Kendrick Says It's Time To Ask Questions

[andrew08]

Lambdrew08 Report 2014

I'm a self publiscising Holte Ender the latest of 5 generations of Villa Season Ticket Holders none of whom ever went within 50 yards of the directors box, spoke to Doug or had any desire to do so. I've been in the Trinity posh bits a few times and seen a few of our executives but have inherited a similar desire not to speak to them.

1971-1983

I first went in 1971 as a 5 year old in the third division. By the time I left school we were European Champions and officially the second best team in the world.
I saw players of a quality that I will never see again in a Villa shirt. I am both blessed and cursed to have been around in this era. The rest of my life, in a footy sense will never be this good. Off the pitch we were lead by a young dynamic Doug.

1983-1987

If you think it's bad now count yourself lucky you didn't see this!

1987-1990

Good times ruined by the FA, who regret it probably more than we do! How different would things be if we'd had 20 years of GT.

1990-2000

The last good decade to be a Villa fan. Atkinson, Little and Gregory and trophies. Footy under Atkinson that we'd love now. Some great European nights and not really worried about our status as a top flight club. Off the pitch Doug's powers are waning as we get overtaken commercially. The first of the Sugar Daddy clubs, Blackburn, appear. The era ends, and in hindsight, the misery starts, with the F A Cup Final.

2000-2014

Graham Taylor returns a decade too late, 3.3.3,DOL, below Blues,Chelsea find a Russian,we run out of money and can't afford to pay to water the training pitches, Randy, MON,5-1,Everton away, Man U away,mega salaries, Moscow,Dowd,Citeh,Barry,Milner, TSM. We run out of money, lambert,Bradford, Millwall,below Albion,home form,2 tier away tickets,Sheffield and finally, a last minute defeat.

Conclusion

Owners,Players,Managers come and go.....

 But VTID.

[Stu]

Wow, this kicked off overnight!

My favourite part was the 'promotion = bad season' doublethink.

[Dave Clark Five]

Lambdrew08 Report 2014

I'm a self publiscising Holte Ender the latest of 5 generations of Villa Season Ticket Holders none of whom ever went within 50 yards of the directors box, spoke to Doug or had any desire to do so. I've been in the Trinity posh bits a few times and seen a few of our executives but have inherited a similar desire not to speak to them.

1971-1983

I first went in 1971 as a 5 year old in the third division. By the time I left school we were European Champions and officially the second best team in the world.
I saw players of a quality that I will never see again in a Villa shirt. I am both blessed and cursed to have been around in this era. The rest of my life, in a footy sense will never be this good. Off the pitch we were lead by a young dynamic Doug.

1983-1987

If you think it's bad now count yourself lucky you didn't see this!

1987-1990

Good times ruined by the FA, who regret it probably more than we do! How different would things be if we'd had 20 years of GT.

1990-2000

The last good decade to be a Villa fan. Atkinson, Little and Gregory and trophies. Footy under Atkinson that we'd love now. Some great European nights and not really worried about our status as a top flight club. Off the pitch Doug's powers are waning as we get overtaken commercially. The first of the Sugar Daddy clubs, Blackburn, appear. The era ends, and in hindsight, the misery starts, with the F A Cup Final.

2000-2014

Graham Taylor returns a decade too late, 3.3.3,DOL, below Blues,Chelsea find a Russian,we run out of money and can't afford to pay to water the training pitches, Randy, MON,5-1,Everton away, Man U away,mega salaries, Moscow,Dowd,Citeh,Barry,Milner, TSM. We run out of money, lambert,Bradford, Millwall,below Albion,home form,2 tier away tickets,Sheffield and finally, a last minute defeat.

Conclusion

Owners,Players,Managers come and go.....

 But VTID.

The 'both blessed and cursed' bit is food for much discussion.
An excellent summary of the different geological era of the Planet Aston Villa, 1971 -2014.

[amfy]

My argument with Hodgson is simply around him calling it a report when it is at best, an article.
People can agree or disagree about it, but no more importance should be attached to it that Chelt's post, or Leighton's letter. Lots of people have something to say, he is just another one.

As for Dave - he is entitled to take his own editorial in whatever direction he sees fit. He has no brief to represent anyone. He gathers articles randomly as they are sent in, and prints them whether he agrees with them or not, but he doesn't have to change his personal view. With most publications, if people don't like the editorial direction they stop buying it. That is people's right. That's the risk he takes by holding an unpopular view - but it is his choice.

On here, the debate goes in all directions, people don't get banned for slating anyone at the club as far as I have seen. (I stand to be corrected - I might have missed something).

Again - as long as others are allowed to express their opinions, Dave arguing against it does not constitute censorship. It is debate between 2 posters.

I just think that sniping at individuals is counterproductive to what started out as a useful thread.

[LeeS]

Finishing 6th and coming up via the play-offs would be enjoyable but you could hardly call it a good season. The 6th best team in the Championship is going to struggle in the Premier League - we see that all the time. So it would be a damning indictment of how the club had been run if that were to happen.

On the other hand, if we got relegated, RL sold us to a proper billionaire and we came straight back up with 100+ points and a cracking team then I'd call that a good season. In fact, if you offered that to me now I'd bite your hand off. Getting relegated to the 3rd division was probably upsetting for Man City fans but do they care about that now?

Of course, all of that is just fantasy. We could easily get relegated and then struggle next season, fail to get promoted and spend a few years down there - or never come back again. So for that fairly obvious reason, we need to stay up.

[rob_bridge]

I am a little baffled by the fact that Graham Taylor's first season has been described as bad.

Anyway maybe the Hendrick and Hodgson articles have had the required effect and stoked the fires in some of the longstanding fans on here and on other forums (however inferior they may be).

Apathy is the enemy at the moment - influenced by a general malaise which has emanated from the club for too long.

[john e]

I don't agree with people being banned from VIP areas for having differing opinions unless its for gross misconduct of some sort

Always thought SAF's treatment of journalists over the years was petty and pathetic, so if we are going down the same road now then its very disappointing,

only threatened weak regimes and  people do this sort of thing

[rob_bridge]

I don't agree with people being banned from VIP areas for having differing opinions unless its for gross misconduct of some sort

Always thought SAF's treatment of journalists over the years was petty and pathetic, so if we are going down the same road now then its very disappointing,

only threatened weak regimes and  people do this sort of thing

Correct and this Hodgson bloke, self importance aside, clearly spends much of his own money I suspect on the top end supporter facilities.

Or rather did.

[Mister E]

My argument with Hodgson is simply around him calling it a report when it is at best, an article.
People can agree or disagree about it, but no more importance should be attached to it that Chelt's post, or Leighton's letter. Lots of people have something to say, he is just another one.

True, although he has had the opportunity to observe the Villa soap opera from a position that most us haven't; the Directors box (and, he was quite obviously reasonably close with PF at some point).
The fact that he is drawing the same conclusions as the fans here should be seen as encouraging that our frustrations are not simply those of uninformed, whingeing fans but people who have identified fundamental issues at our club and want to see something done about them.
We certainly shouldn't raise Hodgson on a pedestal but he could become a useful focal point for our concerns to be voiced.

Just my view, anyway.

The real question - away from Dave's editorial role and responsibilities - is what do we do about the growing sense that the Villa is completely in the shit?

[Ads]

Promotion would not represent a good season. It would merely signify the end of the humiliation and complete ignomy of being in the 2nd Division in the first place.

[Dave Clark Five]

No more or less importance should be given to any reasonable post, whether called a report or not. It does not have to be a lengthy tome or look like part of a thesis, but needs to get the point across. Mr.Hodgson does not appear to have let his position in the Directors Box cause him to be silent on things he doesn't agree with and why not? This isn't Russia. However, I don't know in what form his disagreements were initially aired. If he was shouting things out in there that were derogatory to the Club, then it is only to be expected that it would be jumped on. Although you may pay well to go in those areas, there is always an element of decorum to be observed if you wish to remain in there. But, as I said, I don't know if he did 'misbehave' in that manner.

[Fergal]

Because it's preferable to being so twisted that you start to say relegation was a success.

I'm not sure anyone's said that though.  Relegation = bad season.  Promotion = good season.  I wouldn't have described that as a giant leap away from conventional football wisdom.  Promotion = bad season.  Now that has been said and it is a bit puzzling.

Being there in the first place = absolute disaster. In the circumstances worse than anything any other chairman of any club has ever overseen.

Well it may happen with the chairman we have now. Will you criticise him then?

Depends whether a) we go down and b) we were European champions five years earlier.

In reality what would it take for you to criticise this owner in the same way you used to Doug?  I may be misunderstanding how you are representing your views but you do come across as very defensive towards Randy Learner and Paul Faulkner.

[Mister E]

In reality what would it take for you to criticise this owner in the same way you used to Doug?  I may be misunderstanding how you are representing your views but you do come across as very defensive towards Randy Learner and Paul Faulkner.

As an aside, you'll recall that it took us 20 years to attack Doug with any real venom. He got away with the mid-80's debacle; he survived the brazen lack of opportunity-grasping of the early EPL years; he got away with the 2000 Cup Final shambles and the poor treatment of GT's 2nd coming.
It was only in 2002-03 that the fans started serious opposition - yes, there had been some fans' marches prior to that but nothing massively meaningful.

Lerner has had it easy so far, and the fans' patience has waned far more quickly than in previous eras. Probably because (i) the cost of failure is so much higher than it was; and, (ii) our inadequacies as a club are highlighted much more in the 24-7 media environment that we now have.

[Fergal]

In reality what would it take for you to criticise this owner in the same way you used to Doug?  I may be misunderstanding how you are representing your views but you do come across as very defensive towards Randy Learner and Paul Faulkner.

As an aside, you'll recall that it took us 20 years to attack Doug with any real venom. He got away with the mid-80's debacle; he survived the brazen lack of opportunity-grasping of the early EPL years; he got away with the 2000 Cup Final shambles and the poor treatment of GT's 2nd coming.
It was only in 2002-03 that the fans started serious opposition - yes, there had been some fans' marches prior to that but nothing massively meaningful.

Lerner has had it easy so far, and the fans' patience has waned far more quickly than in previous eras. Probably because (i) the cost of failure is so much higher than it was; and, (ii) our inadequacies as a club are highlighted much more in the 24-7 media environment that we now have.

The PR machine, led by the General, was brilliant. I think they built up so much good will it has insulated them from serious opposition.

[Chico Hamilton III]

Promotion would not represent a good season

Tell that to the thousands who partied after Swindon like it was ..erm...1988. Our promotion didn't represent a good season, it was a great season .

The last few seasons have been shit and the relegation season was dreadful but the promotion season was one of the highlights of my Villa supporting career. It's my opinion, but it was better than the slow death we've been enduring these past few seasons. I saw a team coming together under a proper manager, who didn't make excuses when we played shit and told it like it is, a genuine resurgance in fanatical support, some great wins, some fantastic away days and some geinuine passion without the need for the club to lay on free coaches, Bright Future scarves, silly flags or any other American-style marketing gimmicks.

I'd never want to be in the position again, mind. Have I just contradicted myself?