Philippe Senderos

[not3bad]

Swiss Phil - which is a great nickname, has a ring to it

The Arsenal fans did actually call him Swiss Tony. 

[brian green]

Or perhaps Swiss Philly. The juxtaposition of two cheeses would have a certain serendipity.

[RussellC]

I agree that we can't keep chancing it, it's simply not good enough for Aston Villa, but I also think some folks underestimate just how shit and inept you have to be to go down.

No-one's underestimating it, I just think the realists amongst us realise how close we to being that "shot and inept". Worth remembering that Fulham - one of those very sides - took 6 points of us last season.  It's also worth remembering that we're embarking on a period of reduced spending and cost-cutting at a time when, in general, Premiership Clubs have more income than ever before.

[dave.woodhall]

I agree that we can't keep chancing it, it's simply not good enough for Aston Villa, but I also think some folks underestimate just how shit and inept you have to be to go down.

No-one's underestimating it, I just think the realists amongst us realise how close we to being that "shot and inept". Worth remembering that Fulham - one of those very sides - took 6 points of us last season.  It's also worth remembering that we're embarking on a period of reduced spending and cost-cutting at a time when, in general, Premiership Clubs have more income than ever before.

If what you say, and presumably only what you say, is being a realist, what's your opinion of anyone who disagrees?

[Surrey Villain]

Or perhaps Swiss Philly. The juxtaposition of two cheeses would have a certain serendipity.

More likely Swiss Roll because our defence will be rolled over with him in it!

[Chris Jameson]

Last year I don't think there was a single person on here who predicted Hull and Palace would stay up, our luck will run out eventually.

How is it lucky to be better than the teams you finish above, and what has that got to do with two teams doing better than expected last season?

Sorry. If Villa continue as they are, I think one of these seasons Aston Villa will be bad enough to get relegated because they are one of the three worst teams in the league. Luck, as we all know, never comes into it where sport and football in particular are concerned. Villa have the foresight to ensure they aren't quite as bad as the few teams that finish below them through judgement rather than any form of luck.

[Chico Hamilton III]

Or perhaps Swiss Philly. The juxtaposition of two cheeses would have a certain serendipity.

More likely Swiss Roll because our defence will be rolled over with him in it!

Our defence reminds me of Swiss cheese. Full of holes.

C'mere, there's more.....

[Surrey Villain]

Or perhaps Swiss Philly. The juxtaposition of two cheeses would have a certain serendipity.

More likely Swiss Roll because our defence will be rolled over with him in it!

Our defence reminds me of Swiss cheese. Full of holes.

C'mere, there's more.....

Oh dear, I'll get my wellies!

[KevinGage]

Last year I don't think there was a single person on here who predicted Hull and Palace would stay up, our luck will run out eventually.

How is it lucky to be better than the teams you finish above, and what has that got to do with two teams doing better than expected last season?

Sorry. If Villa continue as they are, I think one of these seasons Aston Villa will be bad enough to get relegated because they are one of the three worst teams in the league. Luck, as we all know, never comes into it where sport and football in particular are concerned. Villa have the foresight to ensure they aren't quite as bad as the few teams that finish below them through judgement rather than any form of luck.

Agree with the first part, not so much the latter.

I don't think it has been judgement at the top that has ensured survival, and there is a certain level of naivety/ ineptness at the top that almost deserves relegation. 

Usually at the end of the season you can look back at games you were unfortunate in, and make a case for a higher league placing.  Even the start of this dreadful era under Houllier:  If we had held on to the lead in even half the games that we were winning by the 80 minute mark that season, we'd have been 6th again (possibly even higher).

Apart from the Everton game at home and (possibly) Chelsea away, I don't recall too many games that we were unlucky in last season. On the contrary, we scratched out quite a few wins against the run of play. 

[dave.woodhall]

Last year I don't think there was a single person on here who predicted Hull and Palace would stay up, our luck will run out eventually.

How is it lucky to be better than the teams you finish above, and what has that got to do with two teams doing better than expected last season?

Sorry. If Villa continue as they are, I think one of these seasons Aston Villa will be bad enough to get relegated because they are one of the three worst teams in the league. Luck, as we all know, never comes into it where sport and football in particular are concerned. Villa have the foresight to ensure they aren't quite as bad as the few teams that finish below them through judgement rather than any form of luck.

Agree with the first part, not so much the latter.

I don't think it has been judgement at the top that has ensured survival, and there is a certain level of naivety/ ineptness at the top that almost deserves relegation. 

Usually at the end of the season you can look back at games you were unfortunate in, and make a case for a higher league placing.  Even the start of this dreadful era under Houllier:  If we had held on to the lead in even half the games that we were winning by the 80 minute mark that season, we'd have been 6th again (possibly even higher).

Apart from the Everton game at home and (possibly) Chelsea away, I don't recall too many games that we were unlucky in last season. On the contrary, we scratched out quite a few wins against the run of play. 

Which when you're at the top is the sign of a good team.

[KevinGage]

If it's during a period of under par/poor form, maybe. 

When that poor form goes on for the majority of the season it becomes harder to ignore. 

[fbriai]

Last year I don't think there was a single person on here who predicted Hull and Palace would stay up, our luck will run out eventually.

How is it lucky to be better than the teams you finish above, and what has that got to do with two teams doing better than expected last season?

Sorry. If Villa continue as they are, I think one of these seasons Aston Villa will be bad enough to get relegated because they are one of the three worst teams in the league. Luck, as we all know, never comes into it where sport and football in particular are concerned. Villa have the foresight to ensure they aren't quite as bad as the few teams that finish below them through judgement rather than any form of luck.

Agree with the first part, not so much the latter.

I don't think it has been judgement at the top that has ensured survival, and there is a certain level of naivety/ ineptness at the top that almost deserves relegation. 

Usually at the end of the season you can look back at games you were unfortunate in, and make a case for a higher league placing.  Even the start of this dreadful era under Houllier:  If we had held on to the lead in even half the games that we were winning by the 80 minute mark that season, we'd have been 6th again (possibly even higher).

Apart from the Everton game at home and (possibly) Chelsea away, I don't recall too many games that we were unlucky in last season. On the contrary, we scratched out quite a few wins against the run of play. 

Which when you're at the top is the sign of a good team.

My concern is that you can only spend so many seasons down there before you eventually get dragged in. You can only go to the well so many times.

[dave.woodhall]

If it's during a period of under par/poor form, maybe. 

When that poor form goes on for the majority of the season it becomes harder to ignore. 

That's a fair point, but it does show how perception plays a large part. Just for one small example, you could say that we were unlucky to lose to stoppage-time goals against Palace and Newcastle, and that diabolical refereeing cost us at Liverpool and Chelsea. That's arguably five extra points which would have seen us safe with a dozen games to go. 

[paul_e]

There's no  possibly about the Chelsea game for me, we were screwed over by 2 really poor decisions in that game.

I think there's a fair few games where we can probably consider ourselves a tad unlucky, the Palace game around Christmas for example, did anyone really expect a finish like that so late in the game.  It was a quality goal but you have to admit that game had 0-0 written all over it.  There's a few others that are similar.

[Monty]

There's a difference between finding a way to win even when you play badly and only winning by luck because you always play badly. Last season had quite a bit too much of the latter, although we had quite a bit of bad luck as well (especially against the Sky teams).