heard a few times on here of late that we once more need to spend big on a striker in January, but given our plight and the seemingly hopeless task that Garde has on his hands you really do have to wonder if to spend any more would be to throw more money at an unsolvable problem. We were incapable of even doing the basics right last night and whatever is said of the lineup, there was enough experience in the first 11 to at least be able to organize themselves. It was once said to me that one of the biggest problems at Villa is that players who play for us know that they can eke out a good career without really raising their game above cruising speed; it’s a nice living for non-ambitious Premiership footballers. The culture is so ingrained at the club that I wonder if only a seismic event will remove it, like relegation for instance. So I ask myself if Fox (let’s not even pretend Lerner cares) has already worked out the risk and is planning for a relegation scenario and an opportunity to move on a large chunk of our team, who are happy to cruise along. If this indeed the case, there is no way in hell we will spend any money in January and as long as we don’t emulate Derby’s infamous low points total, Garde will be the man who will rebuild the club next season from the Championship.

[ChicagoLion]

Richardson, Gabby, Guzan Bacuna Westwood Clark Hutton sanchez Lescott Gestede are Championship level at best.
Then you have Ayew Gana Vertout Grealish that have potential but still lack the ability to play at this level consistantly.
i think that leaves Richards Gil and Okore from the first team that are good enough, that is the size of the problem.

So why on another thread are you saying that team selection has nothing to do with the problem it when five of the seven people that you think might be good enough were left out yesterday for seemingly no reason, and nine of the ten that you think aren't good enough all started?

I am pretty sure that most people would agree on the best 11 or be close to it. We dont see the players train or thier attitude around the club.Even with our best 11 out there we still have a poor goalkeeper and no goal scorer no defensive midfielder and fullbacks with limitations.

[Ads]

How are you able to qualify those comments? That those players cannot play consistently at this level, when they're not even gone the opportunity to play at this level. Ayew has picked up the pace of the league and looks dangerous. He played well against Swansea, yet was dropped.

Veretout hasn't started a game since August as he was the subject of dim Tim's anger.

Amavi can put a cross onto a sixpence and has electric pace, yet he doesn't feature at full back because he might drop the odd mistake. And Richardson, who drops as many if not more, plays and offers nothing going forwards.

Gana is our best midfielder. He looks better than Delph, as he can actually control the ball while running with it, yet because dim Tim had him isolated in a two against Swansea and an error ensued, he doesn't feature.

Keep picking the shit that we are and we will drop, no mistake.

Amavi cant defend, Gana goes walkabout Ayew keeps getting caught in posession.
We can keep  believing these players are better than they are, our league position and induividual performances tell you the truth.

Are we blaming Gana for being one of two men up against three Swansea players? So if Gana doesn't get drawn into space, there is still a numerical overlap. He is easily our best midfielder, but hasn't been played with any consistency.

Ayew looks dangerous. He loses the ball on occasions because we struggle to get anybody within 10 yards of him. Gil comes on, our best player, and lo and behold, we up the tempo and look a lot better, with Ayew being a whisker away from a brace.

Amavi's second half concentration wains, but he's young and on balance, all the excellent things he can offer going forwards far outweighs the negatives and he's streets ahead of Richardson.

These four players are better than what is on offer at Bournemouth, Norwich, Sunderland and Newcastle, yet, they're in and out of the side and are not allowed to build on their good work.

The chopping and changing of Ayew in particular is baffling. Play well against the Noses, out for Liverpool. Don't see him again until Swansea, out for Southampton.

[bob]

https://twitter.com/jalapic/status/661406436384219136

[Clampy]

Richardson, Gabby, Guzan Bacuna Westwood Clark Hutton sanchez Lescott Gestede are Championship level at best.
Then you have Ayew Gana Vertout Grealish that have potential but still lack the ability to play at this level consistantly.
i think that leaves Richards Gil and Okore from the first team that are good enough, that is the size of the problem.

How many times have you seen Veretout, Gana and Ayew to come to that conclusion?

[Vegas]

I have heard a few times on here of late that we once more need to spend big on a striker in January, but given our plight and the seemingly hopeless task that Garde has on his hands you really do have to wonder if to spend any more would be to throw more money at an unsolvable problem. We were incapable of even doing the basics right last night and whatever is said of the lineup, there was enough experience in the first 11 to at least be able to organize themselves. It was once said to me that one of the biggest problems at Villa is that players who play for us know that they can eke out a good career without really raising their game above cruising speed; it’s a nice living for non-ambitious Premiership footballers. The culture is so ingrained at the club that I wonder if only a seismic event will remove it, like relegation for instance. So I ask myself if Fox (let’s not even pretend Lerner cares) has already worked out the risk and is planning for a relegation scenario and an opportunity to move on a large chunk of our team, who are happy to cruise along. If this indeed the case, there is no way in hell we will spend any money in January and as long as we don’t emulate Derby’s infamous low points total, Garde will be the man who will rebuild the club next season from the Championship.

For pity's sake man, we're 4 points adrift with 23 games remaining, and a new manager at the helm.

[class-of-82]

Hear hear Vegas
How many more posts am I going to read about us being doomed. these players just need the right formation and coaching, there has been glimpses of this all season.
Just look at dembele and Erick lamela for Spurs before the argy came in they wasn't best below average lamela was lucky for a place on the bench but with different tactics and coaching there totally different players.
Also we are in a mini survival league with Sunderland Newcastle Norwich Watford bournemouth and who ever gets sucked in. We are a few points off safety.

New manager new training new tactics = new villa

[bobdylan]

Richardson, Gabby, Guzan Bacuna Westwood Clark Hutton sanchez Lescott Gestede are Championship level at best.
Then you have Ayew Gana Vertout Grealish that have potential but still lack the ability to play at this level consistantly.
i think that leaves Richards Gil and Okore from the first team that are good enough, that is the size of the problem.

Okore's not good enough for me, makes basic errors and is poor on the ball.  Perhaps Adama and Illori will be good enough, we've not seen enough to judge yet.  I wouldn't rule out Kozak still having a part to play either.  I'd add Gardner, Crespo, Bunn and N'Zogbia to the first group however.