The Takeover Thread - Recon Group - NOW WITH NEW POLL

[Ian.]

Thanks Godzvilla. I'm still in the pro camp, it's all a bit sketchy so any positive news is welcomed.

[john e]

The problem is all the negatives are based on rumour or are demonstrably false.

The doctorate thing seems to be a rumour based on very little.
The bird's nest thing, as has been said, was probably due to the oylmpic forest and something got misunderstood.
The 1 company not 5 is wrong and I have no idea why it's not been challenged - teamax are a recon company and are registered, lotus are a recon company and are registered, so the 1 company thing is clearly wrong.  It seems to have come from someone calling recon and speaking to an employee but with no info on who they are why does it become gospel and without knowing the actual questions that were asked.

To me it seems that there's a bit of a 'hole' in the info available about him and the internet has filled it with scare stories and rumours and they've been escalated to fact with far less scrutiny than is being suggested for Xia to face.

I remember a poster (can't remember who) defending Lance Armstrong in the cycling thread for his bitter life,
his case was fantastic he argued to and throw he countered anything and everything that was thrown against him with evidence to the contrary
you could only admire his tenacity and I respected him for it, obviously in the end he realised he'd been duped,

This post reminds me of him
I have no problem with people arguing to brush everything they don't like under the carpet, we all want things to go right we all want the new owners to deliver on what they have said

Unfortunately like Lance he had told fibs, just saying they don't matter is not good enough they are untruths
he had embellished his position and is being found out
I have called him nasty names in previous posts as you well know, I won't do that again right now but I don't trust him at all or anything he is saying because if you deceive once you will do it again and that is what we are up against and worried about

[paul_e]

The problem is all the negatives are based on rumour or are demonstrably false.

The doctorate thing seems to be a rumour based on very little.
The bird's nest thing, as has been said, was probably due to the oylmpic forest and something got misunderstood.
The 1 company not 5 is wrong and I have no idea why it's not been challenged - teamax are a recon company and are registered, lotus are a recon company and are registered, so the 1 company thing is clearly wrong.  It seems to have come from someone calling recon and speaking to an employee but with no info on who they are why does it become gospel and without knowing the actual questions that were asked.

To me it seems that there's a bit of a 'hole' in the info available about him and the internet has filled it with scare stories and rumours and they've been escalated to fact with far less scrutiny than is being suggested for Xia to face.

I remember a poster (can't remember who) defending Lance Armstrong in the cycling thread for his bitter life,
his case was fantastic he argued to and throw he countered anything and everything that was thrown against him with evidence to the contrary
you could only admire his tenacity and I respected him for it, obviously in the end he realised he'd been duped,

This post reminds me of him
I have no problem with people arguing to brush everything they don't like under the carpet, we all want things to go right we all want the new owners to deliver on what they have said

Unfortunately like Lance he had told fibs, just saying they don't matter is not good enough they are untruths
he had embellished his position and is being found out
I have called him nasty names in previous posts as you well know, I won't do that again right now but I don't trust him at all or anything he is saying because if you deceive once you will do it again and that is what we are up against and worried about

List 1 lie that  has come directly from Xia, just one.

[Toronto Villa]

I don't think it matters that much in the slightest really.

so within 24 hours of the takeover being announced the club is lying about the business achievements of the potential new owner and that isnt concerning?

the 5 listed companies is another lie but dont worry it was probably lost in translation or something

two whopping lies within two days so what else has been lied about?

what next? the 35000 employed is really 3500 and was a typo

It only matters if you're looking for things to be continually angry about. Let's just see what happens eh?

not angry just amazed that people write off major bollock ups as just one of those things and of no concern

if you go for a job and say i worked on the major restructure of x company and i own 5 companies and i dont really what you still be happy to employ that person?

the lies have come from somewhere and begs the question about more lies and the persons integrity

It's not a case of writing it off, maybe some people are not getting their knickers in an almighty twist at this early stage. Some people might want to wait and see what develops. Just because you're stamping your feet, we don't all have to.

Exactly where I am. I accept there could be doubts. It's natural. But let's see what actually comes out of this. I've had some dealings within the Chinese community and by nature they keep themselves to themselves. That is they are just not as public with their business. I'd be stunned if this is all a massive hoax.

[aj2k77]

lol@ the comparison between Xia and possibly the biggest fraud sport has ever know (that's been found out that is)

[Jimbo]

This ´reasoning´ taken ( stolen ?) from Vital Football, has calmed my Recon fears , somewhat .  ...........Godzvilla!

Looks a good calming voice amongst some of the hysteria about the takeover taken from the Villa New Owner Thread:

McParlandTheGreat posted: 21/5/2016 14:03

Let's look at the facts. The Villa website put out a statement that Recon was a holdings company which has a controlling interest in 5 companies, interests in many more, which in total employ 35000 personnel in 75 countries. It appears that the controlling interest in 5 companies bit was wrong. A guess might be that the mistake was at the Villa end; the Chinese end was quick to correct it. It now appears that the controlling interest is in 1 company (it is of course possible and even likely that it has major interests in the other 4; the statement from the Chinese end that it is engaged in acquiring a controlling interest in another 4 companies tends to imply this)

There is a corrected statement on the Villa web site which reads:
Recon Group is a multinational conglomerate group led by Dr. Tony Jiantong Xia. The group holding company owns, directly and indirectly, the shares of several publicly listed companies on the Hong Kong and Chinese stock exchanges and many other private companies employing 35,000 people in 75 countries.

The mistake is a minor one. It doesn't matter a jot whether Recon owns majority interests in 0 or 100 companies. It is a holdings company; it is a vehicle for investments. What matters is whether or not it can put together the resources to buy Villa. It appears to have satisfied Hollis that it can. It now has to satisfy the leagues. If it can then Recon owns Villa. I have no problem with that.

The thing about holdings companies is that they tend not to just stick money in any old company. They have a strategy. They target certain markets for growth. They build up related investments. They invest over a period, not for the short term. At least the better ones do; from what I've read of Recon this is what Recon does. They're based in a country with huge opportunities in the medium and long term, and Recon is wired into that. If you look at what's been said about the plans for Villa, that approach ties in. I've seen it suggested that it if we aren't promoted at the end of this coming season Recon will pull out. I don't think Recon is that sort of company. It's about long term investment and profit, not about short term return. It has highly ambitious plans for Villa and the structure around it; in the scheme of things, a one season promotion is highly desirable, but nowhere near critical.

Early days. A lot more will become clear over the next two weeks and beyond. I hope we back it not knock it. Teams which aren't optimistic get nowhere on the field. Clubs and fans also need optimism.

Read more: http://www.astonvilla.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7520870#ixzz49JFA03hy

Yeah, but what about the shoes, the fucking shoes?

[oswald funkletrumpet]

I don't think it matters that much in the slightest really.

so within 24 hours of the takeover being announced the club is lying about the business achievements of the potential new owner and that isnt concerning?

the 5 listed companies is another lie but dont worry it was probably lost in translation or something

two whopping lies within two days so what else has been lied about?

what next? the 35000 employed is really 3500 and was a typo

It only matters if you're looking for things to be continually angry about. Let's just see what happens eh?

not angry just amazed that people write off major bollock ups as just one of those things and of no concern

if you go for a job and say i worked on the major restructure of x company and i own 5 companies and i dont really what you still be happy to employ that person?

the lies have come from somewhere and begs the question about more lies and the persons integrity

It's not a case of writing it off, maybe some people are not getting their knickers in an almighty twist at this early stage. Some people might want to wait and see what develops. Just because you're stamping your feet, we don't all have to.

stamping feet?

because someone dares to have an opinion you dont agree with?

have a look at the poll and you will see people have doubts. thats not having a hissy fit its basing your opinion on what is in front of you

the bloke isnt even a doctor but so what that doesnt matter either

[four fornicholl]

This ´reasoning´ taken ( stolen ?) from Vital Football, has calmed my Recon fears , somewhat .  ...........Godzvilla!

Looks a good calming voice amongst some of the hysteria about the takeover taken from the Villa New Owner Thread:

McParlandTheGreat posted: 21/5/2016 14:03

Let's look at the facts. The Villa website put out a statement that Recon was a holdings company which has a controlling interest in 5 companies, interests in many more, which in total employ 35000 personnel in 75 countries. It appears that the controlling interest in 5 companies bit was wrong. A guess might be that the mistake was at the Villa end; the Chinese end was quick to correct it. It now appears that the controlling interest is in 1 company (it is of course possible and even likely that it has major interests in the other 4; the statement from the Chinese end that it is engaged in acquiring a controlling interest in another 4 companies tends to imply this)

There is a corrected statement on the Villa web site which reads:
Recon Group is a multinational conglomerate group led by Dr. Tony Jiantong Xia. The group holding company owns, directly and indirectly, the shares of several publicly listed companies on the Hong Kong and Chinese stock exchanges and many other private companies employing 35,000 people in 75 countries.

The mistake is a minor one. It doesn't matter a jot whether Recon owns majority interests in 0 or 100 companies. It is a holdings company; it is a vehicle for investments. What matters is whether or not it can put together the resources to buy Villa. It appears to have satisfied Hollis that it can. It now has to satisfy the leagues. If it can then Recon owns Villa. I have no problem with that.

The thing about holdings companies is that they tend not to just stick money in any old company. They have a strategy. They target certain markets for growth. They build up related investments. They invest over a period, not for the short term. At least the better ones do; from what I've read of Recon this is what Recon does. They're based in a country with huge opportunities in the medium and long term, and Recon is wired into that. If you look at what's been said about the plans for Villa, that approach ties in. I've seen it suggested that it if we aren't promoted at the end of this coming season Recon will pull out. I don't think Recon is that sort of company. It's about long term investment and profit, not about short term return. It has highly ambitious plans for Villa and the structure around it; in the scheme of things, a one season promotion is highly desirable, but nowhere near critical.

Early days. A lot more will become clear over the next two weeks and beyond. I hope we back it not knock it. Teams which aren't optimistic get nowhere on the field. Clubs and fans also need optimism.

Read more: http://www.astonvilla.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7520870#ixzz49JFA03hy

Yeah, but what about the shoes, the fucking shoes?

Its a sign. Hes not the messiah hes a very naughty boy!

[PaulWinch again]

The site seems to be split into three groups at the moment. There are those who are hopeful that the lack of info and anamolies are a breakdown in communication rather than being indicative of anything worse. There are those who are concerned that the anamolies and lack of clarity mean that we have been sold down the river. I think the majority of the site fall into those two groups and quite possible flip flop between them. Then there's a small number who seem to have already fully made up their mind, based on what is pretty limited information, that Dr Tony is definitely a fraud and is going to destroy Villa. I can understand the feelings of the first two groups, but I don't see how those in the third can be so sure based on what we know.

[ciggiesnbeer]

This ´reasoning´ taken ( stolen ?) from Vital Football, has calmed my Recon fears , somewhat .  ...........Godzvilla!

Looks a good calming voice amongst some of the hysteria about the takeover taken from the Villa New Owner Thread:

McParlandTheGreat posted: 21/5/2016 14:03

Let's look at the facts. The Villa website put out a statement that Recon was a holdings company which has a controlling interest in 5 companies, interests in many more, which in total employ 35000 personnel in 75 countries. It appears that the controlling interest in 5 companies bit was wrong. A guess might be that the mistake was at the Villa end; the Chinese end was quick to correct it. It now appears that the controlling interest is in 1 company (it is of course possible and even likely that it has major interests in the other 4; the statement from the Chinese end that it is engaged in acquiring a controlling interest in another 4 companies tends to imply this)

There is a corrected statement on the Villa web site which reads:
Recon Group is a multinational conglomerate group led by Dr. Tony Jiantong Xia. The group holding company owns, directly and indirectly, the shares of several publicly listed companies on the Hong Kong and Chinese stock exchanges and many other private companies employing 35,000 people in 75 countries.

The mistake is a minor one. It doesn't matter a jot whether Recon owns majority interests in 0 or 100 companies. It is a holdings company; it is a vehicle for investments. What matters is whether or not it can put together the resources to buy Villa. It appears to have satisfied Hollis that it can. It now has to satisfy the leagues. If it can then Recon owns Villa. I have no problem with that.

The thing about holdings companies is that they tend not to just stick money in any old company. They have a strategy. They target certain markets for growth. They build up related investments. They invest over a period, not for the short term. At least the better ones do; from what I've read of Recon this is what Recon does. They're based in a country with huge opportunities in the medium and long term, and Recon is wired into that. If you look at what's been said about the plans for Villa, that approach ties in. I've seen it suggested that it if we aren't promoted at the end of this coming season Recon will pull out. I don't think Recon is that sort of company. It's about long term investment and profit, not about short term return. It has highly ambitious plans for Villa and the structure around it; in the scheme of things, a one season promotion is highly desirable, but nowhere near critical.

Early days. A lot more will become clear over the next two weeks and beyond. I hope we back it not knock it. Teams which aren't optimistic get nowhere on the field. Clubs and fans also need optimism.

Read more: http://www.astonvilla.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=7520870#ixzz49JFA03hy

Yeah, but what about the shoes, the fucking shoes?

If the shoe is lifty, the man is shifty.

 

[Clampy]

I don't think it matters that much in the slightest really.

so within 24 hours of the takeover being announced the club is lying about the business achievements of the potential new owner and that isnt concerning?

the 5 listed companies is another lie but dont worry it was probably lost in translation or something

two whopping lies within two days so what else has been lied about?

what next? the 35000 employed is really 3500 and was a typo

It only matters if you're looking for things to be continually angry about. Let's just see what happens eh?

not angry just amazed that people write off major bollock ups as just one of those things and of no concern

if you go for a job and say i worked on the major restructure of x company and i own 5 companies and i dont really what you still be happy to employ that person?

the lies have come from somewhere and begs the question about more lies and the persons integrity

It's not a case of writing it off, maybe some people are not getting their knickers in an almighty twist at this early stage. Some people might want to wait and see what develops. Just because you're stamping your feet, we don't all have to.

stamping feet?

because someone dares to have an opinion you dont agree with?

have a look at the poll and you will see people have doubts. thats not having a hissy fit its basing your opinion on what is in front of you

the bloke isnt even a doctor but so what that doesnt matter either

You can have whatever opinion you like and i'm allowed to wait and see what happens or 'writing it off' if you prefer.

[Rudy Can't Fail]

List 1 lie that  has come directly from Xia, just one.

Considering it was probably the most important announcement from the Club since 2006, the release would no doubt have been approved by both sides, it's very strange that the legal for Xia and Lerner never spotted the mistakes until they were brought to their attention by fans and the press.

Only time will tell if there are 'lies' on there but it's more than worrying that there were bloody errors. Whilst Lerner can say what he wants as his part is not a listed company, I'd assume that Xia doesn't have that comfort.

[oldhill_avfc]

If there was any tangible evidence he had the money to deliver what his words say, i would give him a chance.

Agreed.

He's going to have to borrow to fund his plan, most likely from the same source he got the down payment from (samuelson?).

The debt will then be undoubtedly be loaded onto the balance sheet. 

Presumably Hollis's due diligence hasn't extended much beyond the chances of xia being able to make the second payment.

The stench of fuck up central is all over this. 

[sickbeggar]

Well the Glazers did it, but then they had a vastly profitable business in Man U so they basically got the business they were buying to pay for itself.  Doing similar with Villa seems a disaster waiting to happen

[oldhill_avfc]

The site seems to be split into three groups at the moment. There are those who are hopeful that the lack of info and anamolies are a breakdown in communication rather than being indicative of anything worse. There are those who are concerned that the anamolies and lack of clarity mean that we have been sold down the river. I think the majority of the site fall into those two groups and quite possible flip flop between them. Then there's a small number who seem to have already fully made up their mind, based on what is pretty limited information, that Dr Tony is definitely a fraud and is going to destroy Villa. I can understand the feelings of the first two groups, but I don't see how those in the third can be so sure based on what we know.

You move very quickly from the second group to the third when the claims that were meant to reassure and add legitimacy turn out to be a crock of shit.