Whose to blame for Comical Lambert ?

[Monty]

Agreed KT. I was listening to the Guardian podcast today, and there was a feeling of great sympathy with us, and even surprise that we weren't more vocal about how immiserating it must be to watch the Villa at the moment. We need have no cringe about this as regards the 'F' word.

[NeilH]

When it comes down to it, our history since O’Neill grabbed his Action Man from the pram and flounced out of Villa Park, is seen as a litany of poor decision making. If Lerner or anyone else making the decisions at the club is guilty of anything, it will be in their decision-making process. However, if we look objectively at the facts since O’Neill went, I do have a certain amount of sympathy though with Lerner and co.
Houllier – Came with a fantastic CV and a reputation at Liverpool that was based on talent spotting and developing youth. His career had been curtailed by illness and he was anxious to get back into management. He seemed to tick all the boxes for us and no doubt seemed a good fit for Lerner, who was anxious to turn the tide quickly on the excesses of O’Neill that had nearly bankrupted us.
McLeish – Putting aside the obvious employer, the fact is that he had just won them a trophy and landed them their highest league finish in eons. It strikes me that when they were going through this managerial hiring process, they had been struggling with a shortlist and decided to enlist the wizened opinion of the most successful manager of our generation. It still seems an insane appointment, but looking at it purely objectionably, they were clearly trying to utilize expert judgment and best practice to the process.
Lambert – Despite his record now, the simple fact is that he came with an impressive CV and had been schooled in the Dortmund model. His appointment was universally welcomed here and his appointment was seen as the right step for us.
I cannot help wonder if the Lerner and co have been so burnt by the appointment process since O’Neill and how they have panned out, that they have been simply frozen into inaction. Put yourself in their position, they are painted as fools and idiots on here, but I genuinely believe that they did try to apply the right decision-making process into this and had any of the three aforementioned managers shown the potential, it would be a different debate.
I, like many others, loved Lambert’s appointment, am bitterly disappointed that he cannot show his potential and am worried that those running our club would not get it right once more; were he to be removed. Maybe they are just bloody unlucky, but should he go, I really worry that what would follow would be nowhere near our expectations.

[Mouse Potato]

A cheese sandwich in charge would struggle to do any worse!

[Damo70]

When it comes down to it, our history since O’Neill grabbed his Action Man from the pram and flounced out of Villa Park, is seen as a litany of poor decision making. If Lerner or anyone else making the decisions at the club is guilty of anything, it will be in their decision-making process. However, if we look objectively at the facts since O’Neill went, I do have a certain amount of sympathy though with Lerner and co.
Houllier – Came with a fantastic CV and a reputation at Liverpool that was based on talent spotting and developing youth. His career had been curtailed by illness and he was anxious to get back into management. He seemed to tick all the boxes for us and no doubt seemed a good fit for Lerner, who was anxious to turn the tide quickly on the excesses of O’Neill that had nearly bankrupted us.
McLeish – Putting aside the obvious employer, the fact is that he had just won them a trophy and landed them their highest league finish in eons. It strikes me that when they were going through this managerial hiring process, they had been struggling with a shortlist and decided to enlist the wizened opinion of the most successful manager of our generation. It still seems an insane appointment, but looking at it purely objectionably, they were clearly trying to utilize expert judgment and best practice to the process.
Lambert – Despite his record now, the simple fact is that he came with an impressive CV and had been schooled in the Dortmund model. His appointment was universally welcomed here and his appointment was seen as the right step for us.
I cannot help wonder if the Lerner and co have been so burnt by the appointment process since O’Neill and how they have panned out, that they have been simply frozen into inaction. Put yourself in their position, they are painted as fools and idiots on here, but I genuinely believe that they did try to apply the right decision-making process into this and had any of the three aforementioned managers shown the potential, it would be a different debate.
I, like many others, loved Lambert’s appointment, am bitterly disappointed that he cannot show his potential and am worried that those running our club would not get it right once more; were he to be removed. Maybe they are just bloody unlucky, but should he go, I really worry that what would follow would be nowhere near our expectations.

The other side of the story being that we appointed a man with a history of serious illness who had been out of club management for a while, followed by a man who had relegated our neighbours twice in three seasons, followed by a man who had one seasons top flight experience.

[mr underhill]

yes, expressed that way you could summarise the last few years decision making as Dumb, Dumb and Dumber

[aj2k77]

I don't buy in to the Lambert having Dortmund philosophies and models that he's picked up and uses. He spent 12 months their and played less than 50 games, that's it. It wasn't a lifes work of study he did, he played one season and fuck all he's shown me suggests he's picked up any kind of mentality from that time.

[ktvillan]

NeilH I understand where you are coming from but whilst I think trying Houllier was risky but not without merit, the McLeish appointment was pure insanity on every level.   As for Lambert, you cant really argue too much with appointing him as he looked one of the most promising young managers around - that's not saying too much as the general standard of management and coaching in this country looks pretty poor to me.  The problem with Lambert is that they either won't admit or realise that it hasn't worked, and is probably never going to work, and he should be booted out.   

That said, from Lerner's point of view, it probably has worked and is working, in that he has set the bar so low that Lambert is meeting  requirements.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

It's not working for Randy though, kt. Everything about Lambert makes it so much harder to find a buyer. Apart from the lack of entertainment, points, best players leaving for nothing, declining attendances, nobody will even look at us until they know what division we'll be playing in next season.

[remy]

I was pleased too when Lambert was appointed. I genuinely wanted him to succeed with the young and hungry plan.

The pastings we took in that first season was a "learning curve" for the players I took it as. Lowton, Westwood, Weimann all showed tremendous promise after that first year for us to kick on in the second. All 3 thought they have "made it" and havent reached nowhere near the heights of that year.

2nd season my patience was running out with some appalling performances before a look-thru-my-fingers at a close call relegation survival.

3rd season he's still here despite record after record of atrocious football and attitude from the players.

Here we are - January and everybody wants us to go down because of how shit we are.

I want Lambert and Lerner gone - and my club back.

We hear a lot about this "wanting our club back". What does it mean and how do you think it's going to happen?

Wanting our club back - my definition - a manager motivating and coaching players representing Aston Villa Football Club to play attacking, flowing, exciting football.

Players playing for the club feeling honoured and privileged to wear the shirt, putting in a shift.

Current custodian of the club to actually take notice of the fans and be present so we have a feeling of leadership.

Paying £38 through nose knowing I will be entertained not depressed and ripped off.

We will get our club back once comical lambert is relieved of his spoof managerial act and our absent owner whose name now escapes me relinquishes control after his misguided foray into soccerball.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

Wanting our club back - my definition - a manager motivating and coaching players representing Aston Villa Football Club to play attacking, flowing, exciting football.

But we haven't had that for over 15 years.

[dave.woodhall]

I was pleased too when Lambert was appointed. I genuinely wanted him to succeed with the young and hungry plan.

The pastings we took in that first season was a "learning curve" for the players I took it as. Lowton, Westwood, Weimann all showed tremendous promise after that first year for us to kick on in the second. All 3 thought they have "made it" and havent reached nowhere near the heights of that year.

2nd season my patience was running out with some appalling performances before a look-thru-my-fingers at a close call relegation survival.

3rd season he's still here despite record after record of atrocious football and attitude from the players.

Here we are - January and everybody wants us to go down because of how shit we are.

I want Lambert and Lerner gone - and my club back.

We hear a lot about this "wanting our club back". What does it mean and how do you think it's going to happen?

Wanting our club back - my definition - a manager motivating and coaching players representing Aston Villa Football Club to play attacking, flowing, exciting football.

Players playing for the club feeling honoured and privileged to wear the shirt, putting in a shift.

Current custodian of the club to actually take notice of the fans and be present so we have a feeling of leadership.

Paying £38 through nose knowing I will be entertained not depressed and ripped off.

We will get our club back once comical lambert is relieved of his spoof managerial act and our absent owner whose name now escapes me relinquishes control after his misguided foray into soccerball.

So you want the same as every supporter of every club everywhere and you think it's going to happen by magic.

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

I think you really know what remy means Dave.
A sense that we are doing something positive and that the owner, manager, players, fans are united in a desire to make happen.
We saw something of that towards the end of Lambert's first season and we looked forward to something resembling steady progress with the promising younger, hungry, and overseas players that Lambert had brought in. I don't think any of us expected that we would be runaway winners of the PL but we would at least give a good account of ourselves with those new players making progress individually and collectively. It didn't happen and it still isn't happening.
Some personnel and "tactics" have changed - performances and results haven't.
4 games against teams below us - which we all believed would have resulted in points gained (implied by the manager) - have resulted in no wins, 2 0-0 draws, 2 losses, no goals and a total of 2 points.  " 2 points from a possible 12. In anybody's terms, way below what every supporter of every club wants: just a reasonable level of performance from a reasonable level of ability - Lambert's and the players'.
But we are not getting it.
Lambert isn't using his players in a way to achieve it.
And we can all see it.
It's bordering on the insulting.
"This is what I do. It doesn't work. We'll carry on doing the same until it somehow miraculously works."
The press seem to have suddenly cottoned on to the fact that all is not rosy in Lambert's garden and that it might have something to do with Lambert.
Last week he had a bit of a go at fans...who, you must agree, have been incredibly patient at times when they don't know which way to look for some kind of confidence or leadership. (What must the players be thinking?).
Like all of us, remy wants to see some sense of hope, of purpose and intent on the pitch to genuinely get our club out of the situation it finds itself in. (That Lambert has got us into?). And that we can all buy in to, embrace and support.
All fans, of all clubs, will want something similar.
For some it won't be enough.
For some it will be expected, regardless.
For us, I think it's become something we dream of.   
   

[remy]

I was pleased too when Lambert was appointed. I genuinely wanted him to succeed with the young and hungry plan.

The pastings we took in that first season was a "learning curve" for the players I took it as. Lowton, Westwood, Weimann all showed tremendous promise after that first year for us to kick on in the second. All 3 thought they have "made it" and havent reached nowhere near the heights of that year.

2nd season my patience was running out with some appalling performances before a look-thru-my-fingers at a close call relegation survival.

3rd season he's still here despite record after record of atrocious football and attitude from the players.

Here we are - January and everybody wants us to go down because of how shit we are.

I want Lambert and Lerner gone - and my club back.

We hear a lot about this "wanting our club back". What does it mean and how do you think it's going to happen?

Wanting our club back - my definition - a manager motivating and coaching players representing Aston Villa Football Club to play attacking, flowing, exciting football.

Players playing for the club feeling honoured and privileged to wear the shirt, putting in a shift.

Current custodian of the club to actually take notice of the fans and be present so we have a feeling of leadership.

Paying £38 through nose knowing I will be entertained not depressed and ripped off.

We will get our club back once comical lambert is relieved of his spoof managerial act and our absent owner whose name now escapes me relinquishes control after his misguided foray into soccerball.

So you want the same as every supporter of every club everywhere and you think it's going to happen by magic.

Not by magic but by a turn of events that begins with a change of manager. I've only supported Villa since 1987/1988 season and since that time I cannot remember a manager who has been as bad as comical and surviving so long. Also the management to allow us to be crap for so long.

I had to wait 20 years for my kids to be born so I could take them down the match and make it a family affair, it breaks my heart that they don't want to go anymore.

All because of bad decision after bad decision that pummels away at AVFC.

[dave.woodhall]

Not by magic but by a turn of events that begins with a change of manager. I've only supported Villa since 1987/1988 season and since that time I cannot remember a manager who has been as bad as comical and surviving so long. Also the management to allow us to be crap for so long.

I had to wait 20 years for my kids to be born so I could take them down the match and make it a family affair, it breaks my heart that they don't want to go anymore.

All because of bad decision after bad decision that pummels away at AVFC.

I'll repeat what I said before. You want what every supporter wants - a successful team. This modern cliche of "We want our *insert name here* back" is just a glib phrase that means nothing except to purvey some vague inclining of entitlement. 

[frankmosswasmyuncle]

Fans feel a sense of "ownership" regardless of the nuts and bolts of owning/limited companies etc.

Contexts count. I think Most Villa fans would be very happy with some sense of stability at the moment and hope that a team that includes Guzan, our solid defence this season, Sanchez, Delph, Agbonlahor, and Benteke could do better than 15th.
I doubt that equals "a successful team" in most fans' views.

It's glib out of context.